how many deer ?

[DRHORNHUNTER]

How many deer do you think this female has taken to get three little ones to this stage?
Watched her through the spottin scope Figured the three kittens were probably 75 pounders

Sorry they are blurry but this was a mile and a half from my house and happened fast

 

[dogshedd]

Amazing to not only glass and witness that but to get it on video. Thanks for posting.. That definelty goes against there being no lions around like some hound doggers would have u believe.

 

[rackman]

Hundreds

 

[Team_UNC]

Does it really matter? Lions and other natural predators have been managing herds for thousands of years before any so called "trophy hunters" came along and thought they owned the deer and had the right to kill of anything that would take a trophy rack out of their hands. Its a joke that anyone would care.

Team_UNC

 

[2lumpy]

I care. Don't wish to offend Team.

Some aren't interested in managing either predator or prey, some want to manage both. I want surplus deer to harvest so I want to manage for that kind of environment, respect those that don't but I'll be on the side of more deer, fewer predators.

I figure as long as humans are going to setup our communities in the middle of the wild kingdom we need to take responsibility to care for all species. Once humans stick their toe in the tube, the natural, non-human system, can't self-regulate. Too many un-natural conditions that critters can't adapt too when modern humans are in the equation. Corn fields, 80 mile an hour diesel trucks by the thousands, not to mention passenger cars, 9 foot high freeway fences, sprinkler irrigation systems, river dams, cities with a million folks living in their winter range, timber harvests, fire suppression, domestic livestock, 100,000 hunters with amazingly effective technology, etc.

That chance do any of our wildlife species have unless humans manage all of them as holistically as our not so brilliant minds can muster.

That's why I care, I guess it could be a joke to some but not from my view of the present world in which we find ourselves.

Peace, Team.
DC

 

[DRHORNHUNTER]

+1 and then some lumpy
I care also Its sorta like the wolf deal Just let them regulate the amount of wildlife left?
Can you imagine if no one would have ever taken any predators ?
I was just posting the pic cause its the first time in my 40 years that i witnessed a lion on the prowl with three little ones. And just wondered how many deer she would need to take since the birth of her kitties? I don't know how old they would be to be this size but can't imagine how many times i may have rode a horse or walked right past her?

 

[BrowningRage]

I'm with team UNC- who cares how wildlife die..? Who cares if lions kill 15,000 deer and elk each year? Who cares if 35,000 deer and elk get killed on highways each year? Who cares if 60,000 deer and elk are harvested each year? Who cares if CWD is killing deer and elk? Who cares how many deer and elk die each winter? I think ignoring factors that effect our wildlife populations is something every sportsman can get behind.

Thanks for paving the way Team UNC...


"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24

 

[TOPGUN]

IMHO those were excellent posts by lumpy and BR!!!

 

[Gator]

Just think how many she will need to get them grown up from this point on.

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".

 

[lostinOregon]

Team UNC,

You should care a ton. We have not been allowed to hunt cats and bears in Oregon without dogs for years and now there are tons of both and no deer. If they are not controlled, hunting becomes a thing of the past. Predators need to be managed, period.

Rich

 

[Team_UNC]

I agree predators are gonna kill EVERY single deer in the world... every single predator needs to be killed till they are like the buffalo are. You tools should worry more about the anti hunters fighting 24/7 to get YOUR hunting rights taken away. Predators dont have money, and they dont have the ability to speak. Anti hunters do and they are getting stronger. Spend more time thinking about what really affects hunting and less about animals that are doing what they were created to do and the hunting world will be better off.

Team_UNC

 

[Team_UNC]

According to the 2007 study by CDOW more and more mountain lions are being killed each year. I believe in predator control I shoot coyotes every chance I get, I would just never shoot a mountain lion... Its the way I was raised. I mean no disrespect to anyone, Im simply saying there is bigger fish to fry. You aint gonna have to worry about lions killing deer if anti hunters get their way.

THis is from the study.. it can be found on the CDOW site.

Hunter harvest of mountain lion has increased from 81 in 1980, reaching its highest level in 2001 of 439. Harvest limits gradually increased from 1980 before leveling at about 790 from 1999 through 2004. From about 1992 through 2001 the proportion of females in hunting mortality appeared to be growing from about 40% to about 45%. In the late 1990?s to early 2000?s, hunters in some areas began reporting that the number of older males in hunter harvest seemed to be declining. Growing attention by hunters and species advocate groups, along with concern from DOW manager led to more detailed analysis and development of new DAU plans statewide in 2004.

Beginning in 2005, DOW hosted a series of seminars with lion hunters and houndsmen providing information about gender identification and the value of females in lion populations, information was also provided ?on line?, and in the lion hunting brochure. Hunters were asked to voluntarily reduce harvest of females in DAUs managed toward stable to increasing lion populations. In addition, the DOW developed an ?on line? lion hunter education course and test containing gender identification information and other lion hunting information. In 2007, the Wildlife Commission required hunter to have taken and passed this course before they can obtain a lion hunting license. Voluntary effort to reduce female hunting mortality was successful in reducing the proportion of females from about 44% on average to 34% in the 2006-2007 season. The lion hunter education requirement will complement the management contributions by hunters and houndsmen


Team_UNC

 

[lostinOregon]

Team UNC,

I respect your opinion but it was the anti-hunters who changed things here in Oregon on bears and mountain lions. They purchased a video from an Oregon hound hunter and showed the animals being shot out of trees on TV over and over and over. They won the election and now we have out of control populations of both. The anti-hunters will then move on to shut down deer season because there are no deer left. Look at Wyoming, you will see some elk seasons that were closed this year due to wolf predation.

It is a complex problem but it is not as simple as you think, ask anyone from Oregon about the deer and elk herds and what ails them. You have a better chance of killing a lion or bear during deer season than you do a mature deer. Anti's work in mysterious ways,

Rich

 

[Blackhawk357]

Regardless of your politics, the biologists I talk to say that an adult female will kill one deer about every seven days.

 

[huntindad4]

I agree that once we started to manage and influence the herds we then have the responsibility to continue.

Team UNC I think your numbers reflect the fact that prior to 1980 (I don't know when for sure) most western states poisoned predators and populations were LOW therefore harvest was LOW. As the population increased so did harvest. It's no secret that in the times before your statistics deer numbers were awesome. The same statistics can be used for both sides of an argument in most cases and this is no different.

Oregon's deer herds are in trouble and it coincides with a time that lion populations are booming. We have the same problem in CA because we cannot legally shoot lions in CA.

We must manage predator populations or we won't have to worry about the Antis. As stated above look at some of the elk herds in MT and WY since the wolf re-introduction.

Bill