Idahoron

I just got in my renegade that I picked up from Flores425. I know he was setting it up as per your instruction and I just have a few questions..I was going to do this in a PM, but maybe others are interested as well. I've searched most of your old posts MM needs stickys!

What lube are you now using?

Also, the gun came with a 501 sizer, and a 501-440 mould. is this the S&W 460grain mould you are using? I've ordered in some #9 onion skin and some pure lead from Rotometal, has this proven hard enough on game for you? And I read you do not lube the bullet at all, is that how you still do it?

I also called Dave at NE and ordered in some of his 460's, he seemed confident that they would shoot, I asked him about paper patching and he said his bullets didnt need it, but I may size them down and PP a batch to try out.

I have some work to do on the rifle still, it came with fiber optic sights, so have ordered a 57SML and a 17AML and some lee shaver inserts, may also try to bed the stock.

Should be a fun project and I'm glad you have done most of the legwork throughout the years.

I don't use lube on the bullet. I use a very small amount of Hornady Great plains lube or Bore Butter on the over powder wad. The over powder wad is made with a sharpened 1/2" black Iron pipe. I keep the ones that cut a wad out that measures .62" in diameter. I use wool felt for the wad.

That is the mould I use. I do harden them a pinch. I found that the pure will throw a bullet in the 460 range on my mould. If I add a little lead shot I bump the hardness up to 6 to 7 BHN. This has been my hardness I have used for the last 3 or 4 years.

Like I said before I don't lube the bullets or the paper on the bullets. I keep them dry. Now I did set up one blued barrel and it was ultra tight. I had to put a pinch of lube on the paper on that barrel. For field use I tested that gun with Chapstick on the paper and it loaded better and shot great. Don't lube the paper and leave it on too long before you load. The lube will cause the paper to fail.

No Excuse bullets are good bullets. I have tested them and they are good, Not as good as mine but they are good. The thing that guys like him don't understand is the paper protects the bullet from the barrel, and the barrel from the bullet. You don't have lead build up in the barrel that over time ruins accuracy. It causes inconsistent groups. The lead build up is constantly building and changing where the bullets hit.
The barrel and flame is hard on the soft lead bullet. When bullet is messed up by the barrel it will not shoot as well. The paper and over powder wad protects both and this is where the paper patched bullets leave all others in the dust. Consistency, I paper patch for consistency.

The wide Meplat of the 500 S&W bullet hits with the power of Thor's hammer. I have seen a pile of game shot with these now. My cow this year was the fist game animal I have found a bullet in. The bullet smashed the shoulder bone and was found in the flank. This load POUNDED this elk HARD.

The NE bullets paper patched shoot good too. I won't deny that at all. I am sure they would also take game well too. But I can make my own that work better in my opinion. When I pour my bullets I can be as picky as I want. I remelt anything that looks odd and I only keep bullets that are +- .5 grains. That is a close tolerance for any bullet.

If you have any questions feel free to ask. Ron

Here is a web page of a test that was done on a lot of different bullets. My bullets that I made won this test. Ron

http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/black-powder/361092-science-project-report-long.html

LAST EDITED ON Nov-19-13 AT 10:20PM (MST)[p]Thanks for the info..I wish I would have asked first before ordering lead, maybe I should have ordered some of their alloy stuff..Oh well looking forward to getting all the stuff in..I've been perfecting my rifle loads and shooting for years but this is pretty new to me as all I have is an inline i shoot sabots out of and a slow twist i shoot PRB's from.

Pistol powder is the way to go right? And when you say 80 grains is that by volume or measured?

I found a pretty nice stock on ebay, not knowing much about these yet I dont know if it will work on mine?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Thompson-Ce...leloader-Rifle-Renegade-TC-Part-/310799170891

Reddog
The TC Hawken stocks made for .45 and .50 caliber barrels have a barrel channel for 15/16" barrels. The stocks made for the Hawken in .54 have 1" barrel channels.
I believe that All of the Renegade barrels were 1" across the flats whether .50 or .54 caliber.
While there isn't much difference, a stock for a 15/16" across the flats barrel would need a bit of inletting work done to get a 1" barrel to fit into it, also the tang for the hooked breech barrel is a bit to small. Hope that helps.

Sounds like if you ordered pure lead, all you might need to do is add some hard lead shot to the furnace to harden it up a bit.

You can add some lead shot to boost hardness. I add 1000 grains of lead shot to 10 pounds of pure then go up from there. That 1000 grains of lead shot would be a good place to start.

With black powder and substitutes you always use volume measurements.
Skip the stock it would be way too much work. Look for a stock that is 1" across the flats. Ron

JUDAS!

Can't wait to see the Barrel on REDDOGS Hawken Shredded after He starts adding Smokeless Powder to get MAXIMUM FPS out of the Old Traditional!

It'll look worse than some of them New Savage Rifles that have flown apart!

Cowboy-Up REDDOG & stuff some 600 Grain Slugs down Her!












I used to know of places worth Hiking in to for Elk & Deer!
Thanks to Illegal Bastards & the USFS not enforcing Rules you can Zing in to them Places on Wheelers now & not see a Damn thing!
But by GAWD it don't take long for them U-Tards to get there with all the Unethical BS and the New Technology!

LAST EDITED ON Nov-20-13 AT 11:43PM (MST)[p]
thanks for the tips..I considered trying the whites 600 grainer..why dont you send me a few

on the other hand tho, i'm digging the idea of shooting and killing critters with bullets i made myself, so thats what my end goal is going to be.

Edit to add, I realize that black powder is traditionally weighed by volume and thats how I've always done it too, but i read of lots of guys doing it by weight now..Has anyone tried both ways to see if there is any improvement..seems to me weighed charges would be more consistent, but maybe not? I'll try it out both ways when I get my gun up and running.

If you weigh by volume, then get an actual weight of the thrown charge then use that and weigh the loads with a scale your fine. 80 grains of Pyrodex P is going to be 66 grains by weight. I have used that weight and loaded. It is one way to get a more accurate load. Ron

EASY with the SMOKELESS Powder REDDOG!

It's a Hawken!










I used to know of places worth Hiking in to for Elk & Deer!
Thanks to Illegal Bastards & the USFS not enforcing Rules you can Zing in to them Places on Wheelers now & not see a Damn thing!
But by GAWD it don't take long for them U-Tards to get there with all the Unethical BS and the New Technology!

Welp..I can see this bullet casting is going to be a bit tougher than i thought.. My first run didnt produce one keeper! I think i found a proper heat setting (maybe) My first bullets were coming out frosted, I assume thats cause I was running too hot?

Anyway, even my better looking bullets still had some wrinkles in them..The good thing is i just have to throw them back in and try again.

Should I be using some sort of flux? I really need to start at the start and order some books I guess.

Also i'm using lyman #2 formula, and it seems way harder than any cast bullets i have been using..You think this stuff is too hard for a good hunting bullet?

I Toyed around with making my own Bullets REDDOG back in the day!

I had access to Lead back then!

At the Time I couldn't find a Mold big enough that my Remington liked!

Maybe somebody makes them now?

You Pre-Heating your Mold?

Does sound like you mighta over warmed your Lead?

I don't claim to be a Pro at it but did experience some of the same as you are!

In My own opinion,I think the Lead in the Whites 600 Grain Bullets is a bit Stiff!

Depending on where you Hit an animal & I'm only going by actual animals I have taken with my Gun/Bullet combo!

I have Punched Holes through the Broadside with little Expansion kinda like Drilling a 50 caliber hole clear through,No I didn't recover the Slug to Inspect it,but you could tell it didn't expand much!

On other animals where I hit a shoulder Bone,Holy Shite,none of My magnum caliber Rifles do this kinda damage!

They Ain't Limping off,Guaranteed!

I do use the Heaviest NO-EXCUSES Bullets I can get too for my 50,535 Grains if Memory is Right?

These are slightly Softer and lighter than the Whites,but quite a bit more consistent on Weight!

These SmokePoles can be a Pain Trying to Dial them in with something they'll shoot!

There's a Fine line between too hard of Lead & Too Soft!

Keep us Posted DAWG!

I'm waitin for the 1,000 Yard Shots out of your HAWKEN!
















I used to know of places worth Hiking in to for Elk & Deer!
Thanks to Illegal Bastards & the USFS not enforcing Rules you can Zing in to them Places on Wheelers now & not see a Damn thing!
But by GAWD it don't take long for them U-Tards to get there with all the Unethical BS and the New Technology!

The heaviest NE offers in 50cal anymore is 495. He says he's thinking on a 600 grain 50.

Ya i'm pre-heating my mould/dipper..and really by the end of the first try they wernt that bad,just a few imperfections to work on.They also only weighed 420 grains. Going to try Rons lead and shot mix on the next try. I only tried lyman #2 first because everything I read said that any idiot could cast it and make it look good lol.

First off frosted bullets are also a sign of hard lead. Then I read down and seen you were using Lyman #2. Lyman #2 is actually harder than wheel weight. It runs 15 BHN hardness. This is WAY too hard for ML bullets. Frost is nothing for pistol bullets. I like them to be frosted. I need more info. What pot are you using? Are you using a bottom pour pot? I clean the mould with dish washing soap and follow that up with heating it up real hot to get all the water out of nooks and cranny's. The wrinkles could be from oil in the mould, or cold mould or lead that is not hot enough. It can also be from a bottom pour pot that is not filling fast enough. I like to use a ladle for a fast fill. If lead is going in slow it will cool and the wrinkles will form. I only flux when I am melting the lead for the first time. taking it from a large chunk to ingots I flux with a lot of different things. I use motor oil or candle wax, or a dry stick. Once I have it in a small ingot I don't flux again.
Pure lead is also hard to pour because it doesn't fill out well at all. That is another reason I use the lead shot to help make it flow better. Ron

I'm using a Lyman big dipper pot and a ladle. I only wiped the mould down beforehand,I will wash it with soap on the next try.

I have another mould on order for my 454 so i'll use up the #2 on those.

Thanks for the advice.