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What help would you take?

 
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Founder
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Mar-31-17, 
01:29 PM (MST)
"What help would you take?"

Question of the Day/Week - What help would you be willing to accept if you held one of the best elk tags in the country?

Let's say you drew a unit 61 tag in Colorado or Boulder Mountain tag in Utah. What help would you want? Would you hire a guide? If a guide offered his services for free, would you accept? Would you only want a half dozen family and friends helping? Or just one close buddy? Or maybe just your wife or son? Or, do you go solo?


Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
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  Table of Contents  

 Subject   Author   Message Date   ID 
 RE: What help ...  FamilyMan      Mar-31-17   1 
  RE: What help ...  dz      Mar-31-17   2 
 RE: What help ...  oilcan      Mar-31-17   3 
  RE: What help ...  257Tony      Mar-31-17   4 
   RE: What help ...  berrysblast...      Mar-31-17   5 
    RE: What help ...  D6native      Mar-31-17   6 
 RE: What help ...  oilcan      Mar-31-17   7 
  RE: What help ...  fullthrottle      Mar-31-17   8 
  RE: What help ...  littlebigho...      Mar-31-17   9 
   RE: What help ...  Vanilla      Apr-01-17   10 
    RE: What help ...  PleaseDear      Apr-01-17   11 
     RE: What help ...  BeDawg      Apr-01-17   12 
      RE: What help ...  Vanilla      Apr-01-17   13 
       RE: What help ...  BeanMan      Apr-01-17   14 
        RE: What help ...  mmwb      Apr-01-17   15 
         RE: What help ...  Dikndirt      Apr-03-17   16 
          RE: What help ...  sambo3006      Apr-03-17   17 
           RE: What help ...  inarcher      Apr-04-17   18 
            RE: What help ...  Elkduds      Apr-04-17   19 
             RE: What help ...  wstrntines      Apr-04-17   20 
              RE: What help ...  schoolhouse...      Apr-04-17   21 
               RE: What help ...  Gator      Apr-04-17   22 
                RE: What help ...  elkantlers      Apr-04-17   23 
                 RE: What help ...  2lumpy      Apr-04-17   24 
                  RE: What help ...  Deerlove      Apr-05-17   25 
 RE: What help ...  elknut300      Apr-05-17   26 
  RE: What help ...  mntman      Apr-06-17   27 
   RE: What help ...  osu92      Apr-06-17   28 
    RE: What help ...  bucksmut      Apr-07-17   29 
     RE: What help ...  tvbrewster      Apr-07-17   30 
      RE: What help ...  hank4elk      Apr-12-17   31 

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FamilyMan
(1455 posts)
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Mar-31-17, 
02:03 PM (MST)
1. "RE: What help would you take?"

I would want the assistance of a guide if I had a tag such as that. I wouldn't want to waste the opportunity trying to prove that I can do it my self - have already taken DIY elk so nothing there to prove. As an added benefit, could count on the guide to do most of the heavy lifting when it comes time to pack out the trophy.

Just my opinion.

Mark

My hunting spot is so secret, not even the elk have found it yet.

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dz
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Mar-31-17, 
02:36 PM (MST)
2. "RE: What help would you take?"

For me it is all about the experience of the hunt, and of course the meat. So no guide for me. The boys would be invited and maybe could make some of it. I shot a smaller bull last fall on a draw tag because my oldest son could be there and only for one day. Some of the best memories from that hunt was laying on our packs at midnight watching shooting stars (resting). I had three of my sons with me. I would take a smaller bull every day of the week over going guided.

DZ

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oilcan
(2713 posts)
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Mar-31-17, 
03:35 PM (MST)
3. "RE: What help would you take?"

That's a good question Brian. Having just turned 50 I look at Elk hunting little different than mule deer hunting. A lot of my hunts are solo so I have to make sure I can take care of the animals properly after harvesting. But having said that I seperate my elk hunts into 2 categories Hunts I may only draw once and has 350" potential ( go guided if possible ) and Hunts with 300-320" more likely ( DIY ).
Funny you mention Colorado Elk unit 61 I will draw a Archery tag next year there as of now I believe I will go solo.
I'm not big on coming on the site and asking for info on specific units but I will take as much info as I can get on that hunt when the time comes. There are a lot of people who have hunted it who I think could be a big help.

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257Tony
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Mar-31-17, 
05:34 PM (MST)
4. "RE: What help would you take?"

I'll take absolutely as much help as I can get, I want the best chance I can get to kill the biggest Bull on the mountain. For Elk I don't think I'd hire a guide, but would consider it for a OIL type hunt (Sheep, Goats).


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berrysblaster
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Mar-31-17, 
06:05 PM (MST)
5. "RE: What help would you take?"

It's sad that a guided hunt has become an idea that it is somehow easier, I push my hunters as hard as they or I can go. The hunt and respect for the animal demand that. There are very few 'shoots' in the guided hunt world. Most of them require just as much or even more effort then a person thought they could or would give.

https://www.facebook.com/strawberrybayoutfitters

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D6native
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Mar-31-17, 
06:50 PM (MST)
6. "RE: What help would you take?"

If I could afford it , I would go guided on a great tag .

I can't afford it, so I'll be going with friends and family

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oilcan
(2713 posts)
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Mar-31-17, 
07:03 PM (MST)
7. "RE: What help would you take?"

Nothing wrong with that D6
My dad and brothers gave up hunting years ago or I would be doing the same.

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fullthrottle
(481 posts)
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Mar-31-17, 
08:10 PM (MST)
8. "RE: What help would you take?"

No guide, never, not on the best tag in the world, in any unit. No problem with guys going guided, that's awesome and there is some great guides out there. Just not my thing. Friends, family, sure. A world record bull guided wouldn't mean near as much to me personally as a 350" type bull on my own.

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littlebighorn
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Mar-31-17, 
08:22 PM (MST)
9. "RE: What help would you take?"

Premium Elk tags in Utah are pretty much a once in a lifetime event, so I feel it would be foolish to not accept as much help as is available. I would certainly consider hiring a guide, especially since I know several that I trust and respect, but I would also want to have a hands on experience where I could still scout and search on my own. A guides help to me would be about assisting me in having the best experience possible. I would also welcome help from my son and good friends who might want to tag along. The fun of hunting for me has always been about sharing the experience with other like minded souls.

I also respect and understand the DIY crowd and if the experience is more rewarding without assistance, I get that too. We each walk our own path. Some choose a narrow trail while others like me, prefer some company along the way.

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Vanilla
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Apr-01-17, 
00:30 AM (MST)
10. "RE: What help would you take?"

LAST EDITED ON Apr-01-17 AT 00:31 AM (MST)

Berry,

I don't think anyone is saying that guided hunts are easy. But in theory, hiring a knowledgeable guide SHOULD increase your chance to kill a big bull. Right? I'm not suggesting that the hunt has to be easy, but if hiring a guide does not increase your chances, why do it?

As for me, if a guide that knew what they were doing on that specific unit offered help for free, I would absolutely take the help. I don't think many guides would do that, but it's your hypothetical, so I'll roll with it. My family/friends that wanted to come would still be there too, though. As was mentioned, these premium units are closer to OIL than LE anymore...so I'd want to make that one chance count. I would not, however, hire a guide. Mostly because I couldn't afford one. But the hypothetical was the guide offering to do it for free. Yes, I'd accept the offer of their expertise.

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PleaseDear
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Apr-01-17, 
03:50 AM (MST)
11. "RE: What help would you take?"

I have only gone guided once and that was for my Colo. Mnt. Lion hunt as it was smarter/cheaper to go guided than to buy some hounds!

So I would do my normal DIY and take any heads-up intel that came my way.

Robb

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BeDawg
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Apr-01-17, 
03:18 PM (MST)
12. "RE: What help would you take?"

Unguided all the way with the help of anyone I enjoyed spending time with. The fun is not pulling the trigger but in scouting and hunting.

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Vanilla
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Apr-01-17, 
04:15 PM (MST)
13. "RE: What help would you take?"

The pulling of the trigger is pretty fun too. Otherwise, I don't need a tag at all!

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BeanMan
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Apr-01-17, 
05:44 PM (MST)
14. "RE: What help would you take?"

When I drew my unit 61 tag it was just my Wife and I. It worked out well.

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mmwb
(2221 posts)
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Apr-01-17, 
07:07 PM (MST)
15. "RE: What help would you take?"

I prefer to hunt alone. Any family with me, would of course be a bonus. The help I always think of with elk, is in getting the beast out of there and I'd plan on hiring a packer.

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Dikndirt
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Apr-03-17, 
04:47 PM (MST)
16. "RE: What help would you take?"

Well when you mention CO unit 61 I went unguided in 2015. With the help of my son in law and a couple of scouting trips I managed to kill a nice bull <300> +- with my bow . I might have killed a bigger bull if I had hired a guide but that's not how I roll. The next year my son drew the same tag and we had a blast hunting together for another 300 inch Bull. No problem with somebody hiring or getting help on a great tag though. I just prefer to hunt with people I know and trust.

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sambo3006
(262 posts)
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Apr-03-17, 
06:53 PM (MST)
17. "RE: What help would you take?"

I drew the Wasatch late tag this last fall and was planning on diy with assistance from a couple members here and utahwildlife.net. 3 days before I left I was contacted by a mm'er about a giude friend who didn't have a hunter. I ended up booking with him and took an awesome bull on the 4th day, a day before a storm came in. I may never draw again and couldn't be happier with my decision. I've killed elk on my own and if I didn't live 1200 miles away I probably would have gone diy.

NRA Life Member

www.swanspointoutfitters.com
www.lazybar-t.com

The critters have to win every time. I only have to win once.

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inarcher
(160 posts)
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Apr-04-17, 
03:05 AM (MST)
18. "RE: What help would you take?"

LAST EDITED ON Apr-04-17 AT 05:26 AM (MST)

Depends what and where I'm hunting. To date, I have never used a guide for big game hunting. For elk specifically, I cannot envision hiring a guide...at least not until I'm too old to pack a bull off the mountain myself!

I'm a DIY guy that typically bowhunts western game solo. Where possible, I apply for good LE tags in units with substantial public access. I have drawn a few pretty good tags in the past including UT elk (Book Cliffs), WY elk (Bighorns), WY Shiras moose and CO mule deer (Unit 61). Zero regrets going solo on any of those hunts. Would do the same again if given the opportunity.

That said, I also apply for bighorn sheep in several states. Many of the areas I apply do not have great public access. Some of those include very tough terrain. If ever fortunate enough to actually draw a sheep tag in one of these areas, I would likely hire the best guide I could find.

Of course, there are always the "givens"....where a guide is mandatory (Canada, certain species in Alaska, NR wilderness rule in Wyoming). Those are all potential guided hunts in my future.

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Elkduds
(466 posts)
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Apr-04-17, 
08:45 AM (MST)
19. "RE: What help would you take?"

A few years back I drew an OIL buck tag for CO RFW. On this forum I found the hunter who had the same tag the previous year. We corresponded, and he seemed like a great guy and hunter. I invited him to join my hunt that year and he accepted. He shared what he knew of the area and rode/hiked/glassed along for the hunt. I vividly remember us stalking through some timber with bucks walking past us, undisturbed, @ 20 yards, midafternoon. I was able to take my best buck w him looking over my shoulder. Incredible hunt, more because of him than the deer, elk and the ranch. Would not have happened except for the MM connection. I hope I get to share a hunt w him again some day.

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wstrntines
(814 posts)
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Apr-04-17, 
10:48 AM (MST)
20. "RE: What help would you take?"

LAST EDITED ON Apr-04-17 AT 10:59 AM (MST)

I wouldn't be able to afford a guide at this point in time. If I could I probably would. And if one offered to help It would be hard to say no. I doubt that will happen when I draw a tag. So I'm guessing my wife will tag along and a buddy or two to help call me in some bulls and pack the bull out. I think I will have to set a bunch of trailcams when I draw the unit I've been putting in for because it's not a very glassable unit. I would also be willing to partner up with another tag holder if I felt like we could both up our odds at killing a couple big bulls. I would take all the help I could get with as hard as it can be to draw a big bull tag here in utah.

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schoolhousegrizz
(721 posts)
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Apr-04-17, 
02:01 PM (MST)
21. "RE: What help would you take?"

Family and friends for me. I enjoy talking to people on this site and researching as much as I can. That is part of the fun.

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Gator
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Apr-04-17, 
03:30 PM (MST)
22. "RE: What help would you take?"

As much help as I could get.

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>Life member of
>the MM green signature club.


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elkantlers
(2049 posts)
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Apr-04-17, 
06:48 PM (MST)
23. "RE: What help would you take?"

Family and friends. That's what it is all about for me.

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2lumpy
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Apr-04-17, 
09:11 PM (MST)
24. "RE: What help would you take?"

Others has said, "it's different for each of us", I couldn't agree more and I might say, most of us change over time, as our own circumstances change.

Based on the scenario given, I live next door to the Boulder elk unit, so my accompaniment might be far different than someone that lives in Minnesota and has never set foot on the unit. It might vary again, if I'd never shot a mature bull elk before, in as much as my current desire would be much different than it was before I'd killed a couple. If I decided to, I could afford a guide, but I don't have tons of discretionary money, so because I've killed a few and because I live next to the unit, I'd rather use the money for something else, than kill a bull that might or might not be 20 or 30 inches larger than if I didn't hire a guide and went with my family or alone.

I had a few experiences, that are pretty much how I've done things, over the last 50 years.

After 19 or 20 years of applying for a Utah shiras moose, I drew. My son, that does a fair amount of hunting, lives on the unit I drew. He knew where the moose on the unit were frequently found, so I invited two sons, three grandsons, and two good friends, with five head of horses, and off we went. Had a great time, killed a nice bull and hauled him to camp in a torrential rain. It was a "once in a life time tag and a once in a life time experience". Everyone that was part of the "posse" had a great time and when we are together, something about those three days together get's discussed.

I applied for nine years for points, for Wyoming antelope hunt. I'd have killed five or six in my life, and I wanted to build points, for my senior years, and have one last antelope. I wanted try to get something bigger than I'd killed before. On MM I made contact with another member who had, over his years of antelope hunting in Wyoming, learned a great deal about which area in the State he could hunt some "better than average" antelope, at least, he had taken some very nice antelope in recent years. We applied together and drew. I was expecting to hunt alone or with one family member but as the hunt dates approached, the gentlemen that I had applied with offered to hunt the same week I was planning to hunt, so we meet there, for the first time, and hunted together. He knew, far better than I, a large antelope, from an average antelope, and he pointed out numerous better than average antelope and after three days of "observing" some very nice antelope, I killed an antelope that was actually larger than I had anticipated, when I applied for the hunt. The next day my MM friend killed his. I had a great time, saw hundreds antelope. Made four new friends, all from four different States, one of which I am going lake trout fishing with at Flaming Gorge in two and half weeks. The other three send me e-mails of their hunting/fishing adventures on occasion. Each have very different personalities and divers interests and my life has been richer for having met each of them.

My son and I went to North West Territories to hunt caribou in 2000, nine local friend went with us over a two year period. North West Territories requires any non-resident to hire an outfitter/guide, so we of course did so. Our outfitter owned a camp on the tundra, with the guides, cook, taxidermist, tents, boats, and electric bear fence. We hunted, two hunters and one guide to a boat. We travelled by boat, over hundreds of miles of shoreline, stopping and hiking to various locations, and high spots, to glass for caribou. It wouldn't have been possible without the outfitter and the guides, because of the law, and the environment, motorized boats were the key factor and without the boats, it's very unlikely any caribou would have been killed. Besides the boats, the outfitters provided these things: the tents, the meals, and the location. So far as hunting, we didn't need them at all. In two years, of the nine different Utah hunters, no a single guide spotted a caribou before we do. Yes, the guides knew the lake, they knew where you could beach a boat, they knew how to get back to camp but as far as spotting game or knowing how to use optics, they were no better than anyone of our group and I guess I'd say, in every case, we found caribou as well or better than they did, including the Inuits and the local NWT Fish and Game employees, that were on vacation and guiding for the outfitter. We help gut and pack every caribou to the boat. Again, it was another hunt of a life time. But, in spite of being as good at seen caribou as our guides, we could not have done it without the outfitter, his equipment and the help of our guides. We had a fantastic trip, two years in a row. So, as much as I like to do my own hunting, unguided, there are times and places where they make it possible and I enjoyed those two caribou hunting trips as much as any hunt I've ever been on.

Never planned for it, but circumstances changed and I've been invited, by a son, to go on an African Safari it will be, of course, fully guided. I don't see that as much different from a sportsman from Wisconsin, drawing a Boulder or a Colorado 61 bull elk tag, regarding needing assistance, if we are going to have a successful hunt. For me to go to Africa, on my own, without a guide, I wouldn't have a clue how or where to start. How is that much different from someone from the east coming to the west? Or someone from the west going to the east, to hunt whitetail or turkeys, or the south to hunt gators or hogs? Or to Hawaii to catch marlin. Trip would be fun, but it's more fun if you bring home what you go after, at least it is for me. I don't need a hunting license to go sight seeing.

So...... in all due respect, to the original question, I don't think we should ever say, "I only do it this way or I only do that way", because it limits so very much adventures that you can and will have, if you stay open to any opportunity that presents itself, regardless of the circumstance.

Over the years I have had no interest or desire to kill a high fence whitetail, but at this stage in my life, if someone came along and afforded me a chance at a mega monster whitetail, on a high fence hunt in Texas, the midwest or an eastern State, and money wasn't an issue, I'd do it, in a New York minute, and I'd love every second, start to finish.

Opinions are like elbows, huh, we all got a couple of'em.

DC

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Deerlove
(4129 posts)
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Apr-05-17, 
10:23 AM (MST)
25. "RE: What help would you take?"

My expectations would be to high to hire someone. Same with cat/helicopter skiing etc. I like to think that I work for it, with my own scouting and family etc.

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elknut300
(41 posts)
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Apr-05-17, 
10:42 AM (MST)
26. "RE: What help would you take?"

LAST EDITED ON Apr-05-17 AT 10:46 AM (MST)

I would research everything I could find out about the area , and ask my son to go with me , if he wasn't able to go then just go solo and have someone lined up to hire for the pack out if successful.

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mntman
(3796 posts)
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Apr-06-17, 
11:52 AM (MST)
27. "RE: What help would you take?"

Would just be me and Dad, He can't hike much so mostly camp cook and show up for pictures
Would not accept help from guide, cause personally I'd feel my hunt would be tarnished. I have the mentality that "I can do it" with nearly every thing in life.

If I was required to have a guide (law) then I'd get one, example sheep in AK. If I have choice not doing it though.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"

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osu92
(99 posts)
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Apr-06-17, 
03:39 PM (MST)
28. "RE: What help would you take?"

Likely it would be just myself and a couple of family members. I'm not against asking or accepting help, but I'm not likely to ever pay for a guide's help. If it was a uber-premium tag of some sort and a guide wanted to help, I'd be open to that. It would be under my terms and no way they'd be ramrodding things.

As others have stated, it's more about the experience for me than a score or having a certain sized head to hang in the house. Heck, I have to fight the wife just to get them in the house anyway!

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bucksmut
(244 posts)
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Apr-07-17, 
00:41 AM (MST)
29. "RE: What help would you take?"

2lumpy-

I think that was my favorite post so far this year. Very well put.

I agree-perspectives change with time. I'm a DIY guy 99% of the time but there are times when a guide is just the right call.

Researching a hunt and meeting new people is half the fun for me and I like that those experiences can happen organically for free without someone being paid since it seems like I get jammed in most every other aspect in life with someone who always needs to get paid but I've met some really cool people
in the past through booking with them also so it just depends.

If I ever draw the Henry's for deer I will be looking for some help from the MM crowd and may even book.

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tvbrewster
(119 posts)
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Apr-07-17, 
06:57 AM (MST)
30. "RE: What help would you take?"

I'm a 61 year old busted up soft white guy that sits behind a desk to earn a living.

Lord knows I need all the help I can get. Not looking for financial help I can handle that end.

I've been hiring outfitters for yearly elk hunts and plan on continuing to up to the point when I physically can't do it.

I've got a wilderness rifle hunt tag in Oregon this year and waiting on results from 3 more states. Love it till the day I die.

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hank4elk
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Apr-12-17, 
09:18 AM (MST)
31. "RE: What help would you take?"

LAST EDITED ON Apr-12-17 AT 09:19 AM (MST)

I've mostly hunted by myself in my lifetime. The trips with old friends are my memories of those folks.
I've helped guide,packed,fed,recovered,etc for many other hunters over the years. 4 last year.
Paid for one tag with an outfitter/rancher buddy and the result is my only CA elk.And one the the hardest with 2 friends.
Paid for a drop camp in the Pecos and had a blast running around chasing elk by myself. Unfilled tag & the outfitter is a friend now.
All that said @ 62 now & a heart attack 2 yrs ago & still going alone, I filled some tags.
But if I draw a Gila tag this year I would take any help I could. I know the units,the outfitters & guides and locals.
Makes a difference if you can only reasonably go so far & not get the meat out too. So the last 2 yrs I limited myself.
My one shot at a true Gila tag bull? I'll take the help.

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