CHOPPERS,COPTERS,ETHICAL???

B

bobcatbess

Guest
WELL!!!

IF BRITISH COLUMBIA BOY DOESN'T NUKE THIS FOR NO APPARENT REASON I HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS???

IF YOU COULD USE A CHOPPER TO HUNT TROPHY BIG GAME WOULD YOU???

MANY TIMES I'VE WISHED I HAD A CHOPPER TO RETRIEVE GAME!!!

AS LONG AS NO ONE LANDED THEIR CHOPPER ON THE PRIMITIVE I COULDN'T & WOULDN'T DO TUNE-UPS!!!

NOW IF THE SKI'S TOUCHED DOWN THATS A DIFFERENT STORY!!!

WOULD YOU OR HAVE YOU DONE PRE-SEASON SCOUTING OUT OF A CHOPPER???

WOULD YOU CHASE,PURSUE & SHOOT BIG GAME OUT OF THE CHOPPER IF YOU HAD ONE???

I'D LIKE TO HUNT YOTES & THEM 'BIG COYOTES' OUT OF A CHOPPER!!!

WOULD ANYBODY BE PI$$ED IF THEY SEEN ME HUNTING IN AN LE UNIT WITH A CHOPPER,AFTER ALL THEM LE UNITS DAYS ARE NUMBERED!!!

THE ONLY bobcat THINKING THIS MIGHT BE THE NEW TOOL!!!
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-18-06 AT 05:22PM (MST)[p]I think that we should use Alaska rules here...You can not hunt the same day you are airborn. and there can be no communication between pilot and ground.

Utah is not Alaska, you can get anywhere in the lower 48 without needing a copter to get you there. Now if you wanted to go scouting or see the lay of the land ie where waterholes are located,timber,clearcuts, ect a plane is faster and better. you can jump out of a plane when someone shots your tail elevator...LOL but in a copter you can not jump out when it autorotates down.

I have not hunted out of them, but have been transported out into the field with them in Newfoundland on a moose/carabou hunt, and had meat picked up by them on the same hunt. Land in camp and get dropped off,hiked about 8 miles from camp thru knee deep moss, then after harvesting a moose and putting the meat up high, hiking out with meat and rack back to camp, it would be picked up by copter at the end of the hunt. due to the terrain it is the only way to transport people and animals there.

So bessy, you can go scout but I dont want to see you landing and hunting in my LE area..

Nate
 
I have accessed land locked BLM with a helicopter a few times. Dropped off and picked up only. What a way to travel. Spotting and landing to shoot is so blatantly unfair and easy it would be a slaughter.

JB

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
--Benjamin Franklin 1759
 
Choppers make a lot of noise. I've been around logging operations that were using choppers. Very loud. That would be good for flushing out those big bucks that like to stay in the thick stuff.

And a good way to access the wilderness for those too busy to hike in. Plus you wouldn't have to spend a whole weeks vacation. You could hunt a lot of places in just one day! Imagine being able to hunt the most remote areas during the day and sleeping in a five star motel that night!

Kind of expensive but cheaper than horses, tack, trailers, etc.

If nothing else they should have Conservation Chopper Tags to auction off.

I think you might be on to something there Bobcat!:)

Seriously......ARE YOU NUTS????:)
 
Heck yea... for Caribou.

You are flying in on a Beaver or a Supercub anyway to even get in the region. A helicopter could land where a cub couldnt (not that they cant land on a postage stamp). As long as the mandatory waiting period is followed before you shoot I see no difference in helicopters or a traditional plane.

Elk, Deer... antelope? Nah no need... except scouting could be cool but thats independant of hunting. Hunting Coyotes out of a 'copter would be a ton of fun I'd imagine.


-DallanC
 
Steve!!!

I'VE BEEN CALLED NUTS BEFORE!!!

WHAT I'M THINKING IS!!!

IF WE'RE GOING TO DESTROY LE UNITS I MIGHT AS WELL HELP DESTROY THEM!!!

IT WILL BE QUICK & SWIFT!!!

THE ONLY bobcat THINKING WE MIGHT AS WELL GET IT OVER WITH!!!
 
No hunting the same day you are dropped off.

I have heard of some folks getting dropped off and picked up the same day in colorado. I think that is total BS.

Nate
 
B_F_E_!!!

DOWN BY BOULDER CITY THEY WERE OFFERING RIDES FOR 25.00!!!

WE COULD PROBABLY RENT THAT CHOPPER,BETWEEN THE TWO OF US WE COULD 'GET ER DONE' IN ONE DAY & GO BACK TO WORK SOONER,PROBABLY WOULDN'T COST ANY MORE THAN WE ALREADY SPEND ON A HUNT!!!

NOW I SURELY CAN'T AFFORD TO OWN ONE,BUT IF I COULD I'D BE THE MOST HATED PERSON THIS SIDE OF TEXAS!!!

THE ONLY bobcat PROMISING TO NEVER SHOOT OUT THE WINDOW WHILE B_F_E_ WAS PILOTING THE VEHICLE,HE,HE!!!
 
only Ethical in Iraq!.............
support our troops!

441cb6bc23cac8e2.jpg


RACKMASTER
 
If I had a chopper there would be 100000 dead coyotes. I would make a coyote coat for each and every Altamont Calendar Girl. I would grind up the yotes and give them to the homeless shelters for food. Just think they wouldn't go hungry. I would then get me one of them net guns and head to the nudist beach and practice catch and release. Maybe a dart gun and head to Wal-mart for these idiots that park where they are not suppose to. I could chase the Altamont Girls down to 110 lbs. Apache would work! I could think of lots of stuff to hunt. I could even help out with some tune-ups. A .50 BMG gantlin At 3000 rounds a min. Give me lots of ammo!!
Rut
 
>
> If I had a
>chopper there would be 100000
>dead coyotes. I would make
>a coyote coat for each
>and every Altamont Calendar Girl.
> I would grind
>up the yotes and give
>them to the homeless shelters
>for food. Just think they
>wouldn't go hungry. I
>would then get me one
>of them net guns and
>head to the nudist beach
>and practice catch and release.
> Maybe a dart gun
>and head to Wal-mart for
>these idiots that park where
>they are not suppose to.
> I could chase the
>Altamont Girls down to 110
>lbs. Apache
>would work! I could
>think of lots of stuff
>to hunt. I could even
>help out with some tune-ups.
> A .50 BMG gantlin
>At 3000 rounds a min.
> Give me lots of
>ammo!!
>Rut



Heck Ya! Add a F.L.I.R. and the coyotes would be hating it.
 
If you have kids I think you would want to preserve OUR wildlife for our future generations. And also teach them the finer points of fair chase and hunting ethics. It would increase your odds of a 40" Monster though. I say let your consience be your guide. Unfortunatly my consience never led me to the 40" buck.
 
I've got a serious question....

I've often wondered why nobody ever uses a helicopter to drop them off in the middle of some of the more remote wilderness areas and LE units in states like NM and AZ. It seems like it would make alot more sense to be dropped off rather then taking pack horses and/or hiking in. Are there any state laws that prohibit a hunter using a helicopter for nothing more then being dropped off, and having their gear/animals picked up?
 
MAP!!!

THE LIABILITY INSURANCE IS OUTRAGEOUS!!!

FURTHER MORE,THE CHOPPER CANNOT SET DOWN ON PRIMITIVE!!!

EVEN IN EMERGENCY SITUATIONS THE SKI'S CANNOT TOUCH DOWN!!!

I DIDN'T MAKE THE LAWS,I JUST HELP ENFORCE THEM!!!

IT ALSO SAYS NO LOW-LIFE ATV'ERS IN THE PRIMITIVE!!!

I THINK THESE ARE FEDERAL LAWS!!!

THERE ARE ALOT OF IDIOTS HERE IN UTARD THAT THINK JUST BECAUSE THEY OWN A QUAD THEY CAN DESTROY ANYTHING THEY WANT TO!!!

THE ONLY bobcat HOPEING THEY NEVER COME OUT WITH A REAL CHEAP CHUTE PLANE OR CHOPPER,EVERY IDIOT IN THIS STATE WILL BE FLYING ONE IF THEY DO!!!
 
No way the last chopper ride I had was on a back board and in a neck brace and it was 4,000.00 for a 20 min. ride.





Kyle
"If it moves shoot it again"
 
First off, if it was an emergency, I would pay what ever fines and take the risk of "letting the ski touch". Thats bullchit

But what about LE units, areas that are not considered "wilderness"?
 
WOW!!!

Kingfish WON'T EVEN NEGOTIATE!!!

THE GROUND IS ALREADY CRAWLING,CAN YOU IMAGINE THE SKY CRAWLING TOO???

I STILL THINK ME & B_F_E_,eelgrass,Rut & Pred COULD HAVE ONE HELL OF A FUN TIME TAKING TURNS FROM GUNNER TO PILOT!!!

THE ONLY bobcat THINKING:SOME OF THEM BIG ELUSIVE MULEYS WOULD HAVE THEIR TONGUES HANGING OUT BEFORE WE WERE FINISHED WITH THEM!!!
 
Hunting out of a helicopter in Iraq should be legal. Thats a given.

I think everyone should get a chance to chase coyotes in a helicopter. (make it a part of hunter ed?). That sounds like too much fun.

Other than that, do it the right way.....from the ground.
 
LE= Limited Entry. You have to get drawn to hunt that unit (season)

I think helicoptors are illegal to use to access "Designated Wilderness". No motorized vehicles of any kind. I think even mountain bikes are illegal in California.

Steve

"Never criticize someone until you walk a mile in their shoes. Then when you criticize them you are a mile away, and you have their shoes!"
 
>I think helicoptors are illegal to
>use to access "Designated Wilderness".
>No motorized vehicles of any
>kind. I think even mountain
>bikes are illegal in California.
>
>
>Steve

Anything with a motor or a wheel is illegal in a wilderness area. It was quite amusing a couple years ago the guy selling deer carts who in his advert talked about how useful it was to retrieve game in wilderness areas where you couldnt get a vehicle into... he didnt realize there is no difference in a game cart or an atv with regard to the law.
 
WOW!!!

I'VE ACTUALLY TURNED DOWN A FEW TUNE-UPS!!!

DEER CARTS IN THE PRIMITIVE!!!

THEY DON'T HAVE PISTONS,MAYBE I'LL AIM FOR THE BEARING ASSEMBLY!!!

THE ONLY bobcat HUNTING A LITTLE HIGHER THAN NORMAL THIS YEAR!!!
 
What if some tree hugger had 100,000 acres of PUBLIC land locked up and wouldn't allow you access? Wouldn't flying a copter over his gate and landing on YOUR public land just be the right thing to do?

I'm not talking about pursueing or chasing critters with the whirybird, 'm talking about accessing public land?

What's the difference between landing a floatplane on a remote lake and having a chopper drop you and your camp off on the mountain top?
 
Hey Bess if you took your 50 cal. with, you could spot for quads & do some aerial tune-ups while your at it,
be careful however since you might take some incoming fire in your chopper, from some pissed off quad owners.
 
It is eligal for a helicopter to touch ground in a designated wilderness unless its a emergency.
 
B_F_E_!!!

DON'T WORRY BUD!!!

OUR CHOPPER WILL BE CAMO STEALTH ARMOR PIERCING PROOF COMPOSITE!!!

THEY WILL BE SHOOTING AT US BUT THEY'LL BE WASTING AMMO!!!

HUNTING JUST MIGHT BE ALOT OF FUN,AFTER THE TAGS ARE FILLED THE TARGET (ATV'S)PRACTICE WILL BEGIN!!!

THE ONLY bobcat THINKING WE'D NEVER NEED TO LAND ON THE PRIMITIVE!!!
 
Some confusion may exist between wilderness and designated Wilderness.


Technically, "wilderness" is defined by the National Wilderness Preservation Act of 1964 as an area of undeveloped federally owned land, designated by Congress.

A designated Wilderness is a chunk of land that is set aside as a Wilderness Area, and named as such. For example Marble Mountain Wilderness here in Cali. Or the High Uintas Wilderness in Northeast Utah.(about 250,000 acres)

You can be 100 miles from the nearest road in Alaska, for example, and not be in a designated Wilderness.(even though it seems like wilderness) Thus you can land your plane or helicoptor, or ride your quad. Not so in a designated Wilderness.

Hope this helps.

OK, so it's Sunday and I have nothing better to do!:)

Steve
 
Rut,
Just to clarify, an apache has a 30mm chain gun, and uses HE or depleted uranium shells.
 
Quack Quack paid-ro2 Are you advertising a hunting web site on mm? Looks like a target to me?? Please don't tell me!! For you my friend I make a good deeal!!
Rut
 
>Could we buy a "chopper tag"
>or one of those varmit
>tags for a few extra
>dollars. Maybe we could
>have bobcat paint a target
>on the bottom of the
>chopper?
>
>PAID2HUNT

I tried to delete the link but it has been over 60 min.
 
Well, I just got off the another topic in the General section of someone who wanted to heli hunt tahr. I explained to him that while it is perfectly legal to do, I just didn't want to do it that way, and I ended up doing mine on foot. But the hei hunts sure are fun! In NZ, there are plenty of ways to skin a cat.... Just pick one that fits you.
But, I did get to do some Red Deer culling on a property that was needing to cull out a bunch of hinds and inferior stags. They paid for the time and fuel on the bird, and then we got to have a blast. We used buckshot and could only take head shots. All of the deer were recovered and then the work began. We had to gut the deer in a particular way because the deer were sold to a meat company. It was a ton of fun and something I'll probably never get to do again.

Remember, this was not a HUNT!! We were culling the population of deer in one particular area. There are no predators in NZ, and the deer pop. gets out of control very quickly without culling operations. I still stand by my opinion that if it was an actual hunt, I'd feel like I got more "bang for the buck" so to speak, if I did it on foot. But then again, i really enjoy torturing myself on brutal hikes!!

Here is me getting into the bird..
cullhunting.jpg


And here we are coming back with a cull stag I took.
cullhunting002.jpg


And here is my buddy Billy and myself with a mess of Red Deer!!!
cullhunting001.jpg

And lastly, here we are with a couple of the stags from the day.
cullhunting003.jpg
 
Just last week I talked to a game warden about helicoptering into a landlocked area for elk hunting.

This area had been my honey hole for 6 years until I made the mistake of inviting an acquaintance to accompany me. He in turn argued with the neighboring outfitter who then denied access through his land to this BLM piece.

I would want to get dropped off on the day before season opener and camp out.

I need to do further research as to cost etc. but if anyone is familiar with helicoper rates in Colorado I'd like to hear from them.
 
> Just last week I
> talked to a game
>warden about helicoptering into a
>landlocked area for elk hunting.

Did he say its legal there?

Utah has for instance 2 laws that make it unfeasable, #1 you cant hunt within 3 days of flying over an area. #2 you cannot fly out a harvested big game animal via an airplane (commercial planes excluded).


-DallanC
 
This whole issue is about extravegance and money. If you have enough to throw at a particular sport, anything goes.
That is why Alaska and some other states have the rule against hunting on the same day you fly in...
Hell, lets just start hunting 24/7 using night vision, live decoys, bait, no limits, no rules... And in some countries if you have the dough, you can do just that...





Stop Global Whining
 
Dallan C,

I asked the game warden about the legality and he said it was OK. He knows of guys who do it every year.

When asked if Colorado had the same rule as Alaska, he merely said, "these guys fly in on Friday and hunt Saturday". I guess I should have pinned him down on that question.

With my luck however, the helicopter would probably spook the elk out of those two or three sections and I would get skunked. And I'd piss off a bunch of other hunters.

Easymoney,

You're right! But what's the difference - spending money on a guide who points out the elk or flying in for a DIY hunt. I know, both are expensive. I guess I'll have to sell my first born :D
 
"MANY TIMES I'VE WISHED I HAD A CHOPPER TO RETRIEVE GAME!!!"
-
Since we're playing the wishing game, I'll take some winning lotto tickets...
 
>Hey Bess if you took your
>50 cal. with, you could
>spot for quads & do
>some aerial tune-ups while your
>at it,
>be careful however since you might
>take some incoming fire in
>your chopper, from some pissed
>off quad owners.


I agree, if it is not wilderness i see nothing wrong with it. I bet there are a lot of hypocrites here.... Any of you that said NO ever hunt Alaska and use a bush plane?? Whats the difference?
 
>Hey Bess if you took your
>50 cal. with, you could
>spot for quads & do
>some aerial tune-ups while your
>at it,
>be careful however since you might
>take some incoming fire in
>your chopper, from some pissed
>off quad owners.

I agree, if it is not wilderness i see nothing wrong with it. I bet there are a lot of hypocrites here.... Any of you that said NO ever hunt Alaska and use a bush plane?? Whats the difference?
 
Hey bess......Are you kidding? Would you also maybe use a machine gun for hunting and ask if that was ethical? Same difference.

How anyone could possibly call shooting an animal out of a chopper "hunting" is beyond me big time. That activity is simply known as killing.

But, I would think that in a total wilderness area, an area where you can't take a vehicle into, one with no roads, maybe a chopper ride into the area would be OK, then a few days later, pick you up. Similar to a bush plane ride into remote areas of Alaska where you can't get to those areas any other way. THEN you hunt regular (you know, walk.....glass.....stalk....HUNT!!).

Scottyboy got it right.......the only thing choppers should be used for is culling animals that have gotten past the carrying capacity of the land, or are diseased, whatever. For game management purposes only. Otherwise it's a lame deal and I think people who think like that should be doing other type of sporting activities, cause that ain't sporting at all.
 
10,000 YOTES!! Sounds like fun!!! But it wouldn't be huntin, just shootin. It is illegal to hunt in Alaska if you have used a helicopter to transport you or any part of your gear. Even if you wait a month!! You must wait until the next day for air planes. It is legal in most designated Wilderness Areas of Alaska to use Planes, Snow Mobiles,ATVs and outboard motors. No Helicopters for recreational use in Wilderness areas. I want a chopper for hunting elk sheds!!Man could I cover some gound then....... Groundhog
 
"I agree, if it is not wilderness i see nothing wrong with it. I bet there are a lot of hypocrites here.... Any of you that said NO ever hunt Alaska and use a bush plane?? Whats the difference?" (Schmaltz)...............


Schmaltz, since you asked "what's the difference?" here's a couple real obvious ones for ya; The difference between being flown into a remote site in Alaska, setting up camp, then hiking, glassing, and stalking vs. shooting an animal out of a chopper is the difference between hunting and killing. Shooting an animal from a chopper, plane, boat or anything under power is simply called killing. No hunting skills required whatsoever. No different than shooting an animal over the internet.

Shooting animals out of a chopper hardly qualifies as "fair chase". Bobcat, I'm a little surprised you even posted this question.

So for those guys who only want the meat, or at least, for some of them, I guess it doesn't matter to them how to go about it. Might as well legalize auto weapons too for that matter. But for others who want to pit their skills against the critters and be a little challenged, those guys are hunters. And my answer of course is no, I wouldn't shoot one out of a helicopter.
 
freedivr2!!!

I DON'T SEE ANYTHING WRONG WITH A BIG MACHINE GUN,A .50 IS A CENTERFIRE THAT MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS RIGHT???

ACTUALLY,THE ONLY REASON I STARTED THIS THREAD WAS TO SEE IF ALL THE LAWBREAKING ATV'ERS WOULD DIS-AGREE WITH ME!!!

YOU KNOW,IT'S O.K. IF I THRASH THE FOREST WITH MY ATV BUT I DON'T WANT TO SEE YOU FLYING YOU CHOPPER!!!

I KNOW IT'S NOT ETHICAL BUT IF THEY MADE IT LEAGAL EVERY IDIOT THAT OWNS A GUN WOULD BE FLYING ONE!!!

YA,I CAN JUST SEE IT NOW,OH YOU CAN FLY ONE BUT YOU MUST FOLLOW THE RULES & LAWS,HELL YOU CAN'T GET PEOPLE TO DO THAT!!!

DON'T WORRY,I DON'T OWN A CHOPPER,BUT IF I DID I'D BE DOING SOME AIR TO GROUND TUNE-UPS!!!

THE ONLY bobcat THINKING IT JUST MIGHT BE THE NEXT PIECE OF HUNTING TECHNOLOGY AS THEY CALL IT!!!
 
Wow, sport/subsistence hunting - especially trophy hunting from a fixed wing or rotor is completely ridiculous. Wildlife management is another matter.

However, what's it saying about out "hunting" heritage when we can afford to use choppers and planes for finding our game. This too is just another way for people to seperate hunting from harvesting - and I'm not even a purest!

Anyone, if they choose, can go on-and-on about how big places like Alaska might be and how you really need to locate the herds on foot. Instead, I say if you're headed up there, you had better pack a lunch! The wildlife need some advantage and we, humans, are not birds.

I'm not against using them to get to a particular location, so long as it really is the only way to get there, but imagine what might happen if choppers become the vehicle of choice for Marco Polos?
 
Weren't a couple of our more renown - or should I say - infamous Mule Deer hunters both accused of hunting via the air? Wasn't one of them accused of using an ultralight to spot big bucks on the Paunsagaunt and then guide his clients and himself to them on the same day? Wasn't the other accused of using an airplane to locate and photograph big bucks in extreme high altitudes and then hunt them the same day - bringing up speculation of gunning from the air?

Didn't BOBCATBESS get a little visit from the ATF about his use of a .50 Cal to hunt for the Nomad buck? Wasn't he also investigated for building "quad" pits filled with pungy sticks covered in excrement along some of the more highly traveled ORV trails in the Uintahs? Wasn't his computer also confiscated for having controversial pics of overweight Basin gals in some kind of Calendar fiasco?

HMMMMM Rumors, rumors, rumors.
ROY
 
Nope!
I know a guy that shot a monster bull in the Mt. Adams Wilderness and got caught in a snowstorm and hiked out, leaving the bull behind. He barely made it out. When the storm cleared the next day he got one of his buddies that was heli-logging in the area to fly him back in to pick up the bull. Something like that I have no problem with, it was an emergency situation.
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Eric
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-01-06 AT 06:49PM (MST)[p]To make hunting ethical we should have to use spears. How fair is it that we get to shoot at things at 400 yards.


THE ONLY marksmen THINKING THAT HE IS GOING TO GO KITTY CAT HUNTING FOR PISSING OFF SO MANY PEOPLE.
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-02-06 AT 11:33AM (MST)[p]>LAST EDITED ON Apr-01-06
>AT 06:49?PM (MST)

>
>To make hunting ethical we should
>have to use spears.


Dude...Ethical and sporting/fair chase are not one in the same. You can be unethical with a spear too (you know, use a spear out of season, spear a deer in the butt because you didn't have any better shot than that, blah blah). Shooting deer or elk out of a chopper and calling it hunting is a misnomer. It's not hunting, OK, that's the point.

P.S. Neither my eyes nor my muzzleloader with iron sights work very well at 400 yards. If you're shooting at 400 yards with a scope, you probably don't have a whole bunch of hunting skills in your toolkit.
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-02-06 AT 07:52PM (MST)[p]Dude, i am just messing with you. Can you really see a guy tackling a grizzly with a spear. Seriously, can't you take a joke. Do you get on here just to gripe. Well if so the following are some things you can gripe about: I love Ted Kennedy, global warming kicks @$$, I hope they drill all over alaska and make huge pipelines, Hillary Clinton is my roll model, I like Canadian gun laws, I hope they invent a bomb to take out the rest of the ozone, i love to hunt illegally out of season with a spot light, and finally, I am an illegal immigrant, i don't work, I draw wellfare. so screw off and have a nice day.

P.S. whitetail deer are cooler than muleys.
 
Dude......with all the wierdos out there, you never know when someone is just messing with you or if they're serious as a heart attack....

While it's nice to know so much about your pitiful liberal arse, (you left out global warming, you mornon.....) I'll just be a good neighbor, bite my tongue and leave it at that :)
 
Fair enough, i will shut up too. No hard feelings, I just had to see how a bunch of hunters would react to my views on things..... JM



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