Sitka gear

muleymaddness

Very Active Member
Messages
1,102
Hello - looking at upgrading my jacket. Right now I have core4element pants in Mothwing camo. I'm looking for a jacket and have it down to the Sitka Jetstream, Sitka 90%, or Sitka Stratus. Anyone have any ideas or input for me? Just in need of an all around good jacket that can be layered up and down.
 
I have a 90% jacket, which means 90% of the time you're going to freeze. my Celcius and jetstrem are a little better. I wouldn't call any of them cold weather jackets unless you never stop moving or you have lots of layers.

It all depends on the temps and moisture and hunting style of course. I'm still learning how to do this layer thing I guess, I've just always had a warm coat and just went hunting but with this new lightweight stuff it is more involved .









Stay thirsty my friends
 
I've owned the jetstream and stratus. The jetstream is the better of the two jackets for blocking the wind. I can't comment on the 90%. I will say the Kuiu guide jacket is about the same as the jetstream in warmth and wind stop, but lighter in weight.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-25-13 AT 03:46PM (MST)[p]I love the 90% jacket. I have two of them. One for early season when the temps aren't too bad and one in a bigger size for late season that I can layer more under. My layering for cold 4th season temps. is: an Under Armor T-shirt, then Sitka Traverse zip with the hood and then the 90% jacket. I do my best to not sweat getting to my glassing spots, that is key to not freezing when you sit down to glass and I have found that if I wear anymore than this I will sweat. I then pack a NorthFace down jacket in my pack for when I stop to glass. This combo has me just fine in temps down to 15 degrees. I love the pit zips on the 90% and usually have them open when hiking to my glassing points. This set up is plenty light weight and the down jacket packs up plenty small.
 
I have the KUIU Guide (similar to Sitka 90%) and it is a great jacket that I wear when I'm near the truck. When hiking, a softshell is kind of an in-between jacket that doesn't excel at anything.

I have gone to a KUIU Superdown jacket with Cabelas raingear. It cuts weight and I can fight super-cold, heavy rain, or just a slight breeze with the same two pieces of lightweight gear.

If I didn't already own the Guide, I'd buy the new KUIU Yukon. It pretty much feels the niche of super-breathable 100% waterproof raingear, and a softshell, in one jacket.

Sitka has similar gear in their line, they are just twin brothers of a different mother. I don't think one brand is necessarily better than the other. Just go with the one that will offer you the best deal.

Grizzly
 
A lot depends upon what type of weather and hunting you do? If you sit in a stand or blind for hours in December in Montana you will likely want something warmer than if you spend most of your time hunting Colorado. You can always add layers but what happens if you buy a jacket that is too warm?

A Sitka 90 works pretty well for my style of spot and stalk hunting in Wyo UT, and Colo. I buy my jackets fairly large soIcan add lots of layers plus there is a little ventilation from the bottom when loose. It's also nice having pitzips. If I intend on sitting for extended periods I'll bring along a windstopper vest, thicker Cabelas microtex shirt, sitka base layer top, neck gator...etc. If it is super cold, windy, with snow or rain I'll add an additional Sitka Nimbus rain jacket. Obviously I can add or strip layers depending upon what is comfortable.
 
Proper layering is based on three layers. Shell, middle/insulation, and base. The shell is supposed to protect the insulation layer from wind, precipitation and physical damage.

None of the jackets you have mentioned are true shells so I assume that you will head for the house when it starts raining or you get a nice wet snow. The Jetstream and Stratus use a Gore Windstopper laminate (the original Gore-Tex without an oleophobic coating) but the seams are not taped so they will leak at some point. The 90% has only a DWR coating on the exterior. They are all great jackets but they are not shells.

Since you are a treestander and weight is not an issue I would suggest you look at the Downpour or Coldfront Jackets. They are true waterproof/windproof/vapor permeable shells then get good base and insulation pieces to keep you warm.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
I have a nickname for Sitka, which is s#itka. I have used the 90% pants and the stratus jacket. they are fine when the weather is good but as soon as any precip is in the air they fail miserably. I will stick with fleece for half the price which, imo outperforms Sitka. also wool is much better when temps get cold. never again will I buy another Sitka product.
 
Thanks for the posts... I haven't purchased my jacket yet. It just seems like the Sitka stuff is a little overpriced and the softshell really is a wasted layer.

Hardcoreoutdoor - what's your basis in identifying me as a tree stand hunter? I don't get it. What is your recommendation for a quiet, waterproof, shell?
 
In my opinion Kuiu has the best rain shell on the market, far better than Sitka. the Yukon or the Chugach have the same outer layer.













Stay thirsty my friends
 
Timberhunter

The 90% and Stratus did not fail, you failed to you use them properly if you expected them to keep you dry or warm. Those jackets are neither shells nor insulation pieces although they serve that purpose in moderate conditions.

While the Jetstream uses Gore Windstopper laminate to, as the name implies, stop the wind from robbing you of body heat the seams are not taped so it will leak when subjected to enough precipitation. They are not made to be anything more than water resistant and they have very little insulating capacity.

Fleece and wool are first and foremost insulators so that is an apples to oranges comparison at best and neither is waterproof without the help of something like a laminate and taped seams.

Don't blame any piece of equipment for not performing when it is being used for a purpose it was not designed.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Muleymadness

I thought I read in the original post that you were a tree stand hunter. Sorry, my mistake.

I have been writing/complaining about this issue for many years and while we have gotten closer (thanks to Sitka Gear) we are not there yet. Although, I was told last week at SHOT by some industry people very high up the chain of command that we are there but it will require a little more maintenance then we are used to. Meaning we will have to renew the exterior DWR more often. And when we do get it, it will come from Sitka Gear.

We (hunters) need waterproof, windproof, vapor permeable (breathable), lightweight, highly durable and quiet shells in camo or stealthy solid colors. We have all that but it has proven very difficult to put quiet and lightweight together in the same garment. You can have quiet but it won't be lightweight and lightweight but it won't be quiet. You just can't have both yet.

So, to answer your question I recommend several shell jackets for trigger pullers but none of them is what I would call quiet and under 25 ounces because that simply doesn't exist...yet.

Go to the SHELL LAYER section of my site for specifics but basically here they are. Each has matching pants or bibs.

Arcteryx Theta AR in Nighthawk (Gore-Tex)
Wild Things Tactical Hard Shell SO 1.0 in Multicam (eVent)
Kuiu Chugach in Verde (Toray)
Sitka Gear Stormfront in Moss or Open Country (Gore-Tex)
Sitka Gear Dewpoint in Lead or Open Country (Gore-Tex)

Sitka Gear Coldfront in Open Country or Charcoal(Gore-Tex Softshell) is quieter but heavier.

My favorite for hunting is Sitka Gear. They are tougher, I prefer the stealthy solid colors, and I think the Gore-Tex performs better than anything else on the market. They (Gore-Tex) also has the best warranty/service in the business.

I think what we will get in the near future short of a major technological breakthrough is a proper Gore-Tex shell with a micro-fleece exterior (like the current Sitka Gear Whitetail line or Cabelas MTO50 rain gear) but it will be a very stripped down feature set to account for the extra weight of the quieter fabric. This will require us to renew the DWR on the exterior more often so the water beads up and runs off.

Getting exactly what we want is a very tall order and the biggest company in the business has been working on it for a long time. We are close but not quite there yet.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
440sixpack

"Kuiu has the best rain shell on the market, far better than Sitka"

How so? Please elaborate.

I have field tested them both extensively and while I have my opinion too there is not enough difference to say one is "far better" than the other. Although,

I get better color/camo choices at Sitka.
I get a more extensive line to choose from at Sitka.
I get the best warranty/service (when I need it) in the business from Sitka/Gore-Tex.
I get outstanding waterproof/windproof performance from my Sitka shells.
I find the Sitka materials to be more durable.
Sizing consistency and product availability has been an issue with both companies.
You will pay more for the Sitka but price is not a consideration in my reviews, I am looking for best-in-class regardless of cost.
Communication with and accessibility to Sitka is significantly better.

My Kuiu products are also very good. At this level it is splitting hairs but Sitka is the winner in my experience. There is no "far better" between the two.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Muleymadness

I agree that once you leave the quad/truck the (non-waterproof/windproof/breathable) softshell is a wasted layer and extra weight. It is super comfortable, quiet and looks great but it is neither a shell nor an insulator regardless of who makes it.

Shell, insulation/middle, and base layers is how the old mountaineers did it and it is still the best way today. I love my Sitka Jetstream for knocking around town and hunting out of the truck but I wouldn't take it on a backpack hunt. That is just asking for trouble because it is not designed for that.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
What I say makes the Chugach better than the Cloudburst is I didn't get wet in the Kuiu. I don't know where my Sitka leaked , but it leaked . My Chugach has been bone dry.

I don't wear rain gear often, but of the two brands Kuiu is definetly my choice. on other items I have both Kuiu and Sitka and I'd say it's just what you prefer.

I've found kuiu to be very good to deal with, they sell stuff faster than they make it is the only issue I've had.








Stay thirsty my friends
 
440sixpack

You may have wetted out in the Cloudburst but it didn't leak unless you damaged the exterior fabric and or the attached laminate. In tact, undamaged and taped Gore-Tex does not leak. Period. It is guaranteed.

Trust me, I have had this conversation a hundred times and what you think is a leak is wetting out. It is a common misconception. I am certain that you would have done the same with any high end waterproof breathable shell currently on the market.

I am the guy that spend hours climbing in bad weather wearing one shell top/bottom set then comes back to the truck to change shell sets to do the same trail over again and so on and so on until I have tried them all. None of the shells I recommend leak from the outside in. They all, however, are subject to wetting out if I don't actively ventilate and practice good exertion control. I have field tested more than fifty shell sets over the past five years and my findings are consistent whether it is Gore-Tex, eVent or Toray.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
hardcore outdoors

no I did not fail to use it properly. hunting is about getting one set of gear that will hold up, rain or shine, not having to pack five different sets of clothes for five different situations. plus i shredded the 90% pants after one season, is this supposed to happen with near 300 dollar pants?? the seams came apart where my boots are and the crotch, as well as countless rips throughout the pants.. I have hunted all my life with wool and fleece gear, while not light, if you are in rugged mountains and harsh condition's it will not fail you. i have read so many good things online about Sitka that i figured i'd give it a shot. it is supposed to be somewhat waterproof, somewhat in my mind is not soaked to the bone in five minutes from the dew that settled on the huckleberry bushes over night... i hunt the mountains of british Columbia and have done so all my life, with my dad and his dad before him. it rains a lot when we go hunting, which makes the bush quiet. any rain gear is useless because hunting in such close quarters and dense bush, the noise is just too much. all Sitka is is a "cool" name for hunters that think they need to spend outrageous cash for a brand name. and it worked about as good as anybody could have hoped for. but it is garbage. you can get a 60$ shell of similar material at workwear world that preforms on par with Sitka.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-20-14 AT 08:40PM (MST)[p]You don't have to pack five different set of clothes if you would just buy the correct three layers in the first place.

Somewhat waterproof? It either is or it isn't under natural conditions. What you bought isn't because it isn't designed to be.

I like how the story grew from the stuff just not being waterproof but other than that fine to it completely fell apart in one season.

So if no rain gear will work in your conditions why did you expect that a non-waterproof piece from Sitka would be keep you dry? I would think somebody who hunted BC their entire life would know better. Again, your expectations for that product was the problem. You should have gone with a Stormfront or Coldfront Gore-Tex piece but never mind that. You used the wrong tool, got bad results and blame the manufacturer for it meanwhile Stika Gear works beautifully for people that know how to use it.

I suggest you stick with the $60 workwear world shell and send me some pics of that marvel of technology but stop blaming something or somebody for your mistakes.

edit-By the way, when you find that magic do everything in every situation and every condition set of clothes please let me know. I have been looking for it for more than 30 years.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-20-14 AT 09:23PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Jan-20-14 AT 09:14?PM (MST)

hardcore, I see that you are very knowledgeable about "gear" I visited your site and found it very informative. but I still don't have anything good to say about Sitka. I was told from where I bought it that it would keep me dry in modest conditions (light rain). the guy even showed me by pouring water on it that it would bead the water off. I didn't expect it to keep me dry, in harsh conditions, but I expected more than it being soaked from minimal exposure to slight moisture.

I said raingear wouldn't work simply for the fact it is too noisy. I'm sure there is great raingear, but it simply will not work where I hunt.

now, I can hunt with wool in a downpour, damp, quiet, and warm all day. or even medium weight fleece, it gets damp but it takes hours before it is anywhere near soaked. can you say the same with anything from the Sitka line up?? from your last post the answer was no.

i am still young and havnt had the time or money in my life to test half of what you have, but i have put the sitka gear i have to the test and it did not preform anywhere near the reviews i have read or the hype that comes with the name. i don't have as much of a negative review on the stratus jacket as it preforms ok, and worked for me but it still isn't worth the money imo.

my story changed because i forgot about all the time i spent behind a sewing machine. another problem that just came to me is two zippers came apart. going over windfalls both zippers at the knee height popped (not the same day). i should also add that for about half the time i spent on the mountain the conditions were dry. so what I'm saying is when the conditions are completely dry they work fine. but the same can be said about jeans in similar conditions.

and I do agree with you, nothing is perfect. there are just way cheaper alternatives to give you the same results. as well as better all around clothing for lets say half the price. although some wool is very expensive you can also get it at reasonable prices.
 
Wade, I couldn't find it on your website, but maybe I just missed it.

Have you had a chance to review the First Lite Stormtight or KUIU Yukon? I didn't make it to SHOT to see the 2014 Sitka or FL, but I would put either of those equal to, or better than, the 2013 Sitka Dewpoint. FL and KUIU are quieter than Dewpoint, and very comparable in waterproof and breathability. The big pro for Dewpoint is lightweight, but I feel the Yukon is more durable than the Sitka.

I am extremely impressed with the progress made from First Lite lately, they seem to be a better contender every year.

I agree with your general premise that Sitka and KUIU are comparable (see my previous post), but I think that puts KUIU in the conversation, and more-and-more First Lite, than some of your posts allude.

PS. Thanks for your reviews, I used them extensively when choosing binocs for my wife.

Grizzly
 
I may not have sense enough to come in out of the rain but I'm smart enough to know if I'm wet ot not. for whatever reason under similar conditions I've stayed dry in my Kuiu .















Stay thirsty my friends
 
440sixpack

You were wet but from the inside out not the outside in. Unless the laminate was physically damaged enough to let water droplets pass the membrane to the inside of the jacket you wetted out.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Hello Grizz

I posted a picture of the First Lite booth that I visited but nothing else so no you didn't miss anything. I have it on my list to call and speak to Ryan at FL. I have had a fair number of requests from readers to review their stuff so it is just a matter of time. Looks good but as you may remember I don't opine on anything before I use it in the field myself.

I have not gotten my hands on the Yukon yet and Kuiu did not go to SHOT so I can't speak to that one but I do have the Chugach and I agree it is quieter than the Dewpoint but just a decibel or two according to my unscientific Radio Shack meter. That difference means nothing though to a rifle hunter.

Agreed that the breathability and waterproofness of the Dewpoint and Chugach are similar but in my back to back trials I give an edge to the Dewpoint but remember that it is hard to quantify and control for external environmental variables. They are both good or very good in both respects but the DWR on the Chugach has not held up as well as the Dewpoint. Also, I love the feel of the Chugach fabric but it is showing some dings from this country where the Dewpoint has not. Again, more anecdotal than scientific but remember that I try to put everything through the same trials under the same conditions because that is the only way I know how to fairly compare.

And again, I don't do this for you guys I do it because I am looking for the best for myself. You guys just get to see the results. Remember that Sitka was started by two guys then they split and the one that left started Kuiu so it should surprise no one that the two products are similar in design and performance but there are differences I listed above.

The big one is longevity of performance which I forgot to mention. I still have 35 year old Gore-Tex parkas that work perfectly well as long as the DWR is kept fresh. I can't say the say thing about the Toray used in the Kuiu stuff. Also, if I have a problem with a Sitka Gear Gore-Tex product, I send it back to Gore-Tex (Sitka is owned by Gore-Tex) not Sitka and they take care of it. Toray doesn't stand behind its downstream products like that.

So they are both very good but my field work gives an edge to Sitka in a number of different areas. Does that mean the Kuiu is crap? Absolutely not and it does deserve to be in the conversation. I have worn it and do wear it. In fact I like it but I am looking ultimately for best-in-class and right now that is Sitka from wear I stand.

Stay tuned for more on the First Lite stuff and the Yukon. Good to talk with you again.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
I did a simple shower test this morning with the Sitka Gear Jetstream Jacket and the pictures confirm my prediction. The Gore Windstopper fabric and DWR keep the water out but it will eventually leak at the untapped seams. Again, if you want true waterproof, windproof protective shell layer performance then you have to buy a true shell layer. As I said in the post I would have suggested the Sitka Gear Dewpoint, Stormfront or Coldfront Jacket and Pants.

Check out the pics on my site.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Maybe you're right, I was wetted out with the Sitka. but if the Kuiu didn't isn't that worth something?

I don't claim to be an expert I just know what works for me. Kuiu says their Chugach made of Dermizax breaths better than Goretex, much better. I'm inclined to think that's true if you're right and my Sitka didn't leak.
















Stay thirsty my friends
 
Hard to tell. Lots of variables and as for the numbers regarding "breathability" I take them with a very big grain of salt. There are three recognized methods of measurement and not even the experts can agree on the best way or the results. Kind of like sleeping bag temperature ratings.

The old Chugach or the new NX Rain version, the old Gore-Tex Pro Shell or the new PRO version? It can get pretty convoluted and hard to keep it all straight.

If there is an edge in the ability to pass water vapor it is not by much so you have to consider each package including fit. Now I will tell you that I have found a significant difference in the jackets that use eVent but then there is a durability longevity trade off there too so my advice is to choose the one among the top choices of Arcteryx, Arcteryx LEAF, Wild things, Sitka Gear, or Kuiu that you like and be done with it. The numbers are close enough. Just keep the DWR up to snuff so you get the most of the what the technology has to offer.

However, none of the above will leak (outside to inside) as long as the fabric and membrane is undamaged but they can all wet out if you generate more perspiration than the system can handle. That's when you get wet then cold.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
What is the best way to keep up the DWR ? my kuiu guide jacket still repels water but it's not a waterproof fabric. I'm sure some sort of maintenace is required.

My Chugatch is the new fabric, I don't know if it's as wonderful as they claim but it does seem to work. my only gripe with Kuiu is I hate hoods and they love them. so I have a local gal put zippers on them but I keep them just in case.











Stay thirsty my friends
 
440sixpack

DWR is a big deal with these hi tech shells because it keeps the exterior fabric face from becoming saturated. If it becomes saturated the water acts like a seal and water vapor on the inside of the jacket has a much harder time escaping. I prefer Granger but there are a number of other good ones out there like McNett. Here is a link to a piece I wrote on the subject.

http://hardcoreoutdoor.com/2011/02/...ean-and-revitalize-waterproof-shell-gear.aspx

Here is the very basic theory on this process. The laminate consists of three layers (usually). A vapor permeable membrane sandwiched between a protective exterior fabric and an interior backing. The membrane has microscopic openings or holes small enough to keep water droplets and wind out but big enough to let water vapor from the inside out. Perspiration turns to water vapor in the micro climate under the jacket and is pushed outward through the laminate by body heat and chimney effect ventilation that comes in through the neck and cuff openings (which also helps dissipate water vapor by evaporation). Again, the DWR on the exterior fabric acts as a first ring of security by beading up and sloughing off the rain so that fabric face does not become saturated. There is some heavy duty chemistry, physics, thermodynamics and hydrology involved but that is how I understand it.

I am no expert in this stuff and my head starts to spin when the rocket scientists explain it in detail but I do have a lot of experience with the end product in the field. Generally it works. For what I do in the boonies I will take a modern waterproof breathable shell over an old fashioned rubber rain coat any day provided I properly manage my system, activity levels and expectations. There is no excuse to be wet and cold anymore in the backcountry.

I am right there with you on the hood thing. I have been griping about that too for a long time. Carhart and Rivers West made good jackets with effective detachable hoods why can't everybody else? I am told the answer is two fold. It effects the over all waterproofness of the shell which gets to warranty issues and also because the manufacturers don't want to have to deal with replacing lost hoods from their customers.

Your aftermarket zipper remedy is a great idea and would be even better if it could be done with a water resistant zipper.

Good talking with you.


Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Timberhunter

In this day and age with the outstanding gear we have available to us there is no reason to have to settle for being damp and warm. That is a miserable way to enjoy the outdoors anyway. It is also dangerous.

You loose body heat twenty five times faster when you are wet then when you are dry and your insulation (even wool or fleece) is less thermally efficient when wet or damp. That means while you grow colder your clothes are loosing their ability to keep you warm. This leads to hypothermia which brings with it loss of coordination and the inability to think clearly which is why so many people make bad decisions or get hurt in these situations. And it just goes downhill from there. Worst case is somebody like me ends up carrying you out in a body bag.

So, one way or the other, try to stay dry. You will last a lot longer out there and have a much better time.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
>Timberhunter
>
>In this day and age with
>the outstanding gear we have
>available to us there is
>no reason to have to
>settle for being damp and
>warm. That is a
>miserable way to enjoy the
>outdoors anyway. It is
>also dangerous.
>
>You loose body heat twenty five
>times faster when you are
>wet then when you are
>dry and your insulation (even
>wool or fleece) is less
>thermally efficient when wet or
>damp. That means while
>you grow colder your clothes
>are loosing their ability to
>keep you warm. This
>leads to hypothermia which brings
>with it loss of coordination
>and the inability to think
>clearly which is why so
>many people make bad decisions
>or get hurt in these
>situations. And it just
>goes downhill from there.
>Worst case is somebody like
>me ends up carrying you
>out in a body bag.
>
>
>So, one way or the other,
>try to stay dry.
>You will last a lot
>longer out there and have
>a much better time.
>
>Wade
>www.HardcoreOutdoor.com

well hardcore, I see that our opinions on how to have a good time in the bush varies significantly. I am not worried about getting packed out in a body bag from being underprepared, especially from you/.i have been on hunts in some of the most rugged country north America has to offer. and have three generations worth of knowledge from oldschool hunters, who did not need the most high teck gear available, to be successful. also not having the most expensive gear, does not put you at a disadvantage. the passion is still there no matter what you wear. hell I still use my grandfathers wool pants, that I have no idea how old they are.
 
Oh I don't know, my assumptions usually prove to be dead on.

BTW, one of my favorite pieces are wool officers pants issued during the Korean war but we have come a long way since then and although cost is not a consideration in my reviews it doesn't have to be an issue. Bargain basement won't get it done but you don't have to spend top dollar either.

My gripe with your earlier post is that you took a big swipe at an innovative company that changed the industry by creating a new segment, one that we desperately needed. They didn't deserve the wholesale knock you gave them just because you let some retail clerk sell you the wrong Sitka product. What's worse is you have written off the entire company then have the temerity to defame it with your "Sh#tka" post. I would be a lot more impressed if you would just admit your ignorant mistake and move on.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
And if the seams fell apart on you then you should have sent them back directly to Sitka so they could make it right instead of sewing them yourself then bitching about it. Although I have to tell you that I am looking at a dozen pair of various pairs of Sitka Gear pants from their last three model years and not one of them has a bad seam or any other defect. They look pretty beat up because I use them hard in extreme country but they are all perfectly in tact.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Sitka and Kuiu can charge what they do and get away with it for one reason. they're worth it.











Stay thirsty my friends
 
now your comparing the way you hunt to how I do? how is it that just because you haven't ripped any sikta pants, that you think I haven't? or do you think I'm lying about the seams coming apart and multiple tears where they have caught on branches etc? maybe you should read your own post about arrogance, and then mine about assumptions again. I've given my response to how they have preformed for me and what I'm looking for when It comes to hunting gear. sure i'll admit that if you use them the way you say, they will work the way you say. but I was not ignorant about how they are advertised to preform and how they actually preform.

remember the product isn't going to please everyone, but from the responses I have read I would say over 95% are happy with the product, my negative review will hopefully sway someone who was in my shoes before i bought Sitka. but overall it wont hurt the company, that is not my intent. I'm sure most people will still be ecstatic about Sitka. you don't need to insult me about my experiences with the product, or that I use them wrong. remember I am the one not happy about my purchase, not you. these are my feelings on the product, I'm just giving my opinion, nothing more. I wish I would have read a few negative responses on Sitka before I bought them, maybe It would have swayed me. i am done with this thread, cheers.
 
If 95% are happy with their Sitka Gear products and you aren't I think that would give you reason to take pause and ask well what did I do wrong. Maybe I screwed up. Instead you blamed the product and the company. Yea mine have some rips, tears and pulls in them too. Hard use in nasty terrain. Rubbing is racing but I don't hold Sitka responsible for that. Thats on me.

You are absolutely entitled to your opinion but I would ask that you keep your comments and criticism constructive when posting about a going concern on a big forum like this one.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
fair enough, I tried to go back and edit my post slandering the name but it said after 300 minutes its not able to. I apologize for being brash with some comments, now I actually am done. cheers.
 
I absolutely love my Sitka Gear, I never thought high tech clothing would make a difference but it does. I have been putting my Sitka collection together a piece at a time off of eBay and MM classifieds. I pretty much have all the pieces I need, I didn't really like Sitka rain gear. I have been using the Cabela's MT050 rain gear for a while now and it has performed flawless.

Wade,

I am a hunting boot fanatic, I have tried more boots than you could imagine. You should the Crispi boots, after I bought a pair my search for the perfect boot for me is over. I did 15 miles day one, right out of the box and when I got back to camp I didn't think about taking them off, taking my boots off is unusually the first thing I do.
 
Dirtygrass

Which MTO50 rain gear? The quiet pak set? If so is it the older stuff or the newer more modern version?

I looked at the Crispi boots a few years ago and then again every time I see them at the shows. They look nice and well made but the guys don't seem very interested in going through my process. Not everybody likes to be put up against the likes of Asolo, scrapa, hanwag, Solomon and Lowa I guess.

The only thing that really matters on boots, especially at that level, is that they fit you. I suggest that if you really like them stick with them and buy a couple extra pair because sure as shootin they will change your favorite model or discontinue them altogether.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Wade,
I have the new MTO50 Gore-Tex rain gear, seems to have the micro fleece outer, very quiet.

I understand what you are saying about buying extra boots when you find the perfect boots. My favorite light boots are Salomon Quest GTX, I have two new pairs in the closet.
 
Wade , I have been an avid hunter for over 40 years and in that time I've seen tons of clothing come and go .For most of my big game hunting I have systems that work for me . Although I hunt about 100 to 125 days a year , with about 30 to 40 of those days spent on deer / elk and other big game , my time is primarily spent as houndsman . I n the summer , late spring and fall I'm good to go .I live in an area that gets lots of sub zero weather in the winter and I've wore every winter boot ever sold by Cabelas. I finally settled on just good leather insulated hiking boots, a little heavy but I usually get 2 to 3 years out of them if I keep them snow sealed up real good .I used to wear wool bibs but I usually wear them out in a year. I hunt in all kind of conditions but for snow I'm still looking for the perfect clothing . A couple years ago I bought a russel brand jacket I really like , and if I wear another coat over it , it does the job .I've been thinking of going with the kuiu rain gear pants but after reading your posts I'm thinking maybe the Sitka would be better . Before I go spend a bunch of money on a pant system to stay dry and warm is there anything better that you have tried ? I may get on a snowmobile at 4 am and 25 below zero for 3 hours cutting for tracks then hiking half the day to get to a tree . When I was younger weight was not a concern but now it is my biggest concern. I may be in snow up to my ass or on bare ground . I would really like to hear your thoughts as I have always been limited by money to an extent as to how often my gear always wore out .
 
I don't have any experience with the Sitka raingear so I'll let Wade or someone else field that one. Based on how much and how hard you hunt though, I suspect you might be disappointed in the Kuiu stuff. It's very lightweight and waterproof but durability is not so great. If you hunt that much and wear it regularly, I think you'll find that you wear it out pretty quickly. The kuiu stuff is made to shed pounds and is good quality if used sparingly but is not durable, IMO. Most guides and outfitters I've spoken to feel the same way. That being said, I don't know of any products out there that are lightweight and durable at the same time.
 
"Wade,
I have the new MTO50 Gore-Tex rain gear, seems to have the micro fleece outer, very quiet."

Hey Dirty, any problems with your MT050 wicking moisture up the sleeves in heavy rain?
 
Ya , that's kinda what I've found out after 30 years Like I said , I used to wear wool but it wouldn't last either . Right now I wear under armour as my base layer and usually levis or my Russell pants over them .Then I go with a good warm micro fiber pant or right now I am using a cheep water proof pant over everything .I'm just getting to damn old to keep packing wet, frozen pants all over the hills . I was hoping the kuiu or maybe Sitka would be the answer but I sure appreciate the info on holding up before I dropped 350 on a pair of pants that won't last a season .I may just keep looking . Thanks , Tod
 
I just got the Core hoodie from them. Noticed the stitching was off on the left thumb loop. Contacted them, now I gotta pay to ship it back to them. Is that unreasonable? I guess I'm spoiled by other places. I'm considering just shipping back the whole kit and starting over. I don't wanna pay $10 more for something that arrived messed up. Just seems odd to me.
 
Rainier,

I have noticed on most merino wool pieces, regardless of manufacturer, that they use a unique kind of stitching. I don't know what it is called but it is a wide back and forth cross stitch. The Sitka Cores use the same type of stitching but I too have found some of them to be a little loose, too loose. I have made them aware of my observations so I hope they are addressing it. If it were me I would ask them to pay for the return shipping. It is after all a defective product.

tod

Wow, that is a very tall order and let me start by saying that I am not aware of a pant that will do everything from snow machines to high exertion tromping through the snow on foot while being multi-year durable and low or moderately priced. That sounds to me like the perfect shell layer.

However, I am a three layer guy through and through so I always go back to that. A good base appropriate for what you are going to be doing, a couple middle insulation layers to choose from according to the situation over the course of the day and a protective shell.

When you are on the snow machine you are using them all together because you are trying to keep a cold wind from robbing you of heat and you are not worried about wicking/breathing/perspiration etc because the snow mobile is doing all the work. When you get off your machine and start walking you have to strip down to the lightest thing possible so you can get rid of all that heat and moisture from perspiration. When you stop, you cool down a little, stop sweating and put your insulation back on so you don't get chilled. When you get going again you strip down again and so on. It is a constant balancing act, right?

So two suggestions for you. First, get rid of the levis for cold and wet conditions. When they get wet they stay wet and that is a major league no no. "Cotton kills". I would replace them with a good synthetic version like the Sitka Timberline pant or the Arborwear Ascender pant. Both are great. Second, you might take a look at the Sitka Coldfront shell pants and jacket. They are a heavy duty softshell Gore-Tex fabric which will breathe but they are expensive.

Have you looked at the Filson Single and double tin bibs and jacket? Tougher than hell and a good waterproof windproof shell if you maintain them. They are relatively heavy though. I would send you to Rivers West but their stuff doesn't breathe at all which is fine for the snow mobile but not the high activity stuff.

Let me think on this a little more.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
Wade , First let me thank you for responding.I have got probably 8 pair of filson bibs .For years they were my go to gear .On average I get about 1 year out of them and then the crotch area wears through .One problem with the wool bibs is they have no leg zipper , so they are not easily removed in the field so you can hike without them .I have even used carhart bibs as an outer layer but it gets wet and the zippers freeze and can't be undone or put back on .Until about 5 years ago I just dealt with the weight , but in 2009 I broke my back while lion hunting and when they fixed me up they cut down along my spine and I lost a lot of strength in my back . Now all weight is a concern .I hear you on the cotton , I have several different types of water proof pants that are relatively light weight but durability is not as good as the filsons .I was mostly just looking for input before I buy anything for next year .I looked at the kuiu stuff and thought it might be the ticket but at the price I would want it to last for a couple years at least . We are not that far from warmer weather now so I'll be hiking bare ground and horseback more . I haven't looked at the Sitka stuff but will definatly give it a look. I appreciate your time and if you find that perfect gear let me know . Thanks again , Tod
 
Tod

Boy I gotta tell you if you are wearing through a set of Filson bibs in a year or even two I am not sure I know of anything of anything better. That is the toughest stuff I know of.

Kuiu, Sitka, Arcteryx, First Lite, Patagonia, Wild Things, Cabelas etc are all made for a different user and significantly less durable than the Filson Single or Double Tins.

Here's an idea. I have not tested them yet but I have seen some interesting things at Duluth Trading Company lately. They have some new things including waterproof breathable jacket and pants if I recall correctly in their Fire Hose line. Pretty stout stuff I understand.

Check them out.

PM me so we can stay in touch. We'll find you something.

Wade
www.HardcoreOutdoor.com
 
No problems in heavy rain, I have the bibs because I am on a horse and don't want the water dripping down the crack of my ass. With the bibs I can leave my jacket unzipped half way to control moisture inside. I wear a waxed felt cowboy hat that focuses the rain away from my body.
 
Hey Wade at Hardcore Outdoor Gear Review,
What happened to your website? I haven't been able to access your website for quite some time. Your website was always the best place to find out great info on gear reviews!!!
 

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