25-06 load recommendations?

sageadvice · Jun 10, 2014

As you may know, i now have my very first hunting rifle, that i bought by hauling hay bales from field to barn at a nickel a bale, back in my possession. Rem 700 ADL 1969 25-06 w/ straight 6x Redfield widefield scope. I haven't gotten to shoot it for about 35 years but my Uncle put very few rounds thru it and before i let it go to him it was, probably with one custom rifle exception, the most consistently accurate rifle i have ever owned. It was, probably still is, a super right out of the box shooter..

So for input, i'll seek opinions from you guys as most here know at least as much as i do and i value your thought. Right now, i'm mulling over 3 options:

1) Buy factory Ammo, 100 gr Barnes TTX, shoot and hunt those if they shoot well. Calif will soon be requiring non-lead bullets

2) Buy factory Ammo, 110 gr Accubonds, shoot and hunt those if they shoot well. Screw the Barnes, still have a couple years at least before the non lead law takes effect, and I really have had awesome performance w/ the Accubond product.

3) or...forget factory ammo, buy a set of dies, develop and test different loadings, starting with something like those above, over at my friend and reloading guru's house.

I can't see shooting this rifle very much after initial good loading is found so that's why i'm thinking Factory Ammo. My plan is to hunt and fill one or two deer tags each year, wishful thinking these days, maybe a few yotes, and enough rounds down range to insure it's still dialed.

What do you think? Thanks!!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

RELH · Jun 11, 2014

LAST EDITED ON Jun-11-14 AT 10:46PM (MST)[p]Joey if you are going to just shoot 20-40 rounds a year and want to shoot factory ammo. I will make this reccommendation on my experience with that caliber. Buy Federal that is loaded with the Sierra 120 gr. bullet. I found that factory load had the best accuracy in several 25-06 rifles. That Sierra bullet is also a very good bullet for deer and antelope, but too light constructed for larger game like elk.

If you decide to handload. Same Sierra 120 gr. Game King bullet with 48-49 gr. of IMR-4350 behind it and seat the bullet ogive about 15-20 thousands off the barrel lands. That load will give me 3 shots at 100 yards into 3/8 to 1/2 inch groups in my 25-06. A Interarms Mark X with factory barrel in a custom Sny. stock.

RELH

Joey in my original post I goofed on the powder I listed for the 25-06 handload. IT IS NOT IMR-4198, INSTEAD IT IS IMR-4350. I use the 4198 for my 45/70 loads, not 25-06. I corrected it above.

whitwell_56 · Jun 11, 2014

Agree with the federals Loaded with the Sierra bullets.

Another good powder is h4831.

I would stay away from the light bullets for deer. I've had better results from 117-120 grain bullets.

RELH · Jun 11, 2014

Whitwell_56,

I do not use H-4831 in any 30-06 size case as it gives up too much velocity over IMR-4350. H-4831 has a very slow burn rate and starts to shine in the magnum calibers. It is my go to powder for the 300 and 7mm Weatherby calibers. Another reason I use it is that I have about 20 lbs of it I got from my father-in-law who got good high velocity and well under 1 inch accuracy in those two Weatherby rifles.

RELH

whitwell_56 · Jun 11, 2014

thanks for the tip. my dad started loading for the 25-06 back in the 70's and that is what he used. never tried anything else. now if I can find 4350

sageadvice · Jun 12, 2014

Thanks for the info and opinions guys!

i just now got back to this thread, day before yesterday went ahead and ordered up a box of Barnes 100 grain Factory ammo to try out.

We'll see how that goes. I also have a box of 100 gr Rem Factory and a box of 122 gr (??) Rem extended Range ammo which i never heard of before.

Looks like i'm due for some fun shooting at the range.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

lve2143 · Jun 21, 2014

Joey, beware the 110 grain Noslers on anything
over 200 pounds. They are super accurate, but
have had hell with them on deer, even on antelope.

I'm loading the 80 grain Barnes.
Have a NM Antelope tag I hope to
try out on.

kilowatt · Jun 21, 2014

I only shoot Federal factory 117gr Sierra Game King rounds....3 antelope so far and all one shot kills.

Brian
http://i44.tinypic.com/es7x8z.jpg[/IMG]

sageadvice · Jun 25, 2014

I finally got to the range this morning. My findings:

The 100 gr Rem Cor-loct, 3 shots, 1 1/4" group, dead on

Rem 122gr Rem Extended Range, 3 shots, 1" group, 3" high

100 gr Barnes vortex TTSX, 4 shots, 1 1/4" group, 1" high

Overall, i am very happy with what i got from my old rifle. First off, i noticed that there were two vertical lines in my old 6X Redfield scope so is adjusted the rear lens on the scope until they came together as one line. Still, the scope was noticeably fuzzy on the 1" black dots i had set up at one hundred yards and try as i did, nothing helped. Then i had no sand bags, shot off a folded up drop cloth. The cross hairs looked steady but my eyes just are not near as sharp as they used to be.

Also, i never noticed as a young man when i had this rifle but the trigger must be 5 or 6, maybe more, pounds and that will definitely need attention. Instead of leaving as is, i may put a Burris Sig series 3-12X scope i have on her and get a couple more different boxes of what you guys recommended above for the next range session. Thanks!!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

30Hart · Jun 25, 2014

Those are good groups w/ factory ammo w/ a 6x scope...I bet those groups shrink w/ a better scope as you suggested and a trigger tune.

sageadvice · Jun 25, 2014

30Hart, hanks!! Yeah, i think so too. The guy that helps me with my reloading for some of my other hunters does wonders with a 700 trigger and the more magnification and newer glass will help these old eyes. I found out my eyes were going when one year i couldn't focus my Leupold Pinnacle field glasses to as sharp as they were or should be. Last year i bought some Zeiss 10X45's hoping that i could see well through them, better but still not as sharp as they should have been so i figure it's not the glass but my eyes.

Sucks to get old! lol

Another note, i don't think i mentioned, maybe i did...another getting old trait, that i was told that through all the years my Uncle hunted and killed lots of bucks and tons of pigs with this 25-06, he never had to adjust that scope from when i had it. Here i go out today with it and the point of impact was a bit higher or lower with each different ammo but each and every shot was pretty darn good in relation to the bull, a clean kill on a buck no doubt.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

RELH · Jun 25, 2014

Joey, of those three brands of ammo. If you are going to hunt Wyoming. I would stick with the Rem. 122 gr. extended range. Best group and I always sighted 3 inches high at 100 yards for Wyoming open ground. No need to figure bullet drop from muzzle to 350 yards as the bullet will be dead on about 275 yards and in the kill zone out to 350 yards on a antelope or deer.

RELH

sageadvice · Jun 25, 2014

RELH, i'm thinking about using them but i haven't a clue if they are still available. They punched a nice tight little triangle like pattern about a hands width directly above center bull. For as fuzzy as my sight picture was, maybe my Bull/target dot was too small for a 6x scope, they shot very commendable.

I got those with the rifle when i went down below to pick up the rifle at my Aunts. I still have 17 of them so getting my buck every year, they could take me well into my 70's. lol

There is a $19.00 price tag on them so though looking brand new in box, they may have been a long past product no longer available.

I seriously like the idea of those Barns TTSX 100 grain loads. They shot well too. It's probably something in me from my Grandfather's guidance with me as his willing student. He was always quick to change equipment when change was due and his rifle cartridge selection was a prime example. I said before here that he bought one of the very first 270 Winchesters, a model 54, the very first year that they came out and then years later, replaced it with the 1969 Rem 700 25-06 that is now my semi custom 280AI and twin to the one that i shot at the range today. He liked the idea of a flat shooting smallish bullet, going like a scalded rabbit, and placed well to drop deer in their tracks.

I'll see if i can find some of those 122's.

Thanks again guys. More 25-06 stuff welcome, add your $.02!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

Zeke · Jun 26, 2014

Ok Joey, I have to admit it's been a few years since I owned one but I still have the dies.
I was more of a speed freak back then and shot yotes to bears, and everything in between, with a 100 gr Partition. It killed 'em all and nobody can dispute their lethality.
If you go that light you'd do well to stay with a well constructed bullet, Barnes or Partitions. (I've never shot Barnes in a 25-06)
The standard cup and core bullets work great too but I'd stay in the 120 gr range. I did shoot a few deer with the old 120 solid base Nosler back in the day.
My powders of choice were IMR4350 and H450. Sadly I didn't have a chronograph back then so none of my records will show actual velocities.
My vote would be to reload... but then I'm a reloader and would roll my own even if it cost more money. I honestly don't think I've shot a factory round since 1969 (except steel for waterfowl).
Zeke

sageadvice · Jun 26, 2014

Zeke said, "...If you go that light you'd do well to stay with a well constructed bullet, Barnes or Partitions."

Yeah, that's why i'm kinda leaning on the 100 gr Barnes TTSX, a light bullet, going Fast, with integrity.

After the last couple years working up new loadings for my 270WSM and 280AI, shooting this 25-06 is a dream, recoil wise, on the bench.

2143, I'm pretty sure that i too could do what i want in that rifle with those 80 gr Barnes. Smoken hot!! If i were to buy the dies and go the reloading route, i might try them just to see what they'd do thru my rifle. I believe that you're going to be just fine on that Wy hunt. Good luck!

whitwell, thanks for the info! my reloading buddy just scored a 8 pound can of 4350. That and there's still several half filled pound containers of mine still in his cabinet. I believe if i were to reload, i'd go that way, especially being getting powder would not be a issue.

Has anybody out there hunted and taken game with the Barnes 100 gr TTSX? Thanks all!!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

lve2143 · Jun 27, 2014

I don't have a WY hunt Joey.

But I could hook you up on a good
.25-06 load.

sageadvice · Jun 27, 2014

2143, Sorry, i read where you had that NM lope hunt and brain farted it to a Wy hunt.

For now, i'm going to go with factory ammo but thanks for offering. If someday i do decide to reload for this rifle, i'll give you a holler.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

lve2143 · Jun 28, 2014

Joey,

If you're going factory.

Look at the Hornady stuff.

Them boy's got it going on.

Laro

REDDOG · Jun 28, 2014

Give the barnes a chance, you'll like them. Dont be afraid to line up some bone, they are tough bullets and work best that way. I've not taken game with the 25'06 with the 100ttsx, but have with a roberts, quartering away, aimed it for an off shoulder exit, bang flop.

dblkicker · Jul 5, 2014

This is a 100 gr. TTSX that I retrieved out of an elk I shot a couple of years ago. It was quarter to me so the slug passed through its shoulder plate and was just under the skin on the opposite side. The slug still weights 94.6 gr. We got a load worked up that has a muzz vel just under 3500 fps and 2700+ ft. lbs of energy, The trajectory is ridiculously flat. That bull took 3 steps and tipped over. It works for me.

sageadvice · Jul 5, 2014

db, Wow, thAt's what i'm talkin about!!

Thanks for the post! Really nice!

My Factory loads rate just over 3200 fps so now i know there's plenty of room for increased velocity if i ever do decide to reload for this hunter.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

sageadvice · Jul 25, 2014

A little update. My old 25-06 now has a super crisp adjusted factory trigger at 2 3/4 pounds, a new kick pad, and we put on the Burris 3X12 Signature series scope. The rifle was filthy dirty and got a cleaning like it never had before. All told, it's ready for more range time, results to be posted in the not too distant future.

I have a Hunters Safety-Education class to instruct at the Range on Sunday. I'm hoping to be able to get out there early and see what she will do.

Note, the Burris Scope's mid section area is thicker than the old Redfield's that was on there and i needed to shim up the scope slightly to have clearance. I used the plastic lid on a shaving cream can to cut strips of plastic to insert on the bottom third of the rings for the additional elevation needed to clear the old Redfield one piece base. The gap between the upper and lower rings is noticeably wider now than it was but the scope seems very secure. Do you guys foresee any problems with this method of shimming? Thanks!!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

maxcarp · Jul 26, 2014

As long as the screws for the rings are long enough to get a good grip in the lower rings it should be OK for a while.I have gone to Midway USAs online catalog and found an appendix there that lists all the specs for the different mfrs of scope rings.Off hand I would say you need a medium set of Redfield style rings.As I recall a set like that from Redfield or Weaver should run $20 or so.

sageadvice · Jul 26, 2014

maxcarp, Thanks for the info. I think that the screws are down in there plenty of threads to hold securely but i keep seeing that bigger gap than it was. I first used a aluminun can to make the shims but they were just too thin. I've never had to make or use shims before so that's why i asked about using the thicker plastic.

My concern with changing rings or change from a one piece to a two piece base is i may put the old 6X scope back on the rifle after i see the accuracy capabilities with these different factory loads. I may also keep the Burris on there. No doubt about it, the Burris is a clearer scope. I thought that Redfield a great scope in it's day and it was a great scope for what i did with it...but they don't compare to what's out there these days, not even close.

The plan is to beat the hoards to the Range in the morning, before the Hunters Ed group shows. I hope that i have the time to re-sight in and shoot several groups. I'm not a early person by nature though so plans sometimes must adjust and i can roll with that too.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

maxcarp · Jul 27, 2014

Hmmm..If the gap between the top ring and bottom ring looks like it is opening up you should check to see that the screws are still tight or have not stripped the threads in the bottom ring.You don't want to go to the range and have the scope start sliding around due to recoil.It can be a very frustrating experience. Don't ask me how I know!

sageadvice · Jul 28, 2014

Opening up? Maybe i didn't express myself to well there. When i put the shim in the bottom of each ring and then tightened the caps down, there is a little wider gap between the rings than there used to be. I don't believe that they are opening but then i haven't shot the rifle since i put on the new scope.

I will pay attention, much attention, to see if there is any movement or loosening during and after my testing. My guess is that i'll be good.

Well, we had a nice day at the Range Sunday for out Hunters Ed Class but when i got there Early to shoot my Rifle and help set up for the class, the range was posted Closed for the Day because of a Trap Shoot going on at the same time. Because it's a small range, they must shut the down range part off when they shoot trap. We were still good to go for our Class, good bunch of Students, but no shooting of my Rifle was possible.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

sageadvice · Jul 30, 2014

I just got back from the range. Hot bugger out there!!

100 gr core-loct... 1/2" group, Nice!!

100 gr TTSX.........1" group, fair

122 rem extended range 7/8" group, pretty good

As some here know, i'm not a huge fan of Core-loct, especially the round nosed version. Compared to a Accubond, IMO, they are not near the product. One can not argue though, that they will and do kill game, lots of game. My old Rifle seems to love them.

I'm not sure just yet, which way i'll go for a "Opening Day" round. All the groups are satisfactory to me for hunting purpose. I have been leaning toward the TTSX, just wish the group would have been a bit tighter.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

maxcarp · Jul 31, 2014

Glad to hear that tweaking the trigger and updating the scope helped get your rifle dialed in.Maybe with some hand loads the Barnes bullets can be dialed in as well.

sageadvice · Sep 19, 2014

Update. Tomorrow is the opening day of our local Deer season. As you have read, i got my very first hunting rifle back after i sold it to my Uncle a bunch of years ago and i've been getting it ready for the season. After the last range session where i again did some testing with other factory loads, i decided to go with the Barnes 100 gr TTSX.

When i left the range last time, she was putting down some dandy groups but i always want to know Exactly where that first very most important shot is going to hit on a cold barrel. My bull is made from electrical tape, showing is the first and only shot i took this trip to the range, on a cold barrel... she's ready!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

kilowatt · Sep 19, 2014

Joey....is that 100, 200, 300 yard shot? Go get a great Buck this season.

Brian
http://i44.tinypic.com/es7x8z.jpg[/IMG]

sageadvice · Sep 19, 2014

Hey Brian!! That was one shot at 100yds. My hits through that rifle on the other trips to the range were all in the same relative spot, some different brand ammo shooting a bit higher or lower than others.

I usually sight my hunters in about 3.5" high at 100yds, dead on a 300, but this country is so thick with timber and brush, a 100 yard or longer shot is the exception rather than the rule. Not only that, this is the same point of impact at 100 yds that i kept and hunted with this rifle as a teenager back when.

I figure that i should be about dead on at 200 yds, plenty close enough to get it done if my skills and chance provides the opportunity.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

REDDOG · Sep 23, 2014

LAST EDITED ON Sep-24-14 AT 01:40AM (MST)[p]Sage, I have not checked in on this thread since I last posted, and I read about your shims..If you have any doubts about them, Burris makes polymer inserts on their signature rings ( they essentially do the same thing you did with the shaving cream shim, but they encase the whole scope tube displacing mounting pressure evenly)and not only do they give you a live eccentric center bore/scope, you can get larger inserts to cant your scope..They really are excellent and I recommend them if you're looking for another option.

http://www.midwayusa.com/Product/71...fset-inserts-installation-kit-005-010-and-020

sageadvice · Oct 4, 2014

My Cali C-4 Buck!

I'll talk my opinion on how that 100gr Barnes bullet did a bit later.

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

sageadvice · Oct 30, 2014

OK, it's time to talk about the 100gr Barnes TTSX i used to take my Buck. I took the shot offhand, downhill, about a ninty to a hundred yards, with him moving right to left. The Buck had been running when i first saw him but he had slowed to a walk and i put the cross-hairs ahead of him in a opening that he soon walked into.

At the shot, the sight picture looked great. I thought i saw the buck hunch up but he took off running. I jacked in another round and found another opening in the trees ahead of him and as he passed into that, the gun went off and he was then down for the count.

The first shot was a little lower than the one shown in the pic but about the same distance back, maybe 7-8" behind the shoulder. I't jellied his lungs and exited low in the center of his front shoulder. The shot impact shown in the pic, it was about 3-4" higher, grazed his backbone and exited high right behind the shoulder. Neither bullet was recovered. Not near as big a wound channels as i would expect with a Accubond but dead is dead.

My concern and up for comments, if you choose, is how in the world did that buck take the first shot and run off? I've taken lots and lots of bucks with the 25-06 cartridge, not many ever got more than a step or two...

Anyway, he has already provided some outstanding venison. My Sister was up for a week visiting her big brother and i threw in some chops along with a beef pot roast one evening. I went to grab a chop from the baking pan, too late, she had already ate a couple of them and jabbed me in the hand with her fork! lol, her way of saying that the chops were hers!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"

hntbambi · Nov 9, 2014

My final hunting recipe with the 25-06 is:

case - Remington
powder - H4831-SC 53.4 gr
bullet - Berger 115 VLD-Hunting
primer - Fed 210 Gold Medal Match
COAL - 3.230"
Headspace - 2.038"
Base to ogive - 2.637"

This setup gives me 3074 fps and in a 24" sporter wt barreled Savage 110 I get minute of angle 5 shot groups at 600 yards.

sageadvice · Nov 9, 2014

hntbambi, Thank you for your contribution to this thread. You at least certainly gave me something to think on!

Joey

"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"