Field Judging Elk:

joesikora · Jul 21, 2008

What are some good rules of thumb for judging elk in the field? I'm hunting the Sargents and was told several times to make sure I don't shoot a small bull thinking he's bigger. Basically hold out for a 300"class to maybe a 320" or even a 340"class. I know width is important and length of main beams, but are there ways of judging lengths, and widths, etc? I've seen on a Brown Bear web site, they say to count the number on head lengths in order to give you some idea of size. Is there some way like that to judge for elk? I'm hunting with a guide but want to know for myself.He told me alot of guys kill-out the first morning or day, but usually end up with less than a 300" class bull, alot of 260's, etc. I don't want to waste a great tag like this.

Thanks Again for all your help.

Joe E Sikora

leftturnabq · Jul 21, 2008

That's a tough one, but judging whether or not a bull is over 300" shouldn't be too hard.

For myself, the first thing I look for is total points. As a quick reference, I look for a fork behind the sword to know it's got 6 per side...typical. To someone new to elk hunting, a 5x5 can look big, but will not typically score too great simply because there is not enough antler.

Second, I look for the tine length.
-How deep is that fork behind the sword? Just because he's got 6 doesn't mean he's a big 6.
-Do his thirds look short, or do they look as long as the browtines?
-How long are his browtines...do they seem to hook up and back from his nose?

Lastly, I then look at the beam length and the spread. From what I can tell, if he seems to have a huge fork after that sword, he'll have good beam length. A wide spread will help with that too.

I really don't have much more to offer than try to take the time to get a good look. I've never killed what I would consider a huge bull, but have seen them. My hunting buddy arrowed a 350", but we've definitely seen bigger. There always seems to be some ground shrinkage. I'm still after the bull that seems to grow as I approach it...that will be my wall-hanger.

apollosmith · Jul 21, 2008

I also have been worrying about this and have learned a lot about field judging elk in the last few months as I prepare for my limited entry hunt. A few things I've found -

- If it's a wallhanger, you usually know it right away.
- If you count 7 points, shoot.
- Where things get difficult is distinguishing between a 330 and a 360 bull. All of the advice above is relevant. Look for long 5th and 6th points and make sure all points are long. If the 3rds (for example) are shorter, the length should be made up some where else (really long 4ths, for example).
- Beside length, be sure to account for mass (most often overlooked) and width.
- A 5 pointer can easily be 350+, but it must be solid all around.

Overall, just look at LOTS of elk. Check mossback.com or kingsoutdoorworld.com or other places where the photo galleries list the elk sizes. But remember, elk look different in real life, so compare what you see in pics to real life.

And the final score isn't everything. Foremost, have fun and make memories!

apollosmith · Jul 21, 2008

I remember seeing an online 'game' a few years ago where it would show you a photo of an elk, you could guess the score of the elk, and it would tell you how close you were... or something like that. Anything like that still around?

If not, would there be interest in something like this if I built one??? It would be kinda like the "Hot or Not" website, but it would show photos of bulls, you would guess the score, then it would show your guess in relation to the average of everyone else's estimates. Users could upload their own photos to add to the pool.

Good idea or no?

chipc · Jul 21, 2008

Congrats on a good tag. If your guide is worth paying he should be able to give you an approx. score pretty quickly. If you are looking for a 300'' bull just tell him '' tell me if its over 300''. thats one of the things you're paying him for. Also on this site there is a photo gallery section. Many of the Elk pictured have their scores listed. Some of them are even accurate :>) That should help too. Eastman's has a rack bracketing system that may be on their website. It shows the difference between the different categories of bulls - nice, big, monster, and holy s**t. GOOD LUCK. C.C.

Cam@strawberry · Jul 21, 2008

you want to judge a bull just look at the frame there is no mistaking a small framed bull with a large one you just know other than that. make sure every tine is 15+ inches the beams are 45+ and width needs to be 35+ add in a basic 50 to 60 inches of mass and you got a bull thats 320-330

Wildlife population control specialist

KB2 · Jul 21, 2008

Great idea on the internet field judging sight. Got my vote.

apollosmith · Jul 21, 2008

This document - http://www.eastmans.com/MRS/MRS2007_Sept-Oct.pdf - has a good overview of the bracketing system and some good details on field judging.

joesikora · Jul 21, 2008

Thanks guys for all the help. Apollo thanks for the link, also very helpful.

Joe E Sikora

d13r · Jul 21, 2008

here's another good one....

https://www.boone-crockett.org/community/pdf/FC_2002winter_fieldjudging.pdf

JB

joesikora · Jul 21, 2008

Thanks d13r.

Joe E Sikora

need4x4 · Jul 21, 2008

I would say to set a goal and tell the guide to help you. Learn all you can, but trust the guide.

I killed a bull in 2004, unguided. Because I had looked at pictures and tv shows, I was a little surprised at the total of 298 (he is a six x six).

Basicly, I had decided I would take a 6x6 or better over the first three days and then would settle for a 5x5.

The third is week and it is overall not very thick (lacks mass). Other than that, it proves that what those folks on the hunting shows claim is a 300 class bull is mostly bull something else.

You need to see a few bulls up close to get to the point you can relax enough to judge, that is why I am saying defer to the guide after letting him know what you want.

If you see something of a nice tail (the fork behind the sword) as mentioned above and it seems thick, it probably is a nice bull.

Your going to have a ton of fun...

Get back to us with a story.

scoutdog5 · Jul 21, 2008

Here is my system, but you have to follow it exactly:

1. Go hunting

2. See a bull

3. Holy (**&&*()))), that guys is huge!!!!!!!

4. shoot him.

5. Celebrate

Seriously, I would look at all the pictures i could find, look at some videos, go to Sportsman, etc. and decide what you like. Even 6 x 6, wide rack, ectra points, or whatever. Then tell the guide what you are looking for, and don't worry about the score. I have seen some bull pictures on here that I thought were really ugly, but they scored great, and then some absolutely beeyoutiful bulls that scored crap, but I would have shot those in a second over the ugly ones.

I think we get too caught up in the score sometimes, when we draw these great tags. Enjoy the experience.

Scoutdog

PleaseDear · Jul 21, 2008

Joe, keep in mind that on a true 6x6 there are only 21 scoreables....

So as simple as 1 inch per scoreable can make the difference in a 330 vs 350 score....

I have always felt an iffy bull that had average 3rds & 5ths vs an iffy bull with good 3rds and 5ths.....was the taker on better 3rds and 5ths.

To many times it has been 'wow look at the sword and whale tail on him'....but average 3rds and 5ths kept the score low...after the harvest.

Enjoy your hunt Joe!

Robb

leftturnabq · Jul 22, 2008

These guys are right...don't get so caught up in the score that it takes the fun out of the hunt.

Pictures can be very decieving. The right picture can make a bull look 50" inches bigger.

The best bet is to get a look at antlers in person, and where the score is known. A taxidermy shop is a great place to start.

fuzzyvelvet · Jul 22, 2008

This is what I heard once; start with a base score of 200, then estimate the length of the brow tines comparing them to the length of the nose (from antler base to nose, I say about 16 inches). Add up all the tines on one side and double it. Add that to the 200 base and that will give you a pretty good estimate. Now, if he is wider/narrower or has a longer/shorter main beams than average, just add/subtract 10 or so points. I have used this and it works pretty close most often within 10 points or so.

Fuzzy.

Avsman · Jul 22, 2008

Pleasedear, Has perty much my same phlosophy, 3rds and 5ths but also mass for me, alot of missed inches in mass, and I like heavy horns, I havent seen too many young bulls with heavy horns and I havent seen too many old bulls with thin horns, Just my .02

elk777 · Jul 23, 2008

Hey Joe did you get anyone to film your hunt yet? I went out to the Sargents to do some hiking and I saw a few potential 300-320 class bulls. They still have about two to three weeks to grow before they start peeling off their velvet. I saw one bull that might go 350 if he continues to grow. Contact me if you still need some one to film your hunt. This would be a professional authored DVD with you hunt on it. Please fill free to request some of my work.

Ricardo Valdez
Sierra Vista Outdoor Productions
(575)770-8629