gutless quartering

[campb]

Thanks everyone for your recommendations on my post a while ago for first time elk hunter on hauling out an elk. Just wanted to pass along some update information I ran across that people may want to know. I was talking to a DWR enforcement officer this past week about his recommendations on getitng an elk out and asked him about gutless quartering method. His responce was that if caught using this method a person would likely get a ticket and possible prosecution for wanton waste on wildlife (speaking mostly about leaving behind the ribs). But he also said that that was his opinion and other enforcement officers may differ, but he has seen it happen with deer. Thoughts on this?

 

[RU1234]

If you take the meat on the outside of the ribs, the neck meat and the tenderloins there isn't any waste. Take picutres when you're done to protect yourself, but there's no way you're wasting meat if you take all that. I do all my animals the gutless way.

 

[Outdoordan]

That is truly unfortunate that he feels that way. The speed at which one can get the animal quartered and taken out using gutless method (thus less meat spoilage) should mitigate the loss of rib meat. IMO I have taken the ribs out in the past and personally feel it isn't worth the back strain. Too little meat, too much fat for my taste(fat and blood cause gamey taste).

 

[campb]

He said they prosecuted on the deer incidents by bringing in a butcher who provided expert witness testimony as to how much meat should be brought in on the "average sized" deer. What was butchered was lower enough than this "average" so the jury said it was too much waste. On an elk, I was told leaving behind the rib meat would likely tip the scales enough.

 

[BIGOLMULEY]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-10-07 AT 04:44PM (MST)[p]I have used this method for years and have never had a problem witht the fish and game. I have been checked 3 times. Once I got all the quarters off and then boned them out. Was checked and the officer weighed my meat and told me I brought out more than most do. (this was a deer) I hardly ever take neck meat and never ribs when I am in a ways. If I am not a million miles from the road I take all I can. Can't really say what the law is though, I guess I had better look it up.

Jason "The Big Ol' Muley"

 

[Flatlandr]

campb,

What state are you referring to?

Mark

 

[campb]

Utah.

 

[REDDOG]

I guess i don't understand, the meat between the rib bones don't weigh enugh to make a judgment, i can see if you didn't take off the thick layer over the ribs, honestly how many take the meat between the rib's, even when ground into burger it has to much fat and silver skin, and that don't tast very good.

 

[rumproast]

I wouldn't think his opinion means squat. Sounds like an attitude problem to me.
Rules for what meat has to be taken are in the Wyo. Regs., aren't they in Utah's regulations?
Still a shame to see a kill site where someone's left a pile of edibles 'cause of whatever excuse seems to fit them.
Half of my burger or sausage comes from those trimmings!!

 

[Huffmad]

my deer I always just half them that way I never have to worry about not bring out enough meat. But I use horses so I don't worry about packing it out on my back. Elk on the other hand they all get quartered.

 

[archerman]

Let me ask you all something. I read about this technique in a couple of books. Do you cut through the skin with your knife to quarter it out? If so, doesn't that taint the meat? I know the rutting Bull elk and rutting deer stink to high heaven with their scents! If you don't cut through the skin, how do you perform this task. I am very interested in this method cause I will most likely be packin the meat out myself. I tried getting answers from the authors, but no such luck. The articles described where to make the cuts, so I'm ok with that, they just didn't say HOW to make the cuts. They also said to skin out the meat after cutting the meat free from the carcass. Please help!
Archerman - Archery hunting addict!

 

[slider]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-11-07 AT 06:28PM (MST)[p]I sent you an E-Mail Archerman!!! Good Luck

 

[archerman]

Thanks slider, got it. Helps a ton. Basically your field skinning before quartering. What messed me up in the articles was the author instructing to skin the quarters after they are removed!
Thanks again for the help!
Archerman - Archery hunting addict!

 

[txhunter58]

In Colorado, you are not required to bring out the ribs. As stated, you can get a lot of hamburger from neck and meat over the ribs on a fat animal, but I never cut out the meat between ribs, and at least in Colorado, you are not required to.

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

 

[5point]

if you are packing the meat out on your back then i would recommend leaving the hair on the quarters till you get it back to the truck. this helps keeping the meat clean everytime you set it dowm for that aching back. you don't cut the hide into the meat. work the knife in between hide and skin where you want to cut it to take off the quarters.

 

[lone_hunter]

It does not surprise me that the UDWR may feel that way. I have quartered or boned out most of my deer for several years using the gutless method. I would challenge anyone that, if handled properly, using this method saves a whole lot more meat than getting guts all over the animal, dragging it through dust and dirt, and take it for a 300 mile ride on top of your ATV in the sun. Then take to a butcher where they run it through a meat saw and toss 2/3 of it in the grinder.

I had one experience where my shot from my muzzleloader was a bit too angled and back. Even though he went down immediately, it was obvious that I got significant gut. I carfully removed the quarters and backstraps and everything else I could, from one side before rolling him to the other. I had no meat contaminition. I guarantee if I had gutted this animal I would have wasted a lot of the meat.

Also, I have always felt better feeding the coyotes, Hawks and magpies the leftovers rather than having it tossed into a barrel for cat food.

 

[dleonard3]

Someone told me that when you're done and ready to leave the kill site, just take your knife and slice the meat between each of the ribs on both sides. This thin meat between the ribs will dry and wither away to nearly nothing withing a few hours. To the casual observer, it will look like you did an excellent job of getting every scrap of un-usable meat.

 

[canhunter]

Montana also specifies what needs to be taken, and the gutless method leaving the ribs and even neck meat is legal. I take everything but the rib meat and small incidental pieces. The only problem is the neck and other chunks need to be processed fast or they dry out and are wasted anyway. We have horses to pack everything out so bones is not the major issue for us. I just don't want to pay the butcher for bones.

 

[KNOPHISH]

I haven't tried this yet but only a matter of time. Last year I just cut my buck in half cuz the drag was straight up. But when you do this how do you get the tenderloins? Maybe cut the gut open when your done.

 

[elk_horn]

When you use the gutless method you have to skin down to get the loins ... so if you skin down a little farther down the ribs then you can reach in under the last rib and reach up and cut out the tenderloins

 

[Kentuck]

I would like more info on the gutless method.
On the elk I killed in Idaho last year, I jsut skinned the side that was up, cut the quarters and backstrap; gutted it; then rolled it over, finished skinning and finished cutting the other side. We took what neck meat we could and also the meat between the ribs. We had game bags with us to place the cuts in to help protect them.

Kentuck

 

[BUGLELK]

Kentuck,

You did it right, up to the point where you gutted it. I don't think there was any need to gut it at that point. You just skin the side that is up, cut off the front and hind quarter and the bigger pieces of rib meat that you can get, cut out the back strap and the neck meat, flip it over and do the same on the other side. We try to pull the hide back over the quartered side before flipping the elk to keep the dirt, etc off it...this will help when you go back to get the tenderloins after you finish up the 2nd side. To do this, just make a small incision behind the last rib, cutting down towards the hib bone. Reach in and cut out the tenderloin, flip the elk again, and do the same thing to get the other tenderloin.

Corey

 

[cohntr6]

I was taught by a well known CO hunter and it was videotaped by CDOW using this method.
I find it hardly wanton waste.
Jeff

 

[slamdunk]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-13-07 AT 06:37PM (MST)[p]Here's my two cents, for what it's worth to anyone.
I have worked for one of the biggest, most reputabale outfitter in the western united states for 12 years now. We take over 40 bulls a year from various areas throughout Utah and have used the gutless quarting on elk and deer for 25 years with no problems whatsoever, and we are closely watched and observed by UF&G. They come into our camps and check our meat all the time. All that is left when we talk care of an animal are the ribs. You can even get the inside tenderloins by cutting under the spine and pushing down on the entrails.
So for what that's worth.......Happy gutting if you choose to do so!

 

[zekers]

Alaska is VERY strict about wanton waste. The Alaska fish and game puts out a very detailed video on the gutless method on moose. It's worth the 20 bucks to see it done right. The dwr officer would do well to buy it also.

 

[spikeBull]

It is truely up to the Division/Officer, but this is where they get their authority...

Utah Criminal and Traffic Code Book (For all Utah Peace Officers). Also in the Big Game Proclamation (page 15).

Title 23 Chapter 20 Section 8 (23-20-8) Waste Of Wildlife.

It reads:
A person may not waste or permit to be wasted or spoiled any protected wildlife or any part of them.

Now I beleive this Officer you spoke with was telling you the law (His job), but I know they have a lot of discretion and I hope this is where they would use it! And I agree, take pictures when you're done. If you think/feel you're wasting or not wasting the animal take a picture. A picture could prove innocents!

 

[1elkarcher]

Has any hunter in Utah ever been convicted of wanton waste? (I'm not talking about poachers). We bone out all of our animals and have stopped at all the checking staions on the way home. Not once have we ever been asked to produce the meat. Also what would they have to compare the weight ratio to. Last year my dad and I took two 5-6 year old dear out of Current Creek. My deer weighed alot less then his. I'm just curious.

 

[elk_horn]

I have two nephews that were convicted of wonton waste because they didn take the meat of the upper part of the leg where its full of tendons and sinew.

 

[gil_wy]

In WY, it states you need to take the meat from each limb above the hock and the meat along the spine, not including neck meat....that's all that is required by law....