Eastmans' editorical

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mtmiller

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LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-06 AT 08:00AM (MST)[p]Finally finished this months Eastmans' while putting in some time on the stationary bike. Unfortunately this was the last part of the magazine I read and it left me shaking my head. I was hoping for a response from Guy, but unfortunately there wasn't. For those that did not see it, I thought I would share. Maybe the author is in the crowd here.

hahah...maybe I should check my spelling before submitting.

FROM EASTMANS'
Would you consider a hunt for a 400 class bull elk fair chase if it was conducted on 7500-plus acres of very steep, rugged country? One thing, the perimeters are 'high fenced.' I am a dedicated hunter of many species and have a true passion for sheep hunting, which I am sure you would agree is one of, if not the most physically demanding hunt of all. However, I am fortunate enough to be able to do it at 41 years old while still in great shape. Guy, we are all hunters, even those of us who hunt 'high fences.' In this day of strong anti-hunting movements I believe we should seek to 'unite' hunters not 'alienate' them. You guys (Eastmans) have a couple of great platforms (T.V., magazine) to speak to 'all' hunters and unite them. Shame on you for missing the big picture. Remember that every future hunter lost or undeveloped is a lost customer for your business. Lastly I would hope you realize two very important facts. 1) People who hunt 'high fences' generally hunt many other ways as well. You are alienating yourself from them. 2) I don't see too much difference between having the freedom and resources to 'camp out' in the Wyoming high country and 'live' with the deer and elk while patterning them for days or even weeks at a time vs. going to a 7500 acre ranch with perimeter 'high' fences. Either way you know the animals are within the general vicinity and it is just a matter of time and persistence before you harvest one. I admire every hunter's kill and congratulate them. Provided the harvest was of legal means. I do this simply because they are fellow hunters who contribute many dollars to the sport I love. The sport I would like to see preserved for future generations starting with my children. Guy, pay attention to what you are doing, the anti-hunters must just love seeing you folks at Eastman's further THEIR cause by driving wedges into the hunting community with stupid slogans like 'no fences here' I do enjoy your magazine but the marketing 'genius' who came up with that slogan goofed up. Hoping you realize your platform.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Personally, I have no interest in hunting an elk behind a fence. To me, elk embody the wild, and should be hunted in wild conditions.

The above said... I find it distressing that so many hunters, particularly Western hunters, are extremely judgmental about hunting practices that may not conform to what is typical in their area. Some seem to have the attitude that, "Since I didn't grow up hunting that way... it must be wrong... and I'm against it".

We can all be against "canned" hunts, including those where elk are hunted in an enclosed pasture with no cover. But there are some ranches, such as the 7500 acre ranch mentioned in the editorial, where plenty of escape cover exists. IMO, we should consider those who hunt these properties as members of our hunting fellowship... not outcasts to be condemned.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Sorry, but the line has to be drawn somewhere, and I choose to draw it at hunting high fenced native game. There certainly are many shades of gray in the hunting world, but the original B & C rules are good rules. We as hunters can and should have some self imposed rules of ethics. When individuals and/or business entities step outside these bounderies we as sportsmen have a right to stand up and say that is not sport hunting as we know it and accept it.

I am not advocating making these operations illegal. You all have the "right" to participate and conduct these type of activities. I just won't condone these shoots. In fact I think hunting celebrities that promote these hunts on TV shows should be called out for doing so and I would hope they would feel some shame for debasing our great sport.

Todd Goldsmith
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

I don't see anything wrong with Eastman's picking out it's taget audience, and catering to it. If somebody wants to read about some high-fenced monster elk killed in somebodies acre enclosed pasture,they need to go buy a different magazine. This guy is an idiot to think that Eastman's should change their whole format and philosophy to make some pet-elk killer feel better about his bought and paid for "trophy". Give me break.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Hold on guys......First off, mtmiller is NOT an idiot or a full-time high fence hunter. Quite the contrary. He may have a different point of view on this particular issue, but that does not justify name calling on anyone's part. If you don't agree, fine. Write a respectful response supporting your view.

BOHNTR )))---------->
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-06 AT 10:05AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-06 AT 10:03?AM (MST)

BOHNTR, re-read mtmiller's post. He just posted an editorial he saw in Eastman's. I was calling the guy that wrote that editorial an idiot. I think mtmiller agrees with me. We all know how hard mtmiller hunts, and we all respect him.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Just one more thing. I wasn't referring to this guy as an idiot because of his opinion as much as him wanting a company to change it's slogan and it's entire philosophy because it didn't encompass what he felt hunting is. Eastman's has built up to what it is now by catering to the D.I.Y. western hunters. It would be like me writing to Nike saying it needs to get rid of the "Just do it" slogan and quit showing athletes wearing those shoes because it makes non-athletic or non-exercising people that like to wear tennis shoes feel "alienated".
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

High fenced hunts have plenty of mags out there specific to them.
Eastman's should stay the way it is. Although I do think they could change their slogan to something more fitting. (I'm sure there are those here that can catch my drift)

I don't care if the area is a rugged 7500 acres. Other hunters cannot access the area because of the fence, or private property boundaries. (drift thrown here) Therefore, it isn't like the bulls got to get to 400" because of so many successful hiding attempts from predators and hunters alike. High fence is a clear line for me. They have their place and I've stated it before.

Chef
"I Love Animals...They're Delicious!"
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-06 AT 10:29AM (MST)[p]nmtaxi:

I stand corrected sir, my apologies. My 'reading eyes" are definately not as good as they used to be. :) Although, I still feel just because someone has a different point of view does not classify them as an idiot. JMO....By the way Craig, I'm relieved it wasn't your point of view. :)

BOHNTR )))---------->
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

I think the author should get a subscription to Big Game Adventures and not Eastmans. I applaud Eastmans for their stance. They have a target customer and they know that customer prefers to read about fairchase western big game hunts. I used to buy BGA because there are articles of fairchase British Columbian hunts, but the HighFenced crap that I have to wade through to read those are too much for me to stomach.
http://sdana.photosite.com/DanasHuntingPics/
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Forgot one thing..

{napoleon/voice/on} "IDIOT!...GOSH! {napoleon/voice/off}

:D

Chef
"I Love Animals...They're Delicious!"
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

This is about what I'd expected from some in the MM audience... name-calling and harsh criticism.

Okay, let's "draw a line" somewhere. If a hunt takes place behind a high-fence, disqualify it from B&C and other trophy competitions. But that does not mean there is a need for the kind of harsh criticism from within the hunting community that only lends weight to the Anti's claim that any hunt behind a high-fence is a "canned" hunt, regardless of whether the fence encloses 100 acres of pasture or 100,000 acres of brush.

IMO, we need to broaden the hunting community, not restrict it, and intolerance of others only serves to fragment our interests, while strengthening the hands of those committed to banning all hunting, whether behind high-fence, or not.

HornedToad
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

High fences alone are enough ammo for the antis. Do you think the term "high fenced hunt" sounds like a 100,000 acre ranch?!

It sounds like a deer, elk, gazelle, whatever, is running around an enclosure coming to the call of the "feed in the bucket" when BAM!...bad shot ...let's run up against the fence to find an exit...when BAM!..BAM! BAM! It's over. Picture taking starts, the measurements take place and the balance paid.

I'm all for those that can't hunt the traditional way to do as they please and hunt as they can. Although to think that high fences and public land hunts are one in the same as far as how they are percieved by the antis is not true.

I believe high fenced hunts hurt our cause more than help it.
That's my opinion.

Chef
"I Love Animals...They're Delicious!"
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Bohuntr, no apologies needed. Maybe I was too harsh on this guy, but I still think him wanting to change Eastman's target customer base is rediculous. There are magazines strictly devoted to whitetails, to Texas trophy hunters, and I'm sure there's some for high-fenced hunters. Eastman's is one of the few that devote their magazine to Western, D.I.Y. hunters, and that guy, being the sheep hunter he is, should applaud this. To tell them "shame on you" for not catering to the high-fenced hunters is just nuts. They would lose a lot more customers than they would gain.
So, like I said, my statements were not really pointed at his opinion of high-fenced hunts, but his wanting an entire company to change everything about them to cater to a handful of high-fenced hunters.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

I think it's obvious that high-fenced hunting was originally and still today, driven by money. This money isn't spent on preserving the herds outside the fence. In fact, CWD is doing an incredible amount of damage to wild game. Nothing good can come from high-fenced hunting unless you own the property and can receive financial gain from it. High-fenced hunting is an oxymoron, it should be called high-fenced shooting. I could go on.

http://huntfairchase.com/
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

(I'm sure there are those here that can catch my drift)

In response to this statement I was thinking they could change it to "No HIGH fences here!" Or when they say that their "specialty is hunting mule deer in the HIGH country". They mean their "specialty is hunting Mule Deer in the HIGH country (a.k.a. low sagebrush flats, plateaus, cedar breaks, river bottoms, and deserts) And last of all when they say DIY (do it yourself) they mean Do It Yourself unless you can get a sweet guide on the best private land available and that guy with the big grey hair and beard to come call elk/guide for you.

I can't resist. Just one more. "Hard Time Bucks" Should be: You will have a "Hard Time coming up with the money to hunt this Kansas farm fed Monster non-typical Buck that the rancher has been watching for years and has tripped over his sheds because he dropped them in his back yard.

I am just trying to be funny so don't take offense. I read Eastmans bowhunting Journal every month and I enjoy thier movies as well. I just think some of their key phrases need translation.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Anybody that thinks Eastman's hunts are all diy hunts are snoking something. Kansas non-typicals eastern Montana mule deer Colorado elk on the Hill ranch very few of the people on here will ever be able to hunt places like these. I enjoy Eastmans magazine along with Trophy hunter and Mulie Crazy but could do without all the BS.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

FINALLY!

A Moosie with some sense!

Chef
"I Love Animals...They're Delicious!"
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Thanks for coming to my rescue Roy, but please feel free to crucify me if I become a high-fence advocate. hahah....

I sure wish you would hurry up and get on that high country deer hunt so we have something better to talk about around here.

Best of luck to all of those hitting the archery seasons during the next month.

Anybody else missing some good stories and pics? Tis the season.

As for you nmtaxi, you have screwed up my pronghorn scouting. Can't seem to find anything within 20" of what your mom put on the meat pole. Awesome buck.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Because I'm involved with them I may be biased but as has been said if you go by what Boone&Crockett says that answers it all. there's B&C hunters and there's Safari Club hunters, choose your poison. I'm not saying you have to get book animals to be a great hunter but at least you'll know what type of hunter you are. I'm not a big Eastman's fan but pick up a copy of Safari Times and try not to puke, it will make you appreciate the "Eastman's way" and hate high fence shoots.
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

This kind of thing just gets my blood boiling! The editorial that was posted in Eastman's is just plain nonsense. I understand there exists a broad range of hunters, each with their own idea of what hunting is. Fine, if you want to hunt high-fenced elk, that is your freedom of choice here in America. We may even have to be united in our cause to protect our 2nd amendment rights, but that does not mean I have to approve or endorse your idea of what real hunting is.

The hunting world in North America IS big enough to belong to a sub-culture that has your like minded people in it. But that is not enough for this guy. So he is a high-fence elk hunter. Why is he not hanging around with SCI folks? He has to come on to Eastman's and complain about how they are excluding him and his fragile feelings and damaging the hunting world. This is what really makes me mad, he is trying to slide this whole sack full of @#^$% in as a guilt trip under the banner of protecting our 2nd amendment rights. BS!

Make no mistake, he does not only want your acceptance, he also wants your APPROVAL! He wants YOU to feel about his brag of stalking behind the feed truck, up on that 440 Bull, to be equal with your brag of finally after years of work, study, conditioning and a little luck that you took that trophy, (regardless of it's size).

So why is this guy reading Eastman's in the first place when it is so clearly a non-highfence magazine APPEALING to the non-highfence hunting subculture? I'll tell you why.... because stories like: "Field judging your trophy by eartag" " How to Corner your trophy" and "Tractor Blinds" would make for some really sucky reading. They see the grandiosity of the pictures and stories from Eastmans and they want that, but they don't want the WORK!!!!!! that comes along with that kind of glory.

It's like competing in a marathon, using a pair of rollerblades and then trying to gab with the other runner's about how you overcame "the wall" at mile 22. Or it's like demanding legitimacy at a backpack troutfisherman's banquet when all you fish are trout farms! "It's like asking to be recognized in Pope & Young, when you shot the bull with a 300 Ultramag at 400 yards!

I don't spend much time thinking negatively about SCI, because I don't think of them at all! I have better things to do, according to what my interests are and I try and surround myself in subcultures that have like-minded people. Like most of y'all.

Anyway, on a lighter note, I really like Eastman's magazine. It is by no means perfect, and there is a small level of cheesiness that comes along with a philosophy that I generally respect. It focuses on Western States hunting for western game, and that is pretty much all I am interested in. For the subscriber that wants to read about foodplots and supplements, let him get Buckmasters or something else. Eastman's should absolutely make no apology for the target audience they are appealing to or for the content that they publish. If any of the Eastmans did apologize for this, that's when I would be on the phone.

On even a lighter note, I have to smile and shake my head a little when I hear Mike Eastman say: "hunting trophy animals out west, Spot and Stalk....."The Eastman Way" That one makes me smile. It doesn't keep me from buying his new releases though.

Just my two cents.

Autumn Pulse

"Be a straight-shooter in all that you do."
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Ethics test - when you know its alright, it doesn't bother you if someone else has an opposing opinion about the way you hunt. It's when you're hiding your own misgivings about it that you feel a need to get defensive. And when all you can do is deal the "What about the antis!" card, well, you must not have a leg to stand on, eh?
 
RE: Eastmans' editorial

Right on Legolas

"Be a straight-shooter in all that you do."
 
I read the article and thought this guy has to much money. I am 100% against high fence hunting. I read it and just shook my head. " NO FENCES " should not offend anyone it is what true hunting is about. Hunting on public or private ground where animals can escape is ok with me. High fenced hunt the animal cannot escape no matter where it may run you still can find it. On the other hand you scare a 400 " bull on public land your probably going to never see him again because he will change zip codes. That is my 2 cents I am glad eastmans doens't publish high fenced hunts it take all of the thrill of the hunt out of the articles.
 
I've had a couple stories and pics in Eastmans but that is not my editorial.
MIKE
 
The reason there was no reply from Eastman's? There's no need to reply when the guy made an A$$ out of himself already.
 
" Divid and conquer" I don't think so. not many of us were ever on board with high fence shooters anyway, they're not hunters.
 
Doesn't matter if you're pitching horse shoes or hunting mule deer when you succeed it feels a lot better when you earned it! But guys this is a free country and people can do what they wish, and as long as it is legal some one some where will figure out how to make a buck off making it easy.

sagehntr
 
If I have to legitimize high fence hunters in order to fight the "anti's", I'll have to think long and hard about just giving it up first.

When a group fails to cast out those that have drifted, muddied or muddled their cause or their name they lose their basic thrust and whatever moral ground they held. There's a distinct and unwholesome
"harvesting" community that has morphed into the tradition of hunting. It wears the same clothes, buys the same products and claims the same tradition. Falsely. I deny those that say we allow ourselves to be divided and become weaker when we won't stand with them. I believe we sully our name we elliminate our tradition's basis and high ground. We provide cover for this nonsense at our peril.
 
Yes, let me hunt you high fence area for the price of an nonresident hunter.
Come on, i dare you,
I'll take that challenge./
What your only in for the money.
then take your high fence and stuff it up your.... dark side.
 
If Eastmans only shared and made money on stories of DIY, high country hunts they would add more credibility to their slogon. The fact is they don't. I did not write it, but I can agree with some of what it says. If you go on guided hunts on private land with a 100% chance of killing a trophy, that is a "canned hunt" in a lot of peoples minds. Is that wrong? Does that money go straight into the wildlife? What about your buddy that patterned a monster coming to the only water hole for miles for you to shoot opening morning? Just like shooting fish in a barrel.

The problem I have, is that people only can think of the animals being trapped up against some high fence begging for their life. Personally I have never seen this on any of the shows or videos which have taken place on a "High Fence Ranch".
I'm sure on occasion it happens, but it is not the norm. I would guess that the ones saying it is bad probly have not done it.

I have never hunted a high fence property, but my dad is going to be 80 years old and soon will not be able hike or spend many hours on a stand. I was thinking of saving up and taking him on a "canned" hunt when this happens. Would this be wrong? He still loves seeing animals and harvesting and eating them. The problem is you don't get much of a chance if you cannot get out of the truck. My dad is a great hunter and deserves to enjoy his last hunts the best way he can. The pictures that get hung up in most houses are the ones of success.

I do a lot of hog hunting on private property as well. We are at 100% success. Should I feel bad or ashamed of that? What about the use of our dogs? When I tell people that it is almost a sure thing they get more excited with anticipation, is that wrong also?

Mule deer in Canada feeding on the farm fields or a big buck at a water hole in the desserts of Mexico or even an animal in a fenced enclosure. We must decide if we will pull the trigger, not some anti.

I personlly would like each of us to be able to decide which is right for our ethical, finacial and phyical condition. We do need to stay together to ensure the future of hunting what ever your defintion of it is. For me I do get tired of people tossing "moral darts" at other hunters. It seems that someone who goes on many "canned hunts" shouldn't put themself above others by saying "No Fences Here", because chances are if they needed those they would have them also.

Just my thoughts, Mike
 
It's not unethical to kill a game animal with a gun this isn't about kiling the animal. I just dont think it's hunting or part of the country's hunting herritage to do it on a high fence ranch. This goes round and round so I'll keep it simple.

In the same breath that they say.. "it's a huge ranch, the game would be here anyway and they can escape you"... they say bubkus when you ask... why the high fence then, if the game would be here anyway?

Why the high fence? It's to maintain an artificial, near zero predator game park management system that can market great quality in antlers with 100% success. Want to kill deer/elk/zebra on those ranches have at it, it means nothing to me. Want to tell me I have to call you the same kind of outdoorsman as the vast majority of hunters and I have to consider you an equal, not going to happen. If you feel trod on, get over it. If you feel that strongly about the legitmacy of it, nothing anyone says should disuade you. The truth I suspect is that most know damn well it's a cheap knock off of hunting they just don't want to be called on it.

I have no problem with someones 80 year old dad paying to shoot game. Do you think he is confused about what he's doing? The 80 year olds I've known wouldn't have sold themselves a bill of goods about it being a real hunt. But they may very well want to feel the rush, hear the report of a rifle, smell camp fires, eat game and revel in the company of men. All good things for sure and there's a place for it. If these places were for the physically disabled, aged and otherwise people with disadvantage to have an experience I'd feel a lot better about them. But for the most part they're about people with more money than sense, with able bodies to shoot what they can't or won't the hard way and then... brag about it and complain they can't enter B&C.
 
I applaud Eastmans for it's stance and hope they never change. To each his own but I believe fenced hunts give "hunting" a black eye and will never participate or support these "hunts".
 
SilentStalker, what stance is that? Say "do it yourself", then pay for a fully guided canned hunt. Where I come from they would call me a hypercrit for that. That being said, I would love to be in a position to afford a hunt like that from time to time. I just don't like the slogans.

I do not know too many private ranches that don't aggressively manage the preditors on their land legal or otherwise to protect their livelyhood, ranching or selling hunts on their land. I also know of some landowners who push the elk back to to their property so their clients can kill them, but your right the fences were not high. Those ranches do have fences, they were put their for the cattle they used to run,. but now it is the game on the land that is very valuable. If it was that way first the fences would have been much higher (since cattle doesn't jump too high).

I am not supporting high fence ranches, just trying to show the simalarities that exist and the fine line between "great" or "disgusting". I also think with the price of trophy mule deer and elk hunting continuing to rise the differences will decrease. Private land and it's wildlife will become more and more valuable. With this people will go to farther lengths to protect it and business.

The people that are so against high fence hunts, but will hunt on a private ranch that manages it's herds will find themselves without a leg to stand on or a fence to sit on.

You don't have to like something to not to come out and condem it.
Mike
 
I'm sure I'll get some flack for this but here it go's. I don't really think there is a whole lot of difference between "some " high fence ranches and many of the limited entry units. Take Utah for example. You draw a tag for the pahavant and your going to kill a 350+ class bull if you know what one looks like. Infact your selection is much better on the limited entry units. I have a good friend that manages a high fenced ranch. He has killed more trophy's (mostly mule deer) than you can shake a stick at. All on public land. He however does not hunt the high fenced ranch himself. It's just not him. My 80 year old grandfather has also killed many public land elk in his younger days. However he don't have the legs any more to go at it on public ground., so me and my brothers pitched in and bought him a tag for a management bull on this high fenced ranch last year and he had the time of his life and got a respectable bull. I personally have no intentions of hunting a high fenced ranch, but when I get older I may consider it. I think what gives the high fenced hunts a bad name is some of the unethical ways they are operated. My friends ranch is 1000 acres and it has everything. Steep Canyons, dark timber, aspens, mahagony, oak, natural springs with wallows--the whole 9 yards. And if you think hunting one of these ranches is a cake walk your in for a suprise. They had a 400 class bull in there last year and a guy came in to hunt him. My buddy said they hunted that bull for seven days and never turned him. The guy ended up killing another bull. Incidentally, another hunter found and killed that 400 bull on a different hunt. My point is you may never have the desire to hunt a high fenced ranch, but don't judge to soon. There are many ranches that are operated and owned by respectable people who run respectable outfits.

Mike
 
High fenced hunts are fine for handicapped and challenged but, the risk of disease far outweighs any other benefits
 
Hey Deerlove, do you have any hunting subscriptions? I don't know of any without advertising for "canned hunts". If you know of any please let me know.

I went on a guided hunt in northern Wyoming a few years back. On that hunt the guide drove us around one of his leases and in 5 hours we counted over 50 bucks we could shoot. I think that would fall into the catagory of a "canned hunt".

Maybe my idea of a canned hunt is wrong.

Mike
 
OK,

MrB has posted a related thread asking what a canned hunt means to you. So far, on this thread, I have heard it all. Even a comparison of high-fence hunting to a trophy-managed unit. WTF?

On that thread, (this one is getting a little long) lets hear your definition of what a canned hunt is and IS NOT!

From the sounds of it, it looks like some of you are anti-increasing your odds of taking an animal!

"Be a straight-shooter in all that you do."
 
I think the point a lot of you are missing is that this guy's 80 year old father who's legs aren't what they used to be isn't the same kind of person that would write the whiney letter to Eastman's. I have absolutely no problem with someone in that situation doing it even if it isn't 100% 'hunting'. His 80 year old father is not going to be on MonsterMuleys or writing Eastman's the day after he shoots a bull complaining about not being able to enter it in B&C...

This whole topic wasn't started to discuss why high fence operations suck (and they do). It was about some ahole complaining that everyone doesn't support his view of what hunting is.

Apparently, from reading the replies some people think there is no difference between high fence hunts and having a decisive advantage gained through hard work, time invested, or research. Here is the difference;

1.) If you've got a buddy that put the time in and has a huge bull patterned to using X water hole at X time every third day, and all you have to do is connect the dots and shoot the bull 30 minutes after you set up...good job. Somebody invested a lot of time and effort to gather that info...they worked for it. Granted, I wouldn't get a very fulfilled feeling out of harvesting an animal that someone else had patterned, but like it or not it's still fair chase hunting.

2.) Many (if not most) dedicated hunting outfits that manage their property year round actively practice predator reduction. The difference between a high fence operation and these other guys is simple; predators are free to come and go onto their property, as is the wild game that they are trying to protect them from. This is not possible on a high fence ranch. No matter how many predators you 'control', more will come and fill the void you created by removing one provided that an impassible barrier isn't in place to stop it.

3.) High fence ranches are breeding grounds for disease that can have devastating effects on wild animal populations. This is unrefutable...

4.) Many (again probably most) year round private land hunting operations do have a lot more game animals available to harvest than surrounding public ground. This is due to these animals desire for not being disturbed, better habitat, etc. Public ground is not only used by hunters, but all year long by hikers, bikers, horsemen, loggers, smowmobilers,etc. Animals will go where the people aren't. Many of these operations boast 100% success rates every year. Does hunting one of these private land outfits constitute a canned hunt? The answer is no...The reason is because someone has taken the time and effort to create conditions and habitat that ATTRACT FREE RANGING ANIMALS TO THEIR PROPERTY. You or Joe or Harold compensate them for their effort and get to take advantage of it. The key difference between the high fence operation and a legitimate hunting operation is in bold.

For the record I have never paid a dime to hunt private land, gone on an outfitted hunt, or have anyone in my family that owns more than 20 acres. And, I have no plans to do so in the future. I don't have a problem with anyone that choses to hunt this way though, because it is still legitimate hunting with increased odds.

With that being said I have made some great friends over the years with a few landowners and have pretty much exclusive access to some very well managed private land in certain states for certain game animals. But, most of my time is still spent hunting public land during general seasons along with what seems like the entire population of California sometimes...

'High fence hunting' is not hunting, period. That is exactly the misnomer we always see in the paper when a poacher gets busted and the words they use to describe him are 'hunter' and 'sportsman'. Apples and oranges...
 
Ipkus, thank you for your views. I think that I will not use the term "canned hunt" to discribe private land hunts without high fences in the future. Increased Odds Hunt or the Less Work Option sounds better. Believe me when I say I have no problem with the any type of hunting the Eastmans do. My only thinking on this has been that hunters and shooters of game get along well enough to fend off the Anti. Orgs. I don't think we will see the end of High Fence hunting in the near future, so we mays well focus our energy towards the obvious and largest threat. The PETA, Tree Hugger, dread-lock wearing, SOB that wants us to give up everything except pot and wellfare.

Just a thought, Mike
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-15-06 AT 05:56PM (MST)[p]What most of you are saying is....Unless you get a high country public land permit on forest service land.
Walk in with a 80 pound pack,sleep in the open,no horses or atvs
{thats all tainted}Anything else is cheating or wrong!!!Sounds stupid dont it!!!The truth is everyone is at different levels or skills or have age/health issues ect.The opinions each of us have change, as we get older and the things we could or would do
back then evolve....I remember when a guy would thumb his nose at hunting Pheasants on a game club. Now those guys go regular.
If you want to run your dogs thats were you go or guess what, you stay home.I bet most of the guys crying on here have never hunted on a high fence.They probobly havent hunted Texas or most any other foregin country cause every one does it different...
To each his own,Dont be jeolous that someone may have more money than you or be thankful you have good knees or what ever advantage you have...No i have never hunted a 'high fence'But i have guided hunts,sheep elk ect. in the west and hunted several different countries... Hunt anyway you feel comfortable and dont worry about everyone else They will just hold you back...Get over it
 
Hard to add anything that has not been said. However, I'd add that at least the author of the editorial recognizes that THE PROTECTION OF OUR HUNTING HERITAGE IS AND WILL BE AN UPHILL SOCIAL/LEGAL/AND POLITICAL BATTLE. Whether or not you agree with his assessment of Eastmans' tag line, at least he is acting towards a positive goal and providing food for thought.
 
Good point.I think MM is awsome for hooking up with other hunters to share info, ect.I just get sick of some guys crying about how some one else may have a advantage in some way over them...I wish they would quit whinning and go hunting or scouting or somthing...
 

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