DWR ?

M

muzzle

Guest
I would like to know what you guys think about this. Last fall my brother in law shot a bull on the general muzzy hunt. I was there when he shot it and helped him quater the bull and pack it out. The bull was hit twice. Once in the front shoulder and once in the ribs. We took the two hind quaters, the full good front shoulder and what was left of the other. (It was hamburger from the shot) We also took the back straps and what we could on the neck.
We ran into a Fish Cop on the way down from the mountain. After all but giving us a physical on the mountain, he looked over our meet. He then started giving us the business about exactly what we took off the bull and such. Seemed to me like he was on a fishing expedition of some kind but we had nothing to hide so we played along and were cooperative. After playing 20 questions, he asked us if we took the interrior something something straps. "They are real small he says but they are the best part" We both look at each other and say "The what now?" He then offers to hike all the way back to the bull to show us how to get them off. (5 miles worth) We look at each other thinking is this guy for real? We declined his offer for a stroll through the woods as we were beat to hell as it was. He say fine and we go on our way.

We I just found out from my brother in law that the F&G showed up at his door a month or so ago and said they are charging him with wanten destruction of wildlife! The claim from deputy douche bag is that there was neck muscle and rib meat that could have been taken. He claims he hiked all the way to the site and scaped meat off that could have been taken. I'm calling absolut BS on that! This claim is outrageous..I was there and I am confident we took all we could that could have been saved. We had 4 full game bags for hell sakes. I have quartered many animals over the years and been checked many times by F&G and never had anyone question my methods.

He is all stressed out now as they are pressuring him to plead guitly and call it a day. I told him no way in hell he is going to do that. I don't know what this guys malfuntion is but it sounds like a witch hunt. I have never even heard of anything like this. How does one fight this kind of BS?
 
Well its going to boil down to testimony and evidence . If he walked in there , and found proof that there was usable meat left at the kill site , and nobody went back for it thats going to be pretty hard to beat .

If he took pictures or some how documented the waste if there was any , its going to be tough to fight .

So a question for you . Did two of you bring all the meat and cape , rack , etc in one trip each , or how may trips each did it take for the four game bags ?
 
I'll bet He went & took the Tenderloins!

Yes,if you left them behind,you left the best part!

Bet'Ya money He ate them!:D

For "GOSH" Sakes,We got "TARDS" on this Site that can't handle a Damn,I Mean DANG thing,maybe MM should add a Church/Biblical Forum for the MM'ers that can't handle the Hunting Forums?
Pfffffffffff............!!!

I don't care if they're big or small!
If they throw lead I like em all!


:p
 
I would make them take you to court and fight it. They are going to have to shoe pictures and prove the wanten destruction of the animal. I think most people are scared and just pay the fine. Sounds like BS.
 
Technically the wildlife officer is right. I have not read every states laws in regard to what exactly must be taken from the animal but the tenderloins from a bull elk are the best cuts of meat on the animal. These strips are on the inside of the ribcage towards the rear and lie just under the spinal column. Failure to remove and take from kill site may be a considered a small offense but man they are the choice cuts and should always be taken. I am not sure how your friend would fare in a trial if he chooses to go that far but the state does indeed have a case. Sorry and Good Luck.

P.S. If your friend chooses to cut a deal and plead guilty I would adisve him to consult a lawyer and get everything agreed upon in writing. I have had experience and the DWR can play nasty.
 
Me & Jr Hiked back in to help pack an Elk out a few years back!

When they were done Cuttin & Hackin,Jr said :You Guys done?

They said yup,We've boned the Bull clear out!

Jr got his knife out & removed the TenderLoins!

Damn them were good!

Can't believe that many Hunters look past the Best piece of Meat on an Animal?



For "GOSH" Sakes,We got "TARDS" on this Site that can't handle a Damn,I Mean DANG thing,maybe MM should add a Church/Biblical Forum for the MM'ers that can't handle the Hunting Forums?
Pfffffffffff............!!!

I don't care if they're big or small!
If they throw lead I like em all!


:p
 
Yes, they may have a case, but there's no point in prosecuting hunters who are trying to obey the law. They are just making enimies of those who would normally support them. This DWR officer is doing more harm than good which is too bad. Most DWR officers I've met and delt with have been great guys.

Good luck with your case.

Dub
 
Good points guys. It took us two trips to the wheelers. My bad, all this time hunting and I never knew the tenderloins were on the inside of the ribcage. I thought the back straps were part of the loins? Feels stupid there but honestly, that would have been all the usuable meat left on it. I want to see his pics if he has any because I can't image they would support his case and can only help us. Even if the officer was techinically correct about the loins, why punish a good and decent hunter when we thought we did it all right? He is so shaken by this deal, we won't come on the elk hunt this year..first time ever he has missed. Oh well, he'll be ok but I think this rediculous.
 
Whether they have a case or not all depends on which state you were in. If the incident happened in utah they have a valid case, utah requires you take a minimum of the 4 quarters, the backstraps and the tenderloins.
 
Yeah, it sounds like the tenderloins...

I don't know the situation and what happened.... But, if it was me I would really be careful about pleading guilty. It sounds like an honest mistake.

Without going into detail, I had a family member go through an experience where the Game Officer was a complete jerk and gave a ticket when he should not have done so. He kept trying to get him to write a confession, or in his words "suffer worse consequences. Well, this family member went and got an Attorney and fought it. He was found innocent and the Officer looked like a fool.

Having said this, most Game Officers have been really good in my experience. But, like everywhere else, there are always a few bad apples....
 
Just make sure you get an attorney. It would be worth your time and money. A letter from a lawyer might change the dwr's tune.

copple2
 
There is no way in hell they hiked back in there 5 miles. Any snow to follow your tracks?


What a bunch of dbags.

Good luck.
 
I think the guidebook states that a certain percentge of the meat must be taken. You might want to look into this.
Sounds like you guys retrieved better than 80% of the goods. Do not plead guilty and risk your hunting priviledges.
I agree with the other statement, have a lawyer send a letter. A lawyer will first make a motion for discovery, at that point you will see the evidence the other side is working with.

Keep us posted!
 
Actually in Wyoming there is a formula for the size of the bull vs. the lbs of meat you need to show. I believe that on a 6point you have to have 185 lbs of boned out meat or they give you a ticket for waste.

They actually will weight it all and make sure! Just a word to the wise when going through game check stations up there :)

Cheers,
Pete
 
Well, thanks guys. He has been advised not to plead guilty on this one...besides, what's the worst that can happen? They find him guilty?

I'm curious though as to why he didn't write him a ticket right there and then? He knew we didn't take the loins and he could see the amount of meat we had..a year later..fishy!
 
I think He wanted them TenderLoins from the Get-Go!

When He had to Hike in to get them You made him mad!:D

And this is for Ziggy!

You may wanna reconsider what a DWR Officer will do in TARDville!

If You had left your Bull in the woods for months here like you did where you live You'd be in Trouble too!:D

For "GOSH" Sakes,We got "TARDS" on this Site that can't handle a Damn,I Mean DANG thing,maybe MM should add a Church/Biblical Forum for the MM'ers that can't handle the Hunting Forums?
Pfffffffffff............!!!

I don't care if they're big or small!
If they throw lead I like em all!


:p
 
its b.s. don't play their game. I always do my best to follow the rules... but always nervous around fish cops for this very reason.
 
>I think He wanted them TenderLoins
>from the Get-Go!
>
>When He had to Hike in
>to get them You made
>him mad!:D
>
>And this is for Ziggy!
>
>You may wanna reconsider what a
>DWR Officer will do in
>TARDville!
>
>If You had left your Bull
>in the woods for months
>here like you did where
>you live You'd be in
>Trouble too!:D
>
>For "GOSH" Sakes,We got "TARDS" on
>this Site that can't handle
>a Damn,I Mean DANG thing,maybe
>MM should add a Church/Biblical
>Forum for the MM'ers that
>can't handle the Hunting Forums?
>
>Pfffffffffff............!!!
>
>I don't care if they're big
>or small!
>If they throw lead I like
>em all!
>
>
>
>:p


I'm guilty bobby. Guilty of leaving a boned out carcass with antlers attached. I know how lazy our fish cops are so there was NCIH they were going to get off their dead ass unless there was a donut shop near by. Antlers recovered so nothing but bones now. Picking my 2011 bull out now. Wish me luck.
 
I got a warning ticket for having only 38lbs of deboned meat off a buck. Guy was a dink, that was in Ut. You should of told him you took everything.
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-23-11 AT 01:45PM (MST)[p]2 Pieces of advice for the guy that finds himself a suspect for an unintentional game violation (if you are a stone cold poacher this isn't for you).

1. NEVER admit anything or sign a confession for a game violation. If they want to write you a ticket let them do it, but I would decline to answer any questions or give any kind of statement without a consultation with your attorney. If they want to interrogate you make them do it in the presence of your attorney. Take it to court and fight it out. If you really didn't intend to do anything wrong that will come out in court and more than likely the judge will at least have a little mercy. Lots of good guys that make mistakes will find that if they fight it in court they get lesser punishment than if they just plead guilty.

2. NEVER put a post on a public forum on the internet confessing to a game violation that is currently under investigation, i.e. posting on MM and admitting that you left the tenderloins to a bull. Fish cops do read these forums and will now have some additional evidence in the case.
 
Read the story again how many trips did it take you on foot? It would would be four trips with meat plus the head. Like C3 said 185lbs of meat, my guess is you get about 200lbs on and elk.
 
+1 Lien2... I doubt he ever found the carcass..


One thing is for sure. If you fight it, they have to provide you and your attorney with every bit of evidence they have against you... At least then you'd be able to see if they have a case or not...


"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
Well Ziggy!

Can we see a picture of the Meat?

We know it be several months before you retrieve the Head & Hide!



For "GOSH" Sakes,We got "TARDS" on this Site that can't handle a Damn,I Mean DANG thing,maybe MM should add a Church/Biblical Forum for the MM'ers that can't handle the Hunting Forums?
Pfffffffffff............!!!

I don't care if they're big or small!
If they throw lead I like em all!


:p
 
If he volunteered to walk back there with you and show you what he was talking about, that should have been a clue that you should have taken him up on it. I have seen to many examples of wasted meat in the field. I wasn't there and won't judge your butchering job. I have seen many examples of people cited for having a coho salmon that they thought was a king, or having the wrong spiecies of rockfish. It is really unfornutate that they don't always look at the intent. If you had hiked backed in with him you would have learned something and avoided a ticket. Life is not fair!
Ted
 
They are asking you to plead guilty for a reason, its because they don't have any hard evidence if they did they wouldn't need you to plead guilty. Even if they have pictures unless your in them they have no evidence that this is the bull that you shot, only problem I see here is if they get a hold of this thread and figure out who you are then yes they have evidence of you admitting you left the tenderloins which I can't see why you left them, you can actually reach in between the ribs and guts and cut them out without gutting the animal it takes 2 minutes and they are the best! Good Luck it seems to me the guy is just being a douche bag in my opinion!!!
 
What a load of shitt on the dwr's part last year on the spike hunt a hunter shot a cow and left it.
we found her 20 minutes after he shot her we called the dwr they told us they would be out in a couple days and wanted gps quards so i gave them
then i offered to quarter and bone the cow and they told me absolutely not i told them she was shot in the head only and they told me to leave her alone so we did.
Is that not the same damn thing only worse
UDWR IS A JOKE

[email protected]

[email protected]


'IT AINT EASY BEING ME'
 
Not sure how you think that is even close to the same thing. You had no legal right to the meat, plus it was taken illegally. Why would they let you butcher up an animal that they haven't even had a chance to investigate what happened with? I equate that to letting a mortuary cremate a body before the cops even investigate the murder. That makes no sense at all.
 
Whether the meat was for you or for the DWR, it makes no difference at all. The meat in this case MUST be left as is so they can perform a proper investigation. If the DWR officer was there right after it happened you might actually have an argument. You can call me whatever you want, but out of both of us, I am the only one that has a clue.
 
Here is what happened :)

After contemplating the encounter with the DWR, while finishing the hike out you decide that it would be probabably be best to go get the tenderloins. So at first light the very next morning you hike back in there to finish the job. and...

a: you retrieved the tenderloins
or
b: they were gone, someone took (stole) them.

Note: be sure you have DWR story in writing or documented before you chose a or b.
 
the dwr is your friend. the dwr will allways help you. the dwr would never lie to you. the dwr does great things for wildlife' the dwr never thinks about the money. god bless the dwr......
 
You're innocent until proven guilty. Make the guy prove you wrong in court. Chances are he might not even show.
 
No one that works for the DWR (or anyone else in law enforcement/public service) makes any money. They don't throw rocks at you while you are at work. . . . mowing, either. These guys/gals have the impossible job of trying to keep everyone happy while enforcing laws. Don't break the law. Problem solved.
 
If I were you I would get this post erased soon. You have admitted guilt in your post. read the book and you will see that from your argument you are guilty. My bud got the same ticket and we only left the neck and ribs. A lot of money and court battle later, well u know the story! If you could have gotten anymore meat you should have according to the dwr and that is how it works.
wish you luck
curtis wilson
 
5 miles and found the remains of an elk?? Was it on the trail?? Good luck with that!!! I don't beleive they found any elk!! I would have to see pictures to beleive it.


Government doesn't fix anything and has spent trillions proving it!!!
Let's face it...After Monday and Tuesday, even the calender says WTF!
 
>Well Ziggy!
>
>Can we see a picture of
>the Meat?
>
>We know it be several months
>before you retrieve the Head
>& Hide!
>
>
>
>For "GOSH" Sakes,We got "TARDS" on
>this Site that can't handle
>a Damn,I Mean DANG thing,maybe
>MM should add a Church/Biblical
>Forum for the MM'ers that
>can't handle the Hunting Forums?
>
>Pfffffffffff............!!!
>
>I don't care if they're big
>or small!
>If they throw lead I like
>em all!
>
>
>
>:p


So you want a picture of my meat? Who takes a picture of their meat? Maybe .0001 percent I would assume. Maybe you want a picture of my freezer?
 
Interesting reads on the Moose, Sheep, Goat and Antelope thread. Now 2 (that we know of) goats shot in the Uintas were left because they were unretrievable and it's ok with the DWR. Where do you draw the line? I guess it depends on what kind of mood the warden is in.
 
Looks like a shake down by this one particular DWR agent. I would force the DWR to prove their allegations.

Eldorado
 
I would think they would have to proof the elk they found was the same one you guys left behind, I guess they could do a DNA test on the meat that is in your freezer and match it up to the dead elk, But it sure would blow the case if the meat in your freezer was a different DNA. It would be hard for them to say it the same bull if the DNA didn't match. I mean how many different elk are you your freezer.

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>[Font][Font color = "green"]Life member of
>the MM green signature club.[font/]
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-06-11 AT 07:16AM (MST)[p]sounds like you pack out more meat than any hunter i ever seen on genral hunt .they dont even gut elk just back straps hind 1/4 thats it. game warden up north says ok front shoulders shot to hell is excusse everone gives. what do you do.
 

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