Mule Deer, Elk and Western Big Game Hunting - MonsterMuleys.com

Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)

 
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Founder
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May-15-16, 
12:42 PM (MST)
"Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Do you launch an arrow or not?
It's the heat of the rut, you're sitting in your stand when this bad boy walks in. You've got 17 seconds to decide to launch an arrow or not. What do you do?
(turn your volume on to hear the screaming)

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
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  Table of Contents  

 Subject   Author   Message Date   ID 
 RE: Do you lau...  kybuck1      May-15-16   1 
 RE: Do you lau...  Buccsboy55      May-15-16   2 
 RE: Do you lau...  Soj51hopefu...      May-15-16   3 
 RE: Do you lau...  Hokkaido      May-16-16   4 
  RE: Do you lau...  Wailing4Wap...      May-16-16   10 
   RE: Do you lau...  Hokkaido      May-18-16   19 
 RE: Do you lau...  wstrntines      May-16-16   5 
  RE: Do you lau...  ElkStirrinT...      Jun-06-16   35 
 RE: Do you lau...  Robiland      May-16-16   6 
  RE: Do you lau...  Founder      May-16-16   7 
   RE: Do you lau...  Hondoarcher      May-16-16   8 
    RE: Do you lau...  berrysblast...      May-16-16   9 
     RE: Do you lau...  littlebigho...      May-16-16   11 
      RE: Do you lau...  Elkduds      May-16-16   12 
       RE: Do you lau...  Wailing4Wap...      May-16-16   13 
 RE: Do you lau...  IdahoBugler      May-17-16   14 
  RE: Do you lau...  sticksender      May-17-16   15 
 RE: Do you lau...  MuleyCreek      May-17-16   16 
  RE: Do you lau...  browtine      May-17-16   17 
   RE: Do you lau...  MuleyCreek      May-18-16   20 
   RE: Do you lau...  berrysblast...      May-18-16   25 
 RE: Do you lau...  Sherlock      May-17-16   18 
  RE: Do you lau...  Jagerdad      May-18-16   21 
   RE: Do you lau...  SDBugler      May-18-16   22 
    RE: Do you lau...  k22hornet      May-18-16   23 
   RE: Do you lau...  Sherlock      May-18-16   24 
    RE: Do you lau...  Wailing4Wap...      May-19-16   26 
     RE: Do you lau...  Jagerdad      May-20-16   27 
      RE: Do you lau...  sludge      May-20-16   28 
       RE: Do you lau...  tooele      May-21-16   29 
   RE: Do you lau...  Idaho75      Jul-04-16   37 
 RE: Do you lau...  trophyhunter      Jun-05-16   30 
  RE: Do you lau...  BUGLEnmIN      Jun-05-16   31 
   RE: Do you lau...  Vanilla      Jun-05-16   32 
 RE: Do you lau...  jakechr811      Jun-05-16   33 
  RE: Do you lau...  Gator      Jun-06-16   34 
   RE: Do you lau...  elkliver      Jun-19-16   36 
    RE: Do you lau...  Wailing4Wap...      Jul-05-16   38 

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kybuck1
(55 posts)
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May-15-16, 
12:59 PM (MST)
1. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Well, I think it really varies on where you are hunting and what day of the hunt you are on for me. Personally, on my upcoming hunts I would not unless it's the last day. Unless I am way off it appears to be around a 290 inch bull which is no slouch, but not what I would be looking for early.

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Buccsboy55
(367 posts)
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May-15-16, 
02:37 PM (MST)
2. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Launch it wouldn't take 17 sec hahaha

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Soj51hopefull
(601 posts)
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May-15-16, 
02:51 PM (MST)
3. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Can't make the video play, do you need a face page to make it work? Don't have one of those.

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Hokkaido
(104 posts)
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May-16-16, 
01:24 AM (MST)
4. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

It would be a bit tricky for sure. But with another bull going like that in the distance I would be waiting for a higher percentage shot. That being said, I think this heart shot would be lethal with my elk setup, Hoyt element, 70lbs, 30in draw, 340axis, 125 muzzies. Would go right through the shoulder muscle and those shorter ribs in front, and if not exit, would rest on the ribs on other side, after slicing right through the heart.

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Wailing4Wapiti
(142 posts)
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May-16-16, 
01:26 PM (MST)
10. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Hokkaido,

I would suggest you move your aiming point to right. You are right up against that shoulder bone. If you hit exactly where you aim, yes, it will be a quick kill. However, if you move to the right and go straight up the front leg, you have a larger margin of error and most animals shot there will fall within sight or at least a very short tracking job.

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Hokkaido
(104 posts)
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May-18-16, 
03:36 AM (MST)
19. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

>Hokkaido,
>
>I would suggest you move your
>aiming point to right.
>You are right up against
>that shoulder bone. If
>you hit exactly where you
>aim, yes, it will be
>a quick kill. However,
>if you move to the
>right and go straight up
>the front leg, you have
>a larger margin of error
>and most animals shot there
>will fall within sight or
>at least a very short
>tracking job.

It's good to hear your insight. But I still think this is a shot worth taking. Right on that red dot is going to miss all the bone in the shoulder, cut the ribs, and zip right in the heart. With the bull turned like that it makes it even more enticing as the muscle is stretched and thinned out. The offside leg makes it clear. I have shot a sika further right and a little higher and like you mentioned and wow.. that didn't go well at all. He went like stink downhill, never saw me nor had a clue. The arrow hit and stuck in the offside legbone, I could tell by the massive smack sound it made. Had good blood for a bit, then once the arrow worked itself out there was no more. It took some time but I was able to get onto him again and do it right. I watched him for over an hour as he hung out with a group of other deer. It was interesting seeing how little energy he had although always standing upright. Glad I finally got him. After the arrow came out there wasn't a drop more of blood.

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wstrntines
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May-16-16, 
06:57 AM (MST)
5. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

If it was a general tag id shoot that bull any day of the week.
If it was LE and it was the end of the hunt id probably take him as well. He's a sweet bull i love his swords. Thanks for sharing Brian.

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ElkStirrinTheHoney
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Jun-06-16, 
07:33 PM (MST)
35. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

>If it was a general tag
>id shoot that bull any
>day of the week.
>If it was LE and it
>was the end of the
>hunt id probably take him
>as well. He's a sweet
>bull i love his swords.
>Thanks for sharing Brian.


Exactly

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Robiland
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May-16-16, 
07:55 AM (MST)
6. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I think I would shoot no matter what. I have had 2 manti archery tags and 2 tag soups. The 1st tag I passed bulls like this all hunt long (DUMB I KNOW). So the 2nd tag (expo tag 2 years later) I said Id shoot any 6 point bull that gave me a chance. Never happened. So shoot now, unless you have LOTS AND LOTS of elk on the wall this size.

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Founder
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May-16-16, 
08:41 AM (MST)
7. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Thanks to my buddy, Brandon, for sharing the elk video. He's the elk man for sure.
Passing this bull during an archery is asking for tag soup, IMO. But if a dude is cool with that, then awesome. How often does one get multiple great opportunities during archery season???
I'd shoot.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
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Hondoarcher
(162 posts)
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May-16-16, 
08:58 AM (MST)
8. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I wouldn't take that shot. It will turn out bad for and for the bull. He is drinking and will turn to leave and that is when I would take the shot. Be ready and shoot quick when he quarters away to leave. I am sure this is trail camera footage so he isn't spooky at all. Often times things are different when their is a human around. They have a sixth sense when you get close to those big guys. They just know you are their unless you are wearing a Hecs suit. I know it is hard to pass but bad shots turn into tag soup too and the bull looses too.

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berrysblaster
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May-16-16, 
10:18 AM (MST)
9. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

A triple brow, and those cool forking 5ths?? That bull gets hammered on nearly any elk unit in the world with a bow, personally this bull isn't about inches, I'm a sucker for mass and triple brow tines so shoot away!

https://www.facebook.com/strawberrybayoutfitters

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littlebighorn
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May-16-16, 
02:28 PM (MST)
11. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

+1 to berry
He's a mature bull and one would be very hard pressed to find one better. Lots of archers dine on tag soup. I guess if you like the taste over elk steaks, then pass.

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Elkduds
(466 posts)
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May-16-16, 
04:04 PM (MST)
12. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Not shooting an arrow until I get a broadside.

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Wailing4Wapiti
(142 posts)
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May-16-16, 
07:25 PM (MST)
13. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Learn the bone structure of an elk well. At close range, (inside 30 yards) that is a slam dunk shot. The vital area is wide open. Granted, it isn't the largest opening, but its plenty big to slip an arrow through if you are a decent shot and know where to aim.

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IdahoBugler
(816 posts)
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May-17-16, 
10:12 AM (MST)
14. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I've seen that bull before. I had this bull at 60 yards broadside and decided to try and get closer. Unfortunately he decided the grass was greener just down the hill. Walked out of my life and yes I ate tag soup. If I could do it all over again he would he on my wall. He has unbelievable mass.

Good times.
IB

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sticksender
(485 posts)
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May-17-16, 
12:21 PM (MST)
15. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I assume this question is not about archery shot placement or body position of the bull, but rather you're merely asking "is this a shooter?".

The answer is arbitrary without knowing the hunt area. Even with the very poor back end, for me, he's easily a shooter on any Colorado OTC hunt. But I don't think he's anywhere close to being a shooter in any top unit in UT or AZ. So the answer depends totally on where I'm hunting.

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MuleyCreek
(56 posts)
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May-17-16, 
01:28 PM (MST)
16. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I believe he was bigger the year before. Like 370. But he was wounded and grew funny the year of the video. I would have definitely let and arrow fly! Especially with the history we have with him.

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browtine
(4876 posts)
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May-17-16, 
02:23 PM (MST)
17. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

LAST EDITED ON May-17-16 AT 02:24 PM (MST)

IdahoBugler, I sure wish you had that year over too

MuleyCreek, The year before this he was quite a bit smaller. The year after this video IMO was his best year (the year he was wounded). His sheds were over 370 and that mass was outta this world. His mass is probably one of best I personally have ever seen.

Berry, I love that you caught all of that from the video. It shows your passion and knowledge of these beasts! Well done!

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MuleyCreek
(56 posts)
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May-18-16, 
06:28 AM (MST)
20. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Browtine, gotcha. Do you have pics of him the year after he was wounded?

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berrysblaster
(1814 posts)
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May-18-16, 
07:59 PM (MST)
25. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Thanks brow that's high praise coming from a guy like you 😃. I'm really kind of infatuated with this bull, I've only watched the video once, I only have one device that will play it, but the pics of him are so cool!

https://www.facebook.com/strawberrybayoutfitters

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Sherlock
(147 posts)
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May-17-16, 
03:44 PM (MST)
18. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Nope.

Would have to wait to see if it presented a better shot. At no time during the video was an ethical shot presented. Could it be done...maybe.

Just not worth the risk to the animal. Usually a little patience and a good angle would present itself. If not, oh well...go find another one.

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Jagerdad
(779 posts)
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May-18-16, 
12:03 PM (MST)
21. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I have a question but First, allow me to say (Politely) that I have never killed an Elk. I understand Zero.

However, in Rifle Hunting I have downed unknown numbers of Deer, 98+ %, All Neck Shots. Although I understand Zero about Elk, my question is why have I not seen comments about a neck Shot on this Bull...?

Is it because so many learn to only try for broadsided positions hence, no one (or few) use Neck Shots in Practice or Afield..?

I understand asking such a question opens me for attacks and such but I honestly wish to know and, although I post in Campfire and not here, just be a tiny bit understanding. I "Have" been this close to a Bull while Mule Deer Hunting in Nevada. I watched him walk towards me as I stood in a Juniper. He may have rubbed himself against the bush had I not said: "How Yah Doing" to him. At that point he was so close I could count his eyelashes. Butt was slightly puckered also...mine, not his

I run Ghostery on Google Chrome and saw no video, just open space where it may be. Ghostery blocked "5" Beacons, Widgets, Analytics that may be associated with Marketing/Tracking. So....I saw no Video, just the picture with a Red circle.

I'm here to learn....yet I'm old.

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SDBugler
(600 posts)
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May-18-16, 
04:55 PM (MST)
22. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Tough call on weather or not to shoot. I'm guessing he will score around 325. For me personally I have shot several bulls in the 300 - 330 range and my current goal is to shoot one 350 or better. I always say that I will never shoot a 350 if I shoot a 300, 315, or 330 bull. I did pass up a couple bulls of this size last fall during my archery hunt in Colorado unit 76. However putting score aside, this bull has some extra character which I like as much if not more than simply score, so I would likely take a shot unless I was in a premium LE unit.

However, I would wait for a better angle though. If I was in a tree stand like Founder indicated in the original post, then this bull came in on his own and is not "looking" for another cow or bull like an elk that is called in would be. He is relaxed and comfortable. I would wait for a full broadside (higher percentage) shot. Elk will usually hang around a waterhole for a while - not like an elk going down a trailor coming to a call. Even if he does start to walk off, he would easily be stopped by a cow call since he is not currently aware of any elk near him (except the other bull in the distance).

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k22hornet
(69 posts)
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May-18-16, 
05:19 PM (MST)
23. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I would not shoot.

I would wait until a more broadside shot presented itself. If one did not, oh well...

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Sherlock
(147 posts)
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May-18-16, 
05:33 PM (MST)
24. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

LAST EDITED ON May-18-16 AT 05:34 PM (MST)

Jagerdad,

At very close range with a bull that you believe will hold still at the shot, AND with knowledge and skill to hit the right spot on the neck...then, yeah, it can be done. My son got his 1st archery elk 2 years ago with a neck shot...but only because the elk jumped back at the 60 yard shot and he got lucky. Wasn't on purpose. But, the elk bled out very quickly with that artery severed.

Personally, I've never tried to shoot one in the neck before. I've had one shot opportunity that in hindsight I could have and should have taken the neck shot at 18 yards broadside while at full draw when it's other vitals were blocked by a tree. Elected to pass at the time, but I am confident I could have made that particular shot. The bull was cooperating.

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Wailing4Wapiti
(142 posts)
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May-19-16, 
08:32 AM (MST)
26. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

A broadside Neck shot with a bow is never a good shot. Way too much muscle to hope you get an artery.

Head on at the base of the neck or quartering to as in this picture, through the shoulder straight up the leg at close range is a very lethal shot for those with the knowledge, skill and nerves to do it. I have killed two bulls and two deer with almost that exact shot. My first deer kill was on a buck I had hit 3 hours earlier and when I jumped him again, he was slow, stiff and looking right at me while quartering towards me. He went about 10 yards and fell over. Another was on a bull my buddy had made a poor shot on the evening before. He went 24 yards after my shot. Yes, the opening is small, but at close range it is very doable. Go to the elk forum on Bowsite and do a search for "head on" or "shot placement" and you will see it has been thoroughly discussed there. Not everyone agrees, nor should everyone take the shot. However, I won't hesitate as I am 4 for 4 on that shot.

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Jagerdad
(779 posts)
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May-20-16, 
09:15 PM (MST)
27. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

http://forums.bowsite.com/tf/bgforums/thread.cfm?forum=5&threadid=452894&MESSAGES=92&FF=5#4209700

THANK YOU...!!!!

I learned a vast amount. Especially by looking at the "Night at the Museum" Elk.

Reading what Archers believe was also educational in a big way for me. Sadly I must say, I have been shooting a Bow since about 1965 and being serious in practice, then decades of Hunting Deer. From a Fred Bear #55 to a Jennings Compound (The 1st I saw on the Market) to my #100 High Country...but...never killed a Buck.

I shot at about 3-5 but they either jumped or were too far. Now disabled and old, I may never accomplish what you men have, so many times. My life long Hat is off with respect for all of you.

Jagerdad

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sludge
(76 posts)
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May-20-16, 
11:40 PM (MST)
28. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

The score isn't always everything. This bull has fantastic character and mass. Plus you can tell he has been the boss of the mountain at one time. Shooting this guy would be a heck of an accomplishment with a bow.

Shot wise, when he turns and looks away, at twenty yards and in, I'm taking that shot pretty much straight up the leg every time. He wouldn't go far.

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tooele
(748 posts)
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May-21-16, 
10:22 PM (MST)
29. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Arizona no
Utah no unless general.
Idaho yes
colorado yes
nevada no
new mexico yes

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Idaho75
(88 posts)
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Jul-04-16, 
10:28 PM (MST)
37. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I shot a 6x1 bull in N. Central Idaho two years ago that had an arrow stuck in the vertebrae. It was festered and had maggots in it. He was not feeling well. Archery had been over for 2+ weeks.

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trophyhunter
(1871 posts)
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Jun-05-16, 
08:29 PM (MST)
30. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I had a really nice 350 bull in that exact position and I did not take the shot...mine stepped over the creek and just kept going....still haunts me....but thats ethical archery....

))))------->

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BUGLEnmIN
(955 posts)
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Jun-05-16, 
08:52 PM (MST)
31. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I killed my bull last year in that same position, drove it between the shoulder and brisket into the heart , he went 50 yards .

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Vanilla
(886 posts)
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Jun-05-16, 
09:08 PM (MST)
32. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

That is a cool bull. Awesome front end and some cool character on the back side. Short main beams, but good mass.

I don't archery hunt, so it's tough for me to say. But I think that bull is a shooter on almost every unit in Utah with an archery tag.

It looks like a clean shot to me in the video. I'm not an archer, so maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see anything wrong with the shot.

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jakechr811
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Jun-05-16, 
09:46 PM (MST)
33. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

That bull would be going on the wall. Awesome mass and character that makes him a good story to tell!

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Gator
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Jun-06-16, 
08:29 AM (MST)
34. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

I would more then happy with that type of bull.
Shot placement is doable. IMO

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>Life member of
>the MM green signature club.


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elkliver
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Jun-19-16, 
11:22 PM (MST)
36. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

At 20 or 30 yards I would feel pretty comfortable with the shot indicated by the red dot. There are still a lot of vitals accessible. But can someone educate me? What's the other shot straight up the leg some guys are seeing. Won't you hit the shoulder bones there or skim off to the right through the brisket?

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Wailing4Wapiti
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Jul-05-16, 
00:49 AM (MST)
38. "RE: Do you launch an arrow or not? (video)"

Elkliver,

No, look at a picture of an elk skeleton then look back at the picture above. The leg bone comes up then makes a hard 75-80 degree turn forward and then connects to the shoulder blade where it angles up and back towards the rear again. If you look closely at the picture above, you can see the bone outline. You have quite a bit of room before the shoulder blade by moving the aiming point straight up the leg. That hit is one of the quickest ways to bring down any animal and the blood trail is usually quite substantial. Where Hokkaido has the red dot will most likely kill an elk but it also has the potential of only getting one lung and/or liver, and if you miss even slightly to the left it means a gut shot.

However, if you miss too far forward, you will either clip a major artery, hit the shoulder bone and get no penetration or give him a flesh wound. While none of us want either of those last two outcomes, most bulls will recover and go on to rut many more days from those misses. A gut miss, however, will always eventually be fatal but will often lead to an unrecovered animal and almost always a slow and gruesome death. I choose to err on the side of aiming too far forward for those reasons.

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