Dedicated Hunter ?

BIG

Active Member
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If someone was to enroll in the DH program and draw out on a CWMU buck deer tag within the 3 years. Does that tag deer count against you. Or would you possibly be able to kill 3 deer in three years if that CWMU tag didn't count towards the program?, Just wondering how that works with other drawings.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-28-07 AT 05:00PM (MST)[p]http://www.wildlife.utah.gov/rules/R657-38.php

R657-38-10. Obtaining Other Permits.
(1)(a) Participants may not apply for or obtain general buck deer permits issued by the division through the big game drawing, license agents, over-the-counter sales, or the Internet during the three-year period of enrollment in the program.
(b) In the initial sign-up year for the program, if the participant previously applied for a general buck deer permit through the big game drawing, a participant must withdraw that permit application prior to the application withdrawal date as published in the proclamation of the Wildlife Board for taking big game.
(i) Upon withdrawal, the general buck deer permit fee may be refunded by the division in May, but the handling fee shall not be refunded.
(ii) If the participant fails to withdraw the general buck deer application and the permit is drawn, the general deer permit obtained through the drawing becomes invalid and must be surrendered prior to the beginning date of the general archery deer hunt. A refund may not be issued pursuant to Section 23-19-38.
(2) Participants may not apply for or obtain general landowner buck deer permits as provided under Rule R657-43.
(3)(a) Participants may apply for or obtain any other non general season buck deer permit as provided in Rule R657-5 and the proclamation of the Wildlife Board for taking big game.
(i) harvest of a deer with a permit obtained pursuant to Subsection (a) shall not be considered a program harvest.
(ii) participants are not required to complete program requirements prior to obtaining a permit pursuant to Subsection (a).
(b) Participants may apply for or obtain a Dedicated Hunter Limited Entry Permit as provided under Section R657-38-12.
(c) If the participant obtains any other buck deer permit, or Dedicated Hunter Limited Entry buck deer permit, the Dedicated Hunter Permit becomes invalid and the participant must surrender the Dedicated Hunter Permit prior to the opening day of the general archery deer hunt. A refund may not be issued pursuant to Section 23-19-38.
(d) If the participant obtains any other buck deer permit, or a Dedicated Hunter Limited Entry Permit, the participant may use the permit only in the prescribed area during the season dates listed on the permit.
(e) Participants who obtain a cooperative wildlife management unit permit may hunt only within those areas identified on the permit and only during the dates determined by the cooperative wildlife management unit landowner or operator.
(4) The permit must be on the person while hunting.
(5) Obtaining any other buck deer permit does not authorize a participant to take an additional deer.
(6)(a) Participants may apply for or obtain antlerless deer permits as provided in Rule R657-5 and the Antlerless Addendum to the proclamation of the Wildlife Board for taking big game.
(b) Antlerless permits do not count against the number of permits issued pursuant to this program.
(c) Antlerless harvest of a deer as provided in the Antlerless Addendum to the proclamation of the Wildlife Board for taking big game shall not be considered a program harvest.

Is that clear as mud, or what.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-28-07 AT 05:02PM (MST)[p]The way I read the rules, which certainly shouldn't be relied on - without contacting the DWR - but it looks to me like if you draw a cwmu, you have to surrender your DH tag for the year.

As for how many deer you can take - GOOD QUESTION:

Subsection 3(a) says taking a cwmu deer does not count towards the DH program harvest requirements.

But, subsection 5 says you don't get to take an additional deer.

Good LUCK! Have at it!!!
 
If you draw a LE tag or CWMU buck deer tag while you are enrolled in dedicated, you give up your oportunity to hunt all three seasons that year and yes, I think that it is counted as a harvest, this is my brothers problem he is going threw, he has enough points to draw his LE Unit he wants but he has killed only 1 deer in 3 years and has 1 more year in the program and dosent want to "waste" his hard earned money and work hours he put out on something he can't use.
 
The way i understand it is, that you can not hunt general session and a draw hunt in the same year. So it would not count against the program. You would just have 2 years to hunt in DH with two tags.
I would call a region office and ask to make sure but that sounds right from what i have been told in the past.
I do know you can not hunt with all three weapons now, and you once could if you were a DH and had a draw tag.

Rock 5150
 
BIG,

Simply put. You CAN NOT kill more that 2 deer in 3 years if you're in the Dedicated Hunter program, regardless of where they're harvested.

Be it a CWMU, LE, or even a conservation tag......
 
I agree with prism, and it sounds like he is not guessing at all so I would bank on it. When I first read the rule, it sounded like it may be OK, but it says no additional deer, and the whole purpose of the program is that you promise to take only 2 deer in 3 years. At least you can surrender your DH tag if you do draw a LE tag.
 
Prism,

I talked to the DWR this morning and they said you could actually kill 3 deer in 3 years if you were to draw a CWMU and do the DH program. The harvest on the CWMU would not count as a DH program harvest. You could not have two different Utah buck deer tags in the same year. If you drew the CWMU you would not recive a dedicated tag that year.
 
I've been told on several occasions that a LE or CWMU draw/harvest does NOT count as one of your 2 harvests for the 3 year program. You CAN take 3 deer in the 3 year program as long as one of them is a LE or CWMU harvest. I even have this in writing because I was so paranoid. I wish I'd of known this little tid bit back in 2005. If I did I'd have a nice 27" 4pt hanging on my wall right now...

Good luck,

NvrEnuf
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-03-08 AT 04:14PM (MST)[p]From personal experience...I've been in the dedicated hunter program and have hunted a CWMU during that time period, and have been told by a couple of DWR people that if I killed a deer with a CWMU tag IT WOULD count towards one of my 2 deer.

Those same people told me that if I purchased a conservation tag and killed a deer during my dedicted enrollment it would count towards one of my two deer.

Things may have changed the last few years.

Maybe it's time to make another call to the DWR.....I'll call too to make sure we get the same answer.

You're also required to pay for the deer tag even after you've returned your dedicated tag. Double whammy.
 
Man i sure don't understand why it WOULDN'T count against you, a drawn deer tag is a drawn deer tag whether private ground or not.

The only thing to MY knowledge that does NOT count against you are the convention tags.
They are "gimme's" and require no points or set you back if you DO draw one.
My son drew a book cliffs tag last fall, he's still eligable to apply again this year.









Skull Krazy
"No Bones About It"
 
Ok, I just called and was told that you could obtain another deer tag, as long as it's not a "general" season deer tag.

Which I already knew.

The rule didn't seem really clear though if you could harvest 3 deer........... Just that you could surrender your dedicated tag to obtain one of these CWMU/Conservation tags during your dedicated enrollment.

My personaly feeling is that if you're in the dedicated hunter program then you should only be able to kill the 2 deer.

So, we're still clear as mud.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-03-08 AT 04:47PM (MST)[p]Wow!

Another Q: If in the program can you still apply for preference points on the gen?

The reason I ask is that at some point after DWR reaches 10K their are going to be some DH left out.
 
I don't think so on the pref points.

BIG, if I were you, I would want something in writing that says in really simple english that you could indeed kill 3 deer while in the dedicated hunter program.

Like I said from personal experience, I was NOT ABLE to get a CWMU tag during the third year because I'd already harvested my 2 deer.

Maybe they changed the rule, or maybe I got hosed a couple of years ago....Both are possible:)
 
Yeah I will see if I can get in writing. I have 5 Bonus points for deer so I was hoping I could get lucky and maybe get a halfway decent CWMU tag in the draw soon. That would make the next 3 years a pretty good deal.

Of course I would have to play it right. I could get hosed if it takes me a couple more years to draw a CWMU and I don't kill a deer on the first year of the DH.
 
so many WRONG answers

it is in black and white,
when the rule changed in 03 or 04 . when a DH could hunt a LE with all 3 of his hunt tags.
the next year they changed it. if you draw an LE deer tag. you turn in your DH tag. the next year you get your DH tag, because you returned it the year before.

as for the 3rd year if you filled year 1 and 2 of the DH program. your obligation is over to the DH program. so you are able to apply for a LE tag.

plain and simple. and for those who NEED proof.
this is today from Sue Robinson. the central DH coordinator
"
If you are a DH and you draw a different deer permit, if you receive a DH permit, you will need to turn it back in.
A DH cannot have two permits in their possession at any time. If a DH draws out on a draw permit, that year will be used as their off year and won't count against them. "

it really is that simple.

since this directly affects me, i am 100% on book cliffs buck archery and also in year one of the DH program.
i went to the source. to make damn sure before i sent my DH$$ in.

Good luck!
 
Going along with that thought does the year you draw out for a LE deer tag count as one of the three years or do you get an extention of the DH program?

400bull
 
it goes to your pass year. there is no extension.
if you don't have a pass year left YOU WILL loose a DH tag.

so a new DH
year 1...draw LE heneries. (lucky dog) you turn in your DH tag.
next year you receive your 1st DH tag. fill it or not.
the 3rd year you will receive your final DH tag.

provided all your service hours are done. and you have been to a RAC meeting.

hope this helps.

I WISH THEY WOULD SPELL IT OUT IN THE PROC.
 
i had this happen to me in 2007. Last January, I signed up for the DH program (1st year). I then drew a LE tag. I have e-mails from my regional DH coordinator and Jill West, the statewide DH coordinator. I can forward them to anyone who wants them, just e-mail me. What they say is in 2007 I did NOT have to do any service hours, attend any RAC meetings. I still have 2 tags in 2 years. I also still have 2 years to complete my service hours and attend my RAC. Seems like a pretty good deal.
 
Looks like they already hit the cap. Too bad for anybody still wanting to join this year.
 

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