Utah, make it fair!

cantkillathing

Very Active Member
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1,454
If everyone is squaking for more bucks per doe, why not just shut down the deer hunt for one year, straight across the board, no mule deer hunt at all. Then have a year to come up with a good solid mule deer plan and proposal. We all miss one year. split the state up into more units. Get a real count on deer numbers, and give tags based on buck to doe ratio per unit. two months of planning will end up in a disaster. One year of planning, and getting a good solid deer count and breaking up the units will give the DWR a better idea how to manage units. I don't want the computer count on the deer, but a good field count on the deer, something that is more accurate.
To make up for the loss of revenue, you can have people buy a preference point to make sure they are going into the next year one point into the game. Preference point will cost you the price of a deer tag.
One year of sitting out will do a lot better than slowly cutting the tags. We will cutt tags little at a time and never see the results, if they cutt one year out you will see a huge result, the next year we will have put 45,000 more bucks in the state.
 
$45 x 97,000 = $4,365,000

Budgets are tight, that is a tough pill to swallow. I don't think they could raise the price of a preference point to $45, and even if they did, I don't think everyone would buy one.
 
I agree that shutting down the hunt would be the best thing they could do, but you and I know they are not willing to sacrafice like the sportsman would. Did you know that they count half the fawns as bucks and then they go through a bad winter like last winter and all die. I bet that we are less than 10 bucks with horns to every hundred doe. Big changes have to occur to have a chance of making this better. You can see by their option 1 choice that they want to do the one less painful to all, but that does not help the deer herd.
 
+1 dax, not to mentiom their contracts with lifetime tag holders and dedicated hunters it simply could not and will not ever happen, but cut 7-13 thousand tags and raise the price of tags stay tuned !!!!
 
At least for a few years, cut the tags in half, raise the fee, and start a fund we can donate to that goes straight to a mule deer fund without groups getting a cut from it.

The Dedicated Hunter program can be abolished within a few years. That is a pretty simple fix, Just don't renew any new ones and honor the remaining commitment to those still in it, and then let it die.

From my understanding there are only about 4,000 lifetime holders and a good portion of those are hunters age 50 or more, so those numbers cant drastically effect much.

Whither we like it or not, Utah's deer hunt has to change drastically and it won't be long before everyone has to draw and then wait a few years to draw again. It's really that simple.

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Have a good one. BB
 
I would still bet to cover the cost most people will still be applying for the LE tags so they will have to buy a license to apply, and to gain a preference point half or more will buy a point because the first year of hunting after a wait would be the best.

Cutting the tags by 7000-12000 is not going to do much for the buck to doe ratio.

Increase some elk permits to help cover the cost as well. I bet your spike elk tags will sale out.

Lifetime hunters can have a deer hunt give them one day to hunt archery in some winter ground where there wont be a deer and call that there hunt for the year.

The dedicated hunters could be froze for 1 year and it wouldn't effect much, just delayed the program one year.
 
"Lifetime hunters can have a deer hunt give them one day to hunt archery in some winter ground where there wont be a deer and call that there hunt for the year."

Hmmm...

Kind of an interesting statement in a post titled:
"Utah, make it fair".....

------------------------------------------------------
"So... Now you got a little taste of what I do...pretty dang exciting, eh?"
 
Management of deer herds- not hunters- is what the DWR/DNR should really be about... They run the hunts every year like a financial institution, money in- espenses out and so forth. Their concern for deer numbers, and buck numbers, seems to play second fiddle to their 'income'.
What I would like to see are actual deer count numbers... If they just use a computer- what the heck do all the employees do...?? The DWR should do something much like the Census- hire a lot of full-time, temporary individuals every other year to literally count the deer and other wildlife. These are No-Benefit, No-Pension jobs that would pay well... They could hire 4 temp people for the salary, benefits, and retirement of one current employee... Let's get some real numbers...


"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-01-10 AT 10:59AM (MST)[p]Dude your stupid. Shut down the deer hunt for a year and see how many people come back! Break the contract with lifetime license holders and see how happy they are. What wrong with dedicated hunters? 2 deer for 3 years and most don't kill anything. Give the 5 day hunt some time! Just because you "cantkillathing" doesn't mean we have to cater to you and your problems!

How about we stop killing deer on winter range? Before any money paid or damages fixed on private land caused by wildlife they have to participate in the walk in access program. If not then they can't legally shoot them either. If they participate then we will help put tall fences around the stackyard, afterall you put YOUR field on THEIR winter range.

Does anyone know how many depredation tags are given in the NE region? Does anyone know how many deer are killed in fields during the winter by the dnr? That is where I see the problem.

Do those things and numbers will come up and so will access for hunters spreading out pressure.


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The whole buck-to-doe ratio concept is good and all if it's done right, but still makes me nervous. If it's below goal, it's pretty easy to kill a few does and bring it back in line. Just sayin'...

Obviously this is ridiculous but the higher ratio's are a start. I hope someone comes up with a better idea to address the deer population. Why doesn't someone compile all these good ideas floating around on this site?
 
Justr_86, I am assuming you must be immature, just like your assuming I cant kill a thing. But anyway instead of bashing you on the internet let me give some insight the DWR has 3 options coming up on the muledeer hunt all of which have little to no impact on what hunters are wanting. Most hunters want to see more deer and more bucks while they are hunting, and none of the option will obtain any of them. The deer herd is in poor shape, I for one am not for cutting tags, I would rather keep the tags at 97,000 and give everyone opportunity to hunt, there are already people sitting out each year, so if everyone sat out one year rather than randomly sitting out it would atleast make a bigger impact on the buck to doe ratio, it wont improve the deer herds because the doe and fawn will dictate that, need more does to make more fawns to make more deer. Until the DWR decides to give more predator tags out then we will always be in this predicament. I also agree with your walk in access, I dont think land owners or the division should be shooting any deer in fields, especially when the land owner doesn't let anyone in.
 
lets get rid of the CWMU's and start getting more walk in access!
I agree they should NOT! pay for crop damage,you freaking moved there deal with it! look at how they decided to fix Bountiful,lets shoot them all! why not transport?
I'm sure a few of us would volunteer, rather than see them all die!
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-01-10 AT 01:16PM (MST)[p]I think you need to read them again. To me the problem is in the winter range more than anything else, ya other stuff plays in but not near as much!

Shutting down the hunt is dumb, too much relies on the hunt every year. From money for wildlife to local economy. Its just not going to happen.

So where are the deer getting killed? How many dead animals are dead on the side of the road during the summer vs winter? Where do they have to go? They can't compete with the elk for food. In or out of the fields, in the fields they just get shot anyways. Up the number of elk tags, bull and cow to help give the deer somewhere to be.

And find some way to get sportsman access to hunt private instead of just paying the landowner for damages when they won't let anyone hunt or charge a trespass fee.


4b1db2ac644136c4.jpg
 
I would like to see a tax imposed on homes built within the last 20 years on historic winter range. We impose a 2% tax on a $500,000 home and we just made $10,000 that could be put back into deer habitat. Muliply that by the thousands of homes that have encroached on the winter range and you get the picture of how much money could be made and put back into habitat management. I also think new homes that are being built on winter range should be assessed a one time 10% tax. That would be $50,000 on a home with a value of $500,000 dollars. Alot of good could be done with that kind of money.
 
hey i have the best idea of all!!! k k now hear me out... lol how about we dont start 50 threads all arguing the same damn thing with each other and oh oh oh heres the best part.... GET YOUR BUTT TO A RAC MEETING AND EXPRESS IT WHERE IT ACTUALLY MATTERS!!!! lol just razzing yall but aeriously thia whole thread is pointless!!!
 
justr-86 i agree with most of what you.said mostly about buglebilly bing stupid.
 
>justr-86 i agree with most of
>what you.said mostly about
>buglebilly bing stupid.

I didn't call bb stupid. That was aimed at cantkillathing for trying to get the hunt shut down for a year.



4b1db2ac644136c4.jpg
 
GET YOUR BUTT TO A RAC MEETING AND EXPRESS IT WHERE IT ACTUALLY MATTERS!!!!

Having your voice heard is the MOST important thing we can do.....

Come to the BOU(Bowhunters of Utah) meeting Wednesday evening at Wilde Arrow in Centerville 6pm to ?????. We are trying to put together a plan for ALL hunters, not just archers......
 
Buck to doe ratio management is ridiculous. If the WHOLE Northern Region has 200 deer and 100 of those are bucks how the hell is that herd in good shape??? Buck to doe ratio's are fantastic but you still don't have any deer to hunt!!!

All of you are quick to cut opportunity for the rest of us
according to a theory that has failed year after year since it's inception in 1994. You've got the proof over the last 16 years of how well this fiasco has worked and now you want to
follow this plan off the edge of the cliff???

What you all need to realize is that we need to GROW MORE MULE DEER NOT JUST PRESERVE BUCKS!!!

You want more Mule Deer??? Here is how you do it.

1. MAJOR road closures to motorized vehicles.
2. KILL SOME FREAKING ELK!!!
3. KILL SOME LIONS!!!
4. No livestock in winter range habitat. This is the most critical piece of the puzzle. You can bring all the deer in the world through the hunt and if they starve that winter what have you accomplished??

Carry On with making things fair




*****************************************
Wiley,
I am nominating that for post of the
century on Monster Muleys!

Your are spot on.
 
> Buck to doe ratio management
>is ridiculous. If the WHOLE
>Northern Region has 200 deer
>and 100 of those are
>bucks how the hell is
>that herd in good shape???
>Buck to doe ratio's are
>fantastic but you still don't
>have any deer to hunt!!!
>
>
> All of you are quick
>to cut opportunity for the
>rest of us
>according to a theory that has
>failed year after year since
>it's inception in 1994. You've
>got the proof over the
>last 16 years of how
>well this fiasco has worked
>and now you want to
>
>follow this plan off the edge
>of the cliff???
>
> What you all need to
>realize is that we need
>to GROW MORE MULE DEER
>NOT JUST PRESERVE BUCKS!!!
>
> You want more Mule
>Deer??? Here is how you
>do it.
>
>1. MAJOR road closures to motorized
>vehicles.
>2. KILL SOME FREAKING ELK!!!
>3. KILL SOME LIONS!!!
>4. No livestock in winter range
>habitat. This is the most
>critical piece of the puzzle.
>You can bring all the
>deer in the world through
>the hunt and if they
>starve that winter what have
>you accomplished??
>
> Carry On with making
>things fair
>
>
>
>
>*****************************************
>Wiley,
>I am nominating that for post
>of the
>century on Monster Muleys!
>
>Your are spot on.

Are those, 1-3 reasons your real belief as to why our deer herds are in trouble?
 
Not totally. But untill we figure out how to make it rain, or how to make it stop snowing, or how to warm up a January night these are some great starting points of things we can have some control over



*****************************************
Wiley,
I am nominating that for post of the
century on Monster Muleys!

Your are spot on.
 

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