Utah blackpowder advice

[ToddT]

Sitting at 11 points, the only "better" chance I have of drawing a tag is the blackpowder season in a couple of units. This is good because I really enjoy hunting with the muzzleloader and I feel that the dates for a coinciding rut are much better than the archery dates, plus it can be hot during those early dates. However, because the elk have been kicked around for two hunts prior, I wonder of the difficulty of hunting then.

The bright side to the Utah system I guess, is the fact that even a new applicant with a lot of luck could draw the best tag in the state. But it is nice to have somewhat of a plan and the only method of doing that is with looking at the tags that go to the top point holders that apply. With that said - and I am pretty certain I understand, but just want to clarify -, does the Utah system give those with more points, more chances in the draw - treating points as actual bonus points? Or is everyone on equal footing, meaning, is everyone simply put into the draw one time and then drawn from the pool of applicants for that particular hunt choice?

The foremost question though, is, how is the hunting in the blackpowder season, but any advice is appreciated.

Actually one other thought is the late rifle hunts. Though I really do not favor later season hunts for elk. The elk obviously aren't bugling and long hikes in the snow, are not my friend. However the goal is to come home with a good bull, so I am not ruling out a late hunt if someone thinks it could provide an enjoyable hunt.

Thanks for any advice.

 

[txhunter58]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-04-15 AT 07:30PM (MST)[p]Yes, it is my understanding that you will have 12 "beans in the pot" this year (this years application plus 11 more chances from your bonus points). Someone with 0 points has 1 chance, those with 1 point have 2 chances, etc.

I have been warned off the late seasons on elk, especially in the best units that have a high bull population. Even the outfitters I have asked will tell you that too many of the bulls are busted up by then.

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

 

[ToddT]

Thanks Tx, I didn't even thank about the bulls being busted up from fighting, I was pretty much thinking about simply the hunt, as they had been kicked around for at least three hunts. But that is one more reason not to go late.

 

[BrowningRage]

As you know, the bonus tags are given straightway to those applicants with the highest number of points. Once the bonus tags are gone, all applicants (even those that were in the running for some of the straggling bonus tags) are all in the same pot for the remaining tags. While it is simple enough to say that you get 12 entries with 11 Bonus Pts, there is a little bit more complication...

What happens is you are randomly given 12 numbers. 1 for each of your bonus points and the current year entry. Of your 12 numbers, 11 of them are thrown out and you are assigned the LOWEST number of the bunch. This same method is used for ALL applicants for the Non-Bonus Tags. Once everyone has their LOWEST number, the tags start going out from the lowest number up... So, a guy with 0 points, may have been randomly assigned the lowest number for all applicants, and he gets a tag. And you, with your 12 numbers, may not even come close to the tag pool at the bottom...

So, with that said, Harvest Data from last year is posted on the DWR website for elk. Its a good place to start looking at harvest percentages and days afield and such. For the most part it looks like there are planet of muzzy hunts that offer high success. Also, I personally know people who have hunted and LOVED the late hunts. But if snow is not your cup of tea, you may want to avoid those.

I was on Boulder last year for the Muzzy deer hunt, which coincided with the Muzzy elk hunt... The bulls were bugling everywhere, so the previous hunts apparently didn't bother them all that much...

Good luck brother...

"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24

 

[ForkWest]

ToddT, you need to tip 15% for an answer like that from BrowningRage! Everything you wanted to know.

 

[Vanilla]

http://wildlife.utah.gov/hunting-in...ting/big-game/1348-big-game-harvest-data.html

This link will get you to the harvest rates for all hunts, but you can focus in on just the muzzy hunts if you'd like. You can also see the late rifle harvest rates as well. You can get a good idea of how difficult the hunts can be compared to other units by looking at the harvest percentage and also the average days in the field.

Muzzy hunts can be tough, but they are in the rut and they are fun as heck. I helped out the last 2 years on LE muzzy elk tags. You will hear bugling everywhere. Putting eyes on them and getting close enough to kill with no magnification on a muzzleloader is the challenge. But it's a good problem to have, because that means you have a tag in your hand and you are chasing big bulls.

At 11 points you are a long ways from the muzzy hunts on the premium units. You are looking at that second tier type of hunt. But that doesn't mean you won't have a great time and can't shoot a giant bull.

 

[Buglelk]

I am in the same boat as you I have 11 points. One thing to consider during the Muzzy hunts there are Muzzy deer hunters all over the place too. If anywhere near the Wasatch the HOrrific DWR also let's EVERYONE shoot a cow too so they are very spooky.
I talked to a friend with a muzzy tag last year on the Manti and he said if he knew how it was going to be he would have turned his tag in and waited

 

[ToddT]

Thanks for the advice guys. I have looked over success rates and they seem to lag just slightly, to somewhat - in most units - behind the rifle hunt. But it goes to reason that the later hunts would be much tougher than the earlier rifle season, but I just wanted to get a clearer picture. I guess, one thing that makes hunting later, almost as good as early, is the fact that in most units, a lot fewer tags are given out, in comparison to other units in other states. I believe it is a given that Utah offers up the very best opportunity at a big bull, but I have also seen it hinted at, that populations aren't near what they are in, even Colorado. The reason I mention Colorado is, they have the largest population of elk than any other state in the country, but after a couple hunts there, many times it was very difficult to actually see elk. Elk sign was everywhere, but with 200 to 500 hunters in a given area, they learn to hide really quick. And from what I found, hearing a bull bugle in, and respond to calling is about as common as an attorney with a conscious. Before this turns into a state versus state thing, I have only hunted Colorado three times in my life, and out of those, only one had a lot of elk. But after opening morning, that quickly changed - it actually changed so quickly that it was amazing. One day bugling all over the hillside that I was on, the next day, crickets.

On the subject of the drawing, I have heard that other states use that particular system - issuing numbers, and those with the lowest number getting the tag. With that said, it sounds like the draw is completed as it goes, and that there is no proverbial drawing - like you think of when you think of a drawing.

Anyway, good information and I appreciate the thoughts.

 

[grosventrehunter]

BrowningRage, your post was very helpful. Thanks!

 

[elkhunterUT]

Good info shared thus far. I have hunted or helped tag holders on every Utah LE Elk hunt except for the late hunt. I personally think the muzzleloader tag is always an excellent option, especially this year with the Sept 21 - Oct 2 dates, which will be prime time for the rut.

If you have some experience hunting elk you should have no problems getting in on bulls and having opportunities with the muzzy (even without experience in many cases). The elk have been pushed around a bit from the prior hunts but they will still bugle and are very active. I would recommend not calling as much and moving in on bugles and ambushing bulls with their cows. It can be tough pulling a big bull away from his harem this time of year, but once you locate him you can usually get within muzzy range by moving in quietly listening for his bugle and his herd.

I know my 16 bonus points will be in for a muzzy tag this year - Hope I get lucky this go around!!