Utah winter kill

B_F_E

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I know we don't got the "Veblen goods" like Colorado, however on similar latitudes, here in Utah we've been hammered too & there will be negative repercussions, in a way, our herd is more fragile since they've been neglected overall so I'm wondering what if anything can be done ?

County's such as; Wayne, Piute, Sevier & Garfield should be effected.
 
Think you're right BFE ... just don't know what to do about it .... as I understand it, deer don't do well on hay like elk do!

RUS
 
Add a few counties to the north of ya BFE..

Weber/Cache/Morgan are a mess with deep snow.

I have been out snowshoeing and the animals don't even attempt to run, they just watch me go by...even the moose are mid leg deep above the knee.

I haven't seen animals in these area's like this in years. I use to just glass up and see deer/elk or moose, now they are down along the road almost.

Sad.....

Robb
 
I'll say down along the road. Wathced a half dozen elk walking down the RR tracks in South Ogden last night! Ya, South Ogden of all places, within a couple hundred yards of a strip mall!
 
It is getting really bad drove from park city to morgan last night and counted 8 dead elk and about 25 deer. I dont know how often they get cleaned up but we are losing alot of animals. Something needs to be done but the state frowns on anyone other than them feeding the wildlife, unless they can come and trap the elk to trade off to some other state.
 
FYI,
There have been specific feeding programs for feeding deer developed. This deer can't be fed is an old wives tail. In fact there are pelletts designed for deer.
The thing that should upset us the most is there is a five dollar tax on hunting tags in Utah that is set aside for emergency feeding programs since 2000. I wonder where the money goes. I observed my first frozen fawn in its bed last night. The old saying is when one animal is starving or freezing all animals are starving or freezing.
Like others have mentioned I am amazed how this winter has forced elk and moose to search for lower country and food. Maybe the effect of the drought/fires was greater than thought. Not a lot of nutritous new growth on plants last summer and fall.
 
Heres your sign...Global warming at its finest moment. I think I'll go blow some chunks in my latest Newsweek magazine!
 
"Veblen goods" what the heck does that mean?

Colorado DOW is only feeding in Gunnison area as far as I know. That region gets VERY cold at times...sets the record low for the day in the entire US MANY days in the winter. This year, along with the extreme cold is deep, crusty snow, even covering brush.

Elk don't need to be fed. And south-facing slopes hold little or no snow in many areas and that will only get better in a few more as days get longer and temps go up.
 
lots of deer&elk (more deer than elk)on the wasatch front close to the cities.tomorrows storm could dump another 2 feet on them. in dec. a guy from the DWR and a muley enthusiast told me the buck/doe ratio on the front was40/100!I havent seen anything over 170" yet but still lookin.
 
slcmuley

As long as the deer on the front don't get hit by cars they should make it through alright. The one thing good with the front is it does have some of the best forage around. It can't hold a lot of deer but the deer it can hold do very well.

You might wonder what the food supply is. Well it is in peoples back yards. They eat grass, shrubs and trees. Some tree huggers even feed them Hay and Christmas trees.



Archery is a year round commitment!!
 
KSL weatherman just made the cynical comment tonight of how after the storms this next week, its going to remind people of 1993 when it snowed all January. Lets hope it doesn't get really really cold all through February or it could be a real chitty situation.
 
I was told yesterday from a good source that they will start feeding deer in northern Utah early next week. The biggest concern with feeding deer is it congregrates the deer, making them vulnerable for CWD or other health issues. The other is it 'teaches' the deer to 'expect' to be feed from then on. We WILL lose deer this year, just how many is the only question.

PRO

Define, develop, and sustain BOTH trophy and opportunity hunts throughout the state of Utah.
 
If we another kill like we did in 92/93 then I am done.....I don't think I can go through that again :(
 
The roadkill from Park City over to Wanship is horrid! Why do we not have a good cleanup for roadkill like WY does?

about two weeks ago now I drove from SLC to Pinedale,WY. I'm up there all the time for work. We(UT) had roadkill all over the place - as I drove through Kemmerer and up to Sublette county there were a few roadkill deer here and there. I drove back three days later and all the WY roadkill I had seen before were cleaned up - hauled off.

I came back through on 80 to Park City and I don't think one animal had been picked up on the UT side. We need to do a better job of cleaning up the mess!
 
The heck with clean up we need to erect deer proof fences and save these deer.

Just think how fast our herds could recover without deer auto collisions

Archery is a year round commitment!!
 
Well this should really do a number on the deer herds now. With more new snow and freezing temps and more snow on the way. I find it funny that people don't think deer like hay. Drive by any haystack in town and watch how moany deer don't like hay. It must do something for them or they wouldn't eat it all winter long. The bad thing is if the state starts feeding they will probally do it like last time and throw it right off of the side of the road.
 
deer like hay--the problem is they can't digest it like an Elk, they need the shrubbery in their diet to complete the process. Deer starve to death with a full belly eating nothing but Alfalfa or meadow hay.
 
So answer me this if I die of hypothermia soon after eating a great prime rib dinner from the Cracker Barrel in Paradise Utah. Did I die from a full belly of prime rib or did I die from exposure?
Since I was knee high I have been involved in feeding wildlife in one way or another. Deer, Elk , Birds. Yes I have watched as (even though they were fed) some died. However, most the time is was not due to the feed but other circumstances, i.e. long term extreme cold, or starvation. You are correct in assuming that if a deer in poor enough condition to die then is fed hay or anything else in order to save them chances are high they will still die. However, if a deer in decent condition is transfered to a supplmentary hay diet be it their choice or our choice not only will they survive they will carry fetuses to full term.
Think of a person with an eating disorder either way too much or too little. As they receive treatment an extreme change is not instituted, but a gradual modification of diet is implemented.
It is much the same with wildlife a gradual change is what is need to allow adjustment, this type of program will allow most ungulates to eat digest and metabloize most forage.
 
Isnt this when the MDF GM/Consultant comes ridding in on his white horse?

"Ensuring the conservation of mule deer, black-tailed deer and their habitats" . . . by shotting them one at a time.
 
I don't think the issue has anything to do with deer not liking hay, especially if they are hungry and if traditional foraging becomes difficult. My understanding is that the digestive system of deer switches to accommodate a browse diet in the winter. A switch from browse forage such as shoots, twigs and above ground level bushes, sagebrush or trees back to eating hay in the middle of the winter wreaks havoc on a deer?s digestive system. Such switch can easily cause death if they are in poor shape in the first place. Elk are much more of a range animal with much of their diet consisting of rangeland grasses and can accommodate eating hay much better than deer. This may help people understand that the implications involving winter feeding programs for deer are a little more complicated. I'm certainly no expert on the subject, but I hope this helps. Any wildlife biologists out there who can shed light on the subject?
 
buckstomp,

My point is that the switch is not season specific, the negative results are related to the condition of the animals and the period allowed for transition. IMO the reason hay has been labeled a killer of mule deer is because of how deer have been changed to it. At different times over the past 50 years deer feeding has become an issue. In most cases someone did come riding in on a White Horse very late in the game and tried to save starving deer by feeding hay. Usuallly extreme amounts of hay, deer continued to die and the hay got the wrap, because deer were not able to fully digest it. However, if wildlife managers/sportsman are proactive in their plan to feed deer there have been many successful attempts at feeding deer. For the past six years deer have been fed on and off in both extreme and light winters in Northern Utah. A study for a doctorate has been conducted and the dissertation should be presented in March. (IMO I believe that hay will have no detrimental effects on deer. However, the implemenatation of feeding programs and their results will be the main factors of concern.)
Although deer are somewhat more fragile than other large mammals and ungulates, biologically they are similar. If any large mammal is in a state of starvation and a different feed or large amount of feed is introduced there is a very good chance of them dying with a full belly. The same can be said for extreme weather changes especially with equine.
I am not a wildlife biologist, nor do I work in a field related. However my education is directly related to many of the issues we are discussing for what it is worth. Life took me in a different path.
 
MulePacker:

Good comments and an interesting perspective. I think the key is that a well thought out and scientifically tenable plan should be in place in order to help mitigate the adverse effects of a harsh winter. I'm not sure such a plan exists among wildlife officials...maybe it does. Let's hope we don't see a significant loss in our deer populations as a result of either ineffective or misplaced action.
 
Mulepacker is generally right and makes some good points. Its not that deer can't eat hay but they cannot make the abrubt change in diet from native forage to hay, thus deer have been found dead with full stomachs. Deer have microrganisms in thier digestive tract that are specific to different vegetation. If they experience an abrubt diet change they cannot digest the new vegetation. But if the diet change is gradual they have the ability and time to develop the proper microrganisms, thus the ability to digest. If feeding is to be successful it also has to be start early enough before they are in poor condition. Also once it starts you can't stop 'til they start to migrate to summer ranges. Colorado has had success in feeding pellet cuz the pellets are custom made to meet the nutritional needs of deer. Colorado develop the custom pellets back in the early 80's.

from the "Heartland of Wyoming"
 

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