IDAHO BONUS POINT SYSTEM

[muleybucks]

Hot off the press in today's Idaho Statesman was something regarding the F&G commissioners apprving a bonus point system for Idaho in a vote of 4-3. The procedure requires the public to be notified, then this will be presented to the legislature for final approval (with all the details ironed out) early in 2006. There was some issue with the specific type of system (using Nevada's which squares bonus points, etc.) and the respective cost of each type. Obviously, the more complicated the system, the higher the cost. Fish and Game estimated an $11 cost INCREASE (NOT $11 TOTAL) for controlled hunt applications if they chose a fairly complicated system such as Nevada's.

At any rate, the article basically stated that this was the first step to getting this in place and it sounded positive that this would actually happen.

For what it's worth....

[email protected]

 

[Canoe]

Good, maybe I can hunt a premium unit once or twice before I die.

 

[bigole5]

i don't like it. the lottery system is perfectly fine. we don't need to follow all the other states by commercializing hunting anymore then it is.

 

[IdahoMuley]

I hope it dosent pass! idaho has the best drawing system its all luck. and if it passes some body with money can go and buy all the points he wanats! i sure hope it gets shut down!
Muley Man!

 

[supersider34]

Dont agree with it either. Keep it as it is. Nothing like raising the fee's again.
Are we talking all units will be a draw or when will we know the proprosal on this?

 

[fairchase]

I don't like it and I don't want any part of their "more fair" system. What could be more fair than 100% random each year, with the current one year waiting period?
Let me add, I have thought for years that their current process should be cunducted or audited be an outside company. That's the only chande to the controlled hunt system I would approve.

Please correct me If I am wrong, but the way I understand it the new system will work out something like this, if your a resident.

Year #1 You get lucky and draw a controlled hunt.
Year #2 You cannnot apply.
Year #3 You cannnot apply.
Year #4 You can apply, but have little or no chance, because you don't have the extra point(chance) yet.
Year #5-? You have your extra point and chances increase and you go on with 2 points(chances)until you draw.
Meanwhile, the people who drew in years 2-4 start cycling back in and the odds start to flatten again.

Anyway, that's how the artical read to me...I guess I just don't understand why???

 

[lv4huntn]

I am with you guys. I dont mind the current system. I allows everyone a fair chance (in theory) and helps to keep the system grounded. I agree that it should be outsourced to an external company, but it still gives the poor guys like me as much of a chance at hunting a quality unti as any other. By the way I missed a big buck on the last day of my buck season. Guess I will have to chase a doe with my bow for the last few days. Good luck to all and hope you draw some good ones.

 

[wilecoyote76]

I've heard that the bonus points will only affect the highly sought after premium hunts where odds of drawing are dang near impossible. Probably speculation but time will tell.

 

[Daxter]

I would sure like to see Idaho stay the way it is. I like that it is 100% luck of the draw.
Dax

 

[elkster123]

I agree with the idea of having an outside company conduct the actual drawing. Idaho Fish and Game can manupilate the system any way they see fit with no checks and balances. They can pick and choose who they want to get a controlled hunt and when. If you guys don't think that this happens pull the blinders off. I would have to say that I am in favor of something different, what that might be I don't no.

 

[jims]

How many of you that appose the new pref/bonus system are Idaho residents? With the current system (as a nonres) I am stuck paying over $100/yr to apply whether I draw a tag or not. The draw odds are fairly good for most species but I could be applying my entire life and not draw a tag. At $100+/yr it really hurts! In 10 years that equals $1,000 and I'm not really getting any closer to drawing a tag.

Obviously if you are an Idaho resident it stinks if you can't hunt your own state every year and there is a wait between years you can apply! If my memory is correct you can apply in the off years for a different species?

Wyo is setting up a pref pt system for nonres (deer, elk, and antelope) this year and keeping the resident draw without pref pts. I believe there were complaints from Wyo residents similar to what has been mentioned above from ID residents. I also hear complaints from Wyo residents that they never can draw premium deer, elk, and antelope tags!

With pt systems at least you can plan out when you'll likely draw super tags. I really like our system here in Colo. For elk there are a majority of units that you can purchase unlimited tags and hunt every year and limited units you must draw through the pref pt system. Some limited units are so popular that the pref pts it takes to draw goes up by 1 just about every year. For Colo deer there are popular units that allocate gobs of tags that can be drawn every year while there are premium units that usually provide a quality experience that take close to maximum pts.

You are absolutely right that the price for applying for tags is astronaumical! Many DOW and G&F managers have found out that license + pt fees are big business and they charge premium prices. Unfortunately this takes most of the average hunter's budget out of the market! It is even tougher finding a way to pull together enough cash to apply you plus your kids for tags! Also, some pt systems almost make it impossible for up and coming kids to ever draw tags if they don't get into the game from the start! What is going to happen to hunting when our kids grow up?

I hope the managers keep all of these things in consideration when imposing new systems! There are always pros and cons to any system. Every system has it's own advantages and most systems take some tweaking to work for that particular species and state. Hopefully Idaho will learn from the experiences of other states!

 

[elkster123]

I am glad to see that Idaho finally joined the ban wagon. I agree that an outside organization should oversee the drawing of controlled hunts. With out a system of checks and balances, the state can manupliate the outcome of the draw and give out permits to who they see fit this happens weither you choose to believe it or not.

 

[fullcry]

No matter what you do,no one will be totally happy.Non-residents pay through the nose for them and their kids to put in.
Residents lose tags to non-residents..Competition is tough and getting tougher.Idaho is one of the last to fall in line...It used to be very few people hunted out of there state...[except maybe for California]Now, most serious hunters have expanded because its harder to get a good tag almost anywhere...Its only going to get worse.....

 

[ID_Paul]

News article from IDFG on this:

http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/apps/releases/view.cfm?NewsID=2887

 

[boneaddict]

I wish Idaho would stay the same. It is equal to everyone, and besides after a decade of folks aquiring points, what happens to our younger generation coming in. They don't have a chance in hell of being drawn until they are older and I am dead. I think it is a horrible thought that they are going to this.

 

[locofife]

I personally like the idea, and I am a resident. I'm willing to pay an extra 10 or 15 bucks if its going to eventually increase my odds of drawing. And for the kids the F&G could always give the new ones coming in a few bonus points to start with so it is more fair to them. I don't agree with rich folks being able to buy more points though.

 

[brymoore]

I called the DNR when I read about this in the Statesman and spoke with the gentleman in charge of this change. Fairchase outlined the proposed system correctly. The maximum points that can be acquired are two; if you draw you are out for two years.

This is a silly solution to a non-existent problem; the current system works. I can look at the draw tags and decide where I want to invest my time. If I have a 1 in 10 chance of drawing a tag, I know that statistically that I should draw that tag if I apply for 10 years. It might be year one or year ten, but I should draw it (there is a small chance it will take longer - these people complain but no one complains when they draw on year 1). The proposed system will increase the amount of time it will take someone to draw a tag.

As for non-residents, this in no ways increases their odds, either. For the non-residents who want us to adopt a WY system: Go to Hell!

 

[ID_Paul]

LAST EDITED ON Nov-25-05 AT 11:54AM (MST)[p]locofife, You might be more likely to draw for some hunts. But, once you draw you are less likely to draw again.

Also, $10-$15 may not be all that much to you (it is to me) but what about families that all hunt together? Dad, mom and 2 kids would see an increased fee of $40-$60. That is a significant expense.

There are a lot of details to be hammered out on the system before they adopt anything. Discussion at this point is mostly speculation anyway.

 

[locofife]

ID-Paul,
I realize that after drawing it would take me several years to build up enough points to draw again. As for the extra money, I can see how it could be a financial burden for people that are applying for more than one person. It would, of course, be great if the fish and game could do something that wouldn't cost any more money, but just about any system is going to cost something. Perhaps they will find a middleground somewhere, like only allowing each person to apply for 1 species per year. I don't imagine doing something like that would increase the fees by too much. I guess we will see what happens. I'll be interested in seeing what is decided.

 

[ID_Paul]

" I guess we will see what happens. I'll be interested in seeing what is decided."

My feelings exactly. Hopefully if it is done carefully, the public is fully informed of all options and gives good input back to the department, maybe in the end something will happen that everyone can see as at least partially beneficial.

 

[Martin]

Here we go again. Why can't the great state of Idaho be different than everyone else? I keep hearing that song by Pink Floyd with the cash register in the background....MONEY! I enjoy the way the current system works...and yes it does work. Your odds of drawing multiple times are better without the bonus point system. Stand up and be heard people! So you don't draw one of the premium hunts every year! Thats why they call it premium and not guaranteed! I have drawn some awesome hunts in the last 5 years...both elk and deer. If they ADOPT a new bonus point system, more than likely I won't have those same odds. This year alone, I drew 2 awesome hunts on the 2nd draw. I like it the way it is...keep it that way.

 

[huntindude]

I'm always in favor point systems but in Idaho's case I don't think it will matter to most non res. hunters as Idaho is way to expensive to apply for special deer and elk draws. I'm sure I won't get tears from residents but having to buy the license and tag just to apply for a special draw is the most expensive of any state unless you plan on using your general tag, and I don't. it would help your odds with the piont system but in the end it would be cheaper for most
to buy a great landowner tag in another state. with my luck to draw the deer tag I want it would take 20 years at $ 350.00 a year equals $7000 ,no thanks.

 

[COSA]

There's an easy solution. Leave it alone and increase the wait time from 1 year to 3-5 years for applying for draw tags. Of course the F&G would not do this because of lack of revenue from nonresidents not buying licenses while they are ineligible to draw.

 

[fairchase]

I hate to bum anyone out...but this new points system is a done deal. All the details have been finalized.
Like all political machines, IDF&G decisions are made behind closed doors. After the commission has finalized a decision, the public is then allowed a comment period. (only because the comment period is required by law in Idaho otherwise the legislature can't approve the changes) Where the commission pretends to value the input of the people and lets the public think that the decision making process is just starting, and that they will do what ever it is that the majority of the people want. It's all a sham! Like it or not this is how F&G works in Idaho.
The funny part is, the Statesman let the cat out of the bag this time and printed something to the effect that, this points deal is final but the F&G couldn't announce it yet because they haven't allowed for public comment.

Regardless of where you stand on this issue, the system needs an overhaul.

 

[fullcry]

For those residents who hunt out of state.This will be the same deal as everyone else.For those who only hunt Res-Idaho,
it will get harder.Part of the reason,they want to go to points is non-residents complain they spent what 120 somthing bucks and get nothing to show for it.The state wants that money to keep
coming in, so there you go...For the guy who told non-residents
to 'go to hell'.What til you grow-up and look to go out of state.Someone may tell you the same thing.One more thing? dont Non-residents get les than 10 persent of Idaho tags...