Gunnison buck

C

ColoradoOak

Very Active Member
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1,920
I was going to post on the original thread, but apparently it was locked. Here is the link:
http://www.monstermuleys.info/dcforum/DCForumID6/23964.html

Here is an article in this week's Gunnison Country News about the buck.

Article1_zps731e733b.jpg


Article2_zps485da044.jpg
 
Strongly agree with this new effort. I think we'll start to see more of these groups as most serious hunters would agree with the basic premise that Governors Tags don't correspond with fundamental hunting ethics.

As to the argument that money-talks, we need to explore alternative methods of generating revenue without compromising our image and our values.

Any other groups out there doing the same thing?
 
Looks like some people got some explaining to do.
Thanks for sharing this....It's about time.
Best,
Jerry
 
All for the Governor tags. No I have no hope of ever having one in this lifetime, but no amount of complaining is going to convince me that 1 buck taken on the wintering grounds in an isolated spot in Colorado versus the tens of thousands of others that are killed during the other hunts is detrimental to the herd. Sorry I said it it's true.
 
>All for the Governor tags. No
>I have no hope of
>ever having one in this
>lifetime, but no amount of
>complaining is going to convince
>me that 1 buck taken
>on the wintering grounds in
>an isolated spot in Colorado
>versus the tens of thousands
>of others that are killed
>during the other hunts is
>detrimental to the herd. Sorry
>I said it it's true.
>

It's not the killing of one buck....it's the tactics used to kill that buck. Flying helicopters around harassing deer on winter range (not 1 deer, all of them), driving through closed wildlife management areas, trespassing, etc.

Why is it always the mule deer guys that are the guilty parties? You never hear about this stuff with the statewide elk tags, or sheep tags, or moose tags, etc. This idea to shorten the governor's tag seasons is gaining traction, and it's all because of the broken moral compasses of a few guys.
 
My question becomes why go in and reinvent the wheel? If the problem is the harassing wildlife, trespassing, closed areas, etc....why not enforce the laws ALREADY on the books?

I don't care if the governors tag exists or not. Keep them, do away with them, I don't care either way. What I am fundamentally against in a strong way is new regulations or rules put in place because you're failing at enforcing what is already on the books.
 
I do not agree with changing the seasons, but do believe that we need to look at the all the other crap that goes on. All of the stuff mentioned that is already illegal should be addressed. We should also find a way to get rid of finders fees and limit outfitters and the brokers of licenses in the state. Enforce our already existing laws with stiff enough fines and penalties that they are followed.

I spend almost every weekend on winter range through out the winter killing predators. I do not believe that any of my activities have every negatively caused an impact. So the winter range issue is a non-issue for me but the truck loads of hunters, paid bounties, and the disregard of existing laws needs to stop.
 
I have to say that I understand what the petition is all about... These guys are seeing huge bucks being killed in their local unit at a much higher rate than other units, and its happening during the winter months, rather than normal hunting seasons...

They are looking at it saying, "We live here, we hunt here. We are happy to let a trophy go each year, but not 3 or 4..." I dont know how big the unit it, or how many deer it sustains, but the quota on that particular unit for Gov Tag holders doesn't seem too far fetched...

I doubt they'll ever get the season dates changed. That's why the rich buy those tags. To hunt at the deers' most vulnerable time.

"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
>Antihunters. This website is full
>of them.


This website also has one taxidermist from Houston who only spouts BS when he posts!!! Gee, I wonder who that could be!!!
 
> I doubt they'll ever get
>the season dates changed. That's
>why the rich buy those
>tags. To hunt at the
>deers' most vulnerable time.

I can tell you for a fact that there is a very good chance of it happening, because it is already being discussed.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-04-13 AT 08:27PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-04-13 AT 08:22?PM (MST)

LAST EDITED ON Feb-04-13 AT 08:14?PM (MST)

It seems to reason that it would be tougher to find and enforce wildlife offenders if there aren't as many game officials and hunters monitoring game units once seasons have closed?

Why extend season dates for a select few hunters? It doesn't seem fair that a select few should have the option of hunting game animals once seasons are closed and game is rutting on winter ranges. They definitely have an advantage over other hunters that have waited years to draw tags that hunt during designated seasons.

Although it may be tougher to harvest the biggest bucks, bulls, rams, and billies during designated hunting seasons it is pretty generous allowing a select few the option of hunting every unit in Colorado! I'm pretty sure governor's tags would be highly desireable tags even if limited to hunting during designated seasons.
 
Tristate, The Gunnison Wildlife Association, Anti Hunting??? Really??
You?re a sheep. Do any of you guys remember the Sate wide either sex year?
Or more commonly known as the year of the? left to lay? dead spike bull fiasco?
If you do some checking you will find this Basin was out of it. Why? the GWA that's why.
And way before your time COLO antler restrictions weren't in place 3rd season, ya back when we had
an astounding less than 15 bulls per 100 cows post hunt. GWA again helped that.
I wonder how many bags of pellets GWA has put on the ground through the years?
In 98 when we went to totally limited deer tags . This basin did away with 90% of the OTC tags averaged
In 95-96-97. Who proposed that percentage? CDOW?

But to the question of the 2 Auction and 2 raffle deer tags. Why have so many of them been harvested in these 3 DAU?s? 50+ Bucks to 100 does from 04 to 07 have any thing to do with it?

Ethics. Yep the big guns have used choppers twice now that I am %100 sure of. Throughout these ?Hype? years our game has dodged a bullet with snow depths. The Big Guys have only had to use snow machines to cross Blue Mesa to gun down a weak, rutted out ?Governors? deer once so far. I'm sure on a tough snow year they won't use them again?

This tag started with an end date of Jan 31. The proposed end last time around was Dec 15th ?Compromised? to 12-31. It needs to and I expect it to go to Dec 1st for 2014. Sorry folks 2013 Gov auction/raffle is already set.

How does all this affect us guys who get our tags in the point game?
Our CPW biologists don't like put in for the auction money for meaningful mule deer projects. They look at it as unethical blood money. (Bet I get a phone call or two for that statement.)

All the hype caused the terrestrial folks so much grief in this basin that we got brand new Deer DAU plans This January. No more 40 to 45 bucks per 100 does folks we are now managed for 35 to 40 in all three DAU?s. And lower total deer #?s for the most part.

We will still get most of the ?GOV Tags? because where else in the WEST is there a deer herd managed for 35 to 40? POST HUNT?
With the choppers, snow mobiles, finder?s fees, fame and photo freaks, and $15,000 4th season
Land owner vouchers Why ?----- WHY? Would any area or regional terrestrial biologist in this State or any other State attempt to manage for QUALITY mule deer?

I promise you that as long as this behavior continues in Gunnison the ?Mature? deer hunting will not get any better here or anywhere else in this State. Or any other State.
The bottom line is, in the long run, and the totality of all the circumstances the two auction tags are doing more HARM to the Mule Deer in the State of Colorado then they are doing GOOD.
 
"Tristate, The Gunnison Wildlife Association, Anti Hunting??? Really??
You?re a sheep."


Yeah really. I am the one person on this thread not following all the herd whimps.

"Killing deer on winter range is baaaaaa-ad."
"People who spend money to hunt don't have eeeee-thics."

Which group sounds more like sheep? Just because you don't know the ten commandments doesn't mean it ain't sin and just because you don't realize you are screwing hunters doesn't mean you aren't an anti-hunter. The attitude of "I don't get to kill the deer so nobody can" is screwing the future of sportsmen everywhere.


Face it people you have chosen a path of diminishing returns. Instead of puting your emotions on a shelf and thinking your way through the problem to a more productive solution you have decided to diminish the returns even further. Its like deciding the best way to unload the gun pointing at you is by pulling the trigger until it goes "click"!
 
I Don't support Mossback. I can't verify he uses unethical tactics, but I reasonably believe what is said about him. I have no problem with late season hunts, or Governor's Tags. Sounds like sour grapes to me. What's next knocking people who drew the strip or the Henry Mnts. as having an unfair advantage??
 
Ahhh-The trill of the hunt....
5247helicopter_elk.jpg

After the hunt....How dare you question our ethics. I am ready for ya wimps!...Besides we don't make hunters look bad..See-
2919tristate.jpg

LOL
 
>I promise you that as long
>as this behavior continues in
>Gunnison the ?Mature? deer hunting
>will not get any better
>here or anywhere else in
>this State. Or any
>other State.
>The bottom line is, in the
>long run, and the totality
>of all the circumstances the
>two auction tags are doing
>more HARM to the Mule
>Deer in the State of
>Colorado then they are doing
>GOOD.


From an outside observation, these tags are known for putting big mature deer on the ground. I can't say the same for the majority of tags going out Archery-3rd season. But hey, that's what folks want shot or else there'd be a 4th season and tags cut from earlier seasons.

As far as means and methods, enforce existing laws.
 
Tristate,I have a question for you.What's fair to the deer?Does that matter anymore?(okay...two questions)

And those of us who don't agree with you are whimps?(wimps).You are a freakin' joke,dude.It's not even about the money.It's about what's RIGHT.Can't you see that?
 
"Tristate,I have a question for you.What's fair to the deer?Does that matter anymore?(okay...two questions)"


NO IT DOESN'T MATTER. "Fair" to a freakin' deer? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? When the lion kills the deer, or you kill one at a different time or place do you think any deer's last thought actually is "Was this fair"?????? Listen to yourself. You are starting to sound like those hollywood stars pushing the USPCA on TV. "FAIR"?????????? You just want to cry like a titty baby because you don't think it is fair that somebody with more means and resources kills more big deer than you do.

"And those of us who don't agree with you are whimps?(wimps).You are a freakin' joke,dude.It's not even about the money.It's about what's RIGHT.Can't you see that?"

No people like you who sit around worrying whether they are the voice of deer emotions and "fairness", like you, are whimps.
 
>"Tristate,I have a question for you.What's
>fair to the deer?Does that
>matter anymore?(okay...two questions)"
>
>
>NO IT DOESN'T MATTER.
>"Fair" to a freakin' deer?
> ARE YOU KIDDING ME?
> When the lion kills
>the deer, or you kill
>one at a different time
>or place do you think
>any deer's last thought actually
>is "Was this fair"??????
>Listen to yourself. You are
>starting to sound like those
>hollywood stars pushing the USPCA
>on TV. "FAIR"??????????
>You just want to cry
>like a titty baby because
>you don't think it is
>fair that somebody with more
>means and resources kills more
>big deer than you do.
>
>
>"And those of us who don't
>agree with you are whimps?(wimps).You
>are a freakin' joke,dude.It's not
>even about the money.It's about
>what's RIGHT.Can't you see that?"
>
>
>No people like you who sit
>around worrying whether they are
>the voice of deer emotions
>and "fairness", like you, are
>whimps.


I always wondered who coined the phrase fair chase.

4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-05-13 AT 05:01PM (MST)[p]Fair is an arbitrary term when it comes to hunting;especially considering all the high tech equipment hunters have at their disposal. Bucks that grow antlers that well exceed 200+ inches are very rare.For a hunter to have a crack at such a buck is even more rare.These tags certainly don't inprove a hunters chances of hunting a buck of that caliber.The real question hunters need to ask is, does the revenue from these tags improve the quality of animals in the state the tag was auctioned in?Does the revenue through on the ground projects generate additional tags for the average hunter?If the answer is no, than the money is likely absorbed and wasted by the very bureaucracies and organizations that allow the tags to be sold. Conduct a survey in Utah, and ask the average hunter if he/she thinks revenue from these tags have improved deer herds, or their chances of drawing a once in a lifetime tag. I think it's important to note that the bad guys aren't the rich guys who buy these tags, it's the organizations who have the ability to say "no more" but choose to perpetually wallow in the mire of corruption.
 
"I always wondered who coined the phrase fair chase."


A bunch of old dudes that baited deer, ran deer with dogs, shot deer after the sun went down, and killed a whole mountian of deer in the winter ranges, and didn't worry about what was fair to the deer. They shot and trapped the grizzly almost completely out of the lower 48. They whiped out wolves, three elk subspecies and a bighorn subspecies. They worried about the "fairness" of their rules between their players, to include animals into their contest.
 
Jims.

If they moved the end of the season dates to the end dates for each unit, the price of this tag would drop considerably. Heck it wouldn't be worth much more than a landowner tag in a desirable uni t. You can hunt some private ground on the landowner tag, not on the governors tag without permission!

I think the end date should be moved to Dec. 1st and there should be 2 governor tags, one in an auction and one in a raffle. My 2 cents are probably worth about 2 cents though.
 
>>I think the end date should
>be moved to Dec. 1st
>and there should be 2
>governor tags, one in an
>auction and one in a
>raffle. My 2 cents
>are probably worth about 2
>cents though.


Don't know if you are aware, but there are currently 4 tags: 2 auction and 2 raffle.
 
>"Tristate,I have a question for you.What's
>fair to the deer?Does that
>matter anymore?(okay...two questions)"
>
>
>NO IT DOESN'T MATTER.
>"Fair" to a freakin' deer?
> ARE YOU KIDDING ME?
> When the lion kills
>the deer, or you kill
>one at a different time
>or place do you think
>any deer's last thought actually
>is "Was this fair"??????
>Listen to yourself. You are
>starting to sound like those
>hollywood stars pushing the USPCA
>on TV. "FAIR"??????????
>You just want to cry
>like a titty baby because
>you don't think it is
>fair that somebody with more
>means and resources kills more
>big deer than you do.
>
>
>"And those of us who don't
>agree with you are whimps?(wimps).You
>are a freakin' joke,dude.It's not
>even about the money.It's about
>what's RIGHT.Can't you see that?"
>
>
>No people like you who sit
>around worrying whether they are
>the voice of deer emotions
>and "fairness", like you, are
>whimps.


Every argument follows the 10-80-10 rule. The radical 10% on either side of the issue (conservative vs. liberal, hunter vs. anti, wimp vs. non-wimp)make the most noise but have the least tenable position. Tri-state, I don't know you, but your constant dribble fits into the irrelevant 10% that only feeds the opposing radical 10%. Congrats on being, as you state you're not, an "anti". Let me spell it out for you.

Fair is an important concept simply because it keeps the anti's at bay (among other reasons). Thus, when a so called "hunter" claims that "fair" or "fair chase" is a myth, he/she is only demonstrating his/her lack of concern for the bigger picture. We use fair chase as a mechanism to ensure the longevity of our tradition. We abide by those rules because the animal deserves it. We cast aside the hunters that don't because they are not hunters -- they are anti hunters. You, Tristate, are an anti hunter because your position is the position acting-anti-hunters use to portray all hunters. Plain and simple.

If you can respond in an intelligent fashion without exclamation marks or other "titty baby" antics, please do so. I am happy to entertain the conversation.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-06-13 AT 10:49AM (MST)[p]"Every argument follows the 10-80-10 rule. The radical 10% on either side of the issue (conservative vs. liberal, hunter vs. anti, wimp vs. non-wimp)make the most noise but have the least tenable position. Tri-state, I don't know you, but your constant dribble fits into the irrelevant 10% that only feeds the opposing radical 10%. Congrats on being, as you state you're not, an "anti". Let me spell it out for you."

Four sentences of blabbering just so you can get to your defense of "I know you are but what am I". It didn't work for Pee-Wee Herman and it ain't working for you.

"Fair is an important concept simply because it keeps the anti's at bay (among other reasons)."

"Fair" is a childish distraction for people who know that their position is childish and can not defend it. To entertain the idea of fainess to an animal that you kill is an immature act promoted by the belief that both you and he are equal. Then to think that this keeps antis at bay is just as rediculous. To the anti all killing of animals is unfair and you have now demoted your arguement by playing by their childish rules and definitions.

"Thus, when a so called "hunter" claims that "fair" or "fair chase" is a myth, he/she is only demonstrating his/her lack of concern for the bigger picture."

Go back and read. I have not heard a single person proclaim fair chase to be a myth.

" We use fair chase as a mechanism to ensure the longevity of our tradition."

Great job. So we have you to blame for this failure.

" We abide by those rules because the animal deserves it."

This is narcissism to the extent it has manifested itself as a god complex. You actually believe you decide what animals deserve for all men. Maybe you would like to make a deer heaven while you are at it.

" We cast aside the hunters that don't because they are not hunters -- they are anti hunters."

Wow! More Narcissism. Your self-righteousness holds no bounds.

" You, Tristate, are an anti hunter because your position is the position acting-anti-hunters use to portray all hunters. Plain and simple."

And now back to the Pee-Wee Herman defense. By the way it doesn't work in debate.

"If you can respond in an intelligent fashion without exclamation marks or other "titty baby" antics, please do so. I am happy to entertain the conversation."

So an exclamation mark is not intelligent??????? Whats the weather like in fairy land today?
 
Why do we have to have people like Tri-State on here that are always just looking for a fight? Your comments aren't constructive and basically you are trying to bully people into thinking what you say holds water, go post somewhere else.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-06-13 AT 12:25PM (MST)[p]These tags should end the last day of the last season like they do in WY. If a "hunter" cannot kill a buck during the 5 hunting seasons then they are a retard.
 
Chasewild,you pretty well nailed it with your post.Thanks.4000fps-I 100% agree.Seasons for Gov tags should end when all other seasons do.Whether you want to cheat by flying to look for your trophy is up to the hunter's personal code of ethics,much like any other hunting aid is.

The term "Fair Chase" is pretty much Boone&Crocket Club's motto.It's on their website.
 
TriState could have said it more eloquently, but he is correct. The deer don't care about fair chase, neither do cougars, wolfs, or bears, or any other predator. Fair Chase is strictly a human concept forced on the natural world. To a deer, dead is dead.
What is actually "fair" is like debating which flavor of ice cream is better. Vanilla or chocolate? Deer should be managed by quantitative scientific means. What is good for the species should take priority what people think is good for deer. IMHO.
 
I am aware of the 2 and 2, I was just saying that I think it should be 1 and 1 myself. I think you could get more than half the money for 2 tags than you would get for the 4 tags. When you are at 4, it is easier to say why not 6 or 8...and then you end up like Utah which I think is pretty ridiculous.
 
If they ended when other seasons did, then there is really no reason to have a tag unless you wanted to hunt all of the seasons (early to late). You might as well just buy a landowner tag and hunt late. If you are going to have governor tags and want them to be worth something in Colorado (WY doesn't have landowner tags so it is a different situation), then you have to give a little. I am sticking with my Dec. 1st date, kill them in November, not around the new year.
 
tristate, to bad you was not around, when them old dudes were,,, maybe they could do for you, what they did for the griz and wolves, ect,,,,,
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-06-13 AT 07:22PM (MST)[p]nripepi, I wouldn't exactly say that a governor's tag is just like any other tag if the tag holder is restricted to hunting open seasons? The tag holder could hunt any unit in Colo from around August through the last hunting seasons. That is a pretty liberal season if you ask me....plus the ability to hunt every corner of Colorado! Colorado is also known for producing some of the biggest muley bucks in the country. That in itself ought to raise the value of those tags!

It certainly doesn't seem too terribly fair with the current system hunting so many weeks after seasons close when bucks come out of hiding for the rut out on the winter range.
 
I fully support this effort and would be happy to sign the petition. The manner in which many of these hunts are being conducted is getting way out of hand. I do not agree with hunting these deer in December after the regular hunting seasons end; that also goes for the extended hunting on Ranching For Wildlife properties.
 
>What is actually "fair" is like
>debating which flavor of ice
>cream is better. Vanilla or
>chocolate?

I'm going to go out on a limb and say vanilla, hands down! ;)
 
There is no reason to have this hunt extend past regular hunting seasons. The deer don't just magically appear after the hunts are over. They are there the whole time. You just need to HUNT for them.(Crazy concept, I know) If a hunter is worth his salt, he should be able to kill a good buck within the seasons. Especially with all the guides looking. I think it would say a lot more about a hunters ability if they didn't have to wait until a buck walks out on the winter range to kill him.
 
>I fully support this effort and
>would be happy to sign
>the petition. The manner in
>which many of these hunts
>are being conducted is getting
>way out of hand. I
>do not agree with hunting
>these deer in December after
>the regular hunting seasons end;
>that also goes for the
>extended hunting on Ranching For
>Wildlife properties.


X100 CrabClaw!
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-07-13 AT 00:40AM (MST)[p]I get that "most" people on this site have mule deers best interest at heart but let's all admit we are "hunters". At the end of the day we all want to kill. So for someone that has potentially paid hundreds of thousands of dollars for a tag let them hunt through Dec. If I'm not mistaken Arizona let's certain tag holders hunt all the year through. Bunch of sour grapes on this site. Everyone talks chit to Tristate but he and Sage make sense. In the end money talks.
 
A lot of good points have been made.
The only reason we do not have a 4th season is These 3 DAU?s have not Met our buck to doe ratios for a three year average since the bad winter.As soon as we do we will have a forth. 10 to 15 tags per GMU.

I can't agree with a December 1 end date like I supported the last time we had the GOV tag debate. Why? I think the get it done at all costs attitude has now been Adequately demonstrated. I am convinced that if we do ?snow up? again like we Used to annually in November the snow machines will come off the trailer.
I guess I am a ?wimp? ?a anti-hunter? and ?eat sour grapes?. In derogatory MM slang I am a ?ethics police?. I agree that biologically 2 to 4 deer in December are not the end of the world.
But since I am from here, and did not move here recently, and don't just visit. I think I will put
Some effort into stopping behavior I do not agree with.
We all have opinions, I think I will act on mine win or lose I will know I Stood up for what ?I? think is right.
OAK as some insider info?so do I. 2013 auction/raffle are set. I have already ordered my elk tickets from CBA. Printed the Sheep form tonight. I Won?t buy any Moose tickets from SCI as they support high fence. The world is full of choices. Not buying moose raffle hurts since this is year 26 of COLO moose applications but o-well. Better the odds for others. Guess we will just all have to wait and see what happens with the Colorado Mule Deer auction and raffle season dates for 2014. Thanks for the intrest.
 
Remember Popeye in WY? He would show himself on the Winter range, but nobody could ever find him during the season. Very cool he pulled that off. Would have been a shame if there had been a Governors tag; so somebody with the means could take him in a manor that would have been poaching for anybody else. Just my jealous poor piker point of view.
 
OK folks I think I have a wonderful solution to our problem. I think the best solution is for this GWA group to combine their resources and start buying the governor's tag. If they do the state still gets to utilize the money for themselves and the GWA can decide how they think a deer should be killed. There are lots of options. TheGWA could have a membership lottery where one of the members gets the tag but is under contract only to hunt under their new rules. Or the GWA could just decide it should be really expensive tag soup. Either way both parties are satisfied. I think it is time for these "conservation" groups to start sacrificing like the evil unethical killers do. Their budgets should not stop at megaphones, office supplies, and tissues to cry into. If they really believe they are fighting for a just cause they should be willing to put their money where their mouth is. I will be the first to give a promise on these forums. If the GWA buys the governors tag next year I will personaly applaud them.
 
>The term "Fair Chase" is pretty
>much Boone&Crocket Club's motto.It's on
>their website.

Which is hysterical as the last Gov. buck killed that has put people over the top is on the B&C trophy watch list!!
 
In general, it's not the "killers" who are the unethical ones. It's the hired posse that puts stress on the whole herd with their "hunting" tactics. I couldn't care less if a guy with the tag went out and popped a deer on winter range in December. What I do care about is someone chasing deer around on winter range for 2 weeks in a helicopter, driving ATVs in closed areas, trespassing, entering closed wildlife management areas, etc, etc. Now I agree that there should be some law ENFORCEMENT being done to control this behavior, but I don't appreciate that fact that these guys need to have a LEO following them around 24/7, on the sportsman's dime.

All of the "governor's" tags in Colorado are valid until December 31st. How many times are we hearing these complaints about the elk hunters, or the sheep hunters, or the moose hunters? There are 2 or 3 mule deer guys that have zero ethics when it comes to these tags, and they will be the reason that the tag dates get changed. Thank you to those who have supported those guys and their tactics over and over and over.
 
>LAST EDITED ON Feb-06-13
>AT 10:49?AM (MST)
>
>"Every argument follows the 10-80-10 rule.
>The radical 10% on either
>side of the issue (conservative
>vs. liberal, hunter vs. anti,
>wimp vs. non-wimp)make the most
>noise but have the least
>tenable position. Tri-state, I don't
>know you, but your constant
>dribble fits into the irrelevant
>10% that only feeds the
>opposing radical 10%. Congrats on
>being, as you state you're
>not, an "anti". Let me
>spell it out for you."
>
>
>Four sentences of blabbering just so
>you can get to your
>defense of "I know you
>are but what am I".
> It didn't work for
>Pee-Wee Herman and it ain't
>working for you.
>
>"Fair is an important concept simply
>because it keeps the anti's
>at bay (among other reasons)."
>
>
>"Fair" is a childish distraction for
>people who know that their
>position is childish and can
>not defend it. To
>entertain the idea of fainess
>to an animal that you
>kill is an immature act
>promoted by the belief that
>both you and he are
>equal. Then to think
>that this keeps antis at
>bay is just as rediculous.
> To the anti all
>killing of animals is unfair
>and you have now demoted
>your arguement by playing by
>their childish rules and definitions.
>
>
> "Thus, when a so called
>"hunter" claims that "fair" or
>"fair chase" is a myth,
>he/she is only demonstrating his/her
>lack of concern for the
>bigger picture."
>
>Go back and read. I
>have not heard a single
>person proclaim fair chase to
>be a myth.
>
>" We use fair chase as
>a mechanism to ensure the
>longevity of our tradition."
>
>Great job. So we have
>you to blame for this
>failure.
>
>" We abide by those rules
>because the animal deserves it."
>
>
>This is narcissism to the extent
>it has manifested itself as
>a god complex. You
>actually believe you decide what
>animals deserve for all men.
> Maybe you would like
>to make a deer heaven
>while you are at it.
>
>
>" We cast aside the hunters
>that don't because they are
>not hunters -- they are
>anti hunters."
>
>Wow! More Narcissism. Your
>self-righteousness holds no bounds.
>
>" You, Tristate, are an anti
>hunter because your position is
>the position acting-anti-hunters use to
>portray all hunters. Plain and
>simple."
>
>And now back to the Pee-Wee
>Herman defense. By the
>way it doesn't work in
>debate.
>
>"If you can respond in an
>intelligent fashion without exclamation marks
>or other "titty baby" antics,
>please do so. I am
>happy to entertain the conversation."
>
>
>So an exclamation mark is not
>intelligent??????? Whats the weather
>like in fairy land today?
>


Tristate, I was hoping you would surprise me. Instead, just one more forum-tantrum to chalk up to your name. Good luck in your future endeavors. You will never garner another response or attempt from me on this site.
 
I guess the thing that really bugs me the worst is the attitude of having to kill the biggest deer of all time,regardless of how that gets done.To me,it just shows a bad ethic.You guys are right-dead is dead.Duh.

Fair chase is in(or should be)each of our minds,not the deer's mind.We all have to live with the decisions we make.

Hunting winter range bucks is akin to hunting high-fence.JMO.
 
>I guess the thing that really
>bugs me the worst is
>the attitude of having to
>kill the biggest deer of
>all time,regardless of how that
>gets done.To me,it just shows
>a bad ethic.You guys are
>right-dead is dead.Duh.
>
>Fair chase is in(or should be)each
>of our minds,not the deer's
>mind.We all have to live
>with the decisions we make.
>
>
>Hunting winter range bucks is akin
>to hunting high-fence.JMO.


+1
 
hunting them on Winter range isn't a whole lot different than all the folks going in and getting on top of the deer for photo-ops. Now if they're shooting them off the golf course then maybe there's a legit gripe.
 
>I guess the thing that really
>bugs me the worst is
>the attitude of having to
>kill the biggest deer of
>all time,regardless of how that
>gets done.To me,it just shows
>a bad ethic.You guys are
>right-dead is dead.Duh.
>
>Fair chase is in(or should be)each
>of our minds,not the deer's
>mind.We all have to live
>with the decisions we make.
>
>
>Hunting winter range bucks is akin
>to hunting high-fence.JMO.

+2
 
There shouldn't even be a fourth season in CO, but that is a different discussion. Some of us actually remember the days of being able to buy a deer tag over the counter and go hunt. In the last 15 years the deer numbers just keep getting worse, and the 4th season and governor's tags certainly aren't helping the comeback.

Funny, if you have money up front you can go kill a sorry starving deer in the middle of winter, and have a bunch of Utards fighting over the photo rights. If you don't have money and go kill the same deer you would face jail time, a loss of hunting rights in all western states, and heavy fines. I am tired of people acting like these auction winners are doing us and deer some big favor. $100k is a drop in a bucket of piss compared to a state's budget.
 
>There shouldn't even be a fourth
>season in CO, but that
>is a different discussion. Some
>of us actually remember the
>days of being able to
>buy a deer tag over
>the counter and go hunt.
>In the last 15 years
>the deer numbers just keep
>getting worse, and the 4th
>season and governor's tags certainly
>aren't helping the comeback.
>
>Funny, if you have money up
>front you can go kill
>a sorry starving deer in
>the middle of winter, and
>have a bunch of Utards
>fighting over the photo rights.


>If you don't have money
>and go kill the same
>deer you would face jail
>time, a loss of hunting
>rights in all western states,
>and heavy fines. I am
>tired of people acting like
>these auction winners are doing
>us and deer some big
>favor. $100k is a drop
>in a bucket of piss
>compared to a state's budget.

I agree with all of this except I am in favor of the deer licenses being issued through a drawing.
>
 
I would 2nd the drawing! Even better yet, those that draw the tag actually loose there pref pts just like everyone else that burns their pts when they draw a tag!
 

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