Elk Hunter Magazine Issue 2 - deadline tonight!

I

idahonative

Active Member
Messages
307
Hey guys,
Just wanted to let you know that tonight at 10pm is the deadline to receive Issue 2. You can see a preview of the cover by visiting our Facebook page. Here's a list of what you will see:

1. Randy Ulmer - moving targets
2. Nate Simmons - Advanced Backpacking Strategies - Backcountry food
3. Nate Simmons - Integrating mapping technology into your hunt
4. Remi Warren - OTC Elk Hunting
5. George Bettas - The Hunting Horseman - How to strategically select a horse camp
6. Jay Scott - Glassing for Elk
7. Mike Duplan - 7 tips for Off-Season Elk
8. Ryan Hatfield - product review, meat and field care
9. Paul "ElkNut" Medel - Elk Vocalization
10. Dan Staton - Fitness
11. Glory Days - Revisiting the Merwin Martin Bull (WY #2 all-time.
12. Feature Hunting Stories from 7 different states!

Take a minute and check it out - 100 pages, only 30% advertising. Pretty good deal! Thanks for your time.
 
Sounds great,looking forward to my next copy. I only get two mags. Elk hunter and Eastmans, cancelled all of the rest!
 
Kinda comical as I cancelled this Elk Hunter mag because of the big tie in with scam Org $FW/BGF....

Glad ya like the 'kool-aide'.....

Robb
 
Robb,
We're not associated with either SFW or BGF in any way, shape or form. The magazine is my "baby" so to speak, and will focus on hard, honest hunting, whether it be backpack, horseback or roadside camp/day hunting, good gear reviews, blue-collar hunting stories and with an ethical hunter/conservationist theme. If you choose not to participate, that's your prerogative and I respect your right to make that decision. I can promise you, however, that the magazine will always make good, ethical decisions that help set proper examples for all who read. Wish you would give us a chance to let the mag speak for itself. If you have a problem with any particular contributor for any particular opinion, I'd really appreciate it you would take it up with them personally and privately. This mag is going to stay positive, motivational, informative, and passionate for all things elk and elk hunting. You're also welcome to email me at [email protected] if you have questions. Thank you.
 
are the two magazines, elk hunter and western hunter, not related? chris denham, jay scott, etc. alll the same people. i have nothing against them as i support the sfw.
 
Saying Elk Hunter Mag is in no way tied into SFW is a flat lie. Avoid it however you want, but the facts are the facts. Floyd Green owns both Elk Hunter and Western Hunter and is listed as one of the original members of SFW Arizona. Chris Denham is the previous editor and now the marketing director for both magazines, also a SFW Arizona member. Jay Scott is touting himself as the editor of Elk Hunter Magazine, and is also involved with SFW Arizona. The list goes on. These guys are as far from regular guys as you can get!
You can try to bath a turd as often as you like, but it will always be a turd and the smell will follow it everywhere. Adding guys like Ryan Hatfield and Nate Simmons is a good cover up, but the guys running the ship have already established their reputations. I'll keep my money with Eastman's.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 03:31PM (MST)[p]I opened my mailbox yesterday to find a copy of this magazine inside. I did not order it. I assume it was a trial or something? I do not know what to make of this. It looks like a nice magazine, but the names elkhunt4life mentioned jumped right out to me.........Chris Denham & Floyd Green. These people's names are all over AZSFW.

The same Chris Denham that claimed SFW wanted only .2 of 1% of the Arizona tags.

When I finally draw my long awaited Paunsagunt archery deer tag this year, I will be one of only 2 guys that waited in line the old fashioned way to earn our public tags there........for 16 years. And the other guy will have gotten lucky in the random draw to do it. I'll definitely be the ONLY one out of of 13 who paid in and waited patiently since 1997. There will be up to 11 (eleven) folks that cut in line to get even with me and snatch a tag, courtesy of SFW. I'm not a whiz at math but I don't think that comes out to .2 f 1% of the tags. More like 85%.

If SFW hadn't returned time and again to steal more tags, I'd have drawn that tag 6 years ago. There are a lot of other Joe Hunters that have been equally abused by SFW politics and tag theft to pay the mortgage for Don Peay's custom home in Bountiful, built on some of the former best mule deer winter range in Utah.
 
This magazine really came out at a bad time to have those names Zim mentioned associated with it and many of us knowing of their involvement with SFW. The others are really top notch guys that know their stuff and that I've followed throughout their careers, but I can't subscribe or support a magazine that is either owned or has on staff persons that are supportive of the Don Peay way of doing things. Sorry!!!
 
I am going to speak for myself only. I don't know Don Peay. I am not or have not and will not be apart of SFW or AZSFW. I am one of many hunting editors of Elk Hunter Magazine. I got my issue as well in the mail and it looks great to me. The magazine does have some very good articles and is very informative. I am not trying to stir trouble but simply trying to clarify. God Bless and see you on the mountain.
 
Shotgun1, et al,
First, thank you for asking my personal opinion. I want to address something, and then I'm going to pretty much drop this, because there's never any way to win an internet fight with someone who doesn't really want to listen anyway (not you). So here's my thoughts:
1) None of us are associated with Don Peay or Utah SFW, nor Big Game Forever. I don't know that there's a person on our staff that would even know Ryan Benson if we had him in a lineup.
2) My personal opinion is that big game should never be for sale to the highest bidder. Even if the short term is good (or supposedly good) for money infusion, I believe it sends an extremely bad message that our wildlife is for sale. Teddy Roosevelt and our conservation founders believed that the game should always belong to the people - regardless of wealth - and I think governor's tags basically say that for the right price, they are for sale. To me, it's similar to the movie "Indecent Proposal" - no one is sleeping with my wife for $1 million dollars, and I don't believe that our ethics with big game management should be sacrificed for $$$ either. It's dirty money in my book. I respect those who think otherwise, but I steadfastly disagree with them.
3) While I understand - TO A POINT - the theory of not sending your money to someone who you think might not represent your values, ponder this:
A) Have you given a questionnaire to each and every contributing editor or manager of B&C, RMEF, Petersen's Hunting, and Bow & Arrow asking their position statements on every topic under the sun? Probably not. You get enough people involved in something, and I guarantee you that not everyone agrees on everything. Do you agree with your wife on everything? I bet not, and I bet you don't threaten to divorce her if you only agree on 90% of the issues.
B) Even if a person on our staff did support something you don't believe in, ask yourself this: Are you cutting off your nose to spite your face by "boycotting"? In other words, Ryan Hatfield is the editor, and as such, a lot of my view, ethics, direction, and message is what will be reflected in the magazine. I plan on keeping this magazine (and Western Hunter as well) extremely ethical and representative of the views that I know you will find favorable. There's an old adage that you "don't mess with a guy that buys ink by the barrel". In other words, this magazine has a LOT of reach and influence. If my mission is to send the right message (which it is), keep it extremely classy and ethical, and make it something you'd all be proud of - and that influences 50,000 people in the RIGHT DIRECTION - then why would you boycott it because 1 or 2 people might think differently than you do on one or two topics?
Just some food for thought to any "knee-jerk" boycotters out there. This magazine is quickly on its way to becoming a major player, and I have no intention of having it be anything less than the best, classiest, most visually appealing, informative, and inspiring publication in the West, with a hunter/conservationist message that is ALWAYS respectful of wildlife. Wanna be a part of it? Sign up. If not, throw the magazine away. I appreciate those who took the time to read this and think about the big picture.
Ryan Hatfield
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 05:45PM (MST)[p]"then why would you boycott it because 1 or 2 people might THINK DIFFERENTLY THAN YOU ON ONE OR TWO TOPICS"

Personally, I didn't "boycott" anything because I don't subscribe to any of those magazines so I have no action to take.

As to the second part of this statement above???................................The "one or two topics" referred to above are for me only ONE topic.............However, for me that one happens to the single most important topic of them all: The direct assault on the North American Model for Wildlife Conservation. Period.

That is one hell of a big topic, and blows away the 2nd through 100th topics combined.

Read my statement above with regards to what SFW has done to the Paunsagunt hunt I will be participating in this August and tell me why I should not be alarmed for the future of hunting in the USA. Understand it took a grand total of only 10 years for SFW to destroy this once working man's public land hunt opportunity. I paid and waited 16 years for my opportunity, and I can have eleven line cutters standing beside me, out of 13 tags!

16 years.

Better be a good answer.
 
Zim,
My opinion is actually very close to yours on the North American Model, and that's what the magazine will reflect.
I think your efforts are misplaced. You're basically trying to railroad against a magazine that will ultimately reflect your own values. Doesn't seem smart to me, however, I know from reading your posts that you pretty much just like to argue, and a lot of people have called you on it in other posts.
The bottom line is that if the magazine constantly makes good decisions and sends a quality and consistently good message, it's doing its job. Let my work, the end product, and how that influences the public speak for itself.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 05:56PM (MST)[p]"a lot of people have called you on it in other posts."

The only ones that call me out are the same ones that complain about SFW but then run like lemmings on steroids to get in line and buy raffle tickets at the SLC Expo.

These folks, and there a lot of them, put themselves above their morals. I was raised with strong morals and believe actions speak louder than words. I refuse to compromise my morals, nor will make excuses for others. That is where the arguments you speak of arise. And for that, we will agree to disagree.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 06:11PM (MST)[p]Zim,
Again, I fully believe in the N.A. Model, and share most if not all of your values. I hope that you'll take a look at the mag and see that this magazine will not disappoint. Thanks for your time.

To your edit: I too believe that actions speak louder than words, which is why all my actions will continue to fight the good fight. Something worth pondering.
 
Do you have storys and pictures of elk that was bought or had anything to do with S.F.W. and there tag grab?


I havent seen the mag but i would bet half the $hit in it has ties with S.F.W.!!!!




hornkiller.jpg
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 06:07PM (MST)[p]Hornkiller,
We haven't run any governor's tag stories. We don't have a questionnaire for them to fill out, so I couldn't say if any of them were a raffle winner, OTC, limited entry draw, etc.

I don't have a problem with raffle tag winners in any state. At least anyone with a $5 bill had a legitimate chance in those cases, keeping those animals a possibility to ALL people. I don't have problems with super tags and other raffles.

Money will ALWAYS be a factor - just look at whether or not you can put in for nine western states or not like some do. Doesn't that create more opportunity for those with means? Money will always create advantages - to me, it's about what's reasonable or not. Auction tags to me are not reasonable and not all have a chance. A $5 raffle? I think those are within reasonable bounds. But that's just me.

And as for "half the ##### in it" - did you even look at the mag to see what' in it? I'm thinkin' "NO".
 
Ryan I guess my point is that you need to be carefull who have working for you. If you have guys who are in the tag grab buisness SFW be prepared for people to boycott.
 
Deerlove,
I appreciate your comments and will keep it in mind. However, again, I hope you will read what I said, take it to heart, and understand what this magazine will represent. If you've followed any of my past work, I think you know that I ALWAYS represent the common, hard-hunting man in the best way possible. It's who I am, how I hunt, and what I believe in. The magazine, especially this brand-new second issue, is pretty awesome, I have to say.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 07:52PM (MST)[p]"I don't have a problem with raffle tag winners in any state. At least anyone with a $5 bill had a legitimate chance in those cases, keeping those animals a possibility to ALL people."

Problem I have is when those tags are the best of the best, stolen from regular Joe nonresident Hunter who has paid and waited 16 years, via a corrupt political process operating under the ruse of conservation but with zero accountability, peddled to people who didn't wait their turn in line. But hey Joe can still have a snowball's chance in hell for something he's already paid for......for $5......plus travel expenses for a 3,000 mile round trip.

Ya I guess that counts for all people.
 
Zim,
You'd argue with yourself over whether the sky was blue. That's a fact and everyone on here knows it. You know by now how I feel about SFW as a whole - I'm not a member. However, I also don't fault sportsmen for doing what they have to do with what's laid in front of them. If a guy wants to drive to Salt Lake and put in for a desert sheep tag for $5 because it's his best chance and the chance is there, he should be able to do that, and just because he does doesn't mean I think he endorses SFW. To most it's no different than the same $5 they spend on an IDaho super tag. It's nothing more than getting your name in the hat and hoping for a great tag. My problem is not with the hunter; it is, like you, with the system. Change the system, Zim. Quit talking and start doing. I plan on DOING, by my actions of what I allow and don't allow in this magazine.
There's few people out there that will do what I'm willing to do to make sure a western hunting publication is to the standards I have, so that our youth and general hunting public will have a decent and respectful view of hunting and responsibility to wildlife. Have a great day.
 
I understand that, Bob. Please read my #3 point on post 13 for my thoughts there. At the end of the day, this mag will represent all those things you care about.
 
I am not a supporter of the sfw and all the bs. I am also excited to see the next issue as I am a subscriber of the magazine. I am going to enjoy hearing from Randy Ulmer, Nate Simmons, Ryan Hatfield and the content of the magazine. If I ever get the impression they are supporting the bs, I will unsubscribe too, until then, I will enjoy a good read.
 
"You'd argue with yourself over whether the sky was blue."

And this is the type of non-answer posted by those who know I have a valid point, and know there is no equitable justification. It was just a plain old fashioned theft. Something SFW is a master at.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-12 AT 08:45PM (MST)[p]Zim,
Here's our conversation:
Zim: I hate SFW.
Ryan: I'm not a fan either.
Zim: No, you're wrong. I hate SFW.
Ryan: Uh, I said I'm not a fan already.
Zim: No, SFW is bad!

Zim, I get it. Really, really, I get it! Thanks.

Bingo - THANK YOU for getting my point and thank you very much for letting the content and direction of the mag stand on its own. I really appreciate it.
 
If every one worked as hard at doing something about the problem instead of bitching like a bunch of kids something might change. But spending every waking moment on chat forums is not going to change a thing.
 
Ryan, I think the magazine is great, i just hope we all realize that what some magazines are doing. They are becoming misleading and ruining many hunting areas IMO. I think many other folks in other states could agree with that. I suscribed to it down at Las Vegas Elk Camp, wish you the best!
Take care.
 
I'm only going to make this one last post to try and make a point and you can say the same thing you said about Zim if you care to as I don't really give a rip. Do you recall Jim Zumbo merely making a short little blog when he was out in a remote camp referring to black rifles as not being his idea of a hunting rifle? He was the Editor of Outdoor Life magazine and they fired him just for expressing his beliefs. He also lost his TV show for a length of time until Uncle Ted came to his defense and bailed him out. Guilt by association is what we are trying to get across and you just don't seem to get it. No matter how good you are, when you have people around you that are associated with what people vehemently disagree with, human nature is to take it out on you regardless of how great your magazine is and what you say you espouse. Have a great evening and please realize what we are saying. I'm sure your magazine will succeed, but how many subscriptions and sales will you lose because of what a number of people feel is tarnishing the masthead!
 
Tyler,
I thank you for the nice email and honest feedback. Thank you for subscribing, and I'll do my best to make this magazine something you're anxious to receive each time. I take this pretty seriously, and want this thing to be the absolute best western hunting publication around, in content, design, and inspiring people. I can't tell you how energized I feel about it and also Western Hunter, which I am also now Editor for. This tandem is going to be very fun.
 
Topgun,
Don't get me wrong - I completely take to heart ALL feedback, and respect what you are saying, and I appreciate you taking the time to say it, so don't think otherwise. On the same token, I'd appreciate if you would also be willing to be open-minded enough to look at the product and judge it on its own. Feel free to email me at [email protected] if you want to talk more.
 
I would be wiling to give the mag a try. Where can I buy a copy of Elk Hunter and or Western Hunter? Is it possible to buy a single copy before subscribing?Also, what is the difference between the two magazines?

As far as SFW and all that $hi& goes, I am all for being pro-active. Lets hear some ideas on how to change/combat the problem rather than b!tch about it and point fingers at other HUNTERS.
 
Isn't Dunham on the board of SFW? isn't he also an editor of the magazine? I'm with Zim on this one. The BS SFW tried to pull in AZ says enough to me....NEVER!!
 
>I understand that, Bob. Please read
>my #3 point on post
>13 for my thoughts there.
>At the end of the
>day, this mag will represent
>all those things you care
>about.

As Topgun mentioned, unfortunately, you're being judged guilty by association because of a cpl guys that are in AZSFW.
I'm sure you have a good mag as the crew is top notch.
 
"THERE IS A PRINCIPLE THAT WILL KEEP MAN IN EVERLASTING IGNORANCE,THAT PRINCIPLE IS CONTEMPT PRYOR TO INVESTIGATION" I received my second copy of the magazine today,and it was very infomative. I live in Idaho,and the articles will add to my Elk hunting adventures. For all the nay sayers out there,i would say if you hunt Elk,and don't at least give this magazine a look through,then it's your'e loss!
 
I'll repeat, I have said absolutely nothing about the quality of this magazine. There in fact may be magical wonders to behold within it's pages. For me it's not about that at all.
 
I saw the first issue of this magazine and was very impressed! Now, with the release of the 2nd issue, I'm even more convinced that they are putting together a very informative, and Classy Publication!....no matter what your current political views are, its worth a look....especially if you enjoy chasing Elk!
 
Kinda comical that you would cancel your subscription to this magazine while on pins and needles awaiting your latest Mossback videos,Robb.Pretty sure Doyle reaps the benefits of the tag giveaways as much or more than anyone!Just sayin'...Oh,and by the way,before anyone starts calling me a "lemming,dipwad,cockroach,or jacka$$",I am NOT a member of SFW nor am I a fan of the huge amount of tags they recieve.I just get sick of listening to everyone whine about SFW while doing NOTHING.
 
For what its worth, im pretty impressed with the magazine.
I found alot of good info in the first one, havent had time to read the second one yet but looking forwqrd to it
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-24-12 AT 05:18PM (MST)[p]WTF--nontypical....

USE me to try and bash Mossback??
Like you are a #1 Draft Choice to be a Mossback guide....

I already proved you are full of pure self surving bullchit on being a big shot guide for RDO..in Wyo- Buck 102.

"BTW,I haven't helped Vic/RDO since '06.He also sees quality slipping in 102.He's a personal friend of mine,and I HAVE HELPED him in the past when he had an excess amount of hunters booked."

So your Boy-- Vic Owner-Outfitter of RDO---hires wknd guides for his excess amount of hunters??
That is a good $$$ gig for him....rip-off outfitter is what you are saying??

BTW--how did your girlfriend DonnetteV do in his Better Than 102 Wyo rifle buck hunt last year, he-she had to harvest a 190 plus buck right?... in the highly prized LQ-109 hunt?

Wanna re-play that gig??----Why?

Robb

PS-- no biggy Russ-----they are twins in format.
 
LOL.Strike a nerve,did we!?What does our previous little spat have to do with this subject.I was merely making an observation.Nothing more,nothing less.Have no idea who "Donette" is.You funny guy,Robb.Temper,temper.Take a pill and call me in the morning.
 
I will leave it at this 'cut & paste'...

"Robb go easy on nontypical as he is an old guy type hunter.
He helped me with alot of advice on my 102 hunt and I did indeed cover alot of ground.
He knew alot of places that produced in the past but I ended up with a 170 type buck (not a NET score). It got almost 80 degree's during the daytime on my hunt and not what I would have like for a mule deer hunt.
With the amount of time you spend in 31 and 32 elk units plus 102 deer filming for guys that draw, it might not hurt you two guys ego to share some knowledge."

You are not my enemy nontypical---Okay....?

Robb
 
Sorry if I get off track and back to the original subject.

I got the magizine in the mail this week, but never ordered it.

So between last night and this AM, I read it, cover to cover. Not knowing the politics, I thought, "I need to subscribe."

Then I get on MM and hear the usual, "We'll never agree on anything stuff."

I'm also opposed to SFW. BUT since the only state they've totally ruined a chance to draw a tag in is Utah, and Utah is only one state I apply in, I don't have the animosity some do. But the attempted takeover in AZ and rumors about NV really concern me.

ZIM'S math really brings it to light.

If Elk Hunter wants to dispute their association with SFW, they have the perfect forum. They can print their stance in their magazine.

If they do so I'll subscribe.
 
Not attending the SLC Expo and not buying SFW draw tickets for one, is doing something. If everyone did what I do, the Expo would go away in one year, and SFW would go away shortly thereafter. And Joe Hunter would have his tags back.
 
I'm also interested in an all elk magazine. But as many have stated, am also hesitant to support it if it really is tied to SFW. Idahonative, I'd like to take your word on it but if you could answer me this it would help me make up my mind: there was an earlier post on another thread that appears to be deleted (at least I can't find it anymore) that seemed to clearly indicate that Elk Hunter magazine was in favor of the concept behind the whole AZ episode, even though it agreed that it was poorly handled. Did I read that post right? If not, what's your insight on that post? Thanks.
 
Any ties with sfw and your screwed,poor poor Utardia is messed up with it.I think the Az guys saw it comin,and checked em pretty good.Zim I think your spot on!Just let it be known in your magazine that sfw sucks,and ILL ORDER A SUBSCRIPTION TOO. BH1
 
idahonative,

Add me to that list. If your magazine will come out and publicly state that it dosen't support SFW (be it Utah Idaho or AZ, etc.) or the current Tag grab in the West, then I will buy a subscription. If not then I will not support anything that supports Denham and AZ SFW. You could also ask Denham to talk about the AZ situation and his flip flop on the Tag grab. I think there is a large group of people who want to support your magazine and would be willing to if you can publicly state that Elk Hunter Magazine is for the average DIY guy and not a puppet of SFW (any group) or for the promotion of public tag grab.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-26-12 AT 11:30AM (MST)[p]I think the big problem here is that the Editor probably does not own the magazine even though he is calling it his. Therefore, he may be able to say what his position is, but cannot speak for the magazine itself unless he has a controlling interest in it. With the publisher being a Mr. Floyd Green and with Chris Dehham being in charge of Marketing/sales and the two of them having the close ties with AZSFW, I think the Editor will have a tough time doing what you guys are asking. Idahonative is literally between a rock and a hard place on this one as I see it and that's a shame because I think he, personally, is on the up and up and one heck of a good guy.
 
No argument form me Topgun. I want to support idahonative but refuse to support AZ SFW or SFW for that matter. I wish I could draw a line between the two but I can't. If Elk Hunter will come out against these two groups (tag grab and SFW) then I will buy a subscription. If they can't then I won't. DP basically said that a person should join PETA if they are against SFW. I refuse to join PETA or support SFW. I beilve that there are a lot of people who fit into that category. to me, SFW is a devidning force in the hunting community that I refuse to support in any way shape or form.
 
I have basically taken that same stance even after reading the post BigFin made yesterday on the OYOA website he owns. I understand what he is saying, but I just can't separate the fact that subscribing to the mag would seem to be supporting the group we hate with those other two who are in charge being the driving force of that mag. I really feel bad for the Editor, whom I hold in very high esteem, but just can't compromise my values and subscribing IMHO would do just that. I think that puts a lot of us between a rock and a hard place just like I mentioned he is!
 
By just stating that the mag. is against SFW when you have 2 guys involved with the the mag. that are SFW board members??? I can not get over the fact that they were involved with the AZ tag grab/steal in a big way and had that bill gone through and passed it would be to late, the damage would have been done, the tags gone to the man with the most money. IMHO you can't do what they tried to do then just say...oh sorry average joe for almost taking away some of your coveted AZ tags like we did in Utah but it was in your own best interest,so now lets sit down and do bussiness.....Screw me once, shame on you....Screw me twice, shame on me, and there ain't no shame on this guy !!

Now if this hadn't of happened I would, and had, every intention of subscribing but after my wife and kids, big game hunting is something in my blood that means way to much to me to ever think I could be tied to SFW in any way, shape, or form !!
 
I can see both sides of the argument....
We have great writters and hunters starting a new magazine that could be tied to an organization we have no intentions of supporting...However if you read and look at the magazine they also support RMEF which I think is a great organization personally. Your views may differ.

I like Eastman's as well even though I do not like the big ranch hunts they sometimes go on and know many times tags they get differ from what common Joe's like me can get or even want to get......Yet ELK HUNTER and EASTMANS so far include many of us average Joe's in it's content and it's those articles I look forward to reading most.
When the majority of content leans towards Governor tag hunters and others taking tags away from us then I will cancel a subscription....But till then I will give guys like Ryan,Mike,Nate and Randy a fighting chance to prove what side they decide to roll with and so far enjoy the magazine and have subscribed.
This is coming from a guy that cancelled a subscription to Muley Crazy because they started Food Plot advertisements. May seem hypocritical but I am trying to keep an open mind by judging my decision on the merit of four guys I so far have no reason to distrust.
Time will tell.
Best,
Jerry

44f4e09309b4a917.jpg
 
TOPGUN, since there has been no further response, I think you nailed it!!

2 thoughts come to mind.

1) It is great having this forum to discuss these things, share info, and pull the covers on shenanigans. Thanks MM!!

2) I feel sorry for a guy that is getting a chance to do what he loves BUT has to "stay the company line" even though he may not agree with it. It would suck to be him.

And I thought the issue of the magazine I got was great.
 
I read the magazine and I have got to admit it is one of the best! They are doing a great job. Of course, I only read one issue, but I really liked the information provided.
 
Zim, you make an interesting point about how the sale of tags have caused you to have to wait an extra 6 years to get yours. I hadn't thought of it that way. You might be right. It's sort of a compelling argument.

That being said, how do you know if those tags hadn't been issued to SFW if they would have been put back in the pool for the avg Joe? I kind of always had the opinion the DWR just decided to throw in a few tags extra tags for these organizations. If the tags were taken away from SFW MDF etc I wonder if they would indeed go back in the drawing pool. Do you have any evidence they would?

I for one am just like you--a guy in line, biding my time--but a few tags here or there aren't freaking me out.
 
to those of you that are not going to buy the elk hunter magazine because their might be people involved with the sfw that are also involved with western elk hunter magazine think about what you are saying you might as well stop putting in for hunts in utah all together because for one their are people on the board that are members of the sfw not to mention that they are doing biasness directly with the sfw two look at where all the tag money is going to I mean come on give me a brake you might as well just start poaching because after all the animals do belong to the people right
 
Somebody should have stayed in School. Now if we don't support SFW we SHOUKD just become a poacher?

Sorry for the lack of punctuation I was in a huge hurry due to the fact that I was late for work.
 
No problem just busting your Ball$. Funny thing is that I misspelled ?should?. In regards to supporting SFW...To each his own. You have no choice but to support some SFW folks if you want to hunt in Utah. The Magazine is a different animal. That is a choice. JMO
 
It seems that AZSFW-AZSFWC have gone directly to the Governor in an attempt to take your AZ tags for their financial gain.

"Memorandum To: Arizona Sportsmen and Conservation Organization Board of Directors

FROM: Alan Hamberlin, Chairman AZSFW

RE: Response to Organization Concerns about HB 2072

DATE: February 29, 2012

In our continuing effort to communicate with sportsmen and conservation organizations, we wanted to bring you up to date on the status of HB 2072. Earlier today we met with representatives from the Governor?s office and two of the five commissioners primarily to see if there is an opportunity for continuing dialogue on the bill. We agreed to continue to communicate with them as we progress to let them know what changes we are making to the bill. We appreciate the responses and feedback that we have received relative to the introduced version of the bill and our responses to those concerns are listed below. It is our desire to solicit any additional concerns you may have. We respectfully request that this memo be disseminated to all members of your respective Boards of Directors asking them to identify additional issues that they may have. We will seriously evaluate and respond to any legitimate concerns. There are at least four items that we agree to modify in response to concerns and issues that have been raised thus far as follows:

1. The original bill had no cap on administrative fees; we will cap those fees at 10%

2. While the original bill had a reporting requirement for the qualifying organization to adopt a Board resolution and submit it to the Arizona Game and Fish Department specifying the amount of proceeds received from the sale of tags from the auction and raffle and sold at the EXPO and Banquets and the costs associated with same and the monies paid for each of the six purposes listed in the bill and the cost of administration. We will add a new provision requiring an annual outside independent audit of the proceeds received from tag sales and the expenditure of those proceeds by a certified public accountant.

3. We have been asked to cap the number of tags that will be available as a result of the legislation in the future to 350 tags. We agree to cap the number of tags at 350.

(This is a real gem:)

4. Concern has been raised by some that none of the monies flow directly back to the Arizona Game and Fish Department (AZGFD). We are willing to negotiate with Game and Fish and are prepared to offer them up to 30% of the net proceeds to augment their hunter recruitment program if they support the legislation.

Please communicate any additional concerns to Suzanne Gilstrap at 602-390-4518 or preferably communicate via email to [email protected] ."

A cpl of the Board members behind this tag grab:

Chris Denham, Floyd Green of:

ELK HUNTER mag

Western Hunter mag

Outdoorsmans

Wilderness Athlete

Go figure---$$$$$---talks and the public walks.

Robb
 
When I read about SFW ( I am anti BTW) I wonder why Utah natives do not take action???

Politicians love of money is only overshadowed by their desire to be re-elected. I would think that they would be mobilizing voters to ouster the SFW-lovin' legislators?
 
If I would have known they supported this tag grab from AZ. I would have never subscribed. This will be my last subscription unless things change. I'm not going to support the money guys even though I could buy any goveners tag I want. Money don't make us better wait in line like everyone else.
 

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