New Mexico ELK 2016

Apply in NM for elk every year as NR but it has been over 10 yrs with no tag....but I'm still playing the game....maybe this will be the year....
 
Been trying to draw a quality elk tag in N.M. for 13 years. Outfitter welfare program and lack of preference point system have conspired to hold me down.

Still trying though.....
 
I have applied the last 3 years and drew one tag. I have a system setup that should allow me to draw a archery tag at least every 4 years in the better units.
 
I quit applying when new mex decided to ##### on the diy nr guys. Kind of a joke and a slap in the face as well as a clear indicator they don't want my money.
 
I'm with you Theox! Quit giving NM my $ when they cut the NR tags worse than any other State I know of. Would love to hunt it but I'd rather put my money elsewhere.
 
>I'm with you Theox! Quit
>giving NM my $ when
>they cut the NR tags
>worse than any other State
>I know of. Would
>love to hunt it but
>I'd rather put my money
>elsewhere.


Same here.
 
Thanks for not putting in guys giving me a better chance;) By the way New Mexico has way better odds than a lot of other states for nonresidents. At least you have a slim chance of drawing. Other states you have zero chance of drawing a quality unit as A nonresident unless you have 18 to 20 points! That's 18 to 20 years.
 
Also one other thing New Mexico also gives you all your money back if you don't draw kind of stupid if you're not putting in for New Mexico!
 
No,it is not stupid.....everyone has to decide for their selves if it is worth it. For me it is worth it even though drawing a quality tag is slim.....
 
? Dirtbag How is it not worth it you get all your money back if you don't Draw, And if you can't afford the hunt if you do draw you shouldn't be putting in.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-02-16 AT 10:05PM (MST)[p] I DROPPED NM OFF MY HUNTING AGENDA A FEW YEARS BACK, AS I DID OREGON. TOO MANY OTHER GREAT STATES TO HUNT, JUST STOPPED PLAYING THE NO HUNTING ODDS STATE. I KNOW HUNTERS WHO HAVE APPLIED FOR 13-16 YEARS W/O DRAWING A ELK, LOPE, OR DEER TAG. NM SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE OVER HAULED.....................YD.
 
>? Dirtbag How is it not
>worth it you get all
>your money back if you
>don't Draw, And if you
>can't afford the hunt if
>you do draw you shouldn't
>be putting in.

Yes, you can get all your money back even cost of hunting license.
And yes, I agree with you on afford the hunt aspect. My point was that not everyone feels putting in for NM as NR is a no brainer even if you do get all your money if you fail to draw and that is their personal choice and nothing wrong with that.
As for me.....every year I submit my apps for elk, deer and antelope.....used to do sheep but now I can't afford the 3k upfront charge.
 
New Mexico is a no brainer for elk applications, and might just be the go to state for landowner tags in quality elk units.
 
I'm applying!!!
Even though the odds are slim, NM has been my lucky state. my two sons and I have drawn many great tags that had slim odds over the years and have had great hunts:

Two 16B first rifle elk.
16D first rifle elk
34 youth rifle elk
5B youth rifle deer
Two 50/52 muzzy antelope
NE corner rifle antelope
Youth ibex
 
>LAST EDITED ON Mar-02-16
>AT 10:05?PM (MST)
>
> I DROPPED NM OFF
>MY HUNTING AGENDA A FEW
>YEARS BACK, AS I DID
>OREGON. TOO MANY OTHER
>GREAT STATES TO HUNT, JUST
>STOPPED PLAYING THE NO HUNTING
>ODDS STATE. I KNOW HUNTERS
>WHO HAVE APPLIED FOR 13-16
>YEARS W/O DRAWING A ELK,
>LOPE, OR DEER TAG.
>NM SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE
>OVER HAULED.....................YD.


No hunting odds states? So I take it you don't put in for az, Utah, Nevada, CO ex.... Because it takes you 15+ years/points to draw Quality units. It's crazy to me how everyone says nm non Rez program sucks and needs overhaul. First you get all your money back if you dont draw! Second at least You have a chance to draw. Other states unless I have 15+ years of donating hunting license fees to them and not until then do I have a chance. I know a guy with 22 points in az and still did not draw. Also know a guy that has pulled a tag for nm 3 years in a row. My be a slim chance in nm but it's a chance and I don't have to kiss my money good bye if I don't draw.
 
As I understand it, your $15 application fee in not refundable so basically a $15 lottery ticket. I originally thought the hunting license fee (like $65) was not refundable so I dropped out. I might reconsider whether I want to buy a $15 chance. Just a bit harder to decide when you know nothing and hunt solo? NM is probably my only chance to draw a great tag as my pts are now drained and it's just too late to start over in the points game in other states.
 
I will apply every year in NM. There problem is not the "screwing" of the NR, its the outfitter welfare.

I'm contributing to the problem though and putting in the outfitter pool for my OIL tags, I'd probably hire one anyway. Which begs the question of why they need an outfitter pool in the first place.

Landowner welfare too.

We all know what should be done - change all unit wide landowner tags to ranch only, eliminate the outfitter pool and to go straight % NR/R.

It won't happen because those that live there and vote dont' care about NR interest. Same problems in WY.

Constituents with no stake - where do we dump the tea in the harbor?
 
I put in for NM, but their NR system sucks. They screwed the NR over when they dropped the allocation to 6%. At a bare minimum, they should swap the NR and outfitter allocation percentages.

I do like the "you have a CHANCE to draw every year" system versus bonus/preference points, but it's still really tough to draw a quality tag in NM as a non-resident. Mathematically, 5% draw odds for any given hunt is the same as 20 preference points, so pick your poison. The problem is most of the true quality hunts in NM are well below 5% draw odds for non-residents. That being said, I still wish every state would go to a straight lottery style draw, especially with point creep getting out of control.

NM is a great place to hunt quality elk, but as a DIY non-resident, the odds suck and they really stuck it to the NR when they changed the law. I quit applying for a year or two after the law change because it ticked me off, but NM is the easiest state for me to hunt. If it wasn't so convenient, I wouldn't apply.
 
Every state should go 90% to Rez and 10% to nonrez. No more dumb point systems! I fell nm is best state for Non Rez. If you Break it down we are getting 16% of the tags! So they take care of the DIY guy with 6% and then take care of guy who goes outfitted. They don't take your money if you don't draw(awesome)! Tell me please if there is another state that We nonrez get 16% of the tags, chance to draw a Quality unit EVERY YEAR, and get money back if we don't draw. We should be trying to get guaranteed percent of the tags in other states and no point system. Time to start fighting other States.
 
Both systems have their pros and cons. I just think the elk opportunity in New Mexico for quality bulls is great. I have never drawn but I think it's worth the persistence.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-03-16 AT 01:34PM (MST)[p]as a non resident I was upset at first too when they changed the draw system a few years ago. However, I apply each year for elk in NM and feel it is a great state for NR overall (16% is better than most states for the draw). I apply for over 50 hunts each year and have been for 6-10 years depending on the animal and state. Each state has their system and they all have pros and cons. It depends on what your goal is as a hunter. Meat hunter, trophy hunter, guided vs DIY, etc etc. I like the fact the most of the states are different so I can plan out what my future hunts might look like. The key for us NR's is to recognize where the opportunities are and formulate a short, medium, and long term plan to achieve your goals. For example I know Utah, Arizona, and Nevada are my trophy elk hunts. Wyoming (unit 45) will be good but not great elk hunt in 2-3 years. I'm burning my 10 CO pts next year and doing my first guided hunt with Mike Lawson in unit 40. I applied for a really good but not great unit in AZ for a late rifle hunt and will go with either A3 or Chappell for that hunt (I have the points it took to draw that tag last year so we'll see what happens with their new split). I've hunted CO (10-12 times otc diy), MT (twice in the breaks), UT, NM (twice with the draw, and twice with LO tags, $1200 and $1800, shot 4 bulls all public land DIY, & Oregon for elk. I always look forward to the entire draw process and NM is no exception. I have just as good of odds as anyone else that applies. Depending on if I go with an outfitter (did twice and didn't draw either time, drew on our own in '08 and '09 for first season rifle tags in a mid tier unit). I think NM gets an unfair bad rap by most NR's considering all the species that we can apply for and have a chance of drawing each year. No state has it perfect, look at all the negative press UT is getting lately about the expo (good late night reading though!) The fact of the matter is the popularity of hunting out west has grown and we have a supply and demand problem when it comes to tags. I've stopped complaining and simply do my best to stack the odds in my favor for this year and many years to come. I am fortunate to have the income to spend on all the apps and points and to hire an outfitter if I want or need to. However when I started building points it was a stretch but I new if I ever wanted to go on some great top end hunts in the future I had to make the investment in it. Good luck to everyone in the draw! For those of you too upset with NM to even apply, thank you I appreciate it!
 
If you can't beat em join em. I moved to NM bought a small ranch smack dab in the middle of elk country with a couple LO tags.....we're going elk hunting every year.
 
>If you can't beat em
>join em. I moved to
>NM bought a small ranch
>smack dab in the middle
>of elk country with a
>couple LO tags.....we're going elk
>hunting every year.

Can we be friends? LOL. I think you've got the right idea.

Free Draw Odds!
www.hunthardcore.com
 
>As I understand it, your $15
>application fee in not refundable
>so basically a $15 lottery
>ticket. I originally thought
>the hunting license fee (like
>$65) was not refundable so
>I dropped out. I
>might reconsider whether I want
>to buy a $15 chance.
> Just a bit harder
>to decide when you know
>nothing and hunt solo?
>NM is probably my only
>chance to draw a great
>tag as my pts are
>now drained and it's just
>too late to start over
>in the points game in
>other states.


I can steer you in a couple directions and at least help you get started with the process if you are interested in applying. PM me if you want.
 
>Every state should go 90% to
>Rez and 10% to nonrez.
>No more dumb point systems!
>I fell nm is best
>state for Non Rez. If
>you Break it down we
>are getting 16% of the
>tags! So they take care
>of the DIY guy with
>6% and then take care
>of guy who goes outfitted.
>They don't take your money
>if you don't draw(awesome)! Tell
>me please if there is
>another state that We nonrez
>get 16% of the tags,
>chance to draw a Quality
>unit EVERY YEAR, and get
>money back if we don't
>draw. We should be trying
>to get guaranteed percent of
>the tags in other states
>and no point system. Time
>to start fighting other States.
>


If they are going to go to a straight draw (no bonus point systems) with percentages split between resident and non-resident then the percentage split shouldn't be 90/10. My opinion is that the split should be based on land ownership. The percentage owned by the state combined with the percent of private land owned by residents of the state should determine how much goes into the Resident only pool.

If a state has 40% of its land owned by private residents and state owned land, then 40% is guaranteed to residents while the remaining 60% can be drawn by anyone (resident or non-resident). Won't ever happen. But the realization that federal owned land (that non-residents pay for) has such strict limitations on non-resident utilization through hunting.

Or another option would be to let every state choose their percentage split but any tags reserved for residents would only be able to be utilized on private or state owned land.....no federally owned land.

And yes, I realize that the game animals are owned by the states.
 
>If you can't beat em
>join em. I moved to
>NM bought a small ranch
>smack dab in the middle
>of elk country with a
>couple LO tags.....we're going elk
>hunting every year.

jodog, most of your posts over the years have been stupid and this one fits right in with the rest of them. Anyone who has followed you knows you led the charge in N.M. to take more tags away from non-residents, yet continue provide the corrupt landowners and outfitters with tags.

I really hope you never draw an AZ elk tag!
 
Thanks for the generous offer bulldog! I have applied in the past so I'm familiar with the app process. I'd mainly need to decide if I could apply this year as I'm helping a friend on his hunt in mid-Sept. I've only put in for the better trophy units as I hunt in CO every year. So for me if I'm gonna pay the NR fee, I'd only want to hunt a top end unit. Just not sure I'd have time to scout it out this year!
 
Rdrdrfan So anyone regardless of what state you live in a non resident could have better odds then you do in your own state. If there is more fed land then state and private. Your right won't ever happen!!! Terrible plan.
 
>Rdrdrfan So anyone regardless of what
>state you live in a
>non resident could have better
>odds then you do in
>your own state. If there
>is more fed land then
>state and private. Your right
>won't ever happen!!! Terrible plan.
>


Great plan. Residents aren't excluded from drawing in the other pool. They will still have much better odds than NR's because they can draw in the resident pool or the general pool. If the land is owned and maintained by "non-resident" tax dollars then non-residents SHOULD get a much larger piece of the tag pie than they currently do in ANY state.
 
I hope I don't draw an AZ tag in the near future either because the AZ tag I bought really put a dent in my wallet. The last time I had the NM Governor and the Commissioner over for dinner I don't remember asking them for fewer nonresident elk tags but we were in the company of Johnny Walker that night and maybe I just don't Remember the conversation. Oh well, gotta go try and sell some prime LO elk tags.
 
I'm in for my usual hunts in 17. This will be my 4th year of trying an so far no luck, even with cows for 3rd choice. Backup plan will be a LO cow tag if I can get one for $400 or less.
 
>>I'm with you Theox! Quit
>>giving NM my $ when
>>they cut the NR tags
>>worse than any other State
>>I know of. Would
>>love to hunt it but
>>I'd rather put my money
>>elsewhere.
>
>
>Same here.


x3
 
"Tell me please if there is another state that We nonrez get 16% of the tags, chance to draw a Quality unit EVERY YEAR, and get money back if we don't draw. "

wyoming
 
Being a former resident of NM I love their draw system. For a resident with snow you have a pretty good chance to draw a tag almost every year if you use the odds and don't put in for the best units for all 3 hunts I have hunted quality units 7 out of the last 10 years. My non resident friends have drawn 3 of the last 10. They are are also archery hunters though. Now being a resident of CO I realize how busted a points system is for rifle. I'm not a fan of waiting 20 years for a dream tag. But with stick and string there's only a few units you have to wait 10 plus years to draw. I'm gettin points for AZ just really planning on hunting there once anyways. But going back to NM, You get almost all your money back. So why in the heck wouldn't you apply? Be dumb not to in my opinion
 
I am a NM resident and I really feel for you non-residents. I absolutely hate that they took tags away from the DYI pool. The outfitter well fair here in NM just sucks. No need for it in my opinion. If an outfitter is good at what he does he will get all the work he needs. Should be a 90/10 split like most every other state. Our game commission always caves into the landowners and outfitters. If the commission was elected it might be different, but as long as they are appointed by the Governor those with the money (landowners and to a lesser extent outfitters) will have their way.

I love the pure lotto system too. I apply every year for Uturd deer and their point system makes it impossible for me to draw a good tag. I have to settle for a general unit archery deer tag every other year or so. No hope what so ever of drawing a premium tag since I am 41 with only 5 points. Even a ok tag is another 5 or 6 years out.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 01:27PM (MST)[p]I was 10 for 12 as NR elk & deer and now 6 for 8 as a resident,elk. 8for8 deer.
Been coming here since I was young to hunt,fish & explore.
The newer NR quotas suck.I rarely apply for premium units.
I have options with RO LO tags too.
I don't hunt other states now.I used to hunt 6.
 
I'm applying NR and do every year.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but since the new tag allocations, only 6% of the tags are guaranteed to non residents. The 10% outfitter pool is shared by both residents and non-residents.

There is no 16% guaranteed to non-residents.
 
I would say New Mexico has the Worst draw system out of any State. They give no bonus pts, only 6% of tags to non-res, they cater to the outfitters, they have way too many landowner tags. No reason to apply there, it's just not worth it..
 
PS Dont go by Huntin Fool or MRS listed odds to determine how often you may draw. The odds they list are inflated by 2X to 5X! For example, they take take the total NR tags and divide by just 1st choice applicants.... even though all three hunt choices are valid.

A much more realistic and simple quick calc is to divide by the total of all applicants listed, 1st-3rd choices. It is far more accurate and is only off by tenths of a percent... ie 0.3% etc or so.
 
The other thing I didn't see mentioned here is that when they lowered the nonresident tag allocation from 12% to 6% non-guided, they also eliminated non-residents from applying or drawing cow tags.

I'm not complaining- just stating a fact. It is what it is. I don't like it, but I can always move back there if I wanted, right?
 
Another tidbit....they also eliminated some areas for NR's as well like the Sargent Wildlife area. Had a friend that hunted there once and he was bummed when they banned NR's. The NR's did take the brunt of the adverse changes and it is what it is.
 
Draw has not happened buddy hang tight.



>Looks like a back door may
>be open.
>I was able to buy a
>general tag again today if
>I wanted to for $65
>so I'm guessing I didn't
>draw.
 

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