new muzzy advise

goldhunter · Aug 1, 2015

I was lucky enough to draw a utah muzzy elk tag this year and am now looking for a new rifle. Am considering the Accura as well as the Rem ultimate. Although this year I can use sabots I hope to draw Colorado next year so then no sabots. Same with sights, this year I will likely use a 1x scope of some sort(better for my eyes). Next year likely will need open sites. Finally the consensus on here is BH209 is the best powder so I would like to use it if I can.

I do not like the look of the Accura V2 with the severe pistol grip stock, but if it is the strong winner otherwise I could live with it. Of course if there are other rifles I should be looking at by all means let me know. Maybe one gun won't do it. Maybe I need a scoped rifle with sabots and a open sighted rifle with conicals?

Finally I will admit I am not the kind of guy that would like to sit at the range and work though a hundred round looking for "the load".

Any advice would be appreciated, thanks

muzz · Aug 1, 2015

Buy the CVA Optima. I just got mine a sportsmans for 259.00 black and stainless.

O--one
B--big
A--ass
M--mistake
A--america

hangfire · Aug 1, 2015

For a all around gun that shoots conicals and sabots equally well, I like my knight mountaineer.

goldhunter · Aug 5, 2015

Went with the optima with open sights and nitride barrel. CVA shows three options on the BH209 breech plug. Anybody know which one I need?

elkassassin · Aug 5, 2015

With that Gun & the BH 209 Powder I Believe you need the CVA AC1611BH Breech Plug!

Double check it!

But this is suppose to Fit all CVA Guns 2010 & Newer!

Note: DOES NOT FIT CVA APEX!
Go Ahead!

Make Me take it down!

elkassassin · Aug 5, 2015

https://www.muzzle-loaders.com/accessories/cva-qrbp-blackhorn-209-breech-plug.html Go Ahead!

Make Me take it down!

goldhunter · Aug 6, 2015

Thanks, order placed.

muzz · Aug 6, 2015

Where did you draw out for? I'm thinkin of switching over to muzz limited entry instead of rifle, better odds of drawing.

O--one
B--big
A--ass
M--mistake
A--america

goldhunter · Aug 6, 2015

boulder mtn. What do you guys call them little elk? Piss cutters?

muzz · Aug 6, 2015

I'll be interested to see how you do that is one of the areas I've thought of putting in for

O--one
B--big
A--ass
M--mistake
A--america

goldhunter · Aug 6, 2015

You should probably judge the unit by some of the hard core resident hunters and guides. As a NR that has never set foot in the unit it will take some luck to do well. But, if they are just making some noise it will be fun trying. I'll take all the luck I get get though.

Next question - Will hollow point power belts work well in this rifle. I have some in the basement. If there is a much better choice I will make the change.

Thanks,

COLOelkman · Aug 7, 2015

A hollow point powerbelt would be my absolute last choice. Several great bullets out there that are significantly more lethal like Barnes TMZ, Hornady FPB, and several solid lead conicals. I might suggest asking those that have your gun what they'd recommend to get you started to save you some time and $ at the range.

goldhunter · Aug 7, 2015

Kind of what I thought.

Thanks

FrontierGander · Aug 7, 2015

Not at all. I'd very very comfortable with the 338gr platinum powerbelt or even the 348gr powerbelt aerolite. The flat point is even a great elk bullet in 348gr lead series.

www.FrontierMuzzleloading.com

goldhunter · Aug 11, 2015

Got the CVA and BH 209 plug today. Was thinking Barnes TEZ 290 gr's for bullets.

Should work?

FrontierGander · Aug 11, 2015

Will do perfect. 100-110gr BH209 and you'll be ready.

www.FrontierMuzzleloading.com

Cow Tag · Aug 11, 2015

Couple of years ago, someone listed data on MM about the various black powder substitutes ranking in regard to the genuine black powder. In other words, black powder was the standard that the other substitutes were indexed against. I remember that to match the power of 100 grains of Black Powder the Triple 7 powder charge needed to be 115. cannot remember it for any of the other substitutes as I then used only 777. Would anyone compare Black Horn 209 powder to Black Powder in this POWER rating? Heard that Black Horn was more powerful than most of the popular substitutes so hopefully someone will know all the comparisons and will publish them.

elkassassin · Aug 11, 2015

I called BH 209 about a week ago!

The Guy Said Blackhorn 209 was more powerful than 3fff Black!

You can't Prove it to My Shoulder though!

So I don't know?

Somebody must know Approx Equivalents?

Go Ahead!

Make Me take it down!

txhunter58 · Aug 11, 2015

I have always used around 15% as a ballpark for the strength of volume measured 777 compared to black or pyrodex powder (same as what you said). From things I have read, there is a slight increase in velocity (power) of BH 209 compared to 777. Here is one source:

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f32/blackhorn-209-new-black-powder-41223/

On other muzzy websites, I have seen posters also do testing and for the most part, back up what is said above: slight edge to BH 209.

That is only true of loose powder, not pellets

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

Bob D. · Aug 12, 2015

Cow tag, I believe you have it backwards. It should take a lower charge of Triple 7, measured by volume, than black powder, for the same velocity.

15% less is what Hodgdon says, so 100 grains of black powder would be equivalent to 85 grains of Triple 7.

From Hodgdon's website:

"All charges of Triple Seven or Pyrodex should be measured by VOLUME not weight. A simple, adjustable blackpowder measure is the correct tool for this job. All loads listed in this brochure are measured by VOLUME.
Triple Seven is a high energy product designed to provide the muzzleloading hunter with higher velocities when used in the same VOLUME as blackpowder. To duplicate a blackpowder load velocity using Triple Seven, you must decrease the powder charge by 15%. *See WARNING below.
Pyrodex is lighter in weight than blackpowder and weighs only about 70% as much as blackpowder. However, because Pyrodex yields more energy per pound than does blackpowder, the same volume of Pyrodex gives similar performance to blackpowder. Pyrodex loads given in this manual for muzzleloading guns are measured by volume, not weight."

Cow Tag · Aug 12, 2015

Bob, thank you for making the needed correction. Yes, I went south in a hurry with this one...........85 grains of 777 is equal to the explosiveness of 100 grains of the original Black Powder. My intent was to find out the amount of the newer Black Horn (by volume measure) that is equivalent to the BEAR LOAD of 100 grains of Black Powder. Your information is well received and appreciated. Thank you for monitoring and making recommendations and necessary corrections. Cow Tag