THIS WILL MAKE YOU SICK

O

oneshotonekill

Guest
LAST EDITED ON Sep-21-04 AT 11:33PM (MST)[p]Well I just got back from something I'll never probably witness in my life again. Something truly a sight to see, something that I marveled at and also puked at at the same time. I received a phone call yesterday at around 5 pm that there was two big bull elk locked in battle apx. 50 miles south of my home town. So my dad, I and a brother along with some family friends got in the vehicals video cameras and picture cameras in hand, and headed for the Idaho Nevada border. This ranch were we were headed, is know for producing some big bulls. Only thing is, hardly any of these bulls get shot. We got there and were leaded to the spot where in the creek layed two magnific bull elk. Horns lock never to come apart. One bull, the bigger one was already dead, he had drown. I guarantee anyone of you elk hunters out there would have pull the tigger on either one bulls. The bull dead we guessed to be somewhere between 380 to 390 and the smaller one 375 to 385. Now I know that elk and deer that become locked are a part of nature, but how many times have you seen them locked, and then freed do to human help. Well thats where the sick part comes in. These to big bulls had been locked for two days as of yesterday. The Nevada Fish and Game was notified by the landowners of the sutition. These particular landowners have had a run in before with the fish and game for illegal taking of elk, but are mainly bitter at them in part they will not issue them landowner permits. Which I can understand because these elk continue to run down fence and everything else. They do need some taken out of there. Well anyways, to make a long story short. The owners and the fish and game could not come to an agreement on what to do with the elk. The landowners wanted to shoot the elk, and then get to keep the meat and have a full body mount of the elk done. The fish and game said no..we shoot them, we keep them. Or we cut the horn off of them. The landowners said no can do, and dooooo not come on our property. So in turn, to beautiful bulls that could have been saved, dead slow and painful deaths. I in my 10 years of hunting and my dad in his 40 plus years of hunting have never felt soo sick over something. It was heartbreaking to see. I will post pictures when I get a chance. I want you all to be able to see this sad event. What do you all think should have happened with them?




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one shot
 
What a waste...over what? Pride!! Neither side wanting to give an inch. Happens way too often unfortunately. Sorry you had to witness the unesessary demise of 2 great animals.

CPSANDMAN
"The Buck stops here...I hope!"
 
Just my opinion and personality. I never go looking for trouble, BUT, there was no sense in either elk suffering. Naturally things do occur, but if I couldn't have helped by freeing the living bull, I would have shot him, plain and simple, fine or no fine, using the meat or not. No animal deserves undue suffering, if there is an alternative solution. At times we need to think on our own without all the paperwork and law abiding crap.
 
This is an act of nature, Gladiators fight and they die it's in their blood, so they stay where they lay and the crows and coyotes eat good, and in the spring the rancher gets the horns and makes alot of money and once again NDOW makes the wrong call, what if it would of been a 20lb gold nugget? Would they lay claim to that also? The ranchers should of ended the fight and never called NDOW they have no jurisdiction on private property, maybe the county sheriff would of been a better choice!
 
Do Game Wardens have to have permission to enter private land if there is a report of any wildlife situation?

Wyomingben
 
I wish that happened on my property!!! Me and my buddy would have tags filled with 380-390 bulls! Woohoo! :0) :0)

Yeah Yeah, serious though, what a waste. I too would have done everything possible to free one or both of the bulls!

HS

Lets see pics.
 
Me personally. i would have not called game and fish. If one bull were already dead and freshly expired. i would have subdued the big bull with best means possible and sawed the lived ones antlers off above the hairline with a chainsaw and retrieved the meat from the dead one and donated it needy local families and kept the cape and horns for mounting. nursed old weak knees back to health and sent him on his way to sprout some new head gear the next year.(unless you have to tag them for the taxidermists to touch them) you know where they would have wound up anyway the warden probably wanted them for himself to sell on e-bay!!!!! got any pics? what awaste. not of one but two magnificent specimens. it is sad that politics outway ethics or logic sometimes. thanks for posting.
 
Without a doubt, a total waste of one or two Elk because of greed and who wants what.
Was this ranch in Idaho or Nevada??

Brian
 
this goes a lot deeper than just what you saw. Relations with the gov and private property owners in this area have been bad for a long time.
 
I don't even know what to say. I would like to see some pictures.

I am from Southern Idaho and I can tell you right now that there is no love loss between the IDFG and land owners.
 
Stick with me on this one. It might be a few days before I get pics. But I promise I will get them up asap.


snipersmilie.gif

one shot
 
>LAST EDITED ON Sep-21-04
>AT 11:33?PM (MST)

>
>Well I just got back from
>something I'll never probably witness
>in my life again. Something
>truly a sight to see,
>something that I marveled at
>and also puked at at
>the same time. I received
>a phone call yesterday at
>around 5 pm that there
>was two big bull elk
>locked in battle apx. 50
>miles south of my home
>town. So my dad, I
>and a brother along with
>some family friends got in
>the vehicals video cameras and
>picture cameras in hand, and
>headed for the Idaho Nevada
>border. This ranch were we
>were headed, is know for
>producing some big bulls. Only
>thing is, hardly any of
>these bulls get shot. We
>got there and were leaded
>to the spot where in
>the creek layed two magnific
>bull elk. Horns lock never
>to come apart. One bull,
>the bigger one was already
>dead, he had drown. I
>guarantee anyone of you elk
>hunters out there would have
>pull the tigger on either
>one bulls. The bull dead
>we guessed to be somewhere
>between 380 to 390 and
>the smaller one 375 to
>385. Now I know that
>elk and deer that become
>locked are a part of
>nature, but how many times
>have you seen them locked,
>and then freed do to
>human help. Well thats where
>the sick part comes in.
>These to big bulls had
>been locked for two days
>as of yesterday. The Nevada
>Fish and Game was notified
>by the landowners of the
>sutition. These particular landowners have
>had a run in before
>with the fish and game
>for illegal taking of elk,
>but are mainly bitter at
>them in part they will
>not issue them landowner permits.
>Which I can understand because
>these elk continue to run
>down fence and everything else.
>They do need some taken
>out of there. Well anyways,
>to make a long story
>short. The owners and the
>fish and game could not
>come to an agreement on
>what to do with the
>elk. The landowners wanted to
>shoot the elk, and then
>get to keep the meat
>and have a full body
>mount of the elk done.
>The fish and game said
>no..we shoot them, we keep
>them. Or we cut the
>horn off of them. The
>landowners said no can do,
>and dooooo not come on
>our property. So in turn,
>to beautiful bulls that could
>have been saved, dead slow
>and painful deaths. I in
>my 10 years of hunting
>and my dad in his
>40 plus years of hunting
>have never felt soo sick
>over something. It was heartbreaking
>to see. I will post
>pictures when I get a
>chance. I want you all
>to be able to see
>this sad event. What do
>you all think should have
>happened with them?
>
>
>
>
>
snipersmilie.gif

>one shot
 
I was the first to find these two elk. We had a Utah tag and found these elk in Nevada. We obeyed the law and did not take them. We were the ones that told others hoping to save these wonderful animals. I wanted to try to separate them myself, but didn't have the means to do so. I have video of them both alive!!!! We too are sick about this situation.
 
You are right, this does make me sick. I think this person is nothing shy of a poacher. What should be done about it? Well, I know that they have already confiscated the racks. Excellent call on NDOW's part. Letting him keep the racks would have opened up all kind of nasty possibilities for other poachers. Next I would take away his hunting license for a minimum of 2 -4 years. What is the charge for wasting not one but TWO whole elk carcasses? I think he should be slapped with that fine as well. This person allowed this to happen and sat back and watched 2 magnificent animals suffer. Yes, it does happen in nature, but we have an obligation to protect wildlife. This tragedy could have been averted had this person not been so selfish in a quest for what he thinks are "trophies". He stole from everyone that is holding a Nevada elk tag. Be sure to thank him for it. Just my 2 cents.
 
uuhhh. jtaxidermist did you read the initial post? i dont think there was mention of poachers here.the game the game and fish should be held responsible for the waste. The landowner(s) done their duty or part and immediately reported it. that is where the fine line is drawn the landowner(s) feel the attachment to these animals or since of ownership but the law indicates they belong to the state and no individual, right? game and fish should have allowed the dispatch of the animals in a swift, humane way, carcasses to be retrieved and processed for the meat. then after the threat of spoil was alleviated then bicker over custody of the head gear. two bull elk could feed a family for a good while. antlers dont spoil at least not where i am from. i think we all have different thoughts on how we would have handled it. poor judgment on the part of the game and fish i think. arent they charged with the management of the wildlife?
 
Lets get the story straight, first of all the land owner that made the call to fish and game is not the same land owner that denide Nevada fish and game access to his proporty. The only reason Nevada fish and game became involved was too save both of these elk from death.At the time of the first call both bulls were still very much alive.When asked for permission to cross the private property the land owner flattly rejected Nevada fish and games attemt to seperate the two bull.The only one looking ahead to gain a profit from these two bull fate was the rancher who owned the land.Please remember that this is the rancher that shot five elk from one of his fields a few years before.Yes he was caught!
After five days of trying to gain access to the two bull,and only after both bulls expired, the land owner then allowed Nevada fish and game to remove the animals. The land owner had made his point.
I as far as I can tell, the one that should be held responcible for the death of thses the animals is the rancher that had to make a point.
 
Yes this rancher didn't shoot five elk, one which is a 351 bull in which my family has the horns from. They were bought at an auction from the fish and game, and a friend gave them to us. He does have a bicker with the fish and game because they won't give him landowners permits. Which they should for the mass of elk he has on his property and what he has to deal with. But the locking up of these two bulls was sad to see that the two sides couldn't come to a conclusion to either seperate the bulls or kill them. I'm sad for both of the bulls and the way they had to die. If no one had witnessed it, it would have been fine, but as a vvvvvery very avid hunter you never ever want to see two beautiful bulls go that way. Very sad deal

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one shot
 
noth1

now the plot thickens as they say. In light of new developments i totally agree with you. the way it was portrayed initially was the exact opposite. they dont allow depredation hunts or permits for the landowner? sounds like he has an axe to grind with the game and fish.
 
Our newspaper had a picture of them locked together though. Dont understand why the rancher didnt let them try to save them.

fca2e9e9.jpg
 
I just gave my video of these elk chanel 5 news.Thay say it will air tonight at 6 and 10. 9/28/04.Thats a utah chanel.Vary sad.
 
I can't belive what i just read on this.

First the guy is up set at fish and wildlife officers for not giving him land owner tags so he will not let them come to the aid of these elk. ( i know its nature but sometimes i think its okay to give a helping hand) But then the fish and game come back and ask if they can have the heads. I know they belong to the state but they are on the guys property that he did not want them on to begin with and now he give the heads to them
what the ****. Why not just let them help in the first place?\
telling them they can't help and then letting them cut off the heads after they have died, Sorry, but sounds kinda of like waste of wildlife to me and he should be charged. Now i know this is the really world and they can't charge him but that make me really mad.

cklspencer
 
Here is a picture of these two Bulls after their heads were cut off. Not sure where these are at but maybe in F&G garage, I just do not know.
lockedbulls.jpg
 
thanks Brian,

I think you just answered the "score" question. I'll promise you that 5x5 ain't close to 375, and the 6x6 don't have it beat by much. I'll guess they won't score 500 combined.

JB

PS- a real shame though.
 
I just saw the video on the KSL 10 o'clock news... the story was bad enough let alone the video ... no they weren't monsters but it is a shame to see even though it is part of nature and probaly happens alot but this time we all got to witness it. ~G4
 
I agree, the landowner is in the wrong. Both these Monarchs could have been saved, but this damn farmer wouldn't allow that to happen. Then once the bulls have passed on, he allows them to come in and collect the heads... NOT RIGHT! This guy needs a lesson is ethics... bad form on his part. Pisses me off that these land owners get away with so much... it ain't right.
 

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