Hi all, I'm thinking of putting in for a controlled bull tag. I'm wondering how unit 18 compares to easier to draw units like 36a-1, 37a, and 48, in terms of bull quantity and quality. I'm very comfortable with steep and deep. I'm not the pickiest hunter but would try to hold out some. Thanks!
Elk Controlled Hunts
- Thread starter idhikker
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customweld
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- 606
This is my 2 cents. It's been a few years since I have hunted 18 for elk. I do spend quite a bit of time in there goofing around. I think there are too many bull tags issued both archery and rifle. At the same time the elk hunt is going, there are cow tags,mule deer tags and whitetail tags. In terms of unit size, 18 is really pretty small. When you put that together with limited access ( especially on the south end of the unit) it can get pretty crowded. One year that I hunted it for elk, there were 21 horse trailers at the Windy Ridge opening morning. It's gorgeous country and really is a lot of fun to hunt. That is just my opinion, I'm sure others have a different story.
LAST EDITED ON May-05-18 AT 10:57AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON May-05-18 AT 10:57?AM (MST)
I'd be very happy with a 320' bull. A 300' bull would make me think hard about pulling the trigger. I'd like to see elk most days or every other day. Probably a little more interested in quantity than quality. Not expecting monster bulls on an easyish to draw tag.
I'd be very happy with a 320' bull. A 300' bull would make me think hard about pulling the trigger. I'd like to see elk most days or every other day. Probably a little more interested in quantity than quality. Not expecting monster bulls on an easyish to draw tag.
In that unit I'd say the draw odds are somewhat dictated by the terrain. Without stock it's going to be tough to get too far off the beaten path unless you have a few buddies to help pack. I think you could find a 300? to 320? bull but getting to it and packing it out may be tricky. There?s decent elk numbers in the unit but I'd agree with an earlier post that the quality is lacking somewhat due to the amount of tags.
NiceRack
Active Member
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I am very familiar with 37A and I'm a bit surprised you think it is an easy draw.....not so. I apply for 37A every year and have only drawn 2 out of 12 years. When I do draw I get a bull. I know where 2 monster bulls live both 340+ just need to get drawn to put in the grueling hike up the mountain to their beds.
PB
PB
Looking at harvest stats...the other three units you mention are better hunts. But 18 is by far the easiest draw. I've hunted Unit 18 three times and had good hunts each time but it was 10+ years ago before they increased the tag numbers. Only one time did i go in with horses...very unforgiving country w/o stock. But it can be done!
I don't have any recent experiences there though, sorry, but if you decide to go with 18 and draw i can give you a couple starting points.
good luck
Dman
I don't have any recent experiences there though, sorry, but if you decide to go with 18 and draw i can give you a couple starting points.
good luck
Dman
elkster123
Active Member
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- 114
Since when is 36a-1 an easy draw. Been putting in for that unit for 27 years with out no luck.... Easy my butt....
Elkster, it MUST be easy......I put in once and drew it, LOL!!!(and that was the ONLY tag I have drawn in Idaho's system). Welcome to a no preference point system!!!I personally know a guy who has drawn 31 rifle three times! The down side of no points sucks!
LAST EDITED ON May-08-18 AT 08:53PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON May-08-18 AT 08:52?PM (MST)
I appreciate all your comments. As far as ease of drawing, look at my post--I said "easier to draw". Compared to most controlled bull elk tags, 20% is good. But it's definitely not easy, I know. It's sad that's where we are at this point.
Also, note that I said 36a-1 which is a fair amount easier to draw than 36a-2. No worries but I just wanted to clarify. I would love to draw 36a or 37a every 2-3 years but that's highly unlikely.
On another note, I still like the no points scheme.
I appreciate all your comments. As far as ease of drawing, look at my post--I said "easier to draw". Compared to most controlled bull elk tags, 20% is good. But it's definitely not easy, I know. It's sad that's where we are at this point.
Also, note that I said 36a-1 which is a fair amount easier to draw than 36a-2. No worries but I just wanted to clarify. I would love to draw 36a or 37a every 2-3 years but that's highly unlikely.
On another note, I still like the no points scheme.
customweld
Active Member
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- 606
+1 on the no points scheme! I'll take my random draw chances.
One of the smartest things Idaho has done has been letting other states do all the testing of different point systems. Now that we're several decades into some of these systems I believe most people would agree that Idaho has the best system of any western state. I really hope they never change it there's plenty of options for relatively easy to draw hunts to ones that you'll be lucky to draw once in your life.
I think some of you guys must smoke crack! There are 53 buck hunts that are draw tags, 18 have better than 1/10 chance of drawing (10% success), 7 have better than a 1/5 chance of drawing (20% success) and those usually have access issues. Of the 49 bull elk hunts that are draw tags, 20 hunts have better than 1/10 odds (10% success) and 5 have better than a 1/5 chance of drawing (20% success). How anyone can think those are better than some type of point system that dramatically increases your odds is beyond me. Sure, some guys buck the odds and draw a few good tags but far and away most applicants will never see a draw tag in their lifetime.
Weiserbucks
Very Active Member
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- 1,659
Would you rather be mathematically eliminated from the drawing by a point system? I don't
Have you actually looked at other states that have point systems? For the most part they all suck because point creep makes it harder and harder to draw tags as the years go by. Then once you do draw and burn your points you're done for your lifetime basically. I'll take Idaho?s system any day.
idahohuntr
Active Member
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- 155
I think if you look at neighboring states you will be grateful for the draw odds in Idaho. Point systems are like a ponzi scheme...some benefit if you get in on the base level, screws everyone else.
yes, some of those systems suck, but that doesn't mean "no points" is good. It wouldn't be hard to establish a good, reasonably fair system but since the only true concern of points systems is to raise money, none of the states are interested. I personally consider Oregon's system is the most fair for residents (non-resident caps make it tough for non-residents). In their system 75% of the tags go to the point holders and 25% go to anyone that applies. It gives everyone a decent chance to draw. The reason this does not benefit non-residents is because the points draw is held first and non-resident caps are usually filled by the time the "anyone eligible" draw is held. As more and more of these systems become clogged by those who are only seeking points (usually non-residents) for one future hunt, I believe that preference should be given to the residents of those states (yes, I know this thought is unpopular on heavily populated non-resident sites like this one).
LAST EDITED ON May-14-18 AT 08:10AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON May-14-18 AT 08:09?AM (MST)
With a point system your odds slowly increase, without one, they slowly get worse. What most probably don't realize is that Idaho's population will most likely double in the next ten years. What will your odds be then? At the same time, more and more areas will become controlled hunting only (next year, we lose the most popular general elk hunt to controlled hunt status). It was only a handful of years ago, you had approx. 1/3 chance of drawing 36a, what is it now? One controversial approach which would end all of this "point hoarding" and keep hunters in their home states might be to place a limit on the life of points, say ten years. After that, they expire and you start over (use them or lose them!). This would do two things, it would eliminate guys from gathering points for years just to have them and it would give an opportunity for subsequent generations of hunters to have a chance at drawing a tag. Regardless of which approach a hunter chooses to follow one thing is certain, these systems will all need to be revamped in order to address the demand.
With a point system your odds slowly increase, without one, they slowly get worse. What most probably don't realize is that Idaho's population will most likely double in the next ten years. What will your odds be then? At the same time, more and more areas will become controlled hunting only (next year, we lose the most popular general elk hunt to controlled hunt status). It was only a handful of years ago, you had approx. 1/3 chance of drawing 36a, what is it now? One controversial approach which would end all of this "point hoarding" and keep hunters in their home states might be to place a limit on the life of points, say ten years. After that, they expire and you start over (use them or lose them!). This would do two things, it would eliminate guys from gathering points for years just to have them and it would give an opportunity for subsequent generations of hunters to have a chance at drawing a tag. Regardless of which approach a hunter chooses to follow one thing is certain, these systems will all need to be revamped in order to address the demand.
idahohuntr
Active Member
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- 155
There is no more fair system, particularly if demand is increasing, than a random draw. There is no need to 'revamp' a random draw. States with point systems...I'm sure we will continue to see all kinds of tweaks to try and satisfy a growing base of unhappy people. The grass is definitely not greener...
Point systems are for suckers. The only people who win with a point system are those in on day one. Everyone else is at a disadvantage especially children new to the sport. Point creep becomes a reality and the states ?update? the system several times trying to correct inherent flaws with point systems. No thanks.
The only way to give a drawing advantage to one person is to disadvantage another. If you want better drawing odds in Idaho, increase the wait periods for successful applicants and/or limit the draw choice to one animal like the trophy species.
The only way to give a drawing advantage to one person is to disadvantage another. If you want better drawing odds in Idaho, increase the wait periods for successful applicants and/or limit the draw choice to one animal like the trophy species.
Weiserbucks
Very Active Member
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- 1,659
If you don't like the random drawing, simply quit applying in Idaho.
>Point systems are for suckers.
>The only people who win
>with a point system are
>those in on day one.
> Everyone else is at
>a disadvantage especially children new
>to the sport. Point
>creep becomes a reality and
>the states ?update? the system
>several times trying to correct
>inherent flaws with point systems.
>No thanks.
>
>The only way to give a
>drawing advantage to one person
>is to disadvantage another.
>If you want better drawing
>odds in Idaho, increase the
>wait periods for successful applicants
>and/or limit the draw choice
>to one animal like the
>trophy species.
This would certainly help.
>The only people who win
>with a point system are
>those in on day one.
> Everyone else is at
>a disadvantage especially children new
>to the sport. Point
>creep becomes a reality and
>the states ?update? the system
>several times trying to correct
>inherent flaws with point systems.
>No thanks.
>
>The only way to give a
>drawing advantage to one person
>is to disadvantage another.
>If you want better drawing
>odds in Idaho, increase the
>wait periods for successful applicants
>and/or limit the draw choice
>to one animal like the
>trophy species.
This would certainly help.
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