Lifetime License holder shouldn't be guaranteed a Regions of choice

[RoadlessHunter]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-05-10 AT 08:43PM (MST)[p]
It's a bunch of BS!! The reason my dad didn't buy him and I a lifetime license was the DWR said that they wouldn't guaranty a tag every year in the future and especially if they went to the 5 region plan. Well we have 5 regions and they get to pick the unit. Now we are going to 29 and they still get to pick a unit. That is BS the best units may have all the tags go to lifetime license holders.

If you want a tag every year a throw away unit should be made and if a Liftime license dosen't draw a tag in the draw. They would get a tag for the throw away unit. The cache would be a good throw away unit.

Do the Math
3500 lifetime tag holders
29 units and 84000 tags on average = 2897 tags per unit
That is less than the 3500 liftime tag holders
they could take the entire unit before the draw

 

[RoadlessHunter]

I am talking about UTAH

 

[1911]

Best money I ever spent.

 

[AWHOLELOTTABULL]

Where did you hear that? I was at the WB meeting and I didn't hear any mention of that. I think there will be a lot of changes coming. You may be right though. All I have to say is, you should have bought that thing when you had the chance. I have one and it's the best purchase I have made in a very long time.


It's always an adventure!!!

 

[Founder]

A throw away unit....LOL
Maybe they could make up a unit out in the salt flats and that could be the throw away unit...LOL

I think they should combine all the LE units with the other 29 and then let us Lifetime License holders have that first pick. I'd like to hunt the Henry's, Book Cliffs, Pauns., or Vernon atleast every other year. It's only fair.....I think. Wouldn't you other Lifetime License holders agree?
I would post my success photos for everyone each year. That way it's a win-win deal for us all.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com

 

[fishon]

Brian

That was your best post yet. I don't even have a Lifetime License and would have a hard time screwing the guys that do.

They put up when $500 meant something. You won't hear me bringing them into any discussion.

Tony Abbott
www.myfreehunts.com
The next buck to have a fawn will be the
1st.

 

[Founder]

I can't remember what year that was, but my dad had called me and said, "you better get one before they do away with them". $500.00 back then was a LOT of money for me. Anyone know what year that was?
I bit the bullet and forked over $500.00. Sure glad dad talked me into it. BUT, I have only got to enjoy the last few years. The first bunch of years that they had the Dedicated Hunter program, we still had to pay full program price. Only the last 6 or 8 years or so has there been a discount.
Since I have had the Lifetime License, I have yet to get a license for free. Have always done the Dedicated Hunter, so the Lifetime Licenses must have ended the same time the DH began.......??????

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com

 

[BIGJOHNT]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-05-10 AT 11:21PM (MST)[p]I just wish I would have bought one for my 2 and 4 year old boys at the time. Hind site is 20/20.
Roadlesshunter
You dont have to worry about us old timers....we never get out of the truck. haha

 

[BIGJOHNT]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-05-10 AT 11:19PM (MST)[p]I think it was March 1st 1994

 

[1911]

Yes it was spring of '94 after the big winter kill. Everyone was getting wise to the fact that it was a loophole to bypass any cap they put on the number of general tags. It became such a hot seller in the final weeks, as they began talking about capping the number of general tags, that they sold more in the last bit than the history of the tag. The state held an emergency session on the hill and voted a resolution to stop issuing the tags. I bought mine in the final week or two of its existence.

 

[AWHOLELOTTABULL]

Yep. 1994. I was coming up on my 5 year wedding aniversary and we were POOR!!! There was no extra money. It was a stretch to get it done but I pulled the trigger and I'm glad I did.

Brian, you put in for the Henries the first year and I will just come and hunt with you. Then I will put in for the Book Cliffs the next, etc. etc. etc. Great idea. When's the next WB meeting?


It's always an adventure!!!

 

[Sir_Huntsalot]

Bought mine right after I got divorced,kind of cheered me up. My brother and a friend have passed on so thats two less you will have to worry about.

 

[Yakatak]

Mine was a post divorce cheer me up too. $500 was a real pinch now that I had to make the mortgage payment myself. I purchased a Swarovski 80HD scope back when they were only $1900 and now they are $2700 or so, but I wont have to buy another spotter or Utah deer tag from now on. Wish my 401k showed that kind of investment sucess!
Yak.

For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well-organized and armed militia is their best security.

Thomas Jefferson

 

[hossblur]

Funny thing is you have the lifetime and the spotting scope and the only deer you can use them on are in Colorado. My question is, who is the genius in the DWR that thought hey lets sell guaranteed tags to a 16 yr old for life and charge him $500. I mean really he will only get what 60 or so tags for that money, we should only lose about $2000 in that deal. Man the DWR are genius', we should let them micromanage the deer units! But its not suprising, this same mathematical genius is what they use to come up with 300,000 deer in a state with 200,000 deer.

Tony, I saw a movie where Arnold Swarzenegger(yeah you try to spell it) had a baby so it must be possible with mule deer bucks and that is why we are concerned about buck/doe ratios so your tag line is bound to be proved wrong, not only will mule deer bucks have fawns, but cutting out another 13,000 hunters is good for the hunters so HA!!!

 

[MBM]

Roadless,

I think who ever your Dad talked to at the DWR at the time told him wrong. I thought the same thing back in 1993, and a lifetime licence would NOT gurantee you a tag every year. I had a co worked tell me other wise as he had just bought one and talked to the DWR. I went in to the DWR and they told me it would guarantee me a tag even if they went to Regions or units. I was fresh out of high school and had just started working but I scrapped together the money and bought it. Best $500 I have ever spent.

 

[cannonball]

Well the DWR told me at the time, that yes, you would be guaranteed a tag each year, but if got to the point where tags would be limited, where in the state would not be guaranteed.

 

[ICHABOD]

I was a POOR college student, and didnt have $500... So I pawned some of my guns, bought the license, and slowly got my guns out of pawn. One of the only great financial decisions of my life. lol!
I, like Founder, have been in the DH program from the beginning as well.

------------------------------------------------------
"So... Now you got a little taste of what I do...pretty dang exciting, eh?"

 

[BrowningRage]

I just wish they would offer Lifetime tags to other generations... I was only 12 when they offered them last time- so I was SOL... But if they offered a quota limit to individuals born between say, 1979-1989 I'd pony up pretty quick... of course it'd probably be about $3000 now...


"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24

 

[western]

The only thing that bothers me about the lifetime licence is my kid cannot get one...I had my chance and chose not to buy one because I couldn't come up with the money...the younger generation should have that chance to purchase one ....

 

[BIGJOHNT]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-06-10 AT 10:43AM (MST)[p]You could have gotten one when you where 12 . There where guys down south buying them for infants. When they got they S S numbers they added it to the license.

 

[western]

What about my twelve year old? How about some of these lifetime license holders give my kid a tag and they sit out for a year or two...that would go over real well wouldn't it...

 

[buglinbilly]

Here's a bit of history about the lifetime tags in Utah.

When Utah first began to sell lifetime licenses they offered much more than they do today. The original people who purchased the (then) expensive $500.00 license, were offered a combination license which allowed one to hunt the entire state, for all three seasons or until they had filled their deer tag. They were also told that if they ever moved from the state, that not only would they received a combination license each year, but they could also purchase any over the counter permit for resident fees and also apply for OIL permits as a resident. Those privileges, as much as the lifetime permits, made me decide to purchase a lifetime license.

Within a few years of getting my lifetime license, they revamped the program and said they would no longer allow anyone, who moved from Utah, to get any license or apply for any OIL license as a resident. The only benefit allowed, would be a combination license each year for the rest of one?s life.

At that point I said the state had made a contract with me and I expected them to keep it. I was offered my money back, but refused saying I I expected them to keep their promise and contract with me. I even wrote a letter refusing their offer and stating my position. At the time of that letter I told them I had no plans of moving but if I did I would expect them to keep their contract with me.

By the time I purchased my son a license, the program had been amended and changed and other than a lifetime combination license, it offered no other perks. But even at that time one could still hunt all three seasons, just like the dedicated hunter could up to this point, and state wide to boot.

Later it was amended again and one had to choose your weapon, either you got a tag for archery, muzzle loader or rifle, but no longer could one get a tag that covered all three season. Even later it was amended to region hunting, and now it looks like they will once again amend it to unit hunting.

Like some mentioned previously, in the early days $500.00 was a lot of money and the Division was financially very strapped, so those funds meant a lot to them, in the early days. As time passed, inflation lessened the value of a five hundred dollar bill, and then in 1994, when the deer cap was dropped from unlimited to 97,000 permits, the combination of demand for permits, which would now be limited, and the devalued $500.00 fee brought a quick end to the lifetime license program.

As a side note, there were more lifetime licenses sold in a matter of a couple months, once the permits were limited and until the programs conclusion, than were sold, in all years of its existence, up to that point.

As unfair as it might seem, to those of you who never got the chance to purchase a lifetime license, or whom turned down the opportunity to do so, the state has a contractual obligation (legally binding agreement) to those that who took advantage of the lifetime license program.

Since I hunted the Bookcliffs this past year, I will just settle for a Henry?s tag from now on. And I will just take an archery tag, rather than making the state allow me tohunt all three seasons like they promised, when I entered that program, under those conditions. Ha Ha.

Have a good one. BB

 

[Founder]

Didn't they have a drawing for a couple years after they stopped selling them? I thought for a couple years you could apply, and if drawn, could purchase a Lifetime License???? Is that right or am I up-in-the-night?

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com

 

[BIGJOHNT]

I think Arizona does have a program where an adult can give his or her license to a youth. With all of these changes coming up maybe we can get this in the works for Utah.
I would give up my tag to take a youth hunter out. How about it Brian or Tony any talk of this ?

 

[buglinbilly]

Western, if the Division would allow that, you might be surprised how many of the older guys would do that. There are most likely almost 1,000 of the tags where the holder has either passed or whose health no longer allows them to hunt. There are also a number of guys who have moved far enough away, that time, finances or employment obligations, no longer allow them to come back and hunt deer each year.

I'm most certain, that if you could get the Division or Wildlife Board, to make that exception, to the rules, that you might have more people donating their permits to the youth, than you might imagine.

Have a good one. BB

 

[western]

You are probably right..there is still good people out there I haven't totally given up on humanity

 

[Zeke]

I'm happy to say my son and I have the lifetime licenses! I wish I would have bought them for my 4 daughters but at $500 a pop, back then, it was WAY too much money!

I hope I get my pick of units. I'm with Brian, I'll take a Henrys tag. LOL

Zeke

 

[30buck]

LOVE MINE.. Don't BE JEALOUS> THANKS AGAIN DAD

 

[justr_86]

I wish I had one......

 

[Apexmtnman]

My oldest son and I both have them thanks to my Bro-in-Law who picked them up about 2 hours before they quit selling them. I only wish I would have bought one for my 3 year old at the time, he's 19 now and will have to draw to hunt.
And to the OP your dad should have manned up and bought them like the rest of us, crying about it now is just too damn bad.

 

[bragabit]

My dad went to the bank and took out a $2000 loan to buy his three boys and his son-in-law one the last day. He had one for years prior to that. Money well spent. There can't be more than 3000 active lifetime license hunters left. 3000 out of 81000 I don't think that should be a problem. Well less than 5%

 

[buglinbilly]

I'm quite sure there are more than 3,000 active lifetime license holders that still hunt, but even if the number were 4,000, by the time they choose their area, they will be pretty evenly distributed throughout the 29 units.

As a father, who wants to hunt with my son, I would go the unit he wanted or lived by ,so I could hunt with him, and bet most older guys feel the same way. They will end up going where their friends or family members can hunt. They will not all end up in what many would call or think was "The BEST" unit.

I'll be at the Henry's. Ha Ha

 

[ICHABOD]

I'm warming up my bow, BB...I'm coming with ya!
hehe

------------------------------------------------------
"So... Now you got a little taste of what I do...pretty dang exciting, eh?"

 

[Yakatak]

+1 on the ability to donate my tag to someone. My son won't be able to hunt for another 12 years. I'd love to take a Youth on a hunt with me and let them smoke a buck off mt tag! I know a bunch of Great kids. Maybe one is yours?
BB, You Rock!

Hossblur, This buck never made it to Co.

For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well-organized and armed militia is their best security.

Thomas Jefferson

 

[prn]

Excuse my ignorance on this issue, but now that Utah makes you purchase a license and a tag, couldn't they make the lifetime license for the license only and not the tag?

 

[Founder]

I suppose they could figure out a way to give us all the shaft. They could bend us all over and give us something real special, but that would sure be bad business. ?????
We all bought Lifetime Licenses with the assumtion that we would get a deer license for a lifetime.

Maybe that "throw away" unit will come about and all us Lifetime License holders will all get stuck hunting Stanbury Island. That could be the throw away unit where they could stick 3,500 Lifetime License holders each year.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com

 

[BIGJOHNT]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-08-10 AT 01:43PM (MST)[p]The whole idea with the lifetime license is just that, a hunting and fishing license for the rest of your life. This also includes a small game license.
If they took that away i am sure the lawers would have a hay day with it.
But it would be nice to be able to donate your license if you choose to do so.

 

[prn]

If I was a lawyer representing the state I would push the issue that you get a license every year to hunt and fish at no charge. If you want a tag though you'll need to put in the draw with everyone else.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. However, I do think it will eventually come down to that.

 

[deadibob]

I still have the original contract from when I purchased my lifetime license, I too was in college and had to pawn my brand new model 70 classic stainless 338 at the Cedar Post pawn shop to come up with the money.

The only way we are not guaranteed a tag is if the deer hunt is completely shut down for the season. It's funny how many people thought it was crazy and not worth it for $500. This has been the best $500 I've ever spent and it's more than paid for itself. We still get a deer tag even if we move out of state.

I'd be willing to bet if they offered them up now for 20k they'd sell faster than before. The only reason there was such a run on them in '94 is because the state news agencies ran with the story that Utah would soon quit selling them, before that most people didn't even know lifetime licenses existed.

Not only does it include small game but a lifetime fishing license as well. Hindsight is 20/20 for you suckers that didn't pay up at the time.

 

[deadibob]

>If I was a lawyer representing
>the state I would push
>the issue that you get
>a license every year to
>hunt and fish at no
>charge. If you want a
>tag though you'll need to
>put in the draw with
>everyone else.
>
>I'm not saying it's right or
>wrong. However, I do think
>it will eventually come down
>to that.

Bring it on you wanna be lawyer. Between myself and 3,000 other lifetime holders we'd only need to donate $200 each to a legal defense fund which would give us $600,000 to fight any changes you might wish to make to our legally binding contracts. I guarantee we could raise that at the drop of a hat. Good luck on next years draw though.

 

[borntohunt]

This is the wording taken directly from my paperwork dated 9-15-93.

This Lifetime License is in lieu of:

1) Big Game License AND a permit AND tag of licensee's CHOICE for one of the following general season deer hunts: archery, rifle or muzzle-loader;

2) Small Game License;

3) Fishing License;

4) Upland Game Habitat Stamp.

borntohunt

 

[Zeke]

I can't wait for the general season Henrys hunt! LOL

Zeke

 

[prn]

Thanks borntohunt, that's what I was looking for. Trust me, I'm 100% in support of you guys getting your tag. I just don't trust the process. I think in the end your going to take it in the shorts.

To be the devil's advocate again. Right now your eligible for "Big Game License AND a permit AND tag of licensee's CHOICE for one of the following general season deer hunts: archery, rifle or muzzle-loader." It says nothing about being eligible for a LE hunt. What if the entire state was classified as LE?

Be ready for a fight because it's coming!

 

[mulemanrack]

My dad got his lifetime license "minutes" before they stopped selling them......His #4545 had to be one of the last they sold. I remember they stopped selling them at about 2:00 or 3;00 before the Division Offices were closed and there were alot of pissed off guys standing in the Springville office that couldn't buy a license after 3;00

 

[Zeke]

prn

The entire state has bee LE. Even the general regions have been limited entry.

I don't know what will happen but I GUESS that there will be true LE or premium units (we will be excluded from a lifetime tag here) and the balance will be general units in which we may select our deer tags.

I don't think it will be much of a fight.

Zeke

 

[long_mainbeam]

I just wanted to say something about the Cache unit. I fully agree that the deer numbers are super low. I rode the range about everyday this summer, and saw nothing memorable when it comes to deer. However, I was watching deer yesterday in one of my favorite spots in Cache valley, and was lucky to see five bucks over 170. Two of these bucks were over 200, two were 190+, and the others were 170-180. It was one of the best deer watching days of my life, and consider myself lucky to have seen these bucks.

P.S. They were doing a good job of passing along their genes too!