Two skunked noobs

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ElkSmith

Guest
Hey guys,

After two straight years getting skunked on the general elk hunt, my brother and I are very discouraged. We are first generation hunters trying to learn and have never gotten an animal. We don't have atv's or horses, just packs and rifles. My questions are the following:

1-We have hunted different areas of the South Slope both years and briefly in the Monte cristo area and have put in some hard hunting but never even seen a bull. Is there an area (hopefully close to SLC) we could go this weekend in a last ditch effort in the any bull general region that we might have a better chance of seeing bulls? bulls of any size, mind you.

2-Should we apply for different tags next year? Antlerless, Spike etc...? We just want to learn to hunt properly(reading every article and post on MM apparently doesn't cut it), and seeing more than tracks and scat would do wonders for morale.

I realize this is lame, but we really don't have anywhere else to learn from and our current methods obviously aren't working. Any tips at all will be greatly appreciated.
 
Big bucks and bulls are earned on general areas with a lot of summer scouting, winter scouting, loads of miles on your truckl, time spent away from family, weekends away from family.

general elk units are tough any way you look at it. I've been hunting them for 10 years now "Im also a first generation hunter" and I have yet to kill a bull elk. Its not that I don't see them but hunting them with a bow is very difficult.

Now when you have put so much time in on general areas the last thing "I" or anyone wants to do is have someone come in that has only been hunting for one or two years and shoot out your honey holes so to speak.

Le areas are different Ill generally let someone know what they can expect on a Le area or might even help them out with my own sweat, gas, ect but your on your own on a general area.

good luck on your quest guys! Look at it like this, at least you know where there are no elk. Now keep looking in other areas you will eventually find them if you put in the time.





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Understandable. We have put in the effort but like you said haven't been at it that long. Thanks for the advice.
 
Buy a spike tag next year and put in for a cow tag in a good area. This is a good way to get started. General area can be tough.
Get up high and glass you can spot a elk from five miles away with some good glass. Then put the boot leather down.If you find them at night, they wont be far from there in the morning. Go in early and down wind. A elk will see you once, .......twice......three times ! But he will only smell you once !! Then he is gone.
I hope you have better luck and I wish you the best. I had a dad that started me elk hunting at 11 and I shot my first branch antlered bull at fifteen. I feel lucky to have a good start.
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-14-11 AT 06:10AM (MST)[p]Subscribe to Eastmans hunting and read their MRS section. I'm not promoting their magazine but it gives you good info about productive areas. Contact your local game office and talk to the biologist for the area your hunting and ask where he might recomend you hunt. All it takes is a phone call.


Government doesn't fix anything and has spent trillions proving it!!!
Let's face it...After Monday and Tuesday, even the calender says WTF!
 
I agree with buying a spike tag. I hunted spikes for 13 years before I finally harvested a branch antlered bull this year. I thought several times of trying the any bull units but every year it came down to this: I would rather see many elk even I don't see or harvest a spike. Because at least I knew I was hunting well. I also agree that the any bull units produce some good bulls and I would love to take part in that, however the harsh reality for me is that I do not have the resources neccessary to be productive on those units. Add to that most of the any bull units are largely private property. Seeing elk every year is worth more to me than hunting for years, seeing few elk and maybe harvesting a larger bull. A spike bull is still an earned trophy in my book. Good luck
 
It is great to have "noobs" that are still trying. Too many guys give up after not seeing anything. I also agree that killing a spike is way easier than an "any bull". I am not sure there is an easy place to go to find a bull at this point, but I hope you will keep trying.
Good luck guys.
 
To all,

Thank you very much for your support and advice. It looks like the way to go is to plan on getting a spike tag next year and researching a decent spike area to go to. I agree that even just seeing elk even if there isn't a spike to shoot every year would be a lot more fun than never seeing anything. I might start applying for cow tags again too.

We are going out again this afternoon, hope to see some of you up in the mountains today and for years to come!

-ElkSmith
 
keep at it hard your time will come but general any bull is hard around the state
 
It's already been mentioned several times but you've got to do a lot of summer scouting, summer scouting and more summer scouting. Spend a lot of time behind your binos and spotting scouting.

If you hiking your hunting area all summer, you're going to find springs, wallows, game trails, bedding areas, feeding areas on some secluded little bench that you never knew were there, and no one goes into because it so brushy. And some might be only be 10 - 30 minute off your main road or trail.

Use the technology that's out there.. Carry a GPS and mark these areas you find while you're scouting and take a few pictures of them so you'll remember them later. Also log them on Google Earth and study the terrain your hunting. It's amazing what you can find looking at a satellite shot of your area.

Get some salt and a game camera or two out. I had one camera in a spot this year from July-Sept. This was a primo, ideal setup that two close friends stumbled onto last year while tracking a bull. It had a spring running into big wallow, perfect tree stand setup, and so very very secluded that the only two dates carved in the trees down there were 1959 and 1955 (the year I was born) . I just knew I'd kill my LE bull in there. My camera had dozens of bulls on it from the first time I checked it throughout the summer and into the fall. All of the bulls were 4, 5 and 6-points, but nothing smaller except 1-cow and 1 spike, but?? nothing bigger than 280-290?. Since this place looked so idea, without the camera I would have wasted a lot of time hiking into this hellhole and waiting for a big bull that never did come.

As far as ATV and horses. I have mules and ATVs and didn't use the mules all fall and not the ATV the day I killed my bull. I drove my car to a trailhead that day and my sons and I packed the meat out on our backs. And last year my wife and I backpacked her LE Bull out as well. Get some good boots and start hiking.

The whole draw back to the general hunt is my observation is that is much easier to kill a 300? bull in most of Utah than it is to kill a spike. That's not a bad thing. So put in for the LE hunts and be patient. My tag took 16 years to draw.

You still have several weeks, maybe a month that you can continue to learn your area this fall and have a head start on next year. Good luck
 
Multiply that 2 years you've put in by 10 years and you'll know what it really means to not be any good at elk huntin :)

I've hunted elk every single year for 31 years and finally killed a bull last year after finally drawing a San Juan tag.

I could write a few volumes on how to blow it on general units. Everything from missed shots to equipment failures to just plain and simple being stupid! For instance, this year I've hunted 26 days so far between general units and the front and have had one encounter at 35 yards on a little 5x5, which of course I blew.

You will pay dearly for every opportunity you get. My fuel bill alone was $1200 for Aug and Sept. That says nothing of the 40 days I went up scouting this spring and summer.

If I knew somewhere to tell you to go I would. Every time I've taken friends to my spots during the rifle hunt there's nothing there. As a bowhunter I've found there's no correlation to where the critters are during this part of the year.

Sorry to say, but that's something you have to earn and on the general units it could be dozens of years trying to sort it out.

Cheers,
Pete
 
like jim zumbo said to hell with elk hunting... lol not so tuff but its time spent before the hunt that makes it successful. 90% of the elk killed every yr are killed by 11% of the elk hunters. its the same 11% yr after yr who kill that 90% the othe 10 is first timers and blunders. those who are learning elk hunting. its a stick with it sport. took me 5 yrs to kill my first. then 4 with my bow to learn it all over in a diffent season. now after 24 yrs ive killed many. had 14 yr kill streak till the miss on a 5 by last yr. so just keep at it...
 
As was said, buy a spike tag next season. As a general rule, elk population and density is higher on the spike units than on the any bull units. Try to get out as much as you can during the time leading up to the hunt and just find and observe elk. How they behave where they like to hang out, just their general mannerisms. Understanding the animal is vital to your success hunting them.
 
Same advice as a lot of people. Try the spike only unit for a couple of years. You will learn what type of country and where Elk like to hang out.

But even with that knowledge you will likely strike out on the any bull units. My brother and I hiked a 6 mile loop in new country to us yesterday evening. All we found were 2 day old tracks up over the ridge and out of there. We did see a ton of different groups of tracks, so where we were would have been good a few days ago. But ATV's in the bottom of the draw got them to move on out.

But, at least we had an idea where to start, cause like neither of us had even been in that canyon before. We will be out mid week in another area. At least this one we have hunted before.
 
This year was my first year hunting the any bull unit and I was successful. I'm sure a lot of that was just plain dumb luck. But, I spent A LOT of time looking at google earth and downloading property ownership data and putting that on google earth so that I could see where good public land was. I also spent a lot of time up in the mountains finding good locations.

It paid off big time. Opening day I only saw 2 other guys and only saw them in the morning for about 5 minutes. We took off a different direction and never saw anybody else. We hiked into an area that nobody would want to hike into which was precisely why the elk were there.
 
Put in for some late season anterless tags and hunt some cows. The general any bull season is kind of a zoo. Success rates are low for a reason. The late season cow hunts will give you a chance to see some elk under less pressure conditions and you won't have to fight a big crowd.
 
Hunt other States.
Utah has big bulls but you can rarely hunt them.
If you want spikes Utah is also good.
For branch antlered bulls look at Idaho Wyoming and Colorado.
Good luck.
 
I hunted 7 years before I killed my first bull and now I kill one most every year and the years I don't I'm really close. So much can be done by simple homework. Most of the bulls killed in Utah in a gen open bull unit are two year old elk with pretty low odds of harvest. With just a few points in most states your harvest odds jump way up -spend the time and dive into the online data. Think of elk hunting as herds of them, not deer hunting solos. Learn to hunt with a bow ml and rifle lol. It's about hunting a place that has lots of elk with less pressure.

Now, if you can't find elk hunt the rut or late in the snow when you can see them better until you get a few down - shoot a few cows more people will help you find them - find the cows first year find the bulls the next year.

Most of the time you can take a unit color in the roads or atv trails then find the canyon thats the hardest to reach and you will find elk 2/3 up the ridge, its really not that hard - be the first to get on them and bang
 
Thank you all for your help and advice. We are not going to give up, but as several have suggested I am going to try for cows and spikes for a few years to learn elk better. I have been catching on to some of what has been said and hopefully I can turn all of this advice into a successful hunt next year. Thank you all so much. Now it's time to start researching where to go for spikes and where to put in for cows next year.
 
Forget all the BS buy me a cup of coffee bring a map of the High Unitas between vernal and manila then bring and antlerless addendumn and I will turn ya on to some good ground ... We already got two on the ground and 5 to go

Dont think you have to settle for a spike kill thats perty easy General gives you a chance for both. And cows are a good start and very easy to kill. Always go late for them like I said drop me a line i will hook ya up
 
I'm not going to wade through all the comments, so possibly I'm repeating ideas others have already suggested.

1. Attach yourself to a more experienced, successful hunter and ask them to show you the ropes. This may involve insinuating yourself into someone else's camp situation.

2. Elk are at different altitudes at different times of year. Before snow drives them down off the high mountains, they typically are up high near timberline. You need to make sure you are at the right elevation for the conditions and time of year you are hunting.

3. You should be somewhere that has a lot of elk. If you are in a state with few elk, get a non-resident license in a state that has a lot of elk.

4. Pay attention to where others are taking elk. That may be a good place to hunt yourself on a later day or next year. You will hear shots, and from these shots maybe you can figure out where the elk was generally taken. Follow down a trail to where you heard shots come from -- does it look like a good spot? Hunt it tomorrow or next year.

5. Elk may be easier to find further away from the road. I took my elk about 6 miles in from the place where I parked my truck this year. I am a DIY hunter, on-foot, so this was not easy hunting or packing.

6. First choose a good hunting area and then hunt it and scout it year after year. It seems the most successful hunters are the ones who hunt the same area year-after-year.

7. Ask everyone you meet -- within reason -- about elk hunting in the area you choose to hunt. Don't ask for their honey hole. Ask them what to look for, where will the elk be located. Try to get information like "They like to bed 2/3s of the way up a ridge, overlooking a park from dark timber" Try to get little pieces of information and then assemble this information into an integrated picture. Elk country is big. You want to learn enough to figure out what 10% of this country is worth hunting.

Hope that provides some ideas.
 
I guess I would say don't be discouraged and do alot of homework before the season starts. I can only speak of Colorado which has the most elk of any state. If you look at the statistics for Colorado in 2010, only 22% of all the elk hunters were successful and close to 50% of those were cows. That equates to about one in 5 hunters. Spiritelk made a good point when he said that most of the elk taken each season are by the same individuals. Elk hunting is hard work and granted a few get lucky and shoot a good animal but most are taken by those that are prepared.

Wildsage
 

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