In desperate need of help

[stu]

For the past 5 years, my buddy and I have hunted in SD with archery equipment only during the first or second week of November. Being from WI and having limited time off, SD worked well for us. Being a school teacher, each year I have to get the time that I need off approved by our district administrator. Well this year we hired a new DA and low and behold, they do not approve of hunting. Say it's cruel. To make a long story short, when I put in my request for leave of absence, the DA denied it. So I went to the school board and pleaded my case. Well the school board approved my leave of absence for this year because of past practice. However, after the meeting the DA said that I better not hold my breath and not look forward to getting it off in the future. So now I am looking for archery hunts in any states that start in August. Shooting a nice muley in velvet would be awesome as well. Does anyone have any ideas, thoughts, suggestions, or places for me to start looking on any states and possible units that would have an archery season for 2006 and the future that early. We would prefer areas that have very little vehicle access and do not mind hiking several miles back in to keep hunter numbers low. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Good luck to everyone this season!!!

 

[Foreman4x4]

It's none of their business what you take time off for! By the way, Utah's Archery hunt is in August.....

 

[wallhanger]

I couldn't agree with Foreman more. In fact, It's none of the their !@#$%^& business what you take your time off for!

That being said, you may have the opportunity to go on two hunts. Take a hunt in August, and maybe look into one of the late hunts that you actually miss school for. If it were me, and they wouldn't approve the time off because I was hunting, I'd suddenly get sick or have to visit my poor old dying Aunt Edna every year when hunting season came around.

Bosses that try to run your life outside of work are not the type of people I could work for.

Good luck,

WH

 

[archerelk]

Use your X-mas break and hunt the rut in Arizona. They also have an Aug hunt, but that is a pretty tough hunt compared to South Dakota.

 

[NVHUNTERER]

I agree with the above, thats B.S.! Sounds like DISCRIMINATION to me.
There always looking for teachers out west.
NVHUNTERER

 

[browtine]

Cant help you on where to hunt however, You should be part of a union. There are several teacher unions out there and if crap like that is happeneing, Your school distric just opened themselves up for a lawsuit. I would tape record your conversation with the DA and when he tells that he denied your leave because he doesnt approve of hunting, You will own him. <my two cents>

Later, Brandon

 

[predator]

You absolutely have a lawsuit. If you earn your time off, it is your time off, regardless of WHY you are taking vacation. It's none of their damn business WHAT you do on your time off.

What state are you in?

 

[stu]

Hey Everyone,

Thank you soooo much for the support and the great advice both on hunting and on handling the situaion I am in. The worst part is that according to our contract, we are allowed to have 2 "paid" personal days and 3 "unpaid" personal days each school year and a person is not allowed to take more than one personal day in a row and cannot be used to extended a weekend or holiday. So even though I am taking off an entire week of school, I will only be getting paid for two of the days days that I will be taking off. That definitely hurts the pocket book. Plus, for the past "umteen" years, our past DA have allowed people to take off not only for a variety of reasons, but as much time as needed as long as there were subs available. I love living in WI, but I wish I lived out West even more. Thanks again everyone for your support. It really means alot.

 

[HighSierra]

Stu,
I too am a teacher. But instead of being from WI, I call the great "hunter friendly" state of California home.

Yep, I'm being sarcastic!

I think what many of you on this board are voicing regarding taking time off is very valid. Unfortunately, the profession we educators have CHOSEN places unique demands on us. Those of you out there that are teachers know what I'm talking about...those of you that arent...well, this may not be the time or place to go into the detail necessary to fully understand. To compound the issue, many teachers (including myself) find it very difficult to lie and say we're sick or something if, in fact, we're not. This is probably true for all professionals though.

I found myself in almost the exact same situation as "stu" a few years ago when we hired a new principal. I took off for a colorado deer /elk hunt by using my 2 discretionary days of leave (no reason necessary)...combinied them with a weekend...and then added on 2 days of "comp-time" that I had earned for substituting during my prep-periods. All of this was "pre-approved" by the principal too!

Upon returning, this principal called me into the office and asked me straight up if I would be missing work on regular basis (yearly) for hunting trips. I told him that if it was in my means (budget) and I'm available to draw or obtain a good tag, it very well could be a yearly thing. When I asked him if he had a problem with that...he said "yes". I smiled and simply walked away....straight to the telephone to call my union rep!

You see, taking the time off in the way I did was NOT in any sort of violation of my contract. Comp time is earned in our district by substituting for other teachers during our prep time...which I do VERY frequently. Comp time is also carried over from year to year. What I tend to do is bank as much of it as I can then take a couple of days worth in combination with a weekend or holiday (like veteran's day in NOV) and off I go.

After my rep pointed out the finer points of our contract to this principal...he never mentioned it again.

I suggest you look into what your contract allows. We are allowed 10 sick days /year of which 2 can be used without giving a reason (discretionary). If you have something similar...look into combining this with a 3 day weekend like Veteran's day and you could get in a great hunt. I know I've used that holiday + some of my time off to go on hunts in Montana. Its just drawing the tag that's hard.

"stu", even if it seems you are being discrimated against...dont jeoprodize your integrity by lying to your principal about your whereabouts during time off! All you'll be doing is giving them more ammo against you. Know your contract and stay within its bounds. Let your union reps fight the battles

Good Luck!

 

[HighSierra]

Stu...

Just read your last post...I should have done that BEFORE typing my last reply!

Anyways, sounds as if your contract is a bit more stringent than ours regarding when and how you can take your time off.

If there are others on your staff that would support you, my suggestion would be to open that article of the contract up for negotiation. Be savy in how you approach this issue though. Explain to other teachers how taking time off that extends a weekend or holiday may be beneficial should they ever need to travel long distances for family get togethers, delivering a child to college, and other activities not covered under your "excused" absence policy. I myself would probably shy away from mentioning extended hunting trips....not that there is anything wrong with them!

I am very active with our local teachers union and am on our negotiating team. Should you need any other advice, feel free to shoot me a personal email.

 

[Foreman4x4]

Stories like these make me appreciate my job even more! I'll never get rich working for the State, but I get three weeks paid vacation, plus 12 or 13 paid holidays a year. My supervisor's philosophy is, as long as the work is done, take whatever time off you want, whenever you want.

Starting Friday the 21st, I'm off work until November 8th! Gonna spend a week hunting deer with a rifle, then spending a week at Disneyland, Universal Studios, Sea World, etc. with my wife and kids.

 

[jlmmason]

Nevada has a August hunt and we are looking for teachers to and the DA in our county hunts to.

 

[NDBadlandsbucks]

Every once in a while, in the last couple days in August the bow season is open in North Dakota. The way the season works it kinda depends on the year when it opens, and if it is in August - its only the last two days or so. You could come in early and scout then get your buck right away...in a perfect world. It depends on when school starts - the season is always open the first week of september though. Nonres bow tags ore over the counter for whitetails, but are limited for mule deer - possibly hard to draw? I don't really know. ND is closer to you than other western states. Good luck with your boss, and thanks for being a teacher - even though it throws a wrench into your hunting plans.

Keep the Sun at Your Back and the Wind in Your Face

 

[BANNOCK1877]

Montana doesn't quite have the seasons you're looking for, but they certainly need the teachers, esp. in eastern MT. Come on over where you'd be considered odd if you weren't out hunting...

 

[stu]

Thanks again to everyone who has not only given me advice, but support in the situation I am in.

HighSierra, thanks for the advice on how being able to use personal days to extend w/ends could benefit everyone, not just me. I just talked with three of our negotiators and the language for using personal days is now on the discussion block, since we start negotiations next month. I also looked into Vet's Day and we do not even get that day off. In Sept., we get Labor Day off and the next one isn't until the 27/28th of Oct. for Teachers' Convention, which can't be combined with any personal days. After that, the next one is Thanksgiving, so you could say that I am up a creek w/o a paddle. So I am really hoping our negotiating team can make an impact in this language that we have. They really like the idea of changing the language on this situation so I am definitely keeping my fingers crossed on this one. This is why I am looking into August hunts, so time really isn't a factor or possibly or possibly ARCHERELK's suggestion and AZ. You want to hear something really crazy = I teach at a K-8 school, which happens to be the largest K-8 in the state of WI with over 60 teachers alone and over 80 including everyone and I am the only person hear that HUNTS!!! Again, thanks for the advice and please, be safe this hunting season....

 

[driftersifter]

I teach in wisconsin as well. I have the same scenario as you. This is what I do I apply every year for Montana and hunt opening weekend of Wisconsin Whitetail. I then go to Montana for a week of mulie hunting and come back to wisconsin for the muzzle hunting. Some years we have all of thanksgiving week off but this year only 4 days. I too have loked at other states with the early seasons. I also hunt muzzleloader in Nebraska during Christmas vacation.
When asked about personal days and their use I reply that I'm hunting with my family and the bonding that takes place is every bit as special as anybody's Christmas time.

I would bet a lot of other hunters feel the same way about the time spent afield with family and friends.

Driftersifter

P.S.I am the only one in our building that hunts, and one only two in our district that hunts. 40 teachers total.

 

[archerelk]

The rut in Az is a good hunt. If you decide to consider it, drop me a line. I Moved to Texas this year so I won't be out there, but can turn you to some really good areas.

 

[woodruffhunter]

Stu,

I am also a teacher and will be archery hunting next year.
If you are interested in archery hunting in Utah, I will
help you in any way I can. I know of some areas where you
wouldn't see many (if any) hunters. Just send me a PM.

PS: I would move west (the principals hunt out here)

 

[stu]

Woodruff Hunter & Archerelk - I would love any information that you could give me. How do you send a PM?, unless this is it. I would love to hunt Utah for mulies in velvet before school even starts and hunt AZ mulies during the rut during my winter vacation. Please let me know how I can get in touch with you through personal emails and I will contact both of you ASAP. Thank you again, it is really appreciated.

Driftersifter - glad to hear of another WI teacher, but sorry to hear your in a similar boat. What part of the state are you in?

 

[driftersifter]

I live and teach in Cornell wisconsin 6th grade been here 21 years and I can hunt out west every three years. Lets break down cost. To take a personal day I have to pay the cost of a sub. 100 dollars a day.
Pay deduct leave = I pay the cost of the sub and lose my pay for the day, plus I'm charged the price of insurance those days.
that equals out to about 400 dollars a day.

We also must get permission to take pay deduct leave.

My salary is about 40,000 a year I haven't taken too many pay deduct days but I have taken a weeks worth. Now we are talkin some pretty expensive venison.

driftersifter

 

[stu]

LOL....I definitely hear where you are coming when you calculate how much venison actually costs. Then when everyone hears that you shot a deer, everyone wants some. That God I do it for the memories and not the venison....I'd be broke!!!

 

[idhunters]

Tell them its none of their business what your doing on your day off. Or tell them you are going to go out and disrupt someones hunt, they'll give you the day off, no questions!! LOL

 

[woodruffhunter]

Stu,

Here is my email address: [email protected]

 

[Bornforhorns]

I thought I had it bad! I teach in Eastern Washington and I too am one of possibly 3 or 4 teachers that hunt in a district that employs over 100 teachers. You need to get out of Wisconsin guys! I get 1 personal leave day paid for and two that I would have to pay for (sub cost $85). I can allow these to accumulate up to 3 paid for if I don't take any for two years, but no more than 3 can be accumulated. My gripe is I would love a contract that gave me 5 consecutive weekdays, tied into two weekends for a total of nine days and I would have to say my job would be one of the best around. I hate the fact I get all that time off in the summer, I would trade 3 weeks of summer for one week in the fall.
I love what High Sierra has done in their district with the comp. time! I'm going to approach our bargaining team with that idea. Anybody else out there in Washington that would like to share their contract? Especially a really good one! I teach Science... let me know if you have any openings.

 

[archerelk]

[email protected]