First time shooting a muzzleloader

T

tuco

Guest
Well I bought the percussion T/C Hawken .54 this weekend for my first muzzleloader. I took it to the range and followed the muzzleloader101 advice. I was pleasently surprised to see that I could get 2 inch groups @ 50yds from this gun with 80 gr of Clearshot and a round ball with prelubed patches. I bought the .54 over the .50 because the 1:48 twist is supposed to shoot shorter bullets better than longer which require a faster twist. With short bullets in .54 I can still shoot 348 gr. bullets which are shorter than .50 348 gr bullets. Right now I am sticking to roundballs that I plan on using for Spring Turkey here in Texas.

A few questions I have after trip are as follows:

1. I was getting some noticeable hangfires (seemed like about .25 seconds). One time the cap went off and it didn't fire until I had picked my head up from the sights. I was told by the guy who sold me the gun to get Musket caps. Would yall recommend musket caps over no. 11's?

2. I had one misfire towards the end of the session (after about 10 shots). When I got home I took the nipple off and notice a lot of crud in the channel so I thought this might have been the cause. What is the best way to clean the area below the nipple?

3. Cleaning. The guy who sold me the gun said to put hot water and a teaspoon of ammonia in a bucket and pump it from the breech upward with a swab. He said soap was not good. Is this true? How often should I do this?

4. I don't know if the prelubed patches i am using are petroleum based or not. Should I get some pillow ticking and lube with bore butter for round balls? The Maxihunters or blackbelts I am going to use for mule deer and elk do not require a patch, right?
 
tuco: My first thought about the hangfire is yeah maybe the conversion to a musket cap would be the right move, but what I think I would first have you try is to get some RWS Dynamit Nobel caps. They come in 2 different charges. GEt the "hot" one which has a green inside. You can get them at local gun stores. You can also get them at www.octobercountry.com or www.jedediah_smith.com. That's all I use. The other thought is maybe your bore/breech area wasn't completely dry thus causing the hangfire. Also, maybe a small piece of crud in the nipple channel. Did you fire a couple of caps before you started loading powder in the gun? If not, try that and it should solve the problem if it was crud.

Use bore butter to lube your pillow ticking patches with. Make sure they are 100% cotton with no synthetic fiber. Black Belts do not require any lube, but the T/C Maxihunters do. Fill the grooves completely with bore butter. Do not try to use any petroleum based lubes once you start using bore butter.

tuco: buy some Remington Vortex REUSABLE bore cleaner and use that for a solvent. Follow the directions on the bottle. If you can't find it in the gun store you can use HOT soap and water. It has worked for 100's of thousands of ML shooters for centuries. Clean your bore after every firing session, and use a spit patch between shots when sighting in. That keeps the fouling soft. Light coat of bore butter in the bore after cleaning. Water should be so hot that you have to hold the barrel with a folded up rag or heavy glove.

Make sure that your younger brother calls me collect at (623) 925-9911. I will talk muzzleloader hunting with him all he wants. Thank you very much for the very kind words.
 
I have a few of the Hawkens and Renegades and I don't have any problems with the #11 caps on them.

Let me ask you a few questions that may help resolve your ignition problem.

What brand and granulation of powder are you using, some brands and particular lots foul a lot worse than others.

Have you taken the nipple off and cleaned out the fire channel into the breach, try using a pipe cleaner and clean it out really well.

Depending upon what was fired in it previously you may want to perform a through cleaning before going any further. Bluelk has that all specified out on the other pages of this forum. Basically you want to start at bare metal.

Invest in a CVA or Traditions bore light. That's about the only way you will see what it really looks like down there. Another thing to pick up is the rounded T/C breach scraper tip for your ramrod to use to scrape the crud from the breach cavity.

I use the T/C bore butter both as a patch lube for round ball and as a bullet lube for the maxiballs in my 54's. After a considerable amount of shooting I will take that seasoning layer down a little, but I let it build up a bit.

Basically if it's clean and you are using 2F or 3F black powder it should fire fine with the #11 caps.

The soap and water solution will do just fine for cleaning and you want to create a pumping action with a patched jag on your ramrod with your (remove the nipple) breach in a bucket of soapy water. I am suspecious of the ammonia.

You can contact me by e-mail if you want to discuss that Hawken.

Tom Krupinski
Glendale, Arizona
 
Thanks for the help Tom and Bluelk

I was using Goex Clear Shot FFG and CCI #11 caps. I will try the RWS Caps next time.

How much more fire do Musket caps put out over #11's. Why wouldn't Hawkens come with musket cap nipples from the factory if they put out more fire. It seems to me that you couldn't have too much spark setting off the charge.

The Pipe cleaner idea seems like exactly the right tool to clean the nipple channel with. I will try it.

This may be a dumb question but what kind of soap?

Tom: what sights do you have on your T/C's. I only shot 50 yds, but it seems that the factory sights would obscure the target at 100 yds. I have seen some after market peeps and fiber optics that might be better. The fiber optics might be too fragile in hunting scenarios. I had one break on my bow and couldn't see the pin when the plastic was gone. I need a good compromise between hunting and target sights.

James Patlovany
Houston, Texas
 
James,

Check the tang on your rifle to see if it has two or three holes in it. If it has that middle hole with a filler screw, you are all set for the T/C Hunter Apeature sight. That what I use on most of the Renegades, but I change the front to a post blade rather than a bead. These are much easier to use for my older eyes than the open style. Although T/C states that you should use the front bead with the apeature, I have be used to a post and apeature over many years, so why change.

On one of the Renegades I have a narrow front blade, don't remember the brand offhand, with a copper insert that is also kind of handy, but the stock blade works just fine.

On one of my percussion Hawkens, I have one of the old T/C vernier apeature, creedmore type, sights with the globe front sight with the six inserts. Of the other two Hawkens, one is a flint and the other percussion and I have the factory blade rear and bead front on those. What I like to do with either the factory sights or the front posts is to use a 6 o'clock hold to see more of the target.

I don't think you really need to change from a #11 cap nipple if you keep the fire channel clean and unobstructed. I only use the CCI brand of caps and they light every time, unless I get lazzy after cleaning and leave the bore went and charge up.

Never used any of the substitute powders, only real blackpowder, Goex, Elephant and Swiss, so I can't compare to what you are using.

Remember you have an excellent warranty on that rifle and don't hesitate to contact them by e-mail for a instruction book if you did not get one with the rifle. I had one old barrel that started grouping so far off that I could not adjust the sights sufficiently. Sent it back to T/C and they just replaced the barrel with a new one.

As far as soap, there really doesn't seem to make too much difference. For a while I have been using Simple Green or just laundry detergent. I am going to try Ivory bar soap in solution, might be gentler on my hands.

Good luck and enjoy that rifle.

Tom Krupinski
Glendale, Arizona
 

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