New Gun Help ( 300WSM or 300WBY )

Elkslayer

Elkslayer

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I need some help out there from those of you in the know!!!!
Looking to buy a new 300WSM or 300WBY with the following requirements: Very lightweight( less than 7 lbs, shorter barrel length ). I have a 5ft 8" frame and like a shorter gun. This gun will be used for Elk Hunting ( shots to 400 yards ) and long range mule deer hunting.

Also, what bullet weight would you recommend?

Currently looking at: WBY Ultralight 300 WBY, Browning A-bolt Micro Hunter 300WSM, Browning A-bolt Medallion 300WSM, Rugar M77 Standard 300 WSM.

What other guns am I missing? Not to interested in other calibers. What do you guy's think between the 300 WSM and 300 WBY calibers. Sorry about all the questions. Thanks for your help!
 
Anything you would have gained with the 300wby will be lost with the shorter barrel. Go with the wsm. There will also be less felt recoil with the smaller powder charge. This is a very efficient caliber. If you want to keep it simple with one load for everything go with a well constructed 165 grain bullet (barnes, partition etc.). When you get over 180 grain bullet in the wsm you get restricted with less case capacity, and you lose the efficiency of the cartridge. Plus, a shorter action with the wsm means a more compact, lighter rifle. Hands-down for what you want the 300wsm is the way to go.

Check out the new CZ model 3, built with a montana rifleman action, far superior in fit and finish compared to everything out there in it's price range. CRF like the model 70 or ruger 77, plus it's available in 300 wsm.
 
controlled round feed, aka mauser style bolt, such as the pre 64 or classic model 70. The Ruger also has this. vs- a push feed style bolt like the remington 700, savage, browning etc. I believe the web site is www.cz-usa.com
Good Luck
 
With the parameters you've mentioned I'd opt for the .300wsm. If I were buying I'd look at the following:

Wood Stocked:
Winchester Mod 70 supergrade- Very nice rife, good wood, controlled feed. Weight 7lbs 4oz. 24" barrel. pachmayer recoil pad.

Kimber 8400 classic- same as above really.

Synthetic stocked:

Kimber 8400 Montana- nice Kevlar stock, same options as above

Remington 700 Titanium- .300Saum-virtually the same as .300wsm. Titanium action, very nice bell& carlson stock very lightweight. Limbsaver recoil pad

My choice in wood guns would be the Winchester, for synthetic guns I'd go with the Rem. Good luck
 
I'd have to agree with what everyone has previously said. For what you want go with the 300 WSM. I have a 300 WBY and it kicks pretty good, if you went with the ultra light Weatherby then make sure you get the muzzle break on it. But, for availibility of ammo, price of shooting, and the shorter, light weight gun the 300 WSM is certainly the choice for you. The Weatherby Ultra Light has a 26" barrell. So you don't want to go with that. I would also have to agree that CZ's are great guns. I just bought a varmint 550 in 22-250 and it shoots a ragged hole, great triggers and great accuracy for the price.
 
Think of the CZ as what the winchester model 70 used to be. Now don't get me wrong, the model 70 is one of my favorites and was the first rifle I owned. But quality control from all of the big boys these days is crap. I've seen way too many junkers come from the factory these days. From all the major manufacturers. With the #3 you're getting semi-custom quality at factory pricing. One of the best bargains out there today in guns.
 
No one has mentioned it (wouldn't have been my first choice either but I got a heck of a deal) a Savage Model 11. Its very light, and the recoil is not bad, I'm 21 and weigh 160lbs and is very manageable. I know there are better guns but this gun is very accurate. I used it on my elk hunt this year and my shot was 413 yds and the 5x5 took 2 steps and collapsed.
 
Well I have narrowed my choices down to the following after looking at a few more guns:

WBY Super Big GameMaster in 300WBY. The gun is 6 3/4 pounds, 26" barrel and 46 5/8" total length without a muzzle brake. I know I would want a muzzle brake, so I would have my gunsmith cut about 3" off the solid end of the fluted barrel. This gun holds 3 + 1. Gunsmith says that I may loose some velocity, but not any accuracy. Also with Monte Carlo Stock.

Sako 75 Finnlight in 300 WSM The gun is 6 1/2 pounds and probably around 43 total length, can't see it in the brochure on the Berettausa.com website. Barrel length is 24 3/8 and gun holds 4 + 1 which I really like. Synthetic/stainless with rubber over the synthetic and sub 1" MOA is guaranteed if the shooter does his job. Also with Monte Carlo Stock.

Browning A-bolt Classic Hunter in 300 WSM. I saw a A-bolt Hunter in the store and liked it. The Classic Hunter has a Monte Carlo Stock and all the same other features as the regualar A-bolt hunter: Low-luster walnut stock and low luster blueing, 23" barrel, 42 3/4" total gun length and 6lbs 9 oz.
I really like this gun also, but have not been able to find one for sale. Browning will not have another run out until the end of February. Does anyone know where one is at? Right handed!

Kimber 8400 in 300 WSM. Mauser action, low luster wood stock and barrel. Very light and short gun. Don't know if this gun is the equal of the WBY or SAKO for around the same money, bive or take $100 or so. Also with Monte Carlo Stock.

The winchester Model 70 was o.k, but not to fond of the camo synthetic stock and the higher price over the Browning.

The Savage guns do not hold enough shells for me ( 2 + 1 ).

The Rugar M77 in 300 WSM was o.k. also, but a 22" barrel, 42" overall length and 7 lbs.

I currently shot 180 grain Trophy Bonded Bear Claws out of my old 300 WBY and will shoot 165 grain Nosler Partions out of a 300 WSM if I go that route. The 165 Grain 300 WSM holds right in there on the Ballistics with the 300 WBT TBBC.

The first three guns listed are the one's that I am really leaning towards. On any of the guns, the barrels will be cut down to install the brake. I would like to finish around 43" total length and under 7lbs total weight. Also like the Monte Carlo Stock.

The 300 WSM round looks great and the factory bullet options that are offered are fantastic off the shelf. Not to mention, the 300 WSM loads are alot cheaper.

What do you gunsmiths think about cutting down the barrels a bit to keep the overall length down?

Please let me know what you all think and why?

I do alot of mountain climbing and bustin the brush. Must be able to shoot out to 400 yards well.

Thanks!
 
300 WSM. If you want to go light and cost isn't a concern you could go with a christensen (carbon) barrel. Add a couple inches to the barrel and pick up a couple 100 fps and steel be lighter than a factory gun.
 
I do not reload and worry about the ammo selection with the 300 RUM. It probably is more gun than I need. Thanks!
 
Elkslayer,
Look at the guns coming out of Remington's custom shop. I have a 700KS which is a semi production gun built by the custom shop,in 7mm mag. Incredibly accurate and very lightwieght. A little pricier than standard production guns, but comparable to the Kimbers and Sakos.
Ken M.
 
Elk, if you are truly wanting a custom job, I can vouch for Christensen Arms. I have a 300WSM on a Remington stock with a Browning action, Timney trigger set at 2.5 pounds. The rifle and scope together weigh less than seven pounds. The muzzle brake is awesome, I can enjoy shooting the rifle as it's kick is less than my .280 Remington. And I'm just a short little gal, so that was important for me.

Oh, did I mention the 1/2 MOA accuracy? It's totally wicked. You can play with different actions, triggers, stocks, etc at their website: www.christensenarms.com

Pred
 
Based on your wants of light and short, in my opinion you have to go with a 300 wsm with a gun with a syn stock.

The wsm has three advantages over the weatherby. It is a short action caliber so there is less steel in any manufactures action because it is shorter so it will always weigh less than a long action( 300 wby).

The wsm has less recoil than a wby. MY wsm shoots the same ballistically as my old 300 win mag but with slighty less recoil.

The wsm burns it powder charge faster so it requires less barrel that standard charges. A lot of factory wsm guns come with 22" barrel instead of the 24 found on a lot of long action guns. That extra barrel adds lenght and weight. If you get wby and cut the barrel you will loose velocity to the point where you might be below wsm numbers. The Wsm is more efficient.

Also you have mentioned guns with wood stocks. If weight is a concern then you almost have to get a synthetic stocked gun to save weight.

If it were me I would not cut barrel to add a brake. I had a brake added to my 300 mag that was wieghed no more that 4 ounces. That extra weight is worth more than the lost velocity of a cut barrel( a brake does nothing to add to the overall effective lenght of a barrel)

Just my two cents!
 
Based on my User name, you probably know what I am going to recommend.

For starters, the Weatherby magnum will outperform the WSM. In Velocity, Trajectory, and sheer knock down MULE power!! I have owned my 300 Weatherby for a couple of years and have killed one elk and one mule deer. I own the Ultra lightweight and thought I could live without the muzzle break. I am putting a break on it this winter. It just kicks to hard. The recoil is worth the performace however. When I looked into getting a rifle I researched a lot and the bottom line was I wanted a magnum that would give me the confidence for down range killing power. I like to keep my shots under 350, but in the country out west there are going to be times when you need to shoot out to 500 yards.

Having said this, I am pushing a 165 grain Nosler ballistic tip out the muzzle at 3285 fps. At 500 yards the drop is only twenty inches. I have not researched the WSM ballistics in a comparitive load, but I would be surprised if it did this.

I know there will be a time when I will be faced with a trophy buck out to 450 yards and I want the confidence of knowing my caliber will perform, and from my experience, I know my Weatherby will. My deer was shot at my personal best 356 yards uphill. The neat thing about the situation was I learned how fast the 300 Weatherby really is. I didnt adjust for shooting that steep uphill and I only had my gun sighted in at 2.25 inches high at 100 yards because of its flat shooting. I initial felt to aim at the base of the bedded buck. I shot and kicked up dirt right in front of him. This is the point, at 356 I could tell were I hit low. With my old .270, I would not have known were I hit. I made the adjustment on the second shot and the buck was toast. The elk I killed with the gun was at about 325 yards with a 180 grain Nosler Partition. I hit him in the shoulder and at that distance had an exit hole.

Hence, go with the Ultralightweight 300 WBY. Put a break on it, and don't worry about the barrell length. I personally think you can't beat a 300 Wby Mag for versatility on big game! Have fun with the decision.
 
I would go with the 300WBY. I have owned one for 3 years now and i love it. it does everything. Mine is the 300wby deluxe. If you want a lighter gun i would check out the 300 wby mag accumark with the muzzle break. Its an awesome gun!!! The ballistics for the 300 WBY are hard to beat. I have shot 6 deer with it and only used 7 bullets.

Garrett
 
I owned a 300 weatherby mag and loved it....If you need a muzzle break you are shooting to much gun. The muzzle break will add so much muzzle blast you'll be sorry you did it. If recoil is a problem then don't buy 30 calibers your just fooling yourself. A 270 or 280 will do everything you mentioned...To many people shoot 30 calibers just because they fall in love with the 30 caliber mystic. I'll say it again......If you need a muzzle break the gun is to much for you....My hunting partner shoots a 300 and put a muzzle break on it. I told him he would be sorry because of the muzzle blast....He is!!!!
 
Kingfish, point well made. The problem herein lies in the fact that it is a two edged sword. I have shot my weatherby for 3 years and have been fine without the muzzle brake until I started to flinch a bit this off season. It comes down to noise or recoil. The noise is going to punish those around you more than yourself. The recoil can foul up your shot placement in the long run.

Were I would disagree with you is your mentioning the .270 or .280 will do everything the .300WBY will. Wrong. At 350 yards I can shoot my .270 at a milk jug, set down my rifle, and pick up my binoculars to see were it hits. We are talking about a bullet weighing 30 more grains cruising 300 fps faster and packing a lot more punch and shooting twice as flat.

Don't get me wrong, I like my .270 a bunch, but the performance of the Weatherby is at another level.

Hence, go with the Ultralightweight in .300WBY Mag with a muzzle break.
 
Don't kid yourself...Muzzle blast will make you flinch just as fast as recoil!!!. The issue here is not recoil or muzzleblast the issue is flinching. I'm willing to bet you flinch just as much with your 270 as you do your 300. It gets to be automatic no matter what caliber you shoot. Does your shoulder hurt after you shoot your 300?. If it does your not getting the butt into your shoulder properly. Go to the range with your 300 and shoot ten rounds if your shoulder hurts, It's you not the rifle. I just hate to see guys spend all that money putting muzzle breaks on their rifles when it really boils down to basic shooting positions. Getting the rifle up to the shoulder properly is really important. I practice "dry firing" all year and basically all im interested in while doing this is getting the rifle up quick and snug to the shoulder and finding my target fast through the scope. Ballistcally the 300 out performs the 270 and 280 allot what I'm saying is shoot the rifle you shoot well and don't think you need a 30 caliber to kill elk at 300 yards. I'll take my 270 anyday...Good luck no matter what you decide....
 
I have the A-bolt stainless stalker, it would be a good choice weighting in at 6.6 lbs it holds 4+1 and with a 40 dollar trigger job, I can put groups in right around 1" MOA some times a little better.
I have nothing against Weatherby, they just want way to much for their shells. and since i dont reload I cant see paying the price for ballistics, the short mags are damn near matching. 165 gr. ballistic tips out of a regular 300 win mag are at 3200 fps muzzle. I shoot 165 Nosler Partitions at 3130 muzzle out of my short mag.
 
For what you want, hands down go browse Christensen Arms as pointed out earlier. Buy one gun. Buy it right. Look at their titanium with carbon barrel. Get it in whatever caliber you want that they offer. They're not cheap but very light. And all the happy customers, one would have to think they are worth it. Shilen barrels have that reputation as accurate.

FWIW the Rem Titanium actions are not supposed to be that much lighter than a normal action(Idont' have figures handy in ounces) but they save most weight in a light barrel contour and 18 oz( appx- check out bansner stocks) stock.

Jeff
 
I would take the 300WSM. I own a 300 WBY as well as a 7mm WSM. The barrel length on the weatherby can be a bit obnoxious at times. If you don't reload your own ammo the cost for a box of shells for the weatherby will kill you!!!
 
300wtby

Are you saying you can shoot the 270 at 350 yards at a milk jug and because its so slow you have time to grab the binocs and watch the bullet impact? Vs not being able to see that with the 300 because its faster?

FWIW I don't own a 270 but do own a couple of 300 wtby chamberings.

Just curious.

Jeff
 
Thanks everyone for all the help. I have decided on the 300 WSM, but don't know what gun yet. The Sako is nice, but I really like the Browning A-bolt Classic Hunter with the Monte Carlo stock. Thw Winchester with Camo Synth. and S.S. is o.k, but does not have the Monte Carlo stock.
 

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