fishons MULE DEER MEETING?

B

B_BOP_A_LU_LU

Guest
LAST EDITED ON Nov-30-10 AT 06:33AM (MST)[p]Well?

Just wondering if there is a Plan Invented & to put in place that's gonna help Our Regressing/Struggling Utah Deer Herd tonight?

No I won't be going!

They already think I'm a broken record & wouldn't/don't listen to me anyway!

Ya this is another Utah Thread,sorry!

Just wondering who's gonna say what?

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
CATALOU the shindig is tonight!!!








*****************************************
Wiley,
I am nominating that for post of the
century on Monster Muleys!

Your are spot on.
 
Sorry!

I thought somebody said Tuesday night,I just looked I'm already one day ahead of myself!:D



God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
Let's hear it?

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
Anybody Talkin?

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
It was real strange to listen to on the radio?
The crowd at the megaplex seem not to want to say anything?

left the panel on show stumbling back and forth talking
about really NOTHING new....
When talking about overall herd numbers , it was pretty
much admitted Waaay lower than 310K..
And Jim k said the DWR has received as many complaints as
they did back in 1993 about low deer numbers..

I listened for 90 minute a couldn't take it any more..

4aec49a65c565954.jpg
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-01-10 AT 11:04AM (MST)[p]Actually, Tony didn't talk that much and didn't bring up elk competition etc.

It seemed like it was a fairly good balance of input from Karp, Don, Miles and Representative Gibson. I thought there were great comments and questions from the public attendees. Either way, it's good to have people involved and have the opportunity to further educate themselves on policies, management and issues facing mule deer.
 
I loved the look on the panels faces when Rep. Gibson basicly called them out. A man that doesnt hunt had the clearest prospective there.


http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p248/nv_hunter/nevadaanimatedhelmetwd2.gif[/IMG]
 
Where do you think his prospective came from, If he does not hunt? Tony did not have to talk because he had Steve Brown and Rep. Brown ask his loaded questions. The meeting and speakers sounded more like a poorly reherst play.

There are not enough deer in Utah...FOR REAL.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-01-10 AT 01:02PM (MST)[p]Most of the questions came from the public. I know my question and many others weren't rehearsed. For most of the meeting, Rep. Gibson sat in the audience and took notes.
 
Well Tree that would be the reason that I did not include you when I listed the above names.

There are not enough deer in Utah...FOR REAL.
 
Cody

Why the constant hard on for me and always trying to bust my balls?

That is a serious question. What have I done to you that brings out always negative comments when I appear to be involved?

What has been my biggest push to this point? Elk. Did you hear one thing about elk last night? No you didn't. Did you hear me even take a stance other then I want our deer herds fixed and lets make more opportunity? No you didn't.

Like I said in the other post your panties are to tight and you need to loosen them a bit.

I planted NOTHING in Steve Brown and Nothing in Rep. Francis Gibson. It is an insult to them and ignorance on your part to accuse that.

You obviously chose to not participate but now you are choosing to attack what went on. I don't understand that.

If you are not part of the solution then you are part of the problem. And by EVERY comment you have made you want to just cause problems.

Why don't you put together a meeting for Mule Deer and put it on the radio and get the TV to cover it and get the main players to it?

Oh wait, you can't. Well I could and I did and I used my resources that I have built over 15 years to do that for OUR Mule deer herds and now you want to continue to be a douche about it.

Last night was not about me and my beliefs, and if you would of paid attention you would of known that. But you don't want answers and solutions you want controversy and CHAOS.

Well keep fighting your fight and I will keep fighting mine.
I have nothing else to talk with you about so fire away while I try to find answers.

Cody good luck in whatever you are doing for Mule Deer but you won't be standing in my way of what I am doing.



Tony Abbott
www.myfreehunts.com
UTAH HAS TOO MANY LAND CARP!
 
Tony,
For 15 you have most definitly been in positions to do alot. That does not mean that others have not been fighting this fight also. Now you jump on the elk or whatever you think YOU can have a voice on. That is fine we all have our own opinions...right?

My problem is you claim to be the voice of sportsmen, and when other sportsmen disagree with your views you demonize and try to discredit them. Again that is fine but don't be suprised when others or myself do the same back to you. To do so makes YOU ignorant or arogant as anyone! I am just a voice that is saying don't buy everything that Tony is selling. I am ok if you are saying the same about my opinions.

If the RACS would have voted to do nothing and leave it as is, would you have pushed to have another meeting? My guess is no? Otherwise this forum or meeting or broadcast would have taken place before the RAC meetings. There is a very big voice out there that voted for Option 2 in 3 of the 5 RACS! They followed the process and they will show up the WB meeting to voice their opinions I am sure. Just because they did not show up to YOUR meeting does not make them unconcerned sportsmen. It means they did not want to show up for that meeting! To call them out on that is just another form of arogance!

Again a voice of oppostions does not mean I have a hard on for you, it does not mean I am only busting your balls. It means that I disgree with your views and when you stand up and scream I choose to do the same. Sure I guess that could make me a douche in the eyes of some. However just because you can do the same thing on a bigger platform does not make you any less of a douche? You want to be front and center that is fine, but understand that make you a target for those that don't agree with your views. If you take that personal don't jump up on the stump! You don't hear me crying that you called me a douche I just simple answered your questions. We all want to help mule deer and we all have our own ideas. What we have done to this point has not worked!

There are not enough deer in Utah...FOR REAL.
 
Elite,

That might just be my favorite post through this whole discussion! LMFAO!!!!! and I aint kiddin neither!

I am sure that some would agree! Other would not. But both sides would know who I am! What was your name again, I did not catch it last time I asked. Maybe I missed it? I have never been good with names, one of my many retarded faults!

There are not enough deer in Utah...FOR REAL.
 
Oh so your the retarded guy that Tony was talking about. Well then that does explain a lot.
 
Cody

Arrogant? To an extent I am, we all are Ignorant? Not one bit. The ignorance is in you saying I scheduled a meeting after the Racs had voted. That is not true. It was actually discussed and scheduled the Friday before the 1st rac took place.

Now I met with Brian of MM after the 1st 2 racs took place to see if he would promote it on his site.

So now you have the facts on the meeting that you chose to not participate in.

I have no problem with how the racs voted, that is the truth. I only have a problem with the process that got them there.

Hunting deer in 5 regions or 29 units or '1000 sub units is irrelevant to me. Do I need to say it again so you understand?

It is not about unit size or numbers, it is about cutting hunters out of the hunt for no biological reason, no logical reason and a bad bad financially outcome.

Now you have it and do not need to seem ignorant. Its not about how they want to cut up the pie, its about making more pie. And the facts are that cutting out hunters does not make a bigger pie, if anything it has a negative effect.

So Cody this is not about me, and I do not represent everyone, but 18,000 deer hunters from all over this state and from every weapon hunt were polled and 12,600 or 70% said opportunity to hunt is more important then trophy hunting.

Your 5 racs altogether didnt have 500 people at them. So Cody does the 500 that wants to kick out 7,000-13,000 hunters have more of a say then the 12,600 that don't?

Answer me that question and then this conversation can be done.


Tony Abbott
www.myfreehunts.com
UTAH HAS TOO MANY LAND CARP!
 
+1 Cody. Couldnt agree more. Although i respect some of Tony's points Im not quite ready to give his big ginger ass a slap on the back for a job well done.
 
Where are these polls Tony? I keep hearing these numbers come up but correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't these numbers come from the same DWR that did the counts on mule deer? Since this topic came up with the whole "polling" issue, I have asked every person I can think of if they got "polled/surveyed". Do you know how many said yes? ZERO!! I have to be beyond 150 people now. I guess they forgot to poll south Utah county. Sorry buddy, I don't trust those numbers any more than I trust their counts. It's obvious those boys and the DWR have a very difficult time with numbers. Trust is a huge issue here. Do WE as hunters trust the DWR? I sure as hell don't.


It's always an adventure!!!
 
+1 Bull.

Tony,
We both know that wording in any poll can sway it in a certain direction. Like I said before you can preach what you believe and I will do the same.

Hopefully I'll see you tomorrow and we can all start working toward a better deer herd in Utah with what ever the out come is.

There are not enough deer in Utah...FOR REAL.
 
So fishon?

Just because 70% of the average Joe hunters want to keep decimating a suffering Deer herd you think that's the right move?

Obama got voted in too!



God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
All I ask is that 1 of you show me how cutting out hunters and micro managing bucks will save and fix a deer herd?

That is all I want to know. If you can show me how it will do that I will be the 1st guy in line preaching it the loudest.

The problem is EVERY study or every bit of information I can find from every state shows me that bucks dont have fawns and that removing hunters only saves bucks.

I am anxiously waiting for the proof so I can switch my tune.

Tony Abbott
www.myfreehunts.com
UTAH HAS TOO MANY LAND CARP!
 
Initially I thought that if we stayed with the current 5 region plan we would need to drastically cut hunter numbers to allow the herds to recover. I was thinking this only because of the pressure that Utah continues to apply on the deer hunts in areas where the deer numbers are way down and under objective. I now think that if we micromanage areas without cutting hunter numbers, we can dispurse pressure. Do you remember a couple of years ago when we got that big winter storm on the opener? I haven't seen that many mature bucks taken in one year on general units since I was a kid! The conditions were prefect for a slaughter and the hunters were concentrated in areas where the deer were heading out of the high country. Had we been in a micromanaged area some of those deer would have made it through. I don't have any studies to back that up, just several bioligists and CO's that said the checking stations were the busiest they had seen in 10 years. As I have said before, dividing the state up in to smaller more manageable units is only a small step. You know as well as I do that the first and foremost problem we have is the way the DWR gathers information that they are basing long term deer management on. They have no business deciding on managament tools based on the inaccurate ways they gather information. If it's a staffing issue (which is what they will tell you) then we need to figure out a way to fund that. Increase license fees to pay for a couple of more biologists and CO's. It can't be that bad. I would gladly pay an increase if I new it would be channeled to the right source. I don't think that it's as much of a Tony vs the world as you think. I believe that every person on here has more in common with each other than we realize. There are a few things that we disagree on but as a whole, we are all pretty much on the same page. I don't think there is anybody that buys a license that doesn't want to see more deer and more opportunity in the future. So lets find some common ground and make the DWR accountable. Force their hand and make them increase the herds. No more of this bullshit of pawning off the responsibility on the RAC's and the wildlife board.


It's always an adventure!!!
 
I hear what you are saying AWLB, and agree with most of it. Unfortunately, the DWR is mandated by law to follow the WB, so it would seem we need to lean on those folks a bit more. I also think that most hunters would gladly pay more for license or tags if, like you said, they knew the money was being allocated to the appropriate areas.

We all have our own thoughts and ideas as to what will help the deer herds, but it does NO GOOD to bicker and fight between us as to who is right or wrong. Ultimately, the WB will make the decisions that effect our hunting and deer herd health.

For the first time in a long time, those that be in power are hearing us, and we need to continue to speak loud and clear. Regardless of the methods they choose, if they are intended to increase the health of the deer herd, it will be a win/win situation for all of us. I would hate to see the downfall of hunting come as the result of hunters themselves...we should be united in our efforts rather than isolated within selfish lines of thought...Thanks for voicing your concerns!
 
I think Tony and I are in the same boat on this one. I too do not want to see tag cuts. Cutting a few thousand people out of the game is not going to grow more deer. It will improve the quality of bucks, but only slightly in my opinion. And, if buck quality improvement is what we want, then I believe there are other things that can be done short of making more people sit out of the game.

The options on the table are all wrong. I say, let's let the 5 day season for adults continue for 5 years, close 20% of roads and atv trails during hunting season, encourage more primitive weapon hunting, test antler restrictions again, and see where we are in 5 years.
I firmly believe that if we did that, in five years we would have better quality bucks without tag cuts.

Now, overall deer herd size, that's something I'm not so sure we will ever have. More deer food is what deer need to increase the herd size. Our wild acres need to be able to support more deer before we can have more deer.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
 

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