Slow going in Washtucna area

[huntnut111]

I have a feeling this area of washington is being overhunted. 30 years ago there just weren't the deer populations in this area and now it does have a good population however with population increases comes hunter pressure increase. Last year for example the private property I was on had 15 bucks come off of it openening morning alone...this year 1. I passed up numerous legal bucks last year because I would just love to see some of these dinker three points grow to potential but passing them up just turns out to mean someone else is going to shoot them. I passed up two legal bucks this year and will go empty handed for this season but I feel good knowing that there are at least two bucks that have a chance to grow for next year. With success down in this area I have to believe that the kill success was just too great last year. I would like to know if anybody else reading this happened to hunt the Washtucna area and if so what you thought about this season.

 

[WAstickslinger]

I coudn't agree more with how you feel about the overhunted area. I am just west of you and south of Moses Lake. I let many nice three points and even a few four points walk during the early muzzleload to see them get bigger. Well, I made a few rifle hunters very happy is all I did. There were about 6-8 nice legal bucks and a few big ones in a little are that has never had much pressure. I know of 6 for sure that were killed during the opener of rifle. It is too bad that 90% of people kill the first legal buck they see. Please, do not get me wrong, I have nothing against those people. It is just frustrating for us who let these bucks live to see them grow and then find out they were all shot.

Huntnut111, I drew the late Ritzville tag for muzzleload, Nov 20-30. I was planning to spend most of my time near Washtucna. Am I going to be dissapointed down there this year?

 

[JACKELOPE]

i spent the first 5 days over in pomeroy.. a little ways away from you but i noticed and was thinking the same things...i just finished hunting kindergarten...nothing but a few small bucks and a LOT of does and fawns...muleys and whitetails. i know 5 bucks at least came off the land i hunt last year, only 1 of which was a muley opening weekend last year. i probably only saw 4-5 whitetails this year in 5 days, one of which was a buck which i would have shot if he slowed down for a second. I believe i am in a seriously overhunted area and have been looking into other options off the beaten path, but i have a hard time leaving the whole family tradition/gathering, etc that happens over there every year.

 

[Tally]

I wish more Wa. hunters though like you.

 

[huntnut111]

Stickslinger, I'm in Ritzville I own the Circle T downtown. I have access to some great private hunting ground 90% of which I didn't even have time to hunt this year. I hunted with a friend during muzzleloader season on one of the pieces down by the palouse river and we had our pick of dandy bucks. I wasn't hunting but he was. He took out an old regress 5 point on one side two on the other. That was an excellent kill since the buck was so old. If you're interested just call the restaraunt and I can give you names of people who do allow hunting on private land. I think you'll find that south of Ritzville (and even north) has extremely depleted numbers this year. I went hunting two days ago on some ground that the guy said his grandkids always get their bucks opening day...this year they all went home empty handed. I saw one three point that I passed on and that's all I saw. Opening day was a real disappointment, I was the only guy with permission to hunt this piece of crp. This piece was heavily posted and I was hiking a hill before daylight when all of a sudden a group of teenagers fly up the hill nearly hitting me and they tore through the entire area I was going to glass when the sun came up. They shot three times when they were about a half mile from me and about thirty minutes later they flew right by me again (of course not stopping when I waved my arms at them) and out they went. All together that morning there were 15 trucks that drove through that piece of private property. I went back to that piece and there were two fresh gut piles on the first hill that I started to climb...so much for doing it right and getting written permission. There's one rancher in washtucna that does give out permission in Washtucna (I didn't have permission to hunt his ground) but I was on a ranch where I did have permission and I glassed over thirty legal bucks on his land including some real bruisers! If you'd like his name it's worth a shot.

 

[Triple_Shock]

it didn't seem to be much better over on the east central slopes... they musta really slaughterd the deer last year. i saw tons of little bucks and a good number of does but no real shooters in 6 days of HARD hunting. very odd indeed...

 

[WAstickslinger]

Huntnut111,
Hey thanks a bunch for the help. I will stop in next time I am down there and we can trade stories and BS a while over lunch. I appreciate one fellow hunter helping another. I have had the same frustrating experince of poeple hunting on ground I know they don't have permission to hunt. Some people are just plain lazy. Thanks again. I will send you a PM and trade phone #'s.

 

[JACKELOPE]

nice to know i wasn't alone in my lack of success. 9 kids trespassing on land with lots of posted signs opening day alone. i approached one group of 3 and they explained to me they were on someones land they had permission to hunt(wrong landowner's name) but they were just passing through to get to the land they had permission to hunt(again, wrong landowner's name) i saw plenty of deer, just none with adequate headgear.

 

[sjhgraysage]

Some of you other Wa. deer hunters may not agree with me but I think the only real solution is permit only deer hunting in Wa., especially for mule deer. Look at states like Colorado and Neveda, trophy deer are the norm, you may not be able to hunt your preffered area every year but when you do it definitely worth the wait.

 

[Bob D.]

>Some of you other Wa. deer
>hunters may not agree with
>me but I think the
>only real solution is permit
>only deer hunting in Wa.,
>especially for mule deer.


I agree with that!

 

[Sportfury]

I have to agree with you all. My son and daughter are up and coming where they will be ready to hunt in a few years, but my past expierences in the rifle deer season have not been quality.

In fact the last time I hunted rifle deer was about 4 or 5 years ago up in the Okanagon out of Tonasket. We got permission to hunt on a private ranch. The first night there I had a nice 4x4 in my sights, but he had a bunch of does with him, so no shot (at least for me). Then two guys from a neighboring ranch walk in from above and shot him while he was standing in the group of does. Next morning another guy from who knowswhere (we were the only truck parked at the ranch) shot another buck as it was coming up the draw below me. Not to mention the people on four wheelers cutting threw the ranch to go to other places or the dumba** who looked at me thru his riflescope just to see who I was. So much for getting permission to hunt on private land.

Permit only hunts for mule deer might be a great way to go. Sure it would limit some peoples hunting, but it would also limit the local yahoos who think just cause they live in the area they can do what they want and it would also limit the "take the first deer you see" syndrome and give some of these bucks a chance to grow up.

Sportfury

 

[sjhgraysage]

BobD & Sportfury,
Do you guys think we would have enough support for this idea to go to the Dept of Wildlife or the Commissioners with it?
Thanks for the replys.

 

[Bob D.]

No, I do not. They had permit-only mule deer hunting as an option in the online survey they did last year, and it was not popular. Most people want to hunt any unit they want, every year. I wish Washington would manage our deer the same way Oregon does.

 

[Colville]

I prefer oportunity to quality. I'll deal with pressure by doing what i have to to take advantage of it. I have absolutely NO interest in hunting every third year so that we can "improve quality". As long as the basic herd is propagating itself, the land is carrying an appropriate capaacity and breeding is occuring successfully I have no interest making hunting in WA a trophy affair. It's the road to becoming Utah and it also drives money interests into locking up more of the private as the value of the more limited hunting oportunity is driven up. No thanks.

 

[JACKELOPE]

colville has a very valid point. there are areas to go for the quality experience if you don't mind burning boot leather. as stated before many many times, get away from the roads a bit and you'll eliminate most of the crowd. i am one who should listen to my own words i guess.

 

[huntnut111]

One of our neighboring states was mentioned in this thread...Oregon, another good example is Idaho. I've hiked in on foot to the High country hunt in the Pasayten, there are good areas to find good deer off the beaten path but nothing like a conservatively managed state like Idaho. Limiting more GMU's to draw units is what states like Idaho, Utah, NM, AZ, OR etc have done with success. There still are OTC tags in all the previously mentioned states but there are a lot more tag only GMU's in those states than we have in Washington. Remember we're not comparing racks here we're talking hunts where you can enjoy hunting without extreme pressure, where you're not afraid you're killing the last buck within 10 sq. miles and where you can hunt with your kids without bullets whizzing by and you can teach them how to hunt using your feet, your optics, the wind, the terrain etc. It's just impossible to hunt and teach others how to hunt with the four wheelers ripping and pickups flying over hills. I agree with getting away from the roads and I've tried that, we were in the Pasayten one year about 6 miles in and we got caught in a snow/ice storm in September in the middle of the night and had to pack out at about 2AM with head lamps and GPS in hand. I've kind of gotten to the point where 1 mile off any road is more than I'll do by myself and I've never had the fortune of being the only hunter around...maybe two miles is the key The problem with limiting more GMU's is lost revenue to the state...they'll probably never consider it. I have story relating to lost revenue and the game department if you have time to read. My buddy shot a buck this year that had black lungs. He called the Game department and got in touch with a biologist. The biologist told him to flip a coin and then decide to eat it or not. He wasn't satisfied with that answer fearing that the deer may have huntavirus or something so he kept asking questions. A different biologist told him it was fine (nobody would come out and look at it). I think that the fear is that if word got out that some disease was in a heard it could cause massive revenue loss to the state. He finally took the lungs to a vet and the vet told him just make sure you cook the hell out of it. He's had a few steaks and he's still alive for now; I just thought the lack of interest from the game dept was fishy.

 

[Colville]

The math is simple... WA doesn't produce like Idaho or MT NOT,, ahem NOT because of failing to have a draw, micomanagement or any other "quality" over oportunity development strategy. It's the population base vs the habitat.

http://roadless.fs.fed.us/documents/feis/data/sheets/acres/appendix_state_acres.html

http://www.factmonster.com/ipka/A0004986.html

We have roughly half Idaho's NF lands and 5 times Idaho's population. WA can't grow habitat and while we have vast areas of sage country that is decent habitat it is also largely private pushing even more pressure to the public lands.

You simply can't drive CO, MT, ID numbers or quality without either cutting the pop in half or inventing new forrests. Pretending that WA can model any of those states is silly.

 

[Bob D.]

LAST EDITED ON Oct-26-06 AT 09:05AM (MST)[p]>We have roughly half Idaho's NF
>lands and 5 times Idaho's
>population.

Isn't that just the reason that limiting the number of tags would make sense? Even Idaho has a quota on the number of deer tags sold each year. Why does Washington have unlimited numbers? Is it because it's so hopeless that there's no point in even trying to manage the mule deer properly? Or what? I do somewhat agree with the point you made in your previous post, but limiting the number of mule deer tags wouldn't necessarily mean all units would have to be managed for "trophy" hunting. With Oregon's system of mule deer hunting by permit only, you can still hunt every year if you choose to apply for certain units that have a large quantity of tags. Or if you don't mind skipping a year or two, you can build up a couple of points and hunt a unit with less hunters.

 

[Colville]

Mule deer aren't struggling in this state. You see the problem is one of perception only. Some guys want fewer hunters and bigger bucks that are bigger on land that gets pressure!

The deer herd is not in trouble. So the current system is maximising oportunity without harming the herd. The only Q then becomes, would you rather hunt every 4th year to be sure you'd see more decent deer on a given trip. I would NOT. Not when guys willing to work extra hard have that oportunity now.

To get to Idaho numbers we'd have to slash oportunity drastically. I want to hunt every year. We have a 3 pt reg in place, the herds are in good shape to the point of offering plenty of doe tags. The whole movement is about trophy, not herds.

 

[JACKELOPE]

again i agree with colville...not to be the guy who just agrees...but i saw plenty of mule deer this year. probably outnumbered whitetails 4 to 1 where i hunt. not many bucks, but lots of deer. i counted 17 does and fawns in one fairly large draw i was hunting over in the southeast where usually i see nothing but whiteys and daydream of seeing muleys. too many people in this state want to hunt every year, me included.

 

[Bornforhorns]

Colville hit the nail on the head, if you don't mind...the next time this conversation comes up I'll need to copy and paste your words. I believe Washington is doing about well as it possibly could and I wouldn't want to live anywhere else.

 

[sjhgraysage]

Colville,
Yes we can burn boot leather and avoid some or most of the people, however not every hunter is physically capable of that, I hunt with my young sons (11 & 13) and I'm not going to burn them out walking their legs off at this point in thier lives, when they are ready for that, then we'll consider it. Personally I don't thgink that a permit only situation in Wa. would amount to hunting every 3 or 4 years, I just think that it would make us decide where we really want to spend our hunting time. As you know now we have some that hunt the okanogan the first few days then some place else for a while and then hunt whitetails in Stevens, Spokane or Pend Orielle county during the late whitetail season if they haven't killed something. I believe that the permits could be fairly liberal in terms of numbers. Bottom line is that I think it would help, and that it will likely Never Happen. Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts on the matter.