Key to Consistently Killing Big Bucks?

C

cowslayer

Active Member
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I wanted to throw this question out to you all and get your insight into killing big bucks. I know there are a few of you that without a doubt have the big buck game figured out. What is the biggest key now days to killing "Monster Muleys"?

$$$ ?
Private Land?
The right unit?
Being in shape?
Long range shooting ability?
Getting away from the crowds/roads?
Glassing?
Scouting?
Understanding their habits and "Monster Muleys"?
Patience?
Confidence?
???

CS
 
Consistently killing them year after year???

Definitely $$$$$$$$$$$$

Just my .02
 
I can't tell you the key to consistently killing big bucks because I have never killed one. But I can tell you that my tactics have drastically changed over the last three years and now I consistently see many deer and during hunting season I consistently see bucks more than anything else. What has changed is that I quit hunting from a truck. The first thing I did was buy a spotting scope, 15x bino's and a quality pair of 10x bino's. I started reading articles in magazines about bivouac hunting and I bought a back pack, high quality sleeping bag and a small tent and got into the wilderness areas. Thats when everything changed for me and now I know that it is just a matter of time and sooner ar later I'm gonna get me a big buck. So far the best quality of bucks I'm finding is 170's class and maybe a 180 class which for me is a great deer. So for me it was optics and getting away from the crowds and hunting unpressured deer. fatrooster.
 
$$$ for sure. $$$ makes all the others possible. It can be done with less $$$, but $$$ will get a big buck 9 out of 10 times.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-12-07 AT 10:29PM (MST)[p]I totally disagree with the whole $$$$$$ concept! I have my fair share of p&y bucks and bulls and all were taken on public land, diy, ultra low budget hunts! The key is perseverance, dedication and homework!!!! You aint gonna kill a nice buck or bull year after year by road hunting or going about it halfassed! $$$$ only buys you an easy hunt.
Eric

Ultra liberal, wolf loving, illiterate, gay, hippie midgets on crack piss me off!!!!

deerline.gif
 
LAST EDITED ON May-12-07 AT 11:22PM (MST)[p]Don't get me wrong, if you put enough time and effort into scouting your unit you can kill a big buck on a shoestring budget without a doubt. But, If you have the money to spend there is no doubt you can kill big bucks year after year. Sure, you can do it other ways like most of us on here do. But, money can substitute for: scouting, tags, time, draws, etc.
 
PB,
Totally agree with ya. "The key is perseverance, dedication and homework!!!!" is where it's at. You don't need money. You can kill monster bucks on a shoe string budget. You just need to commit your time and effort and make it a year long passion. Some guys golf in the off season, I scout. Some guys are busy doing yard work while I'm out pounding the bush looking for tine. It's all a matter of perspective.
 
Polarbear and BCBOy, AMEN!

Saying $$$$$$ is a cpo-out.IMO. $$$$ can get you a good tag every year, but folks that 'want it' can 'get it' EVERY year.

PRO
 
Pro-
$$$$$$ is not a cop-out, it's reality. If you have a hunting budget of $15,000 a year there is no doubt you are going to kill a big buck every single year. Is that sad?? I think so, but that's reality whether you or I like it or not. Those who "want it" can "get it", you are definitely right. But, those that are rich can "get it" too.
 
Cash flow is a major player in hunts.

I do not use an application service and I am strickly a DIY type hunter.

Sometimes remote pack in with the llama pack string and sometimes road side RV camp with the Polaris 6x6 for getting to and from a certain area and then bushwacking for miles-round trip. It equals out about the same $$ costs.

Ya need $$ to apply, $$ to pay for the tag if drawn, $$ to travel for scouting, $$ for any tweaking of your hunt gear/weapon (s) seasonally, $$ for the actual hunt-fuel-travel-eats ect., $$ for mounting harvest.... all on 1 tag.... $$ is a tremendous factor even for those that are 'credit card' hunters.

Throw in two tags -- two states and it increases the $$ factor two fold.

I personally feel drawing the same tag a year or two in a row is very helpful as you have learned the unit alot the first go-round. Unfortunately, with the draw systems of the west today, you are lucky to get the same tag every 5-10 years! ha

Robb

I think you could add ethics to your list......
 
Robb, I totally agree. Unless you live/work/ hunt in your own backyard, you better have some $$$. It also takes a considerable amount of time.

Eel
 
IMHO: dedicated hunters who really work at it can take nice public land bucks.
BUT, guys with the big bucks,, read that money, can hunt private land, buy landowner and conservation tags and hunt premium country almost every year. Guides will do all the scouting for them and put them in good country and on big bucks. And that equals more chances year in and year out. Not saying it's wrong or that it's even not fair, it's just the way it is.



----------------------------------------
Measure wealth by the things you have,, for which you would not take money.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-13-07 AT 09:44AM (MST)[p]Now I don't hunt the draw system's that you guys got down there, but I'm almost willing to bet that many units that aren't considered 'Trophy' units probably hold some pretty solid bucks. With a lot of time and effort, I'm willing to bet there are guys that consistantly kill big bucks DIY on public land. Like I said it is all a matter of perspective. What do you want??? Do you want to work your ass off all year so you can make those payments on that big fancy house and never have the time to hunt, or do you buy a nice small house out in the country, live simply and hunt, scout, and play year round???? I hear it all the time up here in our local forums. Guys living in the rat race of Vancouver, trying to make it, that somehow think that if they just hunt where I hunt, they will be killing big bucks. Sorry, but there ain't anything special about where I hunt. The fact is I know it like the back of my hand cause it's my back yard. I've made my sacrifices. I live in a simple little town in a simple little house. We have a single income family and we do need the wild game for the freezer. My hobbies are simple cause it is all I can afford. When I'm bored, I grab the camera and go for a walk. No money involved. I am sure there are tons of places all over NA that are just like this one. How bad do ya want it is the question?
 
key to finding big bucks every year:

get away from people,

good optics,

patience,

know your area and last,

shoot straight.
 
I think too many of you are focused on the financial side, when so much more is involved than just buying your way to a big buck. That can be done to some degree, but we all know that and you guys have beat that aspect to death here, IMO.

To answer the question that was originally posed, I think there are three keys that will give anyone an opportunity.
1. Hunt in units and areas that have the potential to produce a mature buck in the 4-7 age range.
2. Spend plenty of time scouting and hunting there. Spend your time each day wisely, you'll kill very few bucks from camp so spend your day in areas where you're likely to see a buck at given times of the day.
3. Hunt smart. Use your optics if the country is conducive to that, and make your shot count when you get an opportunity.
 
Just my .02 but to kill big bucks you have to hunt like big bucks act, and the only way to find that out is to spend as much time in the woods scouting and be smart about the way your hunting. Only from personal experience, but all of the big bucks that I have killed have been between the hours of 12 noon and 3:30. So stay in the hills all day. You won't kill a big buck back at camp cooking breakfast at 9 in the morning. Put the time in and sooner or later it will pay off. Also you have to wait for a big buck, you never shoot a big buck if you shoot the first buck you see. I only hunt public land DIY, and I have been fortunate to kill a few trophy class bucks in the last couple of years, it just to alot of homework and hunting daylight to daybreak. I totally agree that $$$$$$$$$ will only buy you an easy hunt.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-13-07 AT 11:46AM (MST)[p]My plan was to tail Bess around and see where he is scouting. Then I would get up real early and beat him to the top(because I have my wheeler). Wait till daylight and watch for the infamous Nomad buck to arise and throw as much lead at him as I could, then probably my gun. Then go home happy!! Im in the process of publishing my first book...LOL


In all seriousness time and patience is the key. It wouldnt hurt to have a really nice boss that is very understanding too!
 
LAST EDITED ON May-13-07 AT 02:32PM (MST)[p]Money:

If you don't have money to apply for prime areas in several states or can't afford gas for scouting trips when it's $3.19 per gallon, you're odds are cut way down. Also, while I don't think equipment necessarily makes the hunter, good equipment goes a long way towards success. Dry feet, dry skin, a good nights sleep, an accurate rifle, and good glass can make all the difference in the world.

Time:

If your job or other commitments limit your time in the field for scouting/hunting, your odds are cut way down.

Skill:

Self explanatory, but if you stumble around the hills blindly and don't have a clue what you're doing, you're killing your chances of harvesting trophy animals on a consistent basis. Skill also includes, but is not limited to, being in shape, reading a topo map, reading terrain, scouting, tracking, glassing, shooting, etc.

Patience:

If you can't sit still and glass or you'd rather be sitting in camp, you're going to miss opportunities.

Luck:

Maybe it's that they make their own luck, but some guys just seem to have plain 'ole shithouse luck when it comes to drawing tags and harvesting quality animals. I know of one guy here in Utah who drew 4 O.I.L. permits in less than 10 years!...
 
I believe the main key is time. Having the time to make several scouting trips. Taking time to talk with biologists, wardens, locals, etc. Having the time to spend the whole season out hunting, not just 2-3 days and come back home. Take the time to glass for several hours. When time is on your side, big bucks will follow.

oakbrush
 
I have been very lucky killling big bucks and I beleive the key is knowing the area your hunting has big bucks, then spending every minute you have in the (deer zone) during your season. A good pair of boots and luck work me also.
 
Money can buy you a big buck, but you don't need it. Obviously you will have expenses on any hunt, but I think we are talking big money for tags and guides. If you can't afford gas, that's a whole different story. I have a friend that has killed 2 bucks over 200 inches in northern Utah since 2000. Both were on public land. The key? They guy hunts his butt off. Out of the tent by 4:00 am, not back until night, lots of glassing and hiking, passing on small bucks, tracking big deer. He owns private property and has $$, but doesn't need them to kill big bucks. I talk to guys in the field every year who are sitting in the truck or on a wheeler complaining about the lack of deer and how the rich guys are ruining the sport with governer's tags. Or how they missed a forkhorn that was the only buck they saw. I don't tell them that I just passed on a nice buck 1/2 mile from the road they are sitting on. There are good bucks killed every year by "average joes" , it just takes some work.

Me personally, I grew up in a family that was back to camp by 10 am and played poker until 4 then drove around looking for deer from the road. Once I left the roads and hunted all day on foot I saw tons more deer. I just bought some nice glass finally and plan to spend more time glassing as well.

Andy
 
$

$ makes it easy to get out more often
$ makes it easier to buy private land
$ makes it so i can buy swarovski
$ makes it so i can put if for 6 states
$ makes it so i can get an outfitter in 6 states
$ makes it so i can buy a landowner tag when i dont draw one
$ makes it easier to buy a reliable truck to get out there in
$ makes it easier to get a nice rifel and scope
$ makes it easier period

guess thats why my best buck to date is a 26" taken on public ground with a general season tag in a national wilderness area and packed out on my back.

"One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
$$$$$$. If you dont have the money to get out there scouting as much as you need to, then you arent gonna find the big bucks. It takes lots of time, and you know how much gas prices are now right? Not everyone gets to hunt in their back yard.
 
$$$$$$ is a COP-OUT! I live in a part of Utah where trophy mulies are few and far between, yet I, a money challenged hunter, have managed to kill THREE B&C bucks(2 of them w/archery gear) on public land. Knowing how, where, and when to hunt is MUCH more important than money. Money is the 'easy' way to kill big bucks, but it isn't the ONLY way. Lots of 'average joe's' kill big bucks year in and year out.

PRO
 
Hunt country that you know holds big bucks or has the potential. Get away from the crowds. The best way and most affordable way to get away from the crowds that I have found is hire a outfitter and do a drop camp. It might take a year or two in the same area but then you will know where the deer are and you will be able to hunt them. Invest in some good optics. Glass alot and then work on being the very best stillhunter that you can be (the deer will let you know when you screw up). I am 50 years old and have been hunting this way here in Washington for the last thirty years. It has worked good for me and my hunting partners.
 
I have been very lucky and sometimes unlucky when it comes to killing big bucks, but I usually fill my tag with a pig and have been on quite a roll for a number of years killing big bucks, despite my weaknesses. I am for the most part a lousy shot, especially with a gun and I am impatient, whereas I bust alot of nice bucks as a result of not slowing down enough.

However, I compensate these two weakenesses with my strengths, which usually allow me to get my buck. Here is what I do pretty well that usually gets me some good bone on the wall.

1. Stop shooting average bucks, gotta be willing to eat that tag

2. Hunt harder and farther in than anyone else. Go where ATVS are not allowed and no roads are near, no brainer right. Leave camp at 4 am, return back well after dark. Hunt long, deep and hard.

3. Time in the field. To do 1 and 2, a man needs time off. I save most of my vacation for hunting season. Commit at least 10 days to hunt Mr. Big.

4. Hunt the Rut. I know another no brainer and not possible in all states, but get as close to it as you can and spend number 3 here at this time.

5. SCOUT as much as possible.

6. Talk to the biologist in whatever respected area you hunt. I am often amazed how under utilized this resource is. I have hunted many states and never, I mean never been steered wrong by a game biologist. However, I have had quite a bit of advice from other hunters that sent me into some very dry holes.

7. Hunt Strategy - Have multiple areas and strategies. Be ready to adjust if the weather has changed the game, etc. Have good maps, study them and have back up plans. Again, this takes time and you should have patience as I have been known to move to quick sometimes.

These are the things that I really focus on, but at the end of the day having strong will power and continuing to hunt hard will determine the outcome, never giving up to the last hour of the last day of the hunt.

Good luck in 07'! Hope you stick or shoot that monster buck.
 
Others have covered where I as coming from on the $$$ side. Money is the thing that makes it all possible from being able to buy a General license to the ammo, gun, bow or what ever else is needed. Now having said that I have never paid a trespass fee, hired a guide, "bought a tag", or any of the other ways hunting is being turned into a money sport. I do own some good equipment that money allowed me to buy. Having some money allows me to take off work to hunt. Enough about money I have been lucky enough to kill three DIY P&Y Mule bucks on public ground in general season the last four years. How?.. hunted hard long and let the dinks go. How was I able to spend weeks in the woods?...money even if it is less then others.
 
LUCK.....
luck get you the tags
luck get that monster seen
luck puts you at the right place right time
luck that put the wife in a good enough mood to let you go
luck no one shoots you
lucky shot
luck BOBCATBESS has not found your Quad and tuned it for you
luck some dumb arse has pushed him to you
luck work lets you have time off to go
luck luck luck
rackmaster
 
1. Getting a tag = OPPORTUNITY combined with spending the time knowing the deer and where they will be in the unit/units you are hunting.........without a tag, you need to still get out and practice each year learning the unit and habits of the deer in preparation for when you draw........................ Thanks, Allen Taylor......
 
Money allows you to get tags to hunt the best area's every year. After that is when all the other stuff that anyone with the desire can do. Most of us only get a few of the opportunities to hunt the areas that hold the monsters. The saying that to be lucky rather than good is sadly true in alot of cases.
 
proutdoors,

so you are saying that if we lived in an area where we had b&c bucks in our backyard we too could get a great buck?

usually those plaes don't have high paying jobs....so once again you sacrifice $

you just forfeit it instead of earn it and then buy a great tag with $

"One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
Good topic.

I would have to say there is a tie for #1 and #2 reasons being money and time.

I am 8 hrs from a decent deer hunt. I live in SoCal.

I have the money to apply, but cant afford the time to "scout" 5-6 days at a time, several times per year...........Now if I moved closer to the hunt areas, I would probably have more time, but sacrifice my pay, thus being forced to work more, scout less...... or force wife to go to work.

so....when you have one or both, time and/or money are the key to having the ability to CONSISTENTLY harvest big bucks.

One thing for sure, anyone I know who consistently harvests bigeys has a lot of time to do it.

Nonetheless...I still hunt DIY, public land and will be happy when I get my monster buck.......

Mark
 
I pretty much in the boat with fatrooster having never killed a monster. I think a combination of things leads to success.

Luck and Hard work almost go hand in hand. The guys who work hard seem to have the best luck by being in the right place and right time. Time and money are next. You need to devote time and the dollars for good equipment and tags.

Ed

46487b2108ac3baf.jpg
 
well if you don't have the time' you gotta have the money to pay some one else to do your scouting (guide)...

so if you don't live where they live or have the money or the time, your screwed 'eh?
 
so the main issues are time and money

someone once said that time is money so....

basically you need money and money


"One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
I do NOT have money, the reason I have time is because it is a priority to me. If you chose to not put in the time, not my fault. I have acousin who lives in a three room house, one bedroom, a bathroom, and a living room with a fridge. He is happy as can be, has very little money, yet he kills big buck after big buck. It is a matter of how bad do you want it, or how bad you want to play the 'money' excuse as to why you can't get it done. Money helps, but it is NOT needed. Atleast the money you all are talking about.

If you want it, you can have it. I am talking about time and/or money.

PRO
 
Yeah money helps, but you don't need 2000 dollar spotting scopes and 1500 dollar binos to kill a big buck. As they say in poker "a chip and a chair" rings true in hunting as well (how about "a general tag and a gun?") The most important factors are getting on land with mature bucks, which incidentally for me has been public land (or block management)in general areas, time, and the perserverence to hunt hard and pass on smaller bucks. People complain about the lack of mature animals in areas that I hunt but often they just don't spend as much time hunting as they do complaining. Get out often and away from people, spend the time, stay positive, and pass on small bucks. I am a poor graduate student but do what it takes to consistently kill (notice I did not say "harvest") big bucks. I hunt new general areas every season and do not scout preseason (I can't afford to and like to fish too much). I scout with maps to look for areas other people simply won't go. My hunting buddy and I have killed 4 deer over 170 inches and one 165 in our last 3 years of hunting in MT on a shoestring budget.
 
Money....sure, that helps but it isn't a prerequisite......

I am not an exceptionally skillful hunter, I don't have tons of cash, I don't hunt the best areas (I want to hunt, not sit and wait to draw a tag, so I apply in areas that are easy to draw in a year of two of applying, or are over the counter), I'm not the best shot around, and most of my hunting is done with archery gear, I have a 9-5 job all week, just like everyone else, and yet in the last six seasons I have taken 5 bucks. The gross scores of those bucks from largest to smallest were 179", 178", 175", and a couple of 130" class spuds. All of these were public land, DIY, cheap hunts. May not be the most impressive resume ever, but it's not bad.

How did I do it?????

PERSERVERANCE!!! That's it! My goal is to hunt harder,longer, and to go farther than the next guy. I believe if I stay at it long enough, something good will happen, and it has for me so far.

That said, I am of course always working to improve my hunting and shooting skills and that will help my success for sure, but staying at it when others won't is by far the most important. Not to mention the fact that the more you hunt the better your skills will become. JUST STAY WITH IT!!
 
If you can't afford gas or a few days to hunt and scout maybe you should be looking at another hobby, like maybe getting a second job or going back to school. EVERYTHING COSTS MONEY. A lot of us here are saying that you don't need a LE tag or guide to shoot a big buck. I know of several MONSTER deer taken within 15 miles of downtown SLC by rifle and bowhunters. They all bought otc tags and hunted when they could get away from work. Saying "I don't have the money to shoot a big buck" is retarded. If you can afford the basic costs of hunting, you can learn to shoot big deer. If you can't , get a better job. Look at BC-Boy, he chooses a lifestyle that lets him hunt big deer. Anyone can do it if they are dedicated.

Andy
 
time is money

if you were at work instead of in the hills you could earn $

so if you give more time to deer hunting you are still giving up money.....difference is it is $ you never had

time is money

"One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
Good post.
I hunt a lot differently than I did 4 years ago, and as a result I'm killing some good bucks every year. Here's my take.
1)Scout where big bucks live
2)Hunt where big bucks live
3) Buy the best glass you can afford and than learn to use it effectively.This is the best way to locate big bucks IMO.
4)Hunt all day
5)Find a big buck in the summer and kill him in the fall (may not be possible on the late hunts, that is why I prefer the early hunts. Hunt only the buck you want to kill. Don't get caught up in jumping from area to area.
6)perseverance
7)Be in shape
7)Luck helps a bunch

Mike
 
Aspen, you are missing the point. Some are implying the only way to kill big bucks is by buying them. Trying to come up with lame-ass excuses why they can't get it done. Spin it how you want, but killing big bucks year after year does NOT require one to have a pile of money to burn on hunting. It takes commitment and desire, with not accepting 'defeat' due to lack of funds. Like was mentioned, a dedicated big buck hunter can chase big bucks in Salt Lake County with leg work and want-to. How much money is needed to be from Sandy to hunt big bucks on the Wasatch Front? About the same as taking the old lady to a movie.

PRO
 
All,

I appreciate some of your insight and best practices. It seems every year I am going to implement some new practices and it seems that I slip back into the old habits. This year I am going to...

Stay out all day long.
Get out into some rugged country that is out of the way.
Coyote/Bivy out
Hunt the whole hunt and layoff the trigger.

I don't know about you guys, but I am getting excited! Only 3 more months and we will be back at it.

Good luck!

CS
 
I have spent some money on some good tags and while I still had to hunt public ground and work hard to kill a good buck, it was depressing to see freinds hunt OTC units and kill even bigger bucks.
I know a small hand full of guys who are very consistent at killing big bucks and the real secret is they are not buying high price tags to do it. It doesn't matter where they hunt;they implore the same tecniques year after year to put the big one on the ground.

Mike
 
The whole idea that time is money is false. Now I don't live where many of you live but I believe the Taxman is still a prick wherever you live. The more you work, the more you make, the more the taxman takes. Sooo, you are never furthur ahead. There is also the concept of 'Image' which many think is a neccessity to kill big animals. Be it new 4x4's pimped out, new quads, new guns, hunters think they need all the latest gizmos and gadjets or else they will never acheive that monster buck on their wall. And because they are working their asses off to pay the taxman, chances are most of those so-called 'needed' hunting items are financed. So the spiral continues, as the bankman takes his share off the top, thus making the need to work more to pay for what you thought you needed.
My strategy is to work less, live on less, and have more 'Time' to actually do the things I love.
 
I don't think there's a post here thats wrong even though everyone has different opinions. Some, like BC can buy a tag and scout all year to find the buck they want. Some like Elmacho can't realistically scout a unit nor lives within a days drive of where trophy bucks live.

I have trophy bucks around my house and one of the best units in the state, X5B, is a 20 minute drive. I won't wait 5-8 years for that tag though. Rather archery hunt a lesser unit every other year and play the draw game in every state hoping for a great tag. Then do the tag justice with research and getting there a week early to scout.

All of the advice given is great for the that particular persons circumstances. I think some of the best advice was to lay off of the trigger til you have the one you want in your sights. That includes the ability to eat the tag and learn from your experence.
 
Pro- I think you are missing the point. Can you please show me where someone has implied that the ONLY way to kill a big buck is to buy it???? Everything that I have read basically states that money allows for you to do some of the other things necessary to kill a big deer. It is not a pre-requesite by any means, but it definitely helps. You can hunt big bucks in your backyard, front yard, anywhere you want, but time is money no matter how you look at it.
 
MortgageMan,

I just reread YOUR first post on this thread:

">Consistently killing them year after year???
>
>
>Definitely $$$$$$$$$$$$
>
>Just my .02"

What does that imply? It implies to me, "Definitely $$$$$$$$$$$$" is your stance.

Time is NOT money. Time is a matter of priority.

PRO
 
Getting a good tag is a moot point. Every person reading this can have a Kiabab Archery Tag. They still sell them across the counter in Arizona. There is a good tag in an area with good genetics. In fact you can hunt bruisers in Southern Arizona during the latter part of December and the entire month of January. The big bucks coming out of Mexico are also on the palo verde flats in Southern Arizona. But it does take money to buy the tag/License and time to scout the area.
The scouting part can be made easier with the use of the internet (google earth), maps (huntmaps.com), and in some cases scouting services.
To increase your chance of success you need to get away from the roads, know what type of areas the big boys hang out in, (the Mulies in the desert act entirely different than the Mulies in the Mountians) and get in shape. It is hard to pack in 10 miles, but a lot harder when you are sucking wind.
Good gear also makes quite a difference. Start with the boots. If you are walking on blisters you can't/won't go very far or stay very long.
Hunt from dusk to dawn. Be willing to change areas if nothing pans out where you are at.
A key to most western hunts is know where the water will be during the hunt. If water is available, deer will use it.
Dollars help but having the will to make it happen no matter what is what will put Moe on the wall. Where there is a will, there is a way. (Have you ever seen the size of the bucks that are on the costal islands in Southern California?)
 
Lots of good points here.

One thing that has made a difference for me is passing on animals.

It means that you get skunked at times, but, the best animals i have shot have been after i have passed on lesser ones.

You pull the trigger or release the arrow your hunt is over.

One of my favite sayings is time and money solve all problems.

Of course this is not completely true, but, it certainly can be applied to the original question.

You gotta have the time. I can make a lot of sacrifices to get some time but i will not sacrifice family time. My solution is to apply the whole family separetely and if that means that i go on a hunt that one of my kids draws or wife it is just as rewarding than if i went.


The money helps, In order to apply in 10 western states you gotta put up bucks. And applying for best units and keeping some type of local hunt in your back pocket if you dont draw something big.

I drew a valle caldera last year, my oldest son drew a 128/129 WY migration hunt and my youngest (9yr old) drew a local youth hunt in NM. Each one was a blast. I am blessed to be at a point in my life i can create time and have some money to help.
 
Why dont we ask those fine gentleman who have their hunting privelages revoked for along time how they managed to kill big bucks. :) I bet it involves a spot light, the wrong area, wrong time of year. Those deer tags are so hard to read!!!
LOL
 
Pro-
You obviously need to re-read it again. You got one thing right in your post, $$$$$$$$ is my stance. But, nobody on here ever said that you have to buy a deer to get a big buck. Several have simply stated that money is the single biggest factor for them as well. If I have money in the bank I can take more time off work to scout and hunt the area to fin big bucks. Does this make sense to you now?? If you don't think time is money then I can definitely tell that you are not self-employed. You probably take paid vacation to hunt and therefore time is not money to you. Hunting is a matter of priority, not time.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-16-07 AT 01:38PM (MST)[p]"Time is NOT money. Time is a priority."

Priorities are feelings about how you should manage your time. Priorities are not time, nor is time a priority, it is what you can do with your time, decided upon by a prioritized belief system, that makes your decision as to how to utilize time.

Most Americans work for an hourly wage. Their earnings are decided upon by how much time they spend at work. Unless a family of 5 makes more than $40,000 per year it is tough to live. According to national statisics, most families make about that much. Most people can not afford to take more TIME off work than necessary because it takes away too much $$$.

They don't go to work and spend TIME there, they don't get $.

Try and tell the average American that time is not money. Believing that, then they would not need to go to work. They could prioritize other things in front of work......and lose their house...car...truck...food.

Wait, you are all correct. Time is not money! What was I thinking? Well back to my hourly wage rate job..... Silly me...



"One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
You get paid for your time, some get paid for their knowledge, others for their expertise in a certain field. It is a matter of PRIORITIES. You even said as much in your post, "Priorities are feelings about how you should manage your time. Priorities are not time, nor is time a priority, it is what you can do with your time, decided upon by a prioritized belief system, that makes your decision as to how to utilize time." EXACTLY....time is a priority. Do you want money, fame, and fortune? Or do you want to spend lots of times with your family, spend time in the hills, and kill big bicks? It IS a matter of priorities. If you chose to live in a small town close to great hunting, but in doing so you make less $$ but get BETTER odds of killing big bucks, then we see where your priorites are. If you chose to live in the city, but in doing so you make more $$ but have worse odds of killing big bucks, then we also see where your priorities are. Do you work 60+ hrs a weeks in order to have a bigger house and nicer truck? Or do you work as little as needed to put food on the table and spend MORE time with family and hunting? A matter of priorities.

PRO
 
LAST EDITED ON May-16-07 AT 06:06PM (MST)[p]Pro,
That is exactly my way of thinking. By making the life choices I have made, I have set my priorities. Money is not one of them. I could make way more money if I chose to move to the big city. Matter of fact, my single income family would become a double income family as there would be more opportunities for my wife to work if I lived in a city. But where would that get me???? The housing markets are insane right now. To buy a house like my little house in Vancouver I'd have a million dollar mortgage. That makes a lot of sense now don't it? I'd never see my family as I'd be bustin my hump to pay for that mortgage. Now, take my life in the country. I live rural. I have great neighbors. My kids can step outside without the worry of gangs, violence, and drugs. Sure I may not make near as much as I would in the city, but who needs all those material things anyways? I get by just fine, eat a lot of healthy wild game, and raise my kids the way I want to raise them. To top it all off, I kill big bucks fairly consistantly. In the last 4 years I've killed a 190 NT, a 178 typical, and a 202 NT. I've also had the privalage to watch my family and good friends kill some Toads as well in that time frame. And it's not just muleys. Be it moose, whitetails, grizz, monster lions, mountain goats and monster black bears, I've been hunting them on my small hunting budget. Look at the 6'4" black bear my 10 year son just shot this past weekend. A mother's day picnic with the family and I get to watch my son kill a trophy bear for his first bear. Do you know how much that hunt cost me? I doubt I even spent $25 in gas. It is all a matter of priorities.
 
BCBOY has got it figured out. I like your style, you've got er dialed and not just in the hunting department, but life as well. I'd love to get out of this freaking rat race and move someplace rural. Sadly, I'm stuck here due largly to reasons you already mentioned........

Now, let me tell the rest of you how to kill a big-buck. Find a spot known to produce big deer occasionally. Locate the most remote godforsaken hell hole in the area. Quit your job, divorce your wife, and hunt it till you kill the huge buck thats bound to live there or die trying. Simple.
 
BCBOY, congrats on your son killing a big ol bear. PRICELESS.

I live in a town with 8,000 people, way to big for my liking, but I have a son with autism, so my #1 priority is him. Hunting is way down my list of priorities at this time, yet I still MAKE time to take my kids out into the outdoors, and I still get to spend a month+ guiding elk hunters, because I MAKE the time to do so.

Everyone has 24 hours in a day, it is what you CHOOSE to do with that 24 hours that dictates how successful you are/can be in anything, whether it is killing big bucks or making big bucks. If money is an issue with you being able/not able to hunt, maybe you need to look at your priorities. Just a thought.

PRO
 
You can have a gazillion dollar budget and no job, all the time in the world, the best guide in the world, more ability than Fred Bear, Chuck Adams, Cameron Hanes, The Eastmans, Jim Shockey and Randy Ulmer combined, no family or other responsibilities to interrupt your desire to kill a monster whatever, But.... If you don't hunt where a monster buck lives... then you are not going to kill one. PERIOD! You can time is money is time yourselves to death.
 
BCBoy, you call you life simple, I call it one heck of a way to live, and yes I am envious.
Keep up with the pics and stories, for those of us not willing to give up what it would take to live that life, LOL.

There are only two types of people - The Hunters and the hunted,
I hunt.
Alchase
 
Hey Bux....

You are right,....you need a good tag

to get the best tags you have to apply for many draws in many states over many years....all of which takes time and money

"One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
I have never applied for an out-of-state deer tag, I have NEVER applied for a LE deer tag here in Utah, and yet I have taken three B&C class bucks(two with a bow) and have taken 4 others that qualify for P&Y. How is that possible? I have limited money and precious little time. Hmmmm

PRO
 
everyone give up!! PRO is always right. I know someone that has alot of money and he has killed many more B&C and P&Y deer than that.. When you have money you harvest trophies in multiple fashion. If you dont have money you try to find the time to put the effort into it and get your every once in a while B&C/P&Y. you just dont get to do it several times a year..
 
Nice to see you have realized I am ALWAYS right. That is the first correct thing you have posted. ATTA BOY!

PRO
 
You guys are just being retarded now. "Tags cost money, scouting costs money, time off costs money, wah wah wah." Tecnically, taking a dump costs money, but it's not a rich man's sport is it?

I believe what pro, BC, and others are saying is that you don't have to be well-off or buy expensive tags to shoot big deer. you just have to put more effort into it than most guys are willing to. Yes they spend money to hunt, we all do. It's like a 12th grade debate class in here.

My Ideas.
1-hunt all day
2-glass, glass, glass. Last season, for the first time, I glassed up some bucks pre-dawn and watched them feed and bed down 1/2 mile away. we put a 4-hour stalk on them and ended up 30 yds away from the bedded bucks.
3-don't shoot small deer. I ended up passing on the biggest of the bedded bucks, a heavy 24" wide 20" tall 3-pt. He was bigger than any deer I've shot, but not what I wanted.
4-eat tag soup. I did last year and it tasted great.

Andy
 
I don't think any of you are wrong. It is true that it takes money to hunt anything let alone big bucks every year. Sure it can be done cheap if you are fortunate enough to live close to quality areas that hold big bucks. not all of us are that fortunate and have to drive great distances. Not all of us have all the free time in the world to scout and hunt as many days in the field. Some of us are limited so we must choose to sacrafice money versus time. We can't all quit our jobs move to limited parts of this country, expected to get a job doing anything and scout/hunt all we want. I live in the bay area, i'm currently unmarried, have a good job but limited time to spend in the field. All I do is think about the next time I can be hunting. So I allow myself a modest budget each year to hunt with and try to maximize my time. Big bucks aren't everywhere so it cost money to get to where the big ones are. In Cali it is (usually but not always)on private land$$$$$

Good luck hunting this year to you guys.
 
>everyone give up!! PRO is
>always right. I know someone
>that has alot of money
>and he has killed many
>more B&C and P&Y deer
>than that.. When you have
>money you harvest trophies in
>multiple fashion. If you dont
>have money you try to
>find the time to put
>the effort into it and
>get your every once in
>a while B&C/P&Y. you just
>dont get to do it
>several times a year..


Your buddy kills several B&C/P&Y critters every year???! How much money does it take to do that? I know some pretty well of dudes but none harvest book heads every year. Especially mule deer. I dont care how much $ you got, A booner muley is a rare critter.
 
Andymansavage,

I like the advice. I figure there are 2-3 things I can change in my approach that are going to make the difference in the coming year. All of those you pointed out are going to make a difference. I really liked the post that mentioned what time of day a fellow MMer had killed a lot of big bucks. I was surprised to reflect back and remember that my biggest buck was killed during a full moon around noon up in wyoming
in the high country. My buddy shot his biggest buck 10-15 minutes later that same day.

WyomingBucks.jpg


Chris
 
Lots of opinions here. Consider this, while a hunter can do everything right like having the best gear, scout like crazy and go to the best public ground available, when it comes to the size of the animal taken the guy with unlimited resorces will win every time. This isn't to say great animals can't be taken DIY, but even an out of shape, can't shoot straight hunter who only spends four days a year in the field can buy the best tags/ access available and kill far better animals than most of us will ever see.
 
The original question is "what is the biggest key". And that is hunting where big bucks live on a consistent basis. You can have all the other variables to the extreme, but if you are hunting for a 200" mulie in Illinios, you are not going to kill one. I know that the only mulies in Illinois are dead one's but it helps prove my point.
 
I've got just the thing...I'll show it to you on Sunday. hehehe

JGH

It's all about the good times...
 
Know what a big buck looks like. I'd wager that few people know what a truly big buck looks like. I frequently talk to hunters who report that they saw several 30 inch bucks on a hunt or a scouting trip. I call BS. Based on check station data in several states the amount of 30 inch bucks harvested each year hovers between 4% and 6%. One thing I have forced myself to do is look a buck over before I pull the trigger. This is hard to do....at least thourghly. Last year I spotted a wide buck with big front forks. He was on the edge of the timber so I dropped the hammer quick based on his frontend and width. When I was finally standing over him, I realized that he had average G2's and piss poor g3's. Had I looked him over better I may have saved him for the last day. Needless to say he's still a trophy and now resides on my wall in my Den.

Mike
 
I agree with pro, its about priorities. I just built a house, could I have built in the ghetto and saved enough to go to Mexico every year for the next 20 years?
 
Thanks PRO.. let me know if I am right on this..

prioritizing time and making effort (like yourself)= great harvest once in a while..

$$$$$$ = ??? you guessed it.. Multiple trophies on the wall..

PRO.. you guide dudes with $$$ right? If you were to go take a look into their trophy room would they have many more to show than "average joe" ?
 
Rammu you seem to have a problem with those so called dudes with money.They could actually be average joes who will do what ever it takes to pursue their passion.Hell most of them probably wouldn't have a problem with somebody who is too dumb or lazy... because they won't kill many big animals anyway.Just a thought!
 
Persistance to me is one of the most important keys to killing a big buck. Staying focused on the task at hand. Lots of things to side track a trophy hunter; weather, hunting presure, fatigue, average bucks that look 'good enough' ect.... It really is a head game that you have to win before you will ever kill that buck of your dreams. You get that head game won and you are well on your way. You set your goal and you go for it. It's a hell bent for leather attitude, that you won't give up, not until the last light of the last day. Do you settle or do you go for broke?
 
Rammu, I thought there was hope for you, now I wonder. The question was not who kills more big bucks, it was, "Key to Consistently Killing Big Bucks?", remember? I love killing big animals and if I could afford to buy tags EVERY year in areas with high trophy potential, you bet your arse I would. But, I can't so I work my ARSE off and get er done reguarly, just not yearly.

PRO
 
Case in point: Just saw a 'Outback with Mossback' program on the tube in which a boy with MS shot a huge 35" (approx) non-typical muley. Mossback found the buck, called the boy's home to get him out of bed and had his family bring him to the canyon where the buck had bedded down, where the boy was carried in and shot him. Now, what of the above listed keys was the key to this boy taking the buck of a lifetime? Yep, $$$$$$$. And with enough of it he could kill this caliber of bucks every year. No other key will produce big bucks anywhere close to an unlimited pocketbook.

Now, take $$$$ out of the equation and all of the other keys play a role, mostly you have to find a place where a big buck can live without disturbance, then use all the proper gear to see him, stalk him and take advantage of the one small chance that he will give you to shoot him. One last thought, if there wasn't a site like this where guys are continually bragging about their 'big buck's horns, bickering over someone's thoughts and generally making the size of the horns the most important thing, would people be willing to pay big $$$$ for these deer? I love horns as much as anyone, but in my opinion a 24" buck on your own far outweighs any size buck in which someone has to "guide" you to the deer.
 
I think you need to rewatch that show. The kid won the tag. It was a Sportsman's raffle tag. The Mossback team showed incredible selflessness and found the kid a buck of a lifetime on their hook. They donated all their time and effort. Too me, that is a great example of modern day Sportsmanship, and I applaud them for that.
 
I agree with BC's next to last. Persistence. To those of us "average joes" in the lower 48 that starts with the draws. Then its talking to biologist, other hunters and scouting. The place where persistence pays off the most is in the field. Wheather its letting the just above average buck walk, getting up early when its cold or you're sore and tired. If i ever have any doubts, I remind myself that I waited all year for this and when its over, I can say I gave it my best effort. Plus, I love it so much that its fun even when the snow has the visibility to 15 feet and those $2,000.00 Swaros you're carrying are useless.
 
BCBOY is right again, the hunter on "Outback With Mossback" drew that tag and Mossback did all that work for FREE. The hunter wasn't ALLOWED to even buy them lunch. They did it because this hunter you are bad-mouthing is in a wheelchair and has VERY limited finaces. To call that into question is pathetic and moronic. WTF?

PRO
 
I don't think his intent was to bad mouth anyone, his point was to show that a guide can LEAD you to a large buck very consistently. Money retains there services (this being a rare exception). First, money is the easy way to consistently killing large animals. If that's not your bag, then hunting land that holds the quality of buck you are looking for is the most important. I agree with who ever said nothing else matters if he ain't there.
 
Actually, I came in late to the show so didn't get all of the details and my point was not to slight Mossback in any way nor the boy who shot the buck. It was to point out that if you have the money, Mossback can produce those bucks for you every year (watch his show regularly and you will see it's mostly deep pocket hunters who are often 'on call' when a big buck is found). No other factor can produce big bucks consistently like money can. There is no question that there are guys whose family has been fortunate enough to own ranches in prime mule deer habitat; there are guys who have been fortunate enough to live in states that offer better tags/seasons to residents, thereby increasing their chances for big bucks, we all envy those situations. However, give me Donald Trump's money and I'll spend only four days a year and kill a 'stud' every year.

So, most of the responses have been about how much money plays a part in obtaining a trophy and probably not the intent of the original post, so let's re-phrase the question. Aside from money, what factor would provide the best chance of killing a big buck? First and foremost, you have to be in an area that has a big buck to find; then you have to find him with good optics and the knowledge of where to look for him; then you have to get inside of his natural defenses so that you have a chance to take his life; and lastly, a good dose of luck. A lot of us know where a big buck lives, but since he isn't in just one spot all of the time or visible all the time, will you see him during the days that you are hunting or even during the short season that many states give you to hunt? Maybe, the statement that luck is doing the preparation and hard work that allows you to take advantage of a situation when it presents itself is the biggest key of all.
 
After thinking about my last response, I wanted to add that probably every one of the keys listed in the original post is equally important as you never know which one will play the biggest role on any given hunt. I've killed a big buck that I saw every day for three weeks before the season, only to not see him for 19 days once the season started (persistance). I've killed a big buck that I knew his habits so well that I could intercept him in his travels (scouting & knowledge of the deers' habits), only to make a bad shot because I was focusing on his horns instead of his vitals when I released my arrow and had my arrow cut his jugular vein as it exited only three inches from where it entered his throat (LUCK!). I've killed big bucks that other hunters pointed out in country too rugged for them to go (being in shape). I've killed a big buck after spending an hour and a half talking with a biologist who was a hunter and had killed his buck and finally broke down and pulled out his map to show me where his #2 and #3 bucks that he had been hunting, lived. The point is that you never know which trait will be needed and need to have everything in your arsenal that you can have to fall back on. And back to the money issue, one can buy Mossback's services with deep pockets, but Mossback finds those bucks by using every one of those other factors to find those bucks for his clients.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-23-07 AT 12:24PM (MST)[p]The key to consistently killing big bucks? It all depends on what consistently means. Does it mean killing one every year? Or does it mean one every 3 to 5 years or more? If it means the latter then I think it comes down to hard work and alot of luck. If it means every year then I think money becomes a huge factor or means that defy ethics or law. For example, there was a guy that killed huge bucks every year it seemed with his bow. Everyone seemed to think he was the greatest hunter and on and on. Then he crashed his chuteplane and the truth was known. Bottomline, if someone is killing big bucks every year then more than likely money or means that defy ethics or law are in the mix.
 
The only thing money comes into play is for gas. Type of job you have or time spent in the woods.
DIY public lands is the only way to hunt. Time out is worth more than anything. More time out lessens the odds of taking a nice buck.
#1 key to taking a good buck is time in the field nothing else. Knowing where to find them and knowing the country. This all comes down to time in the field. Take the time to get to know the country. Every unit has them big ol boys. Those doe's are not getting bred by 2 or 3 points every year. They are in there.



fca2e9e9.jpg
 
I agree that money can definitely buy you a good landowner tag year after year but it is not the most important thing. In the past 6 years my buddy has filled his deer tag every year here in Colorado and the smallest buck he has shot scored 172. Keep in mind that this is a unit that takes 0 points to draw any of the 3 rifle seasons, 1 point for muzzy, and 0 for archery. This guy also packs bushnell binos, no spotting scope, no rangefinder, and shoots a savage .270 with a tasco 3 X 9.

Simple put this man puts in the time in the hills. He shot every one of these bucks on opening day. He knew where each one of these bucks liked licking themselves the most.

SCOUTING IS NUMBER 1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Well.........Money or time........both get it done.

I notice some of the guys on here that do kill a bunch of good bucks live and hunt in areas they have become familiar with over time.....I mean like many years..........

Anyone out there that is middle age, lives a good 12-15 hrs away
and has consistent success?, without having hunted it most of their life or shown by a knowledgable elder? good luck...

I have to travel almost a whole day to get to good deer hunting.

I do: Hunt all day, glass all day, get remote, spend 7-10 days at a time etc..........No monsters yet. 165 is my best. NO REGRETS.

at some point, I will have had enough time in the area I hunt, southern Colorado, to learn which unit, which hole and during which hunt will get it done for me consistently.

There are obvious reasons grwoing up or living relatively close to deer country will boost your odds on a consistent basis.
 

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