I hate elk

S

sonofthesouth

Guest
"I hate elk" I don't know about others on MM but I hear this more and more every year when talking with others about Mule deer and some of the problems that they are faced with. I find myself agreeing with them whenever I go out to look for deer in places that have always held deer and all that is there is elk. I have even heard it said that the only reason to hunt them is to have a chance to kill them. I.e. the only good elk is a dead elk or an elk in another state.

The first elk to start showing up in my neck of the woods was it the late 80s early 90s and since then they have moved into most areas that never had elk but DID have great deer. We have some country that is crucial winter habitat for Muleys, and now when you hike in there all you will see is herds of 30-40 elk and NO deer.

I'm afraid I'm starting to "hate elk" as well.

Son
 
They aren't as fun to hunt as mule deer, but a late season cow hunt is the one hunt that pays for itself & my family likes eating it more.
 
I love elk! I just wish we could have both! In the mean time, I will do my part to kill a few elk each year! They taste better anyways!
 
I would love to kill a big bull but all in all I am not a fan of them.

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High5 i hate you for saying that.
I'm a deer hunter! That being said i do put in for LE elk points, one day i'll kill me a 500 inch bull, and donate the meat to one of you people thats gonna tell me elk meats the best.

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>It's not a good quality in
>a person,"To Hate".

Your going to "hate" Sonofthesouth when I tell you he killed a giant 404" bull with his bow a couple years ago and he doesnt care for elk.

Heres a picture, this was on the cover of Eastmans a couple years ago. I am not a fan of posting pics but seeing as to how it was on the cover of Eastmans here it is again...

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Drum

dan-henderson_wanderlei-silva.gif
 
Mule Deer are way better but I sure wouldnt pass on a 400 bull.

Timberline
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"Live for somethin' or die for nothin'"
 
"High5 i hate you for saying that"

I was wondering how you were going to react?
I'm passionate about and prefer to hunt Mule deer also.

"Your going to "hate" Sonofthesouth when I tell you he killed a giant 404" bull"

Congrats on that 400 class archery bull....,thats an incredible accomplishment.

"one day i'll kill me a 500 inch bull"

You must be building points in Utah, Good Luck!
 
Ya your right, I have seen elk kill deer, this is why we have no deer, those dang elk kill them. dumbest argument I hear it all the time. Come on it is poor management period. If utah managed the deer herd like they do the elk then we would have more deer. For instants if they would sale 97,000 elk permits and only 2500 deer permits then in a few years you would see the opposite, lots of deer and not so many elk.
I guess thinking that the elk kill the deer is a better way to try and cope with why there is no deer.
 
The only elk I hate, are the ones I talk myself into shooting.

If its the elk's fault, how come CO has so many deer yet has a gajillion elk?
 
I agree totally and can't stand elk either. Therefore I am willing to help my fellow man out all I can and shoot all the encroaching beasts for you. Let me know when & where!


T264
 
I would prefer hunting elk any day over anything in the lower 48. Herd them my way.
 
Hate is a strong word for sure and I don't hate elk or anything else for that matter, but I will say that as far as trophy?s go and what they mean to me personally, I would have to say that I would trade away my bull 10 times over for another giant muley.

Son
 
I would have to say that I would trade away my bull 10 times over for another giant muley.

Olin your a jerk! I'd love to have just one of either though lol...I remember your bull and your story, if I remember correct , you killed that bull with your bow during the muzzleloader or rifle hunt right?
 
Elk are there, because they are managed better and can do well with current conditions compared to Mule Deer.

I think the main difference is the elk are way more visible and prolific in these conditions compared to our deer.

Deer are not doing as well and need to be managed better.

The point about Colorado is hitting it right on the head and it didn't take them forever to turn things around.

Cow elk hunts provide a good way to get young people into hunting and some excellent meat. Big bulls are a challenge in many cases.

I don't think the elk are the cause of the less than optimal mule deer overall quality.

I will be forever in search of quaility mule deer bucks, but not blaming elk on the difficulty of finding many bucks.

Logan
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-29-08 AT 12:38PM (MST)[p]"The first elk to start showing up in my neck of the woods was it the late 80s early 90s and since then they have moved into most areas that never had elk but DID have great deer. We have some country that is crucial winter habitat for Muleys, and now when you hike in there all you will see is herds of 30-40 elk and NO deer."


First of all we all know Mule Deer and Elk do share the same habitat. But they do not share the same forage. Elk are more adaptable period. Mule Deer are more sensitive to niche changes. For example, drought conditions, winter habitat dispersement, over harvesting, poaching. Please tell me how bigger Elk numbers equal less Mule Deer numbers. There is no correlation.
 
Of course you know i dont know you well enough to say i hate you. I'm sure you're a great guy? I was just going for the reaction. and yes i'm building points in utah.

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Hey Gramps, can't help you out with that stool sample thing, but there's a dude in the campfire forum that may be able to, his name is Feleno & he's got this man crush deal workin :)

Elk & deer compete, I don't care what you've herd.
I'm watching it right now on the winter range, and have seen it on several occasions over water, when an Elk wants the small trickle it gets it, deer must watch.
No they don't murder them as was the flippant comment, but they are in competition.

One of the best Deer units in the west right now is the Henry mountains. Guess how many Elk, less than 30 on all three mountains & soon to be zero. Utah has been producing enormous bulls in most other limited entry units but not much for deer, there are obviously some exceptions but is not a coincidence that the top trophy producing units are typically known for trophy deer or elk but rarely both.
 
BFE,

.....BUT, the Henry Mountains are also managed for good deer hunting. What would the rest of the state be if that 97k crap was tossed out?

I hate elk too. Slaughter them and grow some deer.;-)
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-29-08 AT 07:01PM (MST)[p]"First of all we all know Mule Deer and Elk do share the same habitat. But they do not share the same forage. Elk are more adaptable period. Mule Deer are more sensitive to niche changes. For example, drought conditions, winter habitat dispersement, over harvesting, poaching. Please tell me how bigger Elk numbers equal less Mule Deer numbers. There is no correlation."

First of all, when you say that they do not eat the same things you are only half right. In this winter country that I speak of the elk are foraging on the same buck brush that the deer do, that is a fact. Elk are more adaptable, they eat grass when its available and they out browse deer when it's not. Secondly, I have watched cow elk chase deer out of my alfalfa fields on several occasions, after so much harassment the deer just move off to lesser food sources and return after the elk have moved out. I'm just telling you what I have seen firsthand. Competition is competition.

The Henrys were mentioned but also look at the AZ strip, no elk at all and some of the best deer hunting in the country. I dont think this by chance.

And yes Larry I shot my bull with my bow during the rifle hunt.

Son
 
SonoftheSouth,

You nailed it in your response regarding elk and deer having different diets. In a tough winter when the deer really need the browse because it is all that is available above the snow, the elk will switch over to browsing no problem. There have been several fecal pellet analysis studies looking at elk diet in relation to the time of year and weather conditions. The results were that elk eat more browse during the winter, especially during deep snow winters. There is definitely direct competition for food.

Also, elk are loud, smelly, and aggressive (kinda like some of the guys that post on here) and will displace deer from preferred ranges just by being there. This indirect competition for resources is harder to quantify, but is real nevertheless.

I do not think elk numbers are the primary cause for declines in mule deer, but I do think they are one of many factors contributing to the decline of mule deer.

So... let's kill more elk! I'm in.

Dax
 

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