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Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?

 
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bigmuleyboy
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Feb-03-17, 
05:52 PM (MST)
"Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I am curious to hear from some experienced hunters and their opinions on the number of management bucks seen on the Henry's and Paun's. I have inconsistent information on both units? I just wanted some more expertise from the MM crowd. I know you guys are the real experts and the real deal! Thanks in advance for any thoughts!

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  Table of Contents  

 Subject   Author   Message Date   ID 
 RE: Number of ...  BIGJOHNT      Feb-03-17   1 
  RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-03-17   2 
   RE: Number of ...  JakeH      Feb-03-17   3 
  RE: Number of ...  ByeByeObamas      Feb-03-17   4 
   RE: Number of ...  goofyelk      Feb-04-17   5 
   RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-04-17   6 
    RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-04-17   7 
    RE: Number of ...  6x7      Feb-04-17   8 
     RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-06-17   9 
      RE: Number of ...  6x7      Feb-07-17   10 
       RE: Number of ...  Muley_73      Feb-07-17   11 
        RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-07-17   12 
         RE: Number of ...  Muley_73      Feb-07-17   13 
          RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-07-17   14 
 RE: Number of ...  dillon      Feb-07-17   15 
  RE: Number of ...  El_Matador      Feb-07-17   16 
   RE: Number of ...  JakeH      Feb-07-17   17 
    RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-07-17   18 
     RE: Number of ...  JakeH      Feb-08-17   19 
      RE: Number of ...  Longun      Feb-08-17   20 
       RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-08-17   21 
        RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-08-17   22 
         RE: Number of ...  6x7      Feb-09-17   23 
          RE: Number of ...  bigmuleyboy      Feb-09-17   24 
           RE: Number of ...  El_Matador      Feb-09-17   25 

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BIGJOHNT
(3160 posts)
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Feb-03-17, 
06:30 PM (MST)
1. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

On the Henrys this year I saw a lot of management bucks that needed to be shot. But everyone with a tag was trying to find a monster management buck. Which is fine but it left a 32 " 2 x 2 to breed the does. On any open unit many of the 3 x would have been shot in a second. They need to have a youth management tag to shoot the smaller management bucks that the adults won't shoot. A lot of 3 x 4 24 to 28 wide. That where good bucks . Just not good enough for all of the hunters.

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-03-17, 
06:37 PM (MST)
2. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I like that idea of a youth management hunt giving out a limited number of tags or putting restrictions on for smaller management bucks to be taken off the unit! I hope the DNR are listening!

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JakeH
(1887 posts)
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Feb-03-17, 
10:55 PM (MST)
3. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

25% of all the management tags already go to the youth, so they essentially already have what you are suggesting.


Jake H. BIG BONE HUNTING Page on Facebook.


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ByeByeObamas
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Feb-03-17, 
10:58 PM (MST)
4. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Good point.

They need more tags. I would shoot a 26+ 2 pt older deer. Only insecure guys are interested in inches....

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goofyelk
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Feb-04-17, 
11:22 AM (MST)
5. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

The DWR HAS added archery and muzzy management hunts for 2017.

As for the OP,
Not as many management bucks on the Pauns'y as there use to be.IMO

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-04-17, 
07:07 PM (MST)
6. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I think I read in the "Big Game Guide Book" that the percentage for youth was 30% and 65 and older 30% and the remaining 40% to regular ages 18-65. I think a management hunt with restrictions would be the best option. Say 1-4 yr old bucks with less that 25" spreads and white antlers. Limit the tags to 10 to 15 tags. Problem is the ability to identify these bucks for the explained characteristics above. The 10-15 who draw the tag must photo the buck and send in a tooth. What do you guys think? I like the idea of taking a picture of all limited entry kills and getting a good library of information on each Limited entry area.

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-04-17, 
07:10 PM (MST)
7. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I guess the biologists and board will decide the number of management tags for the new hunts on the Henry's. (Archery and Muzzleloader).

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6x7
(1070 posts)
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Feb-04-17, 
08:14 PM (MST)
8. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

>I think I read in the
>"Big Game Guide Book" that
>the percentage for youth was
>30% and 65 and older
>30% and the remaining 40%
>to regular ages 18-65.
>I think a management hunt
>with restrictions would be the
>best option. Say 1-4
>yr old bucks with less
>that 25" spreads and white
>antlers. Limit the tags
>to 10 to 15 tags.
> Problem is the ability
>to identify these bucks for
>the explained characteristics above.
>The 10-15 who draw the
>tag must photo the buck
>and send in a tooth.
>What do you guys think?
> I like the idea
>of taking a picture of
>all limited entry kills and
>getting a good library of
>information on each Limited entry
>area.

They take a tooth and picture the Managment bucks all ready everyone has to be checked

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-06-17, 
10:21 PM (MST)
9. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I know they(DNR) have been taking teeth. How long has the DNR been taking pictures too?

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6x7
(1070 posts)
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Feb-07-17, 
03:19 AM (MST)
10. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Not sure but they took a pic of my dads deer this last season when they checked it

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Muley_73
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Feb-07-17, 
08:53 AM (MST)
11. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

White antlers? Please explain where the color of the antlers plays into this.

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-07-17, 
11:49 AM (MST)
12. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Just my personal opinion when I see white antlers I usually associate that with smaller bucks. Not always the case though. I have seen 4 yr old (+) bucks with white antlers that are very nice. I have seen yearling bucks with brown antlers as well. I think geography and location are factors as well. Most of the bucks I see with white antlers are in desert terrain or lower elevation. Higher elevation I see bucks with a darker brown antler. Not always the case but in my opinion the majority of the time. There is always seasonal deer migration. I am talking about the Fall hunting season and where the deer are located at the time of hunting season. Just my .02 cents.

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Muley_73
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Feb-07-17, 
11:52 AM (MST)
13. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

The color of a deers antlers depends on the habitat. Nothing to do with genetics or management.

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bigmuleyboy
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Feb-07-17, 
12:03 PM (MST)
14. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I guess the point I am trying to make is. Take 1-4 yr old management bucks off the Henry's and Paun's with a youth hunt giving out 10 -15 permits per unit. Then continue to take an additional 25 -30 management bucks (any management buck not just the 1-4 yr old bucks) off of each unit which is already in place. That is why I am curious about the number of management bucks on each unit. Maybe increase or decrease the numbers according to a biologist count or hunter count of management bucks.

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dillon
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Feb-07-17, 
04:59 PM (MST)
15. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I have seen some absolute monster management bucks on the Paunsaugunt. It seemed like I saw fewer management bucks on the Henry Mountains. Just my two bits.

Dillon

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El_Matador
(275 posts)
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Feb-07-17, 
05:48 PM (MST)
16. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I hunted the Pauns muzzy about 3 years ago and saw a couple of nice management bucks. Both were 3x4, 170s type bucks.

I think the management hunts are a bad idea and should be done away with. There are a ton of small 4 points that will never get shot on these units because they don't fit anybody's bill. What we need instead is 2 LE seasons. Give the regular LE guys first hack at it, and then open it up to a LE hunt with more tags. The second season guys won't be so picky and a bunch of those old, average 4 points will be harvested. The current management strategy is really great if you're trying to waste 1/2 of the bucks on the unit.

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JakeH
(1887 posts)
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Feb-07-17, 
07:25 PM (MST)
17. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

>
>
>I think the management hunts are
>a bad idea and should
>be done away with.
>There are a ton of
>small 4 points that will
>never get shot on these
>units because they don't fit
>anybody's bill. What we
>need instead is 2 LE
>seasons. Give the regular
>LE guys first hack at
>it, and then open it
>up to a LE hunt
>with more tags. The
>second season guys won't be
>so picky and a bunch
>of those old, average 4
>points will be harvested.
>The current management strategy is
>really great if you're trying
>to waste 1/2 of the
>bucks on the unit.

LMAO, guys wont be as picky? yeah cause the Colorado 3rd season hunts are just peoples back up meat buck hunts, Its the Pauns, and the Henrys, people are going to be picky unless they are regulated to killing 3 points.

The current system isn't perfect, but its a hell of a lot better than what you just suggested.


Jake H. BIG BONE HUNTING Page on Facebook.


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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-07-17, 
11:13 PM (MST)
18. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Interesting thoughts. So from what I am hearing there are a lot of management bucks on both units. Do more tags need to be given out for management hunts or leave it be?

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JakeH
(1887 posts)
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Feb-08-17, 
00:48 AM (MST)
19. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Currently on the Henery's there are something like 60-70 bucks per 100 does, the DWR thinks this number needs to be brought down. So rather than giving more tags for people to kill the biggest and best on the unit, they have started management buck hunts, so to get more bucks killed on the unit without taking out all of the top end bucks hunters are regulated to deer that have not more than 3 points on at least 1 side.

The DWR really dont care what bucks are on the unit and believe this is purely a "social issue" meaning its not biologically helping the deer on the unit other than taking more bucks from the overall herd helps the herd. They do these hunts to keep the public happy as most of the public want big antlers.

This year the DWR are introducing 2 new hunts on the Henery's unit a management archery tag and a management muzzle loader tag. The sole purpose is to take more bucks from the herd, without overcrowding the rifle management hunt.

So, its not that there is an over abundance of management bucks (according to the DWR) on the units, its that they want to reduce the number of bucks overall while at the same time removing bucks that would not normally get shot, thus preserving the bigger racked bucks. There is a number of deer that are kind of in the no mans land, crab clawed 4x4s that nobody wants to kill, or that cannot be killed on the management hunt, but there is not much you can do about that.

Personally I feel they need to implement some of these hunts on other units in the state, as currently they only have them on the 2 premium units the Henerys and and the Pauns. The Bookcliffs is in desperate need of a management buck hunt as I am sure other units are in need of as well, but I doubt it will ever come.

Jake H. BIG BONE HUNTING Page on Facebook.


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Longun
(3214 posts)
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Feb-08-17, 
05:59 AM (MST)
20. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

I would of shot that 32 inch Forked Horn in a heartbeat...

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-08-17, 
05:02 PM (MST)
21. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Thanks JakeH for the good insight. My question is how many of the 50-70 bucks per 100 does are management bucks on the Henry's and Paun's. I am kind of looking for a ball park figure from hunters who have been on both units. Just guesses are fine even.

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bigmuleyboy
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Feb-08-17, 
05:07 PM (MST)
22. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Yes, other LE units should offer management buck hunts. JakeH is spot on with the Books. Last time I was out there I saw a heck of a lot of 3x4's. I have even seen some pretty decent 2x2's and 2x3's not to many other branched antlered 3x~'s out on the Books.

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6x7
(1070 posts)
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Feb-09-17, 
01:23 AM (MST)
23. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

We saw a ton of small bucks that would qualify as Managment bucks ,but they were still young so who knows what they would grow up to in another 3 to 5 years.
During the hunt we saw only 4 bucks that meet antler and what they consider mature deer requirements that they would want harvested.

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bigmuleyboy
(59 posts)
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Feb-09-17, 
12:40 PM (MST)
24. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

Thanks for the information given. The MM crowd is great!

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El_Matador
(275 posts)
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Feb-09-17, 
01:49 PM (MST)
25. "RE: Number of management bucks on the Henry's and Paun"s?"

JakeH, you can laugh your ass off all you want. Its a fact that giving more tags will result in hunters being less picky and shooting smaller bucks. I hunted the Henry's when it was a general season hunt and I saw people shooting spike bucks! Yes, on the Henrys! And even back then the Henrys produced 200" bucks every year. So despite what you might think, when competition increases, people will lower their standards. But, as long as big money is making the rules down there we are not going to see much of a change. They would rather waste 75% of the bucks on that unit than risk losing a few $$ on an auction tag.

In the meanwhile we have these management hunts and they provide a small amount of increased opportunity. More power to you if you can put one to good use.

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