New Utah State Record Bull

antlerrick

antlerrick

Very Active Member
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2,626
Pictures are now posted on the mossbackfever.com website of this magnificent animal. It is the largest 6X6 ever harvested, and potential #4 in the world..
Congrats to everyone involved!
Rick
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-06 AT 09:45AM (MST)[p]bonepiler, this bull was taken in Nov. after the rut and the beginning of winter, what do you expect?

antlerrick, it was worth the wait. It is amazing the number of 400+ bulls that mossback was able to put on the ground. What a year for DM and Utah.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-06 AT 10:50AM (MST)[p]It's a great bull - absolutely beautiful. Congratulations to the hunter. Must have been the best day of his life. Awesome pics. I think it is just the way they are positioning the bull though in the pics that makes him look so scruffy. I noticed too that they mentioned the guide and a bunch of others who assisted on the hunt and there sure were a bunch of them in the pics. Sounds like an awful lot of guides for just one hunter. What did they do, locate the bull, surround him with 19 guides, block off the roads with their pickups, fly in the hunter, take him to the bull, have him make the shot, take some pics and then fly him out the next day? Wouldn't that be funny if it really happend like that? GOOD JOB TEAM MOSSBACK! I noticed also that the same hunter took a 420 bull last year too, and a a governor's tag bull in 2003. Hmmmm, lucky guy. I wonder if I was rich if I could get that lucky too.

UTROY
Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)
 
Wondered how long it would take before the bashing started!
That is kind of what guides do. Find and animal and get the hunter to it. Seems there is a problem with having help there to take care of the bull.
LET'S JUST APPRECIATE THE BULL FOR WHAT HE IS! It is the largest bull ever harvested in Utah, and anywhere in the United States in the past ??? years. It is proof of Utah's efforts to produce quality animals. It is proof that there these bulls can be found on Public land, open to all of us if we ever have the luck to draw a permit, and then the opportunity to hunt.
This bull was in an area open to anyone with a valid permit and nobody blocked roads, kept people out, etc. In fact, I don't think they even seen another hunter, and I know for a fact that nobody even scouted or was in that area for weeks before the hunt.
Public Land, Public Bull, fair chase! Come on guys!!! If you need to bash, you got to do better than that!!!! LOL..

Bottom line, This bull is a beautiful animal! End of discussion!!!
Rick
 
pro,

If you would just quit coming on here and blowing doyle horn for him you wouldn't keep getting replys like you do. We all know you love and worship him so please for the sake of everyone give it a rest alllllllllreadyyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Pro--I wouldnt expect anything differently from a bull killed in November. I am just stating it is too bad he is scruffy and run-down looking. Chill-dude, no need to run to the rescue--lol. Too bad that ear is all split out.
 
On the Mossback website it says he took the bull with a "general limited entry tag." I thought he had another Governor's tag? Anybody know what the deal is?
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-06 AT 02:29PM (MST)[p]>Public Land, Public Bull, fair chase!
> Come on guys!!!
>If you need to bash,
>you got to do better
>than that!!!! LOL..
>
>Bottom line, This bull is a
>beautiful animal! End
>of discussion!!!
>Rick

Sorry dude - not the end of the discussion by a long shot - not at all. Nobody would bash if there weren't some problems with the way this bull was taken. Yeah he was a public land bull taken with a public tag but I don't know if I would necessarily call it fair chase. That's up for debate in my book. That many guides reminds me of the great English and French hunters of the past who rode on elephants and shot safely from above while the bush beaters did all the actual work to flush the tigers out of the long grass of India. Give me a break - the kind of bullcrap that took this elk makes me sick. And that isn't taking anything away from this elk at all - not one bit. He is a giant and a tribute to Utah but IMO - the whole hunt is nothing more than the product of a large corporate enterprise whose sole purpose was to find the largest bull they could, get the hunter there once they did, kill the bull and film it so they can sell more videos. Sorry if I don't think that is what hunting is all about and that it leaves a bad bad bad taste in my mouth.

UTROY
Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)
 
Not the Gov. tag, he had that last year.

$$$+ airplane+ 10 guides+ 400 bull= alot of jealous people.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-06 AT 02:41PM (MST)[p]
>
>$$$+ airplane+ 10 guides+ 400 bull=
>alot of jealous people.

That's the biggest copout ever. "OH - they are just jealous because they can't do the same thing" what a crock of crap. That's what all the rich folks think about people who don't have the same opportunities as they do. They use that argument to justify their lavish extremes when they are really just using their money to compensate for other things that are missing from their lives. Guess what - nobody is jealous, I just think there is something wrong with a system that bids its wildlife resources out to the highest killer who can pay for a guide service to locate the best animal, notify them, fly them in, take them to the animal, kill it, and then fly out the next day. I've got no problem with someone drawing a tag, scouting the area with a guide and hunting hard for a good bull. But more than 10 guides - give me a break. You can't tell me that the average joe from Utah has the same opportunity as this hunter did.


UTROY
Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)
 
>Not the Gov. tag, he had
>that last year.
>
>$$$+ airplane+ 10 guides+ 400 bull=
>alot of jealous people.


$$$+ airplane (and helicopter)+ 10 guides+ 400 bull+ fed up people= prout running to the rescue!!
 
Roy, this bull was for the taking during the LE archery hunt, the LE early season any-weapon hunt, and the LE muzzleloader hunt. That is more than 10 guys looking for this bull, I would argue they had MORE of an opportunity than this hunter did. He had to let all these other hunters have a go at him before he did.

What is a crock of crap is all the mis-information on how this and other guided hunts by this outfit take place. This hunters dont hunt quite the way you make it seem, but I guess it somehow makes you feel better about being a have-not wishing you were a have. This is a capitalist society not a socialist one, there is no need to turn hunting into socialism so that you can be happy no one else gets to do something you wont/cant.
 
Roy,

Very good posts. I too get sick of people saying "oh your jealous"

Selling OUR game to the highest bidder, seems wrong to me. Has little to do with jealousy.

I can guess the response: The money did more good for game in Utah than anything that anyone else has ever done...yada yada.

I do not want to hear it, I think this approach to selling our game is wrong.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-06 AT 03:14PM (MST)[p]Its funny to me....people complain that pics weren't posted sooner. They get posted and let the bashing begin...WHAT A JOKE! Great bull, congrats to the hunter and guides.
 
I do not think you will see post with Roy complaining about not having pics posted.
Your right it is a joke that we allow this.
 
Awesome animal, I would just like to see one that big face to face one of these days!
 
holy balls what a bull,,For those of you with youre derogatory comments ,GIVE ME A BREAK ,Mossback definately puts in there time .If it was as easy as paying a guide to a 400 bull as some of you make it sound ,there would be more 400 bulls taken every year,There are hundreds of outrfitters out there every year ,only a few of them are harvesting bulls like the elk mossback consistently harvest ,Give respect were it is due .I dont know Doyle Moss or have I ever met him ,however ,bulls like this bull are only harvested after an ungodly amount of hours in scouting and preparing .Congrats to the hunter and the guides on a fine bull .
 
$$$ + airplane + 5 guides = 370 bull

$$ + airplane + 3 guides = 340 bull

$ + airplane + 1 guide = 320 bull

......LOL
 
If it was as
>easy as paying a guide
>to a 400 bull as
>some of you make it
>sound ,there would be more
>400 bulls taken every year,


And there WEREN'T more 400+ bulls taken in Utah this year?
 
Imagine you are this hunter. You took the bull as he did. You get it mounted and proudly display it above your fireplace, or wherever. Your friends come over, gawk at the bull and want to hear the story. What story do you tell them?

"Ten guys found it for me. I pulled the trigger. Great hunt."

The bull is awesome. The Mossback guys appear to be the best in the business. If you had the money and drew the tag, it would be really, really hard not to hire the Mossback crew. For all intensive purposes, these tags are once in a lifetime tags. It would be a shame not to take a quality animal. For me, whatever route I choose when that tag comes, however much money I spend, whoever I hire (if anyone), at the end of the day I want to tell a different story when someone looks at my bull on the wall.

-Travis
 
shotgunjim, maybe if you pulled your head out of your own arse you would see I didn't take bonepilers first post badly or as an attack on Doyle. I just mentioned that the bull had been thru the rut and that is all. I just was just pointing out the obvious, if that offends you or him, you need some thicker skin cowboy.

pro
 
Well, i hate to be the party crasher, but if I had a super tag in my pocket, and money in the bank, Doyle would be my first call. Ive said it before and I will say it again. I don't care about DIY, I want the biggest animal on the mountain. Some people take offense to that, oh well.

I for sure would be happier with the #4 typical than a DIY 340" Bull, but that doesn't mean that everyone has to feel that way. if you like the DIY approach, more power to ya, I will congratulate you all the same whatever you kill, as long as you are happy with it, who gives a flying f*ck what anybody else thinks.......

:( Somebody didn't like bouncing betty :(
 
0$ + 4 wheeler - guides = raghorn

0$ + horse - guides = raghorn + tired horse

0$ + public tag - guides - horse - 4 wheeler - airplane = slim chance

.....lol
 
Just a quick question, not a bash at Doyle or the way Utah is currently operating in regards to its money tags.

Are outfitters in Utah given specific areas that they are allowed to guide in or are they free to guide anywhere in the state without protected outfitters territories? I know in Idaho they get certain areas and just can't pull big critters out of the same area year after year.
 
If it was as
>easy as paying a guide
>to a 400 bull as
>some of you make it
>sound ,there would be more
>400 bulls taken every year,

Ok then if it so difficult - explain to me how this particular hunter has taken a 400 bull in 3 of the last four years.


There
>are hundreds of outrfitters out
>there every year ,only a
>few of them are harvesting
>bulls like the elk mossback
>consistently harvest ,Give respect were
>it is due .I dont
>know Doyle Moss or have
>I ever met him ,however
>,bulls like this bull are
> only harvested after an
>ungodly amount of hours in
>scouting and preparing .Congrats to
>the hunter and the guides
>on a fine bull .

I never said that Mossback didn't put in the hours or the research or that they don't every year. They certainly do and the film it and sell it so that they can do it again next year. Sorry - but to me that isn't what hunting is about. To me it is about the hunter doing his fair share of the work. Don't try and tell me that this hunter does the actual hunting work - the only hunting he does is for the tag and the guide service. And now, because of the celebrity he has he doesn't even really have to do that. I am sure the guides are lining up to get this guy as their client. Do a google search on the guy - you will see that most of the hits are on guides' websites. I am glad that he has the money to do what he does and that he lives in a country that will permit him to do so but forgive me however if I hold his style of hunting in disdain because to me it seems that he treats the earth as a giant Wal-mart where he can buy the best animal time and time again. Sure it takes some work to push his shopping cart around the store, but to me it ain't hunting.
>


UTROY
Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)
 
That's the most badass typical I have ever seen.
Congrats to the hunter and DM.

Chef
"I Love Animals...They're Delicious!"
 
New dell+padded chair+scouting on MM= Typical 300 bull seen here on MM.
Bitching cause someone else shot a bigger bull than you pricless.

Makes me wonder why Roy, ropinfool and bowhunt didnt tag team this bull???
 
"he treats the earth as a giant Wal-mart where he can buy the best animal time and time again."

Good lord man.. Your not reaching at all..

FACT: if you weren't there. You DON'T know what it took to harvest this bull.


buck1.gif


Later, Brandon
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-06 AT 09:08PM (MST)[p]14 yeras ago, Utah elk hunters got excited if someone shot a 300 inch bull.

In 2006, about 1700 hunters drew permits and all had the chance to take a 400 inch bull on public lands. Whether these hunters hunted hard enough, passed up enough 350 or 380 bulls, or took a 330 bull and went home happy is the beuaty of the system, they are out there to take them if you want it bad enough.

I believe 16 bulls grossing over 400 were taken.

There are lots of big bulls left on the mountain, and 1700 or so hunters next year will have a chance to hunt a giant bull.

and for the guys who just want to hunt some meat, there are 30,000 or so general season and spike tags.

At least they are out there for everyone to fight over who should or shouldn't get em.

And with $2.5 million from the tags and Ten million more from the state and feds, there will be more food in the future to keep large and robust herds in the future.


www.huntexpo.com is an opporunity to put your name in for 50 of the best elk tags in the world, on public land, no guide required, but there are some great guides if you want to hire on.

Congratulations Doyle and Mossback team, they do a lot to make sure big bulls are out there for many years to come.
 
The bull lived on the Reservation, and migrated off to winter on US public grounds. That is my understanding of the situation. Never was available for an earlier tag. And this wasn't killed on a public tag. Rather a tag purchased, not drawn.

When will SFW take "credit" for elk units which are over objective? When will SFW take "credit" for the longest wait to draw? I have to say that as a SFW member, I wish there was less need to spin everything. Good job though on getting funds earmarked for wildlife.
 
Packout, the bull was killed on opening morning of the late season elk hunt. There were atleast 20 other hunters who started hunting the same unit that morning. Anyone of them could have hunted the same bull. Anyone (res. or non res.) with max points putting in for this hunt would have been gauranteed a tag and could have hunted this bull. For that matter anyone with a half decent job could have bought this tag for what it went for and hunted the bull.
Nobody knows for sure if that bull lived on indian ground. Nobody saw him there or he would have been dead there long before. Although I won't say he didn't summer there. Nobody really knows where he summered.
 
Packout, there used to be 20,000 or so applicants for limited elk.

Now because of the huge bulls, everyone wants one, and i believe 50,000 people apply - Victim of our own sucess, but that isn't bad either, they are the peoples elk.

there is no question the membership of SFW wanted quality elk, that is what Utah has, that is what SFW will fight to keep, and we will also work to see if we cannot increase elk herds with all the money invested to grow more food. That could mean more elk, more elk tags, and keep the quality.

SFW has never ducked the issue, to have quality - extreme quality you must significantly limit the harvest. while i wait for my once in a lifetime chance to draw a trophy bull tag, i will go with friends who draw, or take my boys to another state where they can shoot a raggy and be happy. All other Utah elk hunters can do the same, but there is a chance to take a great bull when you draw. 14 years ago, there was little if any chance to find a big bull.
 
That is the most awesome bull I have ever seen. Congrats to Ron and Mossback. That bull was over 400" for a few years and alot of other tags went home without him.

I can't believe all the ##### and moaners out there. What a bunch of jealous ball babies. You bad mouth a world class animal because you didn't shoot it and some wealthy guy did so that makes him the bad guy? Remember when your mom said "If you can't say anything nice don't say anything at all"?

This record will stand for a long time.IMO Lets give all parties involved the respect they deserve and especially the animal.
 
Wow! I figured the bashing would start near post 20, not post 3!

As far as the bull is concerned....that is ONE MONSTER BULL!! I have been waiting to see the pics, and it has been worth the wait. COngrats to Ron, Doyle, and the rest of the Mossback crew...especially those who spent all the extra hours, days, weeks, on the mountain to help in the harvest of this bull.

I agree with what BROWTINE said, if you weren't there for the hunt and harvest, then you have NO idea what went into the harvest of this bull. If you have NO idea of what went on, then say your congratulations, enjoy the pics, and move on to the next post. Dont come on here with accusations and stupid bitching and moaning, if you know NOTHING about what really went into this hunt.

TUFF
 
Well you are right I wasn't there. So I shouldn't be saying anything about it and I probably wouldn't have except for what I saw posted on Mossbackfever.com. Yes it's true I heard a rumor about this bull a couple of months ago that made my stomach turn and didn't want to believe it. So I ignored it, but then when I saw the pics on Mossbackfever website (which I never ever ever complained about not seeing on MM or anywhere else nor do I give a flying rats behind if they ever are posted anywhere) and it told me all I needed to know to confirm that at least part of what I had heard was true. So I made a couple of calls and confirmed a few more bits of truth through very reliable sources. Lets just say this, not everyone in Mossland is doing their best job at keeping trade secrets, and if I were a journalist I could write an article on this and not need to worry about being accused of conjecture or innuendo in my article. So if all you guys are OK with one hunter having six or more guides to hunt one animal(see the credits and the photos #3 and #4 of the bull in the field), then I probably shouldn't have a problem with it either. If you are OK with hunting becoming an elitist rich man's sport and how the system currently is then I probably shouldn't have a problem either. So let's all turn our heads and look the other way and go back to 19th century England and Ireland and let the kings and nobles hunt the stags of the moors and the tigers of the jungle just because they can. All hail the mighty kings.

It's not jealousy either - not by a long shot. So you can just get off that high horse right now. I could care less about who kills what or that I didn't get a chance to do it. I call them like I see them and what I have seen so far repulses me.

UTROY
Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)
 
I will third what grizz said. Mossback is very good at putting the best bulls down. Aside from that comment, I have no ill feelings or comments toward them. However, for me personally, I like being the boss on my hunt. DIY for me too. The hunts come in a series of steps for me.

Research
Applications (and more applications year after year!)
More research
Scouting
More research and more scouting.
Go hunting and do the best I can.
Feel good about the whole deal.

Any way you slice it, Skoronski's bull is a big old bull!
 
Maybe we could get a octagon set up at the big show in SLC? We could see how tough everyone really is. Great bull Ron, Doyle & Crew, congrats..........
 
Why is it bashing if we are mearly pointing out the truth? I am the last one to tell someone how to hunt or what to do with their money. I'm just stating my opinion. Jeallousy for me has nothing to do with it. I've killed a lot of game, some big and some small. I never have and probably never will have anything scored because it's not important to me. If it's important to someone else, that's fine. I do agree with Roy though about what hunting is becoming.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-15-06 AT 08:41AM (MST)[p]AZ402 - I am in the heavyweight division and I know a few pretty good submission techiques! COUNT ME IN! Too funny!


UTROY
Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)
 
Stan, lets Get-R-Done!

Are you coming to SLC for the show? I's love to repay the favor for that check. :)

buck1.gif


Later, Brandon
 
>Stan, lets Get-R-Done!
>
>Are you coming to SLC for
>the show? I's love to
>repay the favor for that
>check. :)
>
>
buck1.gif

>
>Later, Brandon


Haha, the check!! We will have a booth there. I'm not 100% sure I'll be going but it's likely.
 
>LAST EDITED ON Dec-15-06
>AT 08:41?AM (MST)
>
>AZ402 - I am in the
>heavyweight division and I know
>a few pretty good submission
>techiques! COUNT ME IN! Too
>funny!
>
>
>UTROY
>Proverbs 21:19 (why I hunt!)


Stay away from Roy's headbutt, too. He's got a MEAN headbutt. Just ask the kid who's nose exploded all over his face one day when Roy had finally had enough of his crap.

Go get em' Roy! I'll be there to cheer you on just like I was when you wrestled in high school. REmember when that one kid crossfaced you and I went nuts?? "KICK HIS A@@ ROY! KICK HIS A@@!!!!!" lol Good times...good times..
 
Maybe I missed it but what unit was this on? I've read a couple posts about a record elk from the book cliffs but couldn't find anything specific. Next to a reservation made me wonder if this is it.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-15-06 AT 11:05AM (MST)[p]Hey Roy,

I knew there was a reason I like you. Nice posts - you're right on target with this one.

You coming up for the tag pimping convention next month?
 
I'm sure all you guys that are bashing will go to the expo and tell Doyle just exactly how you feel. (ya right) I can see it now. Walk into his booth, see all the trophys (jealousy will set in once again), congradulate him on a great year, he'll say thanks, and then you'll walk off saying "can you believe the nerve of that guy talking to us!" "I can't wait to get back to my computer and tell everybody at MM what a jerk he was to us."
 
If you don't "HAVE A CLUE WHO THIS GUY IS", why are you sure you speak the 'truth'? If you haven't a clue about someone/something you ought not run your mouth about it/them. I am all for the truth, I just haven't seen any from those bashing this hunter or the guide service he used. Sorry if that hurts your attempt to bring others down in order to feel better about your own SHORT comings.
 
>TripleK,
>
>Do I know you????? Are you
>related to Dr. (almost) Roy
>of Texas? I might just
>know you!
>
>-UGA

I think you just might! ;-)
 
I'm not quite sure what you are arguing about. What I said was money + airplane + 10 guides (or however many) = 400 bull. Are you saying this guy who guided him did it all by himself with no help from anybody else? What I was getting at was if you have enough money you can kill a big bull. Is that not the truth? If that offends you or anybody else, then so be it.
 
Pro, and Raging...

I think you are missing the point:
-I am sure Doyle is a great guy, obviously he does his job very very well. I think that is GREAT!
-The elk is incredible.
-It is great it was killed in Utah

No one is disputing any of that. No one is saying that the bull sucks, Doyle should not be guiding, or anything bad about anyone involved. It is great that they all put in the effort and found this bull.

The issue is this: We do not like the idea that BIG money gives more and better opportunity.

This is not a jealousy thing at all. Hate to break the news to ya, but I could buy a big dollar tag every year if I chose to, but I think everyone should have equal opportunity at every tag.

I am not sure how you translate these post into: Doyle bashing, jealousy, etc.
I just think selling OUR game is wrong, THAT IS IT.
 
Actually a lot of the big money tags give "Us" more opportunity. The money goes into preserving habitat and helping wildlife in numerous ways. In AZ there have been several drinkers and parcels of land bought to help elk and other game and non-game in our state. I'm assuming UT is the same.

Yeah a bull or two may get shot. In the long run the money that comes from those tag helps ?you?. I can only speak from a AZ stand point but those auction tags have generated some big dollars. Those dollars have made an improvement to the elk herd and habitat. Giving all of ?Us? more opportunity.

B-tine it's about 50/50 that I'll be there . Roy, sounds good, I'm a tweener from heavyweight to light heavyweight. Hopefully I'll see some of you boys up there in about a month
 
That is NOT what this country is all about, equal everything, yes we are created equal, but some become more successful and being more successful brings more opportunities. Like it or not. This hunter broke no laws and he didnt cheat the system, he is just playing the game by the rules and winning big time. Instead of saying everyone should have the same choices making you sound like a Frenchie, maybe we should find ways to win ourselves. It's like hating the Yankees because they have more than double the World Championships than any other team, it's silly but natural. DO we dispise all who get better hands dealt them in life or worry about our own damn selves?
 
isayNUNYA - watch your mouth about 3k!! or I will let her come over and thump pop knots on your head!!

That is an awesome bull!! I agree Doyle and his "posse" did a great job. But I still don't like there style for this particular elk.

Yes FACT I wasn't there but I got my info from someone who was!

I just hate to see hunting go this way to the highest bidder. Ever since Utah has started producing big elk land owner, conservation, and General season tag prices have more than doubled. And I don't see the prices coming down so you can't tell me hunting hasn't turned into a rich mans sport.
 
Basic economics, supply and demand. The supply is limited and the demand gets higher every year. I guess we could just kill all the big bulls then the demand would lessen and the prices would go down. That would solve all the 'rich man' and 'meat hunter' trouble right there. Have nothing to supply and there will be no demand. Brilliant! Brilliant!
 
Ropinfool,
Yeah, I give. In fact I think we should auction all tags to the highest bidder, alla the Yankees! LOL
 
Two comments,One thing I love about hunting is what I call the luck factor. It doesn't matter if you have the best tag and have scouted your butt off, you still never know when or if you'll see the animal you're looking for. I don't see that being a part of this type of hunt.
Secondly I think there is a trickle down effect from these big money tags and hunts. I think this will eventually make it unaffordable for the average guy to be able to trophy hunt.
 
> Everyone in the basin know
>3K. She gets around;)

Uh-oh! Ya woke up the HadenShedHead, Nunya! lol And I DO get around...in a good way. ;-) I do know an awful lot of people here. I make friends everywhere I go and sometimes I latch onto my brothers (Roy and HadenShedHead) and their friends.

And just because I disagree w/someone on one issue doesn't mean they're not my friend either. I do like to discuss certain issues and as long as it doesn't get into personal insults I can agree to disagree peacefully.

Jenn
 
In this case the luck factor is mitigated by quantity of men involved. More men, more eyes, more ground is covered, less luck.
 
WOW, what a good comeback. Did you come up with that on your own?

I was referring to a beer ad with two guys wearing white smocks my thin skinned little moosie.

How about a response that has some merit based on facts not just emotions and 'feelings', or just call Ophray, she might make you feel better about your life.
 
>WOW, what a good comeback. Did
>you come up with that
>on your own?
>
THIS from a guy who's only defense yesterday was (and not actual quotes but basic sentiment...and you have to say it in a kid-on-the-playground-who's-just-been-insulted accent) "Oh yeah? Well....you're just jealous and you have a small penis and no balls." LOL

Don't even start that because you have been the KING of playground insults on this thread.

And yes...I am referring to your response to someone who challenged you. You know...where you said "Get over your small pe###er syndrome and grow a sack"...which, BTW...totally baffled me. I thought he HAD a sack since he was telling you how he felt. You're just so defensive about all this. Maybe you ought to tell some of your Mossback buddies not to tell too much about the hunt, huh? Then maybe people wouldn't question the method.

And really...you are totally missing the point on alot of these posts and some of your responses do sound a bit 'off'. Maybe you should quit now, eh?

Jenn
 
I think credit for this bull should go to where it is due. Congratulations to the DWR, BLM,(SITLA too), and the Ute Indian tribe for managing and preserving habitat out there. Without their efforts, this bull would not have been there. These groups have spent a lot of money rehabing the large wildfires that feed a lot of elk. The nutrition being produced right now from the high quality forage from fire rehabilitation efforts certainly has promoted strong antler growth. I do not think anyone can disagree about that. Good job to them again.

I also hate to see hunting in the U.S. rocket down the path towards what happened in Europe. We should learn from the past, not repeat the same mistake. I do not think anyone posting here can honestly tell themselves that they want to see hunting left to the nobles, unless you stand to profit from it.

There will always be a division in points of view on this topic. For me, it goes back to a underlying concept. Wildlife are owned by the people of the state. As such, people should have equal chance. Furthermore, money should not be an issue in deciding chance. It is the only fair (and honest) way to handle public owned wildlife. If everyone has the same chance of acquiring a tag, then I think they wouldn't have as big of a problem with people hiring a guide.

My original post merely pointed out this elk was shaggy and run-down looking. Not a bash on anyone. But it does beg the question? Should we really be hunting bull elk post rut in the early winter when their body condition is low and they should be preserving their remaining energy to survive the winter? Can you imagine trying to eat that thing? Yes, there is more to hunting than the antlers, we should make use of the animal when it is fit for consumption.
 
I read the negative posts with regards to "big money" getting more oportunity to hunt than everybody else. I would pose this question to those of you who think that big money shouldn't get more opportunity. Do you apply in other states or can you just scrape the bottom of the barrel to buy your resident hunting license every year? Do you shoot a Ruger or Savage with a Bushnell scope or do you shoot a custom rifle with a Schmidt & Bender. It doesn't matter how you look at it, more money = more opportunity. That's life not just hunting. It's always been that way and will always be that way. That's why we work hard in our professions to get raises, because again, more money = more opportunity.



It's always an adventure!!!
 
I have to disagree with you, it hasn't always been big money to draw a public land tag. This is something that has happened once the different fish and game departments realized what people would pay for these hunts. As I said before its the trickle down effect and it's getting worst all the time.If you don't beleive me look at the increase in the cost of Utah tags in the past few years.Everyone should have the same opportunity to draw public land tags.
 
Everyone DOES have the same opportunity to DRAW public land tags already/still. The increase in the cost is because of increased cost to the DWR AND the demand fo rthese tags has gone up. Look how many people put in for these tags today compared to 10 years ago.

Like it or not, money DOES make the world go round. What is the point in having money if it gains you no advantages? We all strive to make more so we can have more, this is not bad nor wrong.
 
Just how much do people pay for these tags and how much do they pay this Doyle Moss guy to guide them?
 
in2chukar - last year the price range for all the auction tags ranged from around $7000 - $130,00 for elk and $4000 - $156,000 for mule deer however, a janitor from Utah drew the same mule deer tag that another guy paid $156,000 for. The opportunity is there. Are the odds great? Hell no but the odds of making a million aren't great either but it's out there.

It's always an adventure!!!
 
>If indeed you did talk
>to someone who was there
>then the story was not
>relayed correctly. I assume it
>was Caleb you talked to,
>you good people being from
>the Basin and all.

Roy and I know people from all over this state. Don't assume it's a Basin guy. You call Caleb and he's probably not going to know what you're talking about.

>In this case find the
>biggest damn elk the state
>has ever seen.(Not an easy
>task)Credit due to the person
>who found it and kept
>track of this bull until
>opening morning of the hunt.

Absolutely. Great job. And Mossback is good at what they do. No denying that. They are good at their jobs. I do respect that, so does HadenShedHead.

All involved
>were there to help with
>the hunt. A few
>more (6 total judging from
>the pic) were there for
>added insurance or maybe just
>because they wanted to see
>the bull on the hoof
>and put their hands on
>those amazing antlers.

Obviously.

> Outfitters are business men. For
>some its their livelihood others
>more of a part time
>deal. You can't blame someone
>for wanting to further and
>expand their business, i.e taking
>huge bulls and having a
>wealthy client base. I think
>everyone would agree that it
>is hard to run a
>business without advertising. I would
>say the best way to
>advertise in this business would
>be through quality work. i.e.
>taking the biggest bucks and
>bulls around. Something that Doyle
>has become very good at,
>through hard work on his
>part and those who help
>him.

I can't disagree at all with that. Not that I would. Like I said before, Mossback is good at what they do. Nothing wrong with that and I have the utmost respect for them, I really do.
 
we_Be_huntin

I didn't say that it has always been big money to draw a LE tag. I remember putting in for a LE tag when it was $130. At that time in my life that was a lot of money for my situation. I honestly put in not knowing how I would pay for it if I drew it. I know people today that stretch just to pay for their resident hunting license. My point is, it's not really fair for those of us who can't afford to buy an auction tag, but can afford to hunt out of state, to bad mouth those that can. I am sure there are people that can't afford to hunt out of state that say the same things about us. No matter how you look at it, money buys better tags, better equipment, and more opportunity, whether it be paying a landowner some cash to hunt his property or paying for some information on a good hunting area. Think about it.


It's always an adventure!!!
 
we_Be_huntin

.........and one of these days, maybe you can draw ANOTHER LE tag and kill ANOTHER 400 bull all by yourself..........now I am jealous.

JB
 
>>>>>"I never said that Mossback didn't put in the hours or the research or that they don't every year. They certainly do and they film it and sell it so that they can do it again next year. Sorry - but to me that isn't what hunting is about."<<<<<

Roy, And this is why you wont be filming your hunts and selling it to others. (because its not what hunting is about to YOU) everyone has a diferent veiw of what hunting is all about who are you to push your views onto everyone else.

>>>>"I just think there is something wrong with a system that bids its wildlife resources out to the highest killer who can pay for a guide service to locate the best animal, notify them, fly them in, take them to the animal, kill it, and then fly out the next day. I've got no problem with someone drawing a tag, scouting the area with a guide and hunting hard for a good bull. But more than 10 guides - give me a break. You can't tell me that the average joe from Utah has the same opportunity as this hunter did." <<<<

Ether way you look at it whether it was a 300 bull or a 450 inch monster there was an elk killed, wether it was a guy on a DIY hunt or a guided hunt with 10 guides there was still an elk killed. And yes I will tell you that the average Joe had the same oppertunity as Ron did they just had to pay the money to hire Doyle, did they have the money probly not I guess they should work harder and make more. All in all everyone in this country has the oppertunity to make alot of money and hire Doyle and kill a pig bull of a thousand life times every year. So in a way you could say that every one has the same oppertunity as everyone else.

>>>>"This is not a jealousy thing at all. Hate to break the news to ya, but I could buy a big dollar tag every year if I chose to, but I think everyone should have equal opportunity at every tag."<<<<

Bowhunt,
Like it or not but everyone dose have an equal opportunity at every tag,(as I stated above) those big money tags are not just given to the guy because he is rich he has to bid on them with every other person that knows about it and wants a chance at it. And going with your logic what about the guys that dont have the money to buy even a limited entry draw tag (lets face it there not cheap)should we start giveing away all the tags and not make anyone pay for them, that is the only true way you can give EVERYONE equal opportunity. But thats not going to happen.


So I say Congratulations to Ron, Doyle, Doyles crew, the BLM, UDWR, Forrest Service, SFW, RMEF, MDF, and everyone who contributes to these organsations, and anyone else that I missed. That is a huge bull and we should be proud.

And most of all I want to congratulat UTAH, we kicked Arizona's ASS on big bulls this year.;-);-);-) just kidding guys (sort of)



MM Member since 1999. Jake H
 
Hey JB
Good to hear from you. I hope you're right about drawing another tag but I doubt it.Do you think if we throw our money together we could buy one. I got cans I can sell.
 
Brandon,
You are exactly right. It was killed with a landowner tag. In fact, they thought this bull had disappeared at one point.


It's always an adventure!!!
 
Awholeotta,

I do not think people should bash the guy either, that is not my intent.
I just simply think it is wrong to carve off so many of our tags and have them auctioned to the highest bidder.
Makes me concerned for the future.
Really does not impact me, I could buy one if I wanted, but I worry about the direction it is headed.
10% of our tags today, 15% later, maybe it will take 30% of them to really provide quality hunting...that is what worries me.
Like I have said over and over: Great Bull, cool those guys found it, good for Doyle, etc.
I just do not agree with the amount of tags that are sold this way.
 
"I just simply think it is wrong to carve off so many of our tags and have them auctioned to the highest bidder."

This was NOT an auction tag. Those are sold at banquets (SFW ect). This was a land owner tag.

"I just do not agree with the amount of tags that are sold this way."

Land owner tags?
buck1.gif


Later, Brandon
 
CANT WE JUST ALL GET ALONG ? I still cant beleive how perty this bull is ,The last typical 6x6 taken in the 420 range was a navada bull,Its not very often any of us get to see one of that caliber,Once again ,All I can say is congrats to the whole group involved.
 
Then why did you push to lower age objectives two years ago, then after getting all your expo tags, push to get them up again?

Something doesn't smell right.
 
>I removed my post because apparently
>it was misunderstood by some
>people in the Moss camp.
>I stand by my thoughts
>Wayne as they are very
>neutral.

I thought your post was quite neutral, ktc. Not offensive and had good points.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter how it was killed does it? The hunter still goes home w/an awesome bull and the rest of us plan our dream hunts...some with Team Mossback...some without. To each his own.
 

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