Thieves caught red handed in salt lake county

The identified perpetrators are avid outdoorsmen and women as well. Although non-hunters, based off their Facebook profiles, they own a business in the Park city area and enjoy rock climbing, skiing and other outdoor activities.
The husband (main culprit) even is sponsored by black diamond.
DWR and salt lake police are currently investigating while many on Facebook have reached out to this couple via social media. Black diamond has been contacted and asked to drop his sponsorship.
Please share the story.
I hate thieves
Situations like this are becoming more prevalent and action needs to take place.


?Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak. So
we must and we will."
Theadore Roosevelt
 
Andrew Mclain founder of the chuting gallery. Well know skier here in the wasatch. Start contacting Blackdiamond.
 
Hope it ruins his whole life! Probably should strap him to a tree in Yellowstone let the Grizzlies take car of his ass.
37205hornkiller.jpg
 
Already reached out to black diamond.
*?ndrew McLean






"Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak. So
we must and we will."
Theadore Roosevelt
 
Remember Boys!

This is the USA Where People Get Paid to Watch People that are Watching You!

AKA:

The Boys Running Their Trail Cams & doing it Right Are Setting up Cameras to Watch the Main Cameras and Setting more Cams up Down the Trail!

So When You go to Whizz in the Woods Watch out!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
Hope it a lesson that keeps on giving.
That moment he took it will linger in his life for a long time.

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>[Font][Font color = "green"]Life member of
>the MM green signature club.[font/]
 
I saw an update.
Both ?ndrew and his wife Polly were arrested and charged with 3rd degree felonies. I guess due to threats made to the couple over social media, the police have asked the victim to not post anything else about it on social media.







"Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak. So
we must and we will."
Theadore Roosevelt
 
Thieves are the WORST! I had a camera stolen last year that was over a mile into private property, someone came in and stole it off a waterhole. UNBELIEVABLE!
 
90030treestand1.jpg









I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
CAT, what are you doing on my FB Page??




"If the DWR was just doing its job, and
wildlife and hunting were the actual focus,
none of this process would even matter.
But that is not the focus or the goal in any
of this. The current DWR regime, and
SFW were born out of wildlife declines,
and are currently operated and funded
under that paradigm. Those 200 Expo
tags would not even be worth anything if
the focus was where it was supposed to
be, and wildlife and tags were plentiful.
But under the current business model,
that is how the money and power is
generated. It is generated through the
rising "value"(monitization) of a declining
resource. A resource that is supposed to
be being beneficially managed for the
masses that own that resource, ie. US.
The problem is obvious, hedging is not a
long term sustainable strategy, and
others have to lose, for some to win. In
this case it is us, the many, and our
resources, that are being forced to lose,
because there is a minority who's power
and money is derived from our loses."

LONETREE 3/15/16
 
Not a FaceBooker ww!


>CAT, what are you doing on
>my FB Page??
>
>
>
>
>"If the DWR was just doing
>its job, and
>wildlife and hunting were the actual
>focus,
>none of this process would even
>matter.
>But that is not the focus
>or the goal in any
>
>of this. The current DWR regime,
>and
>SFW were born out of wildlife
>declines,
>and are currently operated and funded
>
>under that paradigm. Those 200 Expo
>
>tags would not even be worth
>anything if
>the focus was where it was
>supposed to
>be, and wildlife and tags were
>plentiful.
>But under the current business model,
>
>that is how the money and
>power is
>generated. It is generated through the
>
>rising "value"(monitization) of a declining
>resource. A resource that is supposed
>to
>be being beneficially managed for the
>
>masses that own that resource, ie.
>US.
>The problem is obvious, hedging is
>not a
>long term sustainable strategy, and
>others have to lose, for some
>to win. In
>this case it is us, the
>many, and our
>resources, that are being forced to
>lose,
>because there is a minority who's
>power
>and money is derived from our
>loses."
>
>LONETREE 3/15/16











I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
Don?t forget the father, son scumbag duo down on the Boulder that like to play in chit and steal / vandalize cams.

Same page, different post.




"If the DWR was just doing its job, and
wildlife and hunting were the actual focus,
none of this process would even matter.
But that is not the focus or the goal in any
of this. The current DWR regime, and
SFW were born out of wildlife declines,
and are currently operated and funded
under that paradigm. Those 200 Expo
tags would not even be worth anything if
the focus was where it was supposed to
be, and wildlife and tags were plentiful.
But under the current business model,
that is how the money and power is
generated. It is generated through the
rising "value"(monitization) of a declining
resource. A resource that is supposed to
be being beneficially managed for the
masses that own that resource, ie. US.
The problem is obvious, hedging is not a
long term sustainable strategy, and
others have to lose, for some to win. In
this case it is us, the many, and our
resources, that are being forced to lose,
because there is a minority who's power
and money is derived from our loses."

LONETREE 3/15/16
 
Not a FaceBooker ww!
>
>
>>CAT, what are you doing on
>>my FB Page??
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>"If the DWR was just doing
>>its job, and
>>wildlife and hunting were the actual
>>focus,
>>none of this process would even
>>matter.
>>But that is not the focus
>>or the goal in any
>>
>>of this. The current DWR regime,
>>and
>>SFW were born out of wildlife
>>declines,
>>and are currently operated and funded
>>
>>under that paradigm. Those 200 Expo
>>
>>tags would not even be worth
>>anything if
>>the focus was where it was
>>supposed to
>>be, and wildlife and tags were
>>plentiful.
>>But under the current business model,
>>
>>that is how the money and
>>power is
>>generated. It is generated through the
>>
>>rising "value"(monitization) of a declining
>>resource. A resource that is supposed
>>to
>>be being beneficially managed for the
>>
>>masses that own that resource, ie.
>>US.
>>The problem is obvious, hedging is
>>not a
>>long term sustainable strategy, and
>>others have to lose, for some
>>to win. In
>>this case it is us, the
>>many, and our
>>resources, that are being forced to
>>lose,
>>because there is a minority who's
>>power
>>and money is derived from our
>>loses."
>>
>>LONETREE 3/15/16



Probably a good thing my friend. ?
KTC say to tell you hello.











>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>I know so many people in
>so many places
>They make allot of money but
>they got sad faces
>
>It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D








"If the DWR was just doing its job, and
wildlife and hunting were the actual focus,
none of this process would even matter.
But that is not the focus or the goal in any
of this. The current DWR regime, and
SFW were born out of wildlife declines,
and are currently operated and funded
under that paradigm. Those 200 Expo
tags would not even be worth anything if
the focus was where it was supposed to
be, and wildlife and tags were plentiful.
But under the current business model,
that is how the money and power is
generated. It is generated through the
rising "value"(monitization) of a declining
resource. A resource that is supposed to
be being beneficially managed for the
masses that own that resource, ie. US.
The problem is obvious, hedging is not a
long term sustainable strategy, and
others have to lose, for some to win. In
this case it is us, the many, and our
resources, that are being forced to lose,
because there is a minority who's power
and money is derived from our loses."

LONETREE 3/15/16
 
>Don?t forget the father, son scumbag
>duo down on the Boulder
>that like to play in
>chit and steal /
>vandalize cams.
>
>Same page, different post.
>
>
>
>
>"If the DWR was just doing
>its job, and
>wildlife and hunting were the actual
>focus,
>none of this process would even
>matter.
>But that is not the focus
>or the goal in any
>
>of this. The current DWR regime,
>and
>SFW were born out of wildlife
>declines,
>and are currently operated and funded
>
>under that paradigm. Those 200 Expo
>
>tags would not even be worth
>anything if
>the focus was where it was
>supposed to
>be, and wildlife and tags were
>plentiful.
>But under the current business model,
>
>that is how the money and
>power is
>generated. It is generated through the
>
>rising "value"(monitization) of a declining
>resource. A resource that is supposed
>to
>be being beneficially managed for the
>
>masses that own that resource, ie.
>US.
>The problem is obvious, hedging is
>not a
>long term sustainable strategy, and
>others have to lose, for some
>to win. In
>this case it is us, the
>many, and our
>resources, that are being forced to
>lose,
>because there is a minority who's
>power
>and money is derived from our
>loses."
>
>LONETREE 3/15/16


Who are they ww?








I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
What disgusts me the most is, the woman in the photos showing them hauling the tree stand away is the wife of the the guy mentioned above and she is a Park City assistant attorney. I wouldn't be surprised if Park City does nothing and she keeps her job, but man, I sure wouldn't risk that type of job over a treestand just because you despise hunting.
 
>What disgusts me the most is,
>the woman in the photos
>showing them hauling the tree
>stand away is the wife
>of the the guy mentioned
>above and she is a
>Park City assistant attorney. I
>wouldn't be surprised if Park
>City does nothing and she
>keeps her job, but man,
>I sure wouldn't risk that
>type of job over a
>treestand just because you despise
>hunting.

An assistant attorney with a class 3 felony, I dont think she survives.


#livelikezac
 
Is it the initial charge that matters or what the final one she is guilty of that does? I bet it doesn't stay a felony if any plea deal is entered.
 
I've seen several first time offenders even take a plea deal from a felony to a misdemeanor and still receive jail time.

In most circumstances with an original felony charge, some jail time is required. Or a work center if you can confirm employment due to the seriousness of the offense.

She looks to have already been removed from jail and is probably being supervised by AP&P until her sentencing.
The husband will probably bond out of jail within the next 24 hours and both will have to appear in court where they both will try to make plea deals.
Restitution will be mandatory.



"Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak. So
we must and we will."
Theadore Roosevelt
 
WOW That throws a whole different spin on things.

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>[Font][Font color = "green"]Life member of
>the MM green signature club.[font/]
 
>do you think the dog is
>in trouble too??
>
>
>
497fc2397b939f19.jpg


Sort of, hes how they found em.


#livelikezac
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-09-18 AT 06:55AM (MST)[p]

I'm Afraid it might be time for Her to go back to New York!

If there Ain't an Example set here I'm afraid there might be an Up-Rising!

Here's where another Question for NVB arises:

I Hear through the Grapevine She's Helped Prosecute Law Breakers for Years,Anybody know for sure?

Would it really be Fair for them not to Pay their Dues?










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
It's Park City. The city probably has Patagonia on retainer to pay fines for any eco-warrior heroes like these two!

Okay, my sarcasm is high this morning. But, it's Park City...

I don't believe she is a prosecutor. My guess is she works on the civil side of things in the office. But I could be wrong, I don't know this for sure.
 
NOTE:Not Related to above Story!


Another Trick of the Anti-Hunters is to Vandalize Your Rig after You Park it to go Hunting/Hiking!

The Problem with that is:

Hunters/Outdoors-men are Setting Up Cameras on their Vehicles after they Park them!

Kinda Sad it's came to this!

Wasn't too many years ago you didn't have to contend with all the BS that goes on today!

Now!

If I Just woulda had a Camera Set up in the Right Spot I Mighta been able to Figure out Who Spooked a couple of Bucks I'd been watching!:D













I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
>It's Park City. The city probably
>has Patagonia on retainer to
>pay fines for any eco-warrior
>heroes like these two!
>
>Okay, my sarcasm is high this
>morning. But, it's Park City...
>
>
>I don't believe she is a
>prosecutor. My guess is she
>works on the civil side
>of things in the office.
>But I could be wrong,
>I don't know this for
>sure.


OK Niller!

Ya!

You're Right!

It is Park City!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
I Know a Guy that took a Tree Stand down Once!

He Felt so Bad about Doing it He Took it Back & Set it Back Up!

Maybe these Two were gonna do the same!:D









I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
You sure that couple isn't from California, maybe San Francisco?

So glad the hunter put that second camera up--bam! Thieves on film.
 
Good they caught them. The question is this, where it is on public land, when does it become abandon? I know of a fellow who found a trailer in the mountains after it had been there unattended for several months, took it home, had it inspected by the police, and was able to keep it.

I know, this is not the same, but as I understand it, to be legal in Utah you need to frequent your camp trailer every 24 hours. Wonder what the laws are in situations like this.
 
>Good they caught them. The
>question is this, where it
>is on public land, when
>does it become abandon?
>I know of a fellow
>who found a trailer in
>the mountains after it had
>been there unattended for several
>months, took it home, had
>it inspected by the police,
>and was able to keep
>it.
>
>I know, this is not the
>same, but as I understand
>it, to be legal in
>Utah you need to frequent
>your camp trailer every 24
>hours. Wonder what the
>laws are in situations like
>this.

This case may answer those questions (and lots more) regarding the extended use of treestands (and/or other equipment while hunting) on public lands! It'll be more interesting if/when the Forest Service and the Utah Division of Wildlife Resources get involved. Stay tuned, folks!
 
Looks like after further investigation into this case by police, upon search of this couples property, there has been quite the stash of equipment found by police that they suspect to have been stolen.

We might be potentially seeing more theft charges depending on the results of this.

If you've had your stuff stolen, I'd be looking into this










"Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak. So
we must and we will."
Theadore Roosevelt
 
Different situation, what could the outcome have been if there were no second camera. But the couple ran face to face with the owners of the tree stands. In the middle of nowhere, miles from anyone else........ i think it might be lucky that the hunters werent there, and only gave the pics to police. Could have been a lot worse for the theives......... might of had a high county tune up.....
 
Any hunters that lost stolen gear where these two frequent, would be wise to contact the law enforcement agency that conducted the search of their property and view the recovered hunting gear. They just might find some of their property and charges are added to these two thieves.

RELH
 
I'm one of the first dudes to push the "we need the other side with us" narrative. I haven't heard, or read, did the other side, mainly black diamond pull their support?


From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
Maybe if the two have investments in/or own a Ski Resort?

They should let the Hunter/Owner of the Tree Stands go Tear the Lift Down just to Get Even!

Then Say:

Yup!

LIFE'S A REAL ##### SOMETIMES!







I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
I'm assuming that the theft is in Salt Lake County and under the jurisdiction of SLC or Unified Police. It won't go to trial in Park City or have anything to do with the conflict of interest in the Park City Attorney's office.

I know those guys from the ski and snowboard industry. Hope they throw the book at them. I'm sick of all the lib tards in our industry making look like they are holier than thou.

These guys fly around the world on a regular basis, sponsored by these companies leaving chit an every glacier and mtn in the world they think worth of climbing, then have the gall to pretend that we who stay home and recreate perfectly legally in our own back yard are the bad guys.

Really do hope they eat chit and get the book thrown at them. Not holding my breath for it to happen though.

Cheers,
Pete
 
+1 Pete. Hypocrisy at its finest. Plus, How many animals get hit within a 35 mile radius of park city by vehicles every year?

Plus all those houses built where the animals live and winter. If you really want to be ?Green? then summit county is not the place to clear a spot and build a foundation.


"That's a special feeling, Lloyd"

www.cloverleafrifles.com

https://youtu.be/l3xHt-xeNYw
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-11-18 AT 00:12AM (MST)[p]I sent Black Diamond an inquiry asking for a public comment, guess we will see.

The trail cam my bro in law had ripped out of a lockbox in the last month was done by camo and orange wearers. Awesome these two got clipped, but lets not act like our community ain't got its fair share of thieving turds.

Kimber is in bed with BHA, as is Yeti. Guess they are guilty by association for what Black Diamonds sponsored folks do?

If Black Diamond sends me something ill let you know.


From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
>Kimber is in bed with BHA,
>as is Yeti. Guess
>they are guilty by association
>for what Black Diamonds sponsored
>folks do?
>
>
>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>PUBLIC LAND.

Nah, yer earlier comment seemed to point in that direction. Was just curious is all.


#livelikezac
 
A Couple Things I Have a Problem with:

1-They're Claiming the Jail was Over Full & They couldn't Keep them for a While which is TOTAL BS,They could have at Least let a couple people out early & let these two have a turn!

2-Now We've got people saying and I Quote:

Since this was on public property and the equipment was left overnight ? the question is ? could the McLean?s have just thought it was abandoned and wanted to clean up the area?

Ya!

F'N Eh!

That's what they were doing!

JFP!

Even though it's Total BS,I Don't Expect to see much more than a Slap on the Hands with some Minor Fines for a couple that probably have more money than they can spend!

Like somebody else mentioned!

It's only a matter of time before somebody catches somebody in the Act and the Shite hits the Fan!








I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
Shredding Mother Nature/Timber just to Put a Multi Million Dollar Cabin in!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
>DW, that is a classic!!! LMAO
>

I stole it off the Utah site. Posted your video over there as well. Seemed like evidence to me.


#livelikezac
 
> Shredding Mother Nature/Timber just
>to Put a Multi Million
>Dollar Cabin in!

>I know so many people in
>so many places
>They make allot of money but
>they got sad faces
>
>It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D

He had to have someplace to stash all that huntin gear he was gatherin!


#livelikezac
 
>>DW, that is a classic!!! LMAO
>>
>
>I stole it off the Utah
>site. Posted your video over
>there as well. Seemed like
>evidence to me.
>
>
>#livelikezac


Hey DW careful using that "stole it" word on a thread like this one... ;)
 
>>>DW, that is a classic!!! LMAO
>>>
>>
>>I stole it off the Utah
>>site. Posted your video over
>>there as well. Seemed like
>>evidence to me.
>>
>>
>>#livelikezac
>
>
>Hey DW careful using that "stole
>it" word on a thread
>like this one... ;)

???


#livelikezac
 
And Maybe the 3rd Camera too!








I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
I'll Bet there's gonna be an UP-RISING in TARDville if nothings done!








I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
I am curious as to how leaving a cam or blind or stand isn't looked at as littering. Is there Utah law in the subject, or are we looking at new precident coming our way?



From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
My take is that they are going to pack them all up at the end of the season. Givent that, it is not litter in the conventional sense.

Hasbean
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-11-18 AT 10:52PM (MST)[p]This was a quote attributed to Sergeant Melody Gray of the Unified Police Department. It was in one of the original articles on the kpcw.org website. This makes it sound like it doesn't matter if it's left up there or not in the grand scheme of things, but it also doesn't say how long it needs to be there before it's considered abandoned. The way it sounds, even if found and you think it's abandoned, you still can't take it without going through the proper authority. Was in this article below. I still have lots of questions on this even with seeing this quote. I would suspect if you abandon property, that you could get a littering ticket, but the intent would need to be that you had no intention of ever going back for it. That'd be a hard thing to prove with hunting gear during hunting season.

http://www.kpcw.org/post/park-city-assistant-attorney-and-her-husband-arrested-felony-charges

?Theft is taking property with the intent to deprive," Gray said. "So, if something doesn't belong to you and you take that property with the intent to permanently deprive them of that property that constitutes theft. You can't just take property because you find.?
 
^^ "but the intent would need to be that you had no intention of ever going back for it."

I'd have to agree. It's the difference in parking your truck on the side of the road and leaving an old refrigerator or a beer can in the same spot.

It all comes down to reasonable intent... cutting security chains makes that a pretty easy call as to the hunters intent of returning.

Grizzly

-----------------------------------------
"This is a classic case of a handful of greedy fly fishermen getting too greedy." -Don Peay, Founder of SFW, as told to KUTV

"It's time to revisit the widely accepted principle in the United States and Canada that game is a public resource."
-Don Peay, Founder of SFW, as quoted in Anchorage Daily News
 
>I am curious as to how
>leaving a cam or blind
>or stand isn't looked at
>as littering. Is there
>Utah law in the subject,
>or are we looking at
>new precident coming our way?
>
>
>
>
>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>PUBLIC LAND.



Well hoss!

If You took your Camp Trailer Up & stayed in it for 2 days!

But decided to leave it there until the following weekend unattended!

And Somebody during the Week decided to Steal your Trailer & Belongings!

Because it was just sitting there Littering the Forest!

What You gonna Think about that?

Ya,You're gonna See some Changes!

But SWEET GEEZUS!

Is it that hard for People to Leave their Thieving F'N Hands off of other Peoples Gear?









I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
>I am curious as to how
>leaving a cam or blind
>or stand isn't looked at
>as littering. Is there
>Utah law in the subject,
>or are we looking at
>new precident coming our way?
>
>
>
>
>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>PUBLIC LAND.

Litter is defined as: trash, such as paper, cans, and bottles, tat is left lying in an open or public place. This is equipment that a man paid a lot of money for and took the time to pack in and set up. He never abandoned it. He checked it regularly. How could this be considered trash? In what way could it even be construed as trash??

It kind of baffles me that you even could even get the two mixed up!!
 
Guess Andrew didn't like us viewing his backhoe skills on a stolen trail cam. Hes pulled the video down.


#livelikezac
 
I emailed Black Diamond and this was their response

Thank you for taking the time to write us. On September 10, 2018, Black Diamond released its brand ambassador Andrew McLean. McLean was arrested last week and faces charges after he removed hunter?s equipment in the Wasatch Mountains. Black Diamond appreciates all that Andrew has contributed to our brand and the backcountry community, however we cannot condone or support him anymore given the recent events. We have a strong history supporting the outdoor and recreational communities we serve. Our employees are outdoor enthusiasts. Moreover, we require all Black Diamond's brand ambassadors to act professionally at all times.



Best Regards,

Nate



Nathan Sackett | Black Diamond Equipment

2084 E. 3900 S.

Salt Lake City, UT 84124

ph: 801-278-5533

fx: 801-278-5544

www.blackdiamondequipment.com
 
Based on the KPCW it sounds like part of the way they found him was because he posted about it on an anti hunting website. Is that right?
 
>Facebook users:
>Bowhunters of Utah followers:
>
>Some thieves have been caught via
>trail camera stealing two tree
>stands. Follow along
>
>
>https://www.facebook.com/groups/40552002858/permalink/10156876541912859/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>"Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak.
>So
>we must and we will."
>Theadore Roosevelt


This is probably the single greatest thing I have heard all month! I am so happy that these guys got caught and I hope they go to jail for a long time...and lose every bit of credibility there is in the community.
 
The UPD sgt was correct in the first statement, but not in the second. Below is the language, straight out of Utah Code, for theft. There is no "permanently" anywhere in there. Therefore, permanently depriving is not required.

You can see the issues if "permanent" was a requirement. I could say I was only going to take it for a year and then bring it back, and you couldn't convict me of theft. Or I was going to keep it for 10 years, then return it to the rightful owner. You can see how that could lead to a ridiculous response. Anyway, here is the language:


76-6-404. Theft -- Elements.

A person commits theft if he obtains or exercises unauthorized control over the property of another with a purpose to deprive him thereof.
 
>Based on the KPCW it sounds
>like part of the way
>they found him was because
>he posted about it on
>an anti hunting website. Is
>that right?

The guy who lost his stands drove around looking for them, he saw the dog and followed it to their front door. When they came out he recognized her from his trail cam pick. He posted a video of finding and following the dog. These people aren't real bright, they might have bragged on an anti sight but the guy said he found em on his own by driving around.


#livelikezac
 
>The UPD sgt was correct in
>the first statement, but not
>in the second. Below is
>the language, straight out of
>Utah Code, for theft. There
>is no "permanently" anywhere in
>there. Therefore, permanently depriving is
>not required.
>
>You can see the issues if
>"permanent" was a requirement. I
>could say I was only
>going to take it for
>a year and then bring
>it back, and you couldn't
>convict me of theft. Or
>I was going to keep
>it for 10 years, then
>return it to the rightful
>owner. You can see how
>that could lead to a
>ridiculous response. Anyway, here is
>the language:
>
>
>76-6-404. Theft -- Elements.
>
>A person commits theft if he
>obtains or exercises unauthorized control
>over the property of another
>with a purpose to deprive
>him thereof.

I'd say having other stolen hunting equipment stashed at 2 residences would lead me to believe the purpose was to "deprive them thereof".
This is a slam dunk in Ray Charles's eyes!

#livelikezac
 
I got same black diamond email today. They did the right thing.

BESS, take your trailer up and leave it in the same spot all summer, bet you get contacted regardless of how many times you check it.

You can't leave blinds in waterfowl management areas.
I don't run cams or stands personally. They will get tried in hippie land, not Provo. If their defense is abandonment or littering, and it works, does the law not now say all unattended will be considered abandoned or litter? Camps on the man are 14 day, is there a law for cams and stands?





From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
>>I am curious as to how
>>leaving a cam or blind
>>or stand isn't looked at
>>as littering. Is there
>>Utah law in the subject,
>>or are we looking at
>>new precident coming our way?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>>PUBLIC LAND.
>
>Litter is defined as: trash, such
>as paper, cans, and bottles,
>tat is left lying in
>an open or public place.
> This is equipment that
>a man paid a lot
>of money for and took
>the time to pack in
>and set up. He
>never abandoned it. He checked
>it regularly. How could
>this be considered trash?
>In what way could it
>even be construed as trash??
>
>
>It kind of baffles me that
>you even could even get
>the two mixed up!!

If they go to jury, it will be a dozen park city folks. They might look a a pile of steel strapped to a tree differently than you or I.

It was obvious what went down, but it was obvious OJ decapitated his wife too.


From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
You might think it is a "slam dunk" on getting a theft conviction as a felony. If the D.A. decides it is not that big of a case and does not want to go to the expense of a jury trial, he will offer a plea bargain before you can bat an eye.
In my 30 years of law enforcement I have seen many felony cases plea bargain down even when the evidence assured the D.A. of a 95% chance of a conviction on felony charges.
I am telling you Utah hunters, if you are fed up with anti hunters stealing or destroying your hunting gear, you will unite and get the word to the D.A. that you expect him to pursue this case or loose votes next time he runs for election.
You can bet the anti hunters will be watching this case and will be putting pressure on the D.A. to downplay the charges.

RELH
 
I have a couple of questions about leaving equipment ?.tree stand in a public area.
What happens if on the day the "owner" decides to go hunt out of the stand again......and there is someone else in the tree stand...hunting?

I understand about leaving a camp on public land.
But, would leaving anything else in the forest be considered abandonment? At what point is it abandonment?

What right does a hunter have to put his tree stand in the forest and then leave it? Is the hunter "claiming" the area as his private hunting area?

Litter would be considered to be anything the person has left in the area. Anything from a beer can to ?????
So....I go into the forest and drink a six pack of beer and leave the cans.....Is that litter?
I could say that I was planning on coming back to get them in a week. Would that be littering then?

I vote the finder, remove the tree stand and then drop it off at the USFS office and let them deal with it. But, I do not think it is right for a hunter to stake out an area by leaving the tree stand in the forest. Even overnight.
I know this is going to open me up for some flack.
But, I do not think it is right to leave the tree stand in the public forest.
Woodturner
 
The law is that if I place a stand it can be for the length of the season. But if you show up on a certain day first you can use my stand. Placing it does not guarantee you the exclusive use of the stand and area. It's still first come first serve. A simple thing is to leave a note saying what days you will be hunting.
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-12-18 AT 07:39PM (MST)[p]
An even simpler thing is to not hunt out of somebody's stand. Pretty simple. REHL they have pics of him carrying the stand out of the woods. They searched his house and cabin, found the stands and camera from the pic as well as other hunting gear. Theres a game cam video of him digging footers for his cabin he posted to YouTube and has since taken down.They dont hunt=slam dunk! It's a prosecutors dream!



#livelikezac
 
>I got same black diamond email
>today. They did the
>right thing.
>
>BESS, take your trailer up and
>leave it in the same
>spot all summer, bet you
>get contacted regardless of how
>many times you check it.
>
>
>You can't leave blinds in waterfowl
>management areas.
>I don't run cams or stands
>personally. They will get
>tried in hippie land, not
>Provo. If their defense
>is abandonment or littering, and
>it works, does the law
>not now say all unattended
>will be considered abandoned or
>litter? Camps on the
>man are 14 day, is
>there a law for cams
>and stands?
>
>
>
>
>
>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>PUBLIC LAND.

Not always So hoss!

Locals here have had their Trailers parked for weeks now waiting for Hunting season!

The One bunch is Wise though!

About every 2 weeks they move their Trailers!

Sometimes just swapping spots 20' away with their Friends/Relatives!

But at least they weren't parked in the same spot forever!:D











I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
DW - I am not saying these people should not have taken the stand. That is wrong.
My problem is that one should not leave the stand in the public forest when not in use. It is not right for one hunter to stake out an area and claim it as theirs.
As far as using the unattended stand.....I believe the first come gets it. Problem is that if I hunt out of your stand, and you come up and then claim it is yours and for me to leave. It is public ground.

The right way for a hunter with a tree stand in the forest is to put it up, use it, take it down. Not leave it unattended in the forest. Put it up on the next trip. Then there are no problems with the use.

A number of years ago, a hunter found a tree stand on public ground. He climbed up and was hunting from the stand. Fellow came along and said he was hunting in his stand and to get out. The first hunter told him to go fly a kite. The second hunter shot and killed him.

On waterfowl wildlife areas, I have seen hunters claim that a specific area was theirs.....even if another hunter had gotten to the spot first. Guns pointed at each other and all that......for a duck hunting spot on a public area.

Woodturner
 
>I have a couple of questions
>about leaving equipment ?.tree stand
>in a public area.
>What happens if on the day
>the "owner" decides to go
>hunt out of the stand
>again......and there is someone else
>in the tree stand...hunting?
>
>I understand about leaving a camp
>on public land.
>But, would leaving anything else in
>the forest be considered abandonment?
> At what point is
>it abandonment?
>
>What right does a hunter have
>to put his tree stand
>in the forest and then
>leave it? Is the
>hunter "claiming" the area as
>his private hunting area?
>
>Litter would be considered to be
>anything the person has left
>in the area. Anything
>from a beer can to
>?????
>So....I go into the forest and
>drink a six pack of
>beer and leave the cans.....Is
>that litter?
>I could say that I was
>planning on coming back to
>get them in a week.
> Would that be littering
>then?
>
>I vote the finder, remove the
>tree stand and then drop
>it off at the USFS
>office and let them deal
>with it. But, I
>do not think it is
>right for a hunter to
>stake out an area by
>leaving the tree stand in
>the forest. Even overnight.

So?

You Want Hunters to Remove their Stands at Dark & Put them Back up at 3 AM?

That Ought to go over Good!

Who the Hell do you Think would Enforce it?

You Might have better Luck Trying to get them Banned altogether!


>
>I know this is going to
>open me up for some
>flack.
>But, I do not think it
>is right to leave the
>tree stand in the public
>forest.
>Woodturner











I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-12-18 AT 07:56PM (MST)[p]>DW - I am not saying
>these people should not have
>taken the stand. That
>is wrong.
>My problem is that one should
>not leave the stand in
>the public forest when not
>in use. It is
>not right for one hunter
>to stake out an area
>and claim it as theirs.
>
>As far as using the unattended
>stand.....I believe the first come
>gets it. Problem is
>that if I hunt out
>of your stand, and you
>come up and then claim
>it is yours and for
>me to leave. It
>is public ground.
>
>The right way for a hunter
>with a tree stand in
>the forest is to put
>it up, use it, take
>it down. Not leave
>it unattended in the forest.
> Put it up on
>the next trip. Then there
>are no problems with the
>use.
>
>A number of years ago, a
>hunter found a tree stand
>on public ground. He
>climbed up and was hunting
>from the stand. Fellow
>came along and said he
>was hunting in his stand
>and to get out.
>The first hunter told him
>to go fly a kite.
> The second hunter shot
>and killed him.
>
>On waterfowl wildlife areas, I have
>seen hunters claim that a
>specific area was theirs.....even if
>another hunter had gotten to
>the spot first. Guns
>pointed at each other and
>all that......for a duck hunting
>spot on a public area.
>
>
>Woodturner

Woodturner when I hunt I want as little drama as possible. I've had people camp on top of me, set up a spread so close we had to flip decoys over to read names to figure out whose decoys were whose. How many millions of acres of public land do we have? Pick another spot. I dont put up stands but if I did I'd expect someone to leave when I showed up, after all I packed the thing up the mountain! I'd be pissed but understand why they were in it if they left politely. I pack a spike camp in several miles several days before season then ride in the afternoon before season. The first time I find someone in my wall tent claimin first come first served I'll burn that sumbitch to the ground with them in it! Explain to me the difference between my spike camp and a treestand. How bout when I head out to hunt in the am and come back to camp midday, does someone have the right to camp in my tent cause there was nobody home when they arrived?


#livelikezac
 
>LAST EDITED ON Sep-12-18
>AT 07:56?PM (MST)
>
>>DW - I am not saying
>>these people should not have
>>taken the stand. That
>>is wrong.
>>My problem is that one should
>>not leave the stand in
>>the public forest when not
>>in use. It is
>>not right for one hunter
>>to stake out an area
>>and claim it as theirs.
>>
>>As far as using the unattended
>>stand.....I believe the first come
>>gets it. Problem is
>>that if I hunt out
>>of your stand, and you
>>come up and then claim
>>it is yours and for
>>me to leave. It
>>is public ground.
>>
>>The right way for a hunter
>>with a tree stand in
>>the forest is to put
>>it up, use it, take
>>it down. Not leave
>>it unattended in the forest.
>> Put it up on
>>the next trip. Then there
>>are no problems with the
>>use.
>>
>>A number of years ago, a
>>hunter found a tree stand
>>on public ground. He
>>climbed up and was hunting
>>from the stand. Fellow
>>came along and said he
>>was hunting in his stand
>>and to get out.
>>The first hunter told him
>>to go fly a kite.
>> The second hunter shot
>>and killed him.
>>
>>On waterfowl wildlife areas, I have
>>seen hunters claim that a
>>specific area was theirs.....even if
>>another hunter had gotten to
>>the spot first. Guns
>>pointed at each other and
>>all that......for a duck hunting
>>spot on a public area.
>>
>>
>>Woodturner
>
>Woodturner when I hunt I want
>as little drama as possible.
>I've had people camp on
>top of me, set up
>a spread so close we
>had to flip decoys over
>to read names to figure
>out whose decoys were whose.
>How many millions of acres
>of public land do we
>have? Pick another spot. I
>dont put up stands but
>if I did I'd expect
>someone to leave when I
>showed up, after all I
>packed the thing up the
>mountain! I'd be pissed but
>understand why they were in
>it if they left politely.
>I pack a spike camp
>in several miles several days
>before season then ride in
>the afternoon before season. The
>first time I find someone
>in my wall tent claimin
>first come first served I'll
>burn that sumbitch to the
>ground with them in it!
>Explain to me the difference
>between my spike camp and
>a treestand. How bout when
>I head out to hunt
>in the am and come
>back to camp midday, does
>someone have the right to
>camp in my tent cause
>there was nobody home when
>they arrived?
>
>
>#livelikezac

Hey DW!

Please let Me know where Your Spike Camp is?:D









I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-12-18 AT 08:09PM (MST)[p]>LAST EDITED ON Sep-12-18
>AT 07:56?PM (MST)
>
>>DW - I am not saying
>>these people should not have
>>taken the stand. That
>>is wrong.
>>My problem is that one should
>>not leave the stand in
>>the public forest when not
>>in use. It is
>>not right for one hunter
>>to stake out an area
>>and claim it as theirs.
>>
>>As far as using the unattended
>>stand.....I believe the first come
>>gets it. Problem is
>>that if I hunt out
>>of your stand, and you
>>come up and then claim
>>it is yours and for
>>me to leave. It
>>is public ground.
>>
>>The right way for a hunter
>>with a tree stand in
>>the forest is to put
>>it up, use it, take
>>it down. Not leave
>>it unattended in the forest.
>> Put it up on
>>the next trip. Then there
>>are no problems with the
>>use.
>>
>>A number of years ago, a
>>hunter found a tree stand
>>on public ground. He
>>climbed up and was hunting
>>from the stand. Fellow
>>came along and said he
>>was hunting in his stand
>>and to get out.
>>The first hunter told him
>>to go fly a kite.
>> The second hunter shot
>>and killed him.
>>
>>On waterfowl wildlife areas, I have
>>seen hunters claim that a
>>specific area was theirs.....even if
>>another hunter had gotten to
>>the spot first. Guns
>>pointed at each other and
>>all that......for a duck hunting
>>spot on a public area.
>>
>>
>>Woodturner
>
>Woodturner when I hunt I want
>as little drama as possible.
>I've had people camp on
>top of me, set up
>a spread so close we
>had to flip decoys over
>to read names to figure
>out whose decoys were whose.
>How many millions of acres
>of public land do we
>have? Pick another spot. I
>dont put up stands but
>if I did I'd expect
>someone to leave when I
>showed up, after all I
>packed the thing up the
>mountain! I'd be pissed but
>understand why they were in
>it if they left politely.
>I pack a spike camp
>in several miles several days
>before season then ride in
>the afternoon before season. The
>first time I find someone
>in my wall tent claimin
>first come first served I'll
>burn that sumbitch to the
>ground with them in it!
>Explain to me the difference
>between my spike camp and
>a treestand. How bout when
>I head out to hunt
>in the am and come
>back to camp midday, does
>someone have the right to
>camp in my tent cause
>there was nobody home when
>they arrived?
>
>
>#livelikezac

DW, there is no difference between your two analogies... but I'll put money on it that ole Hugh Buttnut comes back and says that your wall tents fair game...

By the way do you think I could get the GPS coordinates to your wall tent also? ?
 
How the F___ is this an issue???? What the hell is being argued here??? It's F?ing simple! If it isn't your stuff, leave it alone! Plain and simple! You all learned it in Pre-school. It really isn't any tougher than that.
 
>How the F___ is this an
>issue???? What the hell
>is being argued here???
>It's F?ing simple! If
>it isn't your stuff, leave
>it alone! Plain and
>simple! You all learned
>it in Pre-school. It really
>isn't any tougher than that.
>

Well evidently it is purty tough clownpuncher!


#livelikezac
 
The issue is becoming more relevant. At what point does your "right" to place a cam out way my right to not be filmed? If I set up my trail cam looking in your trailer window are we good? How long do you get to leave a stand? Week, month, year? If a contraption for hunting is cool, is atv parts? Ropes for climbing? Etc, etc. I just hope our chance to make that decision isn't taken away by a good defense attorney and a jury that is simpithetic.

We are gonna have to address stands, and cams at some point. Of prefer it be us.

It is PUBLIC LAND. Doesn't mean steal crap, obviously.

Bess, you haul a blind into a WMA, you get to haul it out. You can't leave them. Plus, don't be hating because I can get one of those "sheep camp" signs from FS letting me bypass the 14 day rule. HATER!


From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-12-18 AT 10:39PM (MST)[p]DW you might think it is a slam dunk case. If that D.A. makes the decision that he does not want to spend the 5-10 days in court and the added expense of a court trial, he will offer a plea bargain to the suspects.
They will probably accept a token fine and probation with no jail time. The only way the D.A. will not do this is if he feels there will be a out cry from many citizens that voted him into office.
I have seen rock solid theft cases get plea bargain many times down to a far lessor crime just because the D.A. did not want to spend the time in court on a property crime. The funny part of it, even that plea bargain will still count as a conviction by the D.A. who at election time will spout off about how great of a conviction record he has.

RELH
 
Of course they are going to get a plea deal offered. 99.99% of cases are offered a plea to resolve the case. Sometimes ithat means a reduced charge, a plea in abeyance, or agreed upon sentencing recommendations to the judge. The criminal system would grind to an absolute halt if this were not the case.

It is a pretty darn rare case for a defendant to not get some sort of plea offer. There is no way the Salt Lake County DA?s Office is putting this case in the extremely rare category where no plea deal will be offered. I just don't see it. While what these people did is despicable and horrible, and they should be held accountable-they didn't rape, torture, and murder the hunters and their children. They will get plea offers, and should.

Now if/when that time comes, we can all quibble over if the plea offer is appropriate or not. The devil, as they say, is in the details.
 
>The issue is becoming more relevant.
> At what point does
>your "right" to place a
>cam out way my right
>to not be filmed?
>If I set up my
>trail cam looking in your
>trailer window are we good?
> How long do you
>get to leave a stand?
> Week, month, year?
>If a contraption for hunting
>is cool, is atv parts?
> Ropes for climbing?
>Etc, etc. I just
>hope our chance to make
>that decision isn't taken away
>by a good defense attorney
>and a jury that is
>simpithetic.
>
>We are gonna have to address
>stands, and cams at some
>point. Of prefer it
>be us.
>
>It is PUBLIC LAND. Doesn't
>mean steal crap, obviously.
>
>Bess, you haul a blind into
>a WMA, you get to
>haul it out. You
>can't leave them. Plus,
>don't be hating because I
>can get one of those
>"sheep camp" signs from FS
>letting me bypass the 14
>day rule. HATER!
>
>
>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>PUBLIC LAND.


Hey hoss!

Not HATING anything here!

But Careful what you Wish for!

I/We Can tell you don't Like Cams & Tree Stands in the Woods!

Just to Re-Fresh your Forgetful Memory of just a few short years ago!

There were a Bunch of People Screaming:Somethings got to be done about Shed Hunting,It's getting out of Hand!

So to Appease a few people!

The DWR did something alright!

They set Laws in Place that can't be Enforced!

And Who Lost on that Deal?

The Honest Guy just like always!

All the Laws & Rules Stacked in one F'N Pile are Worthless if they Can't be Enforced!

I Agree as the World gets more Populated with TARDS you see more BS going on in the Woods!

Here's what I see Happening hoss when you get the New Rules you're wanting:

They'll have a Rule saying the Tree Stand can only be set in the same place for so many days!

But Just like Trailers!

The Owner of the Tree Stand will Move it over 2 Trees away/6 feet and what you gonna do about that?

You'll be just as Mad as you ever were!:D

How about the Frying Pans/Griddles/Pots Hanging in Tree's that I See in the Wilderness/High Lakes that's been there for who knows how many years?

I've never heard anybody Bittching about them?

Nobody ever Steals them!

And I don't see the USFS removing them!

Just Sayin hoss..................!

Careful what You Wish for!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 

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