Island state hunter
- Thread starter YELUM
- Start date
U
utahgolf
Guest
great deer! It'll be interesting to watch the episode to see how much they dress up the "hunt"
WhiteMooseTaxidermy
Active Member
- Messages
- 207
Love the mass on that buck.
E
elkun
Guest
nice buck,, wish i had his last years sheds,,,
Gee, by the pics it seems this buck was approachable other than during the rut unlike what you stated in the Antelope island thread.
That's it, I am going to petition the Denver Zoo to allow a few tags to prevent the poor critters from wasting dieing from old age.
Maybe raise $160,000 dollars for deer or elk management to further bring more trophy bucks to the zoo where only our selected group of "hunters" can uthanize them humanely with a .300 Ulta Mag at 40 yards ...We will offer a petty concilation buck to a citizen. No worries I am sure the citizen non hunters will appreciate and except it as normal without gaining further disapproval.
I will then contact B&C and tell them it's a "fair chase" hunt and if they try to deny entry I will use the rich hunters funds and threaten to takem to court.
Start a guiding business where the motto will be "You shootum and the stories we will dilutem".
If any negative publicity arises our posse will pounce and tell them they are just jealous and the cause of hunter to hunter rivalry.
Within ten years the record books will be re-written by our conquest and much back slapping and Brandy will be consumed.
The next step in the plan will be to buy trophy mounts from cableas and enter them as our own with our posse backing up the hunt story.
Any attempt to question our abilities and fair chase ways will be considered "High School" whinning.
Thank you for your time....Outback with Knack Hunting LCC
That's it, I am going to petition the Denver Zoo to allow a few tags to prevent the poor critters from wasting dieing from old age.
Maybe raise $160,000 dollars for deer or elk management to further bring more trophy bucks to the zoo where only our selected group of "hunters" can uthanize them humanely with a .300 Ulta Mag at 40 yards ...We will offer a petty concilation buck to a citizen. No worries I am sure the citizen non hunters will appreciate and except it as normal without gaining further disapproval.
I will then contact B&C and tell them it's a "fair chase" hunt and if they try to deny entry I will use the rich hunters funds and threaten to takem to court.
Start a guiding business where the motto will be "You shootum and the stories we will dilutem".
If any negative publicity arises our posse will pounce and tell them they are just jealous and the cause of hunter to hunter rivalry.
Within ten years the record books will be re-written by our conquest and much back slapping and Brandy will be consumed.
The next step in the plan will be to buy trophy mounts from cableas and enter them as our own with our posse backing up the hunt story.
Any attempt to question our abilities and fair chase ways will be considered "High School" whinning.
Thank you for your time....Outback with Knack Hunting LCC
BIGJOHNT
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,172
LAST EDITED ON Nov-15-12 AT 09:29PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Nov-15-12 AT 09:26?PM (MST)
He looks much bigger here in that last picture!
Do we know what the lucky guys name is or where he is from
? I guess he must be from Utah, can non's put in for that tag?
Oh I just saw his name is John Montgomery
He looks much bigger here in that last picture!
Do we know what the lucky guys name is or where he is from
? I guess he must be from Utah, can non's put in for that tag?
Oh I just saw his name is John Montgomery
hossblur
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,500
First I saw this buck was early in the summer, YEAH in the deep dark timber, I mean standing on the pavement right after you pass the chain link fence that runs west from the road. Watched him in my headlights, well inside 200yrds, in fact about 25 feet. He is a very cool looking buck. Curious though, how much negotiation took place to decide who got their name first on the pic? Lord, had I known there were so many celebrities on the island I would have run out to get my autograph book signed.
Again, no one says this hunter did anything wrong. No one says MB did either. Colorado buck needs a freaking haircut and some new boots, other than that I guess he is in the clear too. What is wrong is this hunt. Everyone and everything is perfectly legal, and I am sure it was an ethical kill, but anyone, including a very dignified Yelum, that tries to pass this as a real hunt, is lying. I have never heard or read anyone have to spend time defending hunting the book cliffs, or henries, or the strip as real hunts. The reason this one needs so much time spent defending it is that it is a pretty sad excuse for a hunt. Hell, I bet next year THE PIGMAN and Uncle Ted will be out filming this "fair chase, western mule deer hunt". Sad! When I was younger I worked with a Springer Spaniel field trial trainer. Mostly we used piegons, but every so often we would take out a pheasant, shake and spin him unti he was really dizzy then stick him in the field. When the Springer flushed this bird, I was a shooter and shot a bunch of pheasants to help train the dogs. Now I was in a field, the pheasant was free to run or fly, etc, etc, but I never thought I was hunting pheasants. This hunt is pretty much the same.
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
Again, no one says this hunter did anything wrong. No one says MB did either. Colorado buck needs a freaking haircut and some new boots, other than that I guess he is in the clear too. What is wrong is this hunt. Everyone and everything is perfectly legal, and I am sure it was an ethical kill, but anyone, including a very dignified Yelum, that tries to pass this as a real hunt, is lying. I have never heard or read anyone have to spend time defending hunting the book cliffs, or henries, or the strip as real hunts. The reason this one needs so much time spent defending it is that it is a pretty sad excuse for a hunt. Hell, I bet next year THE PIGMAN and Uncle Ted will be out filming this "fair chase, western mule deer hunt". Sad! When I was younger I worked with a Springer Spaniel field trial trainer. Mostly we used piegons, but every so often we would take out a pheasant, shake and spin him unti he was really dizzy then stick him in the field. When the Springer flushed this bird, I was a shooter and shot a bunch of pheasants to help train the dogs. Now I was in a field, the pheasant was free to run or fly, etc, etc, but I never thought I was hunting pheasants. This hunt is pretty much the same.
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
nontypical
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 4,192
I guess Colorado Buck decided he needed to cash in on the deal as well.Money,money,money!!It makes the world go 'round!
C
CaptainJack
Guest
+1 to this statement!
I raised pheasants my whole life and have had people come in and shoot them. Sometimes they even had to kick them out of a bush cause the birds didn't know whether to fly, run, or try and get some corn out of the hunters hand. This is the same as this hunt. Where are they going to go that you won't be able to see them or find them? The excitement that is on the faces of the hunters who kill these deer on the island isn't from a "Job Well Done." Its from being up close to a special sized animal. If you want proof of this look at every picture mossback has ever taken of himself with a trophy and he is up close and smiling from ear to ear.(I'd do the same) but in the picture above he is sitting back with a look on his face that doesn't show excitement nor accomplishment. He's thinking "what are my guides doing on their real hunt." Think about how excited you get when you hit a target at 200 yards with your rifle. You have the same look as mossback has in that picture.
I'd prefer this buck over the other one.
I raised pheasants my whole life and have had people come in and shoot them. Sometimes they even had to kick them out of a bush cause the birds didn't know whether to fly, run, or try and get some corn out of the hunters hand. This is the same as this hunt. Where are they going to go that you won't be able to see them or find them? The excitement that is on the faces of the hunters who kill these deer on the island isn't from a "Job Well Done." Its from being up close to a special sized animal. If you want proof of this look at every picture mossback has ever taken of himself with a trophy and he is up close and smiling from ear to ear.(I'd do the same) but in the picture above he is sitting back with a look on his face that doesn't show excitement nor accomplishment. He's thinking "what are my guides doing on their real hunt." Think about how excited you get when you hit a target at 200 yards with your rifle. You have the same look as mossback has in that picture.
I'd prefer this buck over the other one.
trophymuley
Active Member
- Messages
- 441
LAST EDITED ON Nov-15-12 AT 10:49PM (MST)[p]last years sheds.
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
trophymuley
Active Member
- Messages
- 441
dude, doyle was out there to help the hunter out. the hunter asked for his help and he obliged. the guide is the other guy. i dunno about you but if i was simply asked to help and obliged i think i would be courteous enough to stand off to the side instead of throw my face in front of the deer. dont make it out as more than it is.
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
elkassassin
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 36,928
Impressed to see an Island Buck with some Mass on Him!
Would it be OK to re-name the Island "Doyles Island"?
RAZZIN Ya Doyle!
That's a little bigger Buck than the PISSCUTTERS I was Huntin this year YELUM,Thanks!
Wisz was a Hell of a Sport this year even if He did tell the UDWR to F-Off during the Phone Call!
15" Bases?
30" 5ths?
Missing 450" Bull!
The next 4 years is Slicks Fault,again,GEEZUS!
GOOD GAWD A MIGHTY!
Would it be OK to re-name the Island "Doyles Island"?
RAZZIN Ya Doyle!
That's a little bigger Buck than the PISSCUTTERS I was Huntin this year YELUM,Thanks!
Wisz was a Hell of a Sport this year even if He did tell the UDWR to F-Off during the Phone Call!
15" Bases?
30" 5ths?
Missing 450" Bull!
The next 4 years is Slicks Fault,again,GEEZUS!
GOOD GAWD A MIGHTY!
SneakAttack
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,405
Da turdy point buck!
smokepolejohnson
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,335
Lmfao!!! Looks like Doyle had to bring Colorado buck out of the bull pen to close this long grind it out glass and burn hunt.....yelum, Amazing original live photos as always.
R
Rambo
Guest
I love big deer. I hope to kill one that big someday..... not on an island though, just my preference.
Those sheds are awesome! So where can I find the details on shed hunting the island? Also when can I put in for a tag to "hunt" the cemetery buck?
Those sheds are awesome! So where can I find the details on shed hunting the island? Also when can I put in for a tag to "hunt" the cemetery buck?
Hossblur, I will again state for the record, I am NOT, and have never been in favor of this hunt. It's a state park. I'm also pretty sure you can't find where I stated it was a ?real hunt?, although any legal hunt on public land is technically a real hunt. They just vary in difficulty from unit to unit. A case in point.
This it a map of antelope island, roughly 17x5 miles and 7600 ft elevation.
About 40 miles west is this mountain called Newfoundland, roughly 19x5 miles, 7400ft.
Last year my wife drew a sheep tag there. The week before the hunt, my friends and I drove out there and filmed a ram 100 yards from the road. The following week my wife, accompanied by my posse of friends, hiked the mtn 1500 vertical ft, ands shot the very ram we filmed from the road.
Last year, Doyle and his hunter hikes 3-4 to find the buck he was after, only to find him broken. Then they hiked another 3-4 miles to find the buck they killed. Which of these two hunts was harder? Which is a real hunt? Some guys bash Doyle or the hunter, some just like to bash. I've never said the island hunt was not an easy hunt. Of the 4 deer and 4 sheep that have been killed, only 1 hunt lasted more than a day, and that was because the hunter missed his ram. How many hunts on the henrys, Phavant, Book Cliffs, guided and unguided, last only a day. Are those guys getting bashed.
Some people that make the island out to be a zoo, clearly have never been there. Some that claim it's a difficult hunt are exaggerating. The truth lies somewhere in between, but far from a zoo. It's a park. I have nothing against the hunters or guides, just the state for allowing it.
Yelum
This it a map of antelope island, roughly 17x5 miles and 7600 ft elevation.
About 40 miles west is this mountain called Newfoundland, roughly 19x5 miles, 7400ft.
Last year my wife drew a sheep tag there. The week before the hunt, my friends and I drove out there and filmed a ram 100 yards from the road. The following week my wife, accompanied by my posse of friends, hiked the mtn 1500 vertical ft, ands shot the very ram we filmed from the road.
Last year, Doyle and his hunter hikes 3-4 to find the buck he was after, only to find him broken. Then they hiked another 3-4 miles to find the buck they killed. Which of these two hunts was harder? Which is a real hunt? Some guys bash Doyle or the hunter, some just like to bash. I've never said the island hunt was not an easy hunt. Of the 4 deer and 4 sheep that have been killed, only 1 hunt lasted more than a day, and that was because the hunter missed his ram. How many hunts on the henrys, Phavant, Book Cliffs, guided and unguided, last only a day. Are those guys getting bashed.
Some people that make the island out to be a zoo, clearly have never been there. Some that claim it's a difficult hunt are exaggerating. The truth lies somewhere in between, but far from a zoo. It's a park. I have nothing against the hunters or guides, just the state for allowing it.
Yelum
BrowningRage
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 4,436
I dont know YELUM personally... I think we live somewhere near one another, but aside from that, I have no idea who he is.
Frankly, I couldn't agree more with him on this subject. +1 for his posts here. He's a smart dude. I've spent time on the Island, and this year I never did see one of the giants. Saw some great bucks I'd shoot in an instant, but I must have missed the biggest ones. No luck.
Congrats to the public hunter... I think he got a stellar buck.
"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
Frankly, I couldn't agree more with him on this subject. +1 for his posts here. He's a smart dude. I've spent time on the Island, and this year I never did see one of the giants. Saw some great bucks I'd shoot in an instant, but I must have missed the biggest ones. No luck.
Congrats to the public hunter... I think he got a stellar buck.
"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-12 AT 11:32AM (MST)[p]Having spent significant time on the island, much of that time spent hiking the island, I can agree with Yelum. Also, I am familiar with all the wildlife research that is happening on the island facilitated by the money generated from the sale of the tag and it, the research, is substantial. Since I have been a member of this site, I have realized many on the site don't care much for scientific research. So, maybe the money generated by the sale of these tags carries different meaning for different people. Overall I would say Yelum has it just about right.
Incredible buck by the way.
Incredible buck by the way.
Zeke
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,603
>Hossblur, I will again state for
>the record, I am NOT,
>and have never been in
>favor of this hunt.
>It's a state park.
>I'm also pretty sure you
>can't find where I stated
>it was a ?real hunt?,
>although any legal hunt on
>public land is technically a
>real hunt. They just
>vary in difficulty from unit
>to unit. A case
>in point.
>
>This it a map of antelope
>island, roughly 17x5 miles and
>7600 ft elevation.
>
>
>
>
>About 40 miles west is this
>mountain called Newfoundland, roughly 19x5
>miles, 7400ft.
>
>
>
>
>Last year my wife drew a
>sheep tag there. The
>week before the hunt, my
>friends and I drove out
>there and filmed a ram
>100 yards from the road.
> The following week my
>wife, accompanied by my posse
>of friends, hiked the mtn
>1500 vertical ft, ands shot
>the very ram we filmed
>from the road.
>
>Last year, Doyle and his hunter
>hikes 3-4 to find the
>buck he was after, only
>to find him broken.
>Then they hiked another 3-4
>miles to find the buck
>they killed. Which of
>these two hunts was harder?
> Which is a real
>hunt? Some guys bash
>Doyle or the hunter, some
>just like to bash.
>I've never said the island
>hunt was not an easy
>hunt. Of the 4
>deer and 4 sheep that
>have been killed, only 1
>hunt lasted more than a
>day, and that was because
>the hunter missed his ram.
>How many hunts on the
>henrys, Phavant, Book Cliffs, guided
>and unguided, last only a
>day. Are those guys
>getting bashed.
>
>Some people that make the island
>out to be a zoo,
>clearly have never been there.
>Some that claim it's a
>difficult hunt are exaggerating.
>The truth lies somewhere in
>between, but far from a
>zoo. It's a park.
> I have nothing against
>the hunters or guides, just
>the state for allowing it.
>
>
>Yelum
+1 to what he said^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Zeke
>the record, I am NOT,
>and have never been in
>favor of this hunt.
>It's a state park.
>I'm also pretty sure you
>can't find where I stated
>it was a ?real hunt?,
>although any legal hunt on
>public land is technically a
>real hunt. They just
>vary in difficulty from unit
>to unit. A case
>in point.
>
>This it a map of antelope
>island, roughly 17x5 miles and
>7600 ft elevation.
>
>
>
>
>About 40 miles west is this
>mountain called Newfoundland, roughly 19x5
>miles, 7400ft.
>
>
>
>
>Last year my wife drew a
>sheep tag there. The
>week before the hunt, my
>friends and I drove out
>there and filmed a ram
>100 yards from the road.
> The following week my
>wife, accompanied by my posse
>of friends, hiked the mtn
>1500 vertical ft, ands shot
>the very ram we filmed
>from the road.
>
>Last year, Doyle and his hunter
>hikes 3-4 to find the
>buck he was after, only
>to find him broken.
>Then they hiked another 3-4
>miles to find the buck
>they killed. Which of
>these two hunts was harder?
> Which is a real
>hunt? Some guys bash
>Doyle or the hunter, some
>just like to bash.
>I've never said the island
>hunt was not an easy
>hunt. Of the 4
>deer and 4 sheep that
>have been killed, only 1
>hunt lasted more than a
>day, and that was because
>the hunter missed his ram.
>How many hunts on the
>henrys, Phavant, Book Cliffs, guided
>and unguided, last only a
>day. Are those guys
>getting bashed.
>
>Some people that make the island
>out to be a zoo,
>clearly have never been there.
>Some that claim it's a
>difficult hunt are exaggerating.
>The truth lies somewhere in
>between, but far from a
>zoo. It's a park.
> I have nothing against
>the hunters or guides, just
>the state for allowing it.
>
>
>Yelum
+1 to what he said^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Zeke
T
typicalfreak
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-12 AT 12:59PM (MST)[p]This place (Antelope Island) is what it is... Its a game preserve... And anyone in the business of managing game animals has to know the benefits of hunting... and this is what they are doing for the Island... No matter how much one might think its a bad thing its not, theyre just ignorant!
Hunting is a key management tool to maintaining a healthy herd when done properly. I believe they know what they are doing out there... I think its obvious by the animals that can be found on the place!
Before youre so against it consider the place without these animals to enjoy?????
This hunt is -NOT- a bad thing... Its good management! It would be bad management to allow the Island to be overrun by too many mule deer for it to hold. By letting them just live there and then die of old age is not good management.
Another option besides hunting would have to be to transplant some animals, but for the money that it can produce by giving out tags why would they????
If they just let the animals live there, grow to old age, and die, there would eventually be too high of a carrying capacity for the area. If you dont know what happens when there are too many animals for an area to hold just look at the history of the AZ, Kiabab unit... During the time of Teddy Roosevelt they declared the area as a game preserve and no hunting was allowed and eventually there became too many animals for the unit to hold and then the numbers crashed... dramatically! Today there is hunting on the unit and it is a great unit.
Guys! Hunting is good! Why cant you hunters see this? It has nothing to do with the difficulty of the hunt... Every unit needs to be managed... Just leave it be.
In almost any given area... a certain amount of hunting is a good thing. Nuf said.
Hunting is a key management tool to maintaining a healthy herd when done properly. I believe they know what they are doing out there... I think its obvious by the animals that can be found on the place!
Before youre so against it consider the place without these animals to enjoy?????
This hunt is -NOT- a bad thing... Its good management! It would be bad management to allow the Island to be overrun by too many mule deer for it to hold. By letting them just live there and then die of old age is not good management.
Another option besides hunting would have to be to transplant some animals, but for the money that it can produce by giving out tags why would they????
If they just let the animals live there, grow to old age, and die, there would eventually be too high of a carrying capacity for the area. If you dont know what happens when there are too many animals for an area to hold just look at the history of the AZ, Kiabab unit... During the time of Teddy Roosevelt they declared the area as a game preserve and no hunting was allowed and eventually there became too many animals for the unit to hold and then the numbers crashed... dramatically! Today there is hunting on the unit and it is a great unit.
Guys! Hunting is good! Why cant you hunters see this? It has nothing to do with the difficulty of the hunt... Every unit needs to be managed... Just leave it be.
In almost any given area... a certain amount of hunting is a good thing. Nuf said.
MulePacker
Active Member
- Messages
- 514
I agree hunting is good. I agree hunting can be used as a management tool.
However, for someone to assert that the removal of two male deer from this herd of deer by hunting is a management tool for population control is absolutley absurd.
Call this "hunt" what it is and that is simply selling one deer to the highest bidder and balancing it with a draw tag to make money and appease those who lobbied for the hunt.
Yes the money may help the Island whether it out weighs the negative is debatable. I would like to see some actual documentation of the so called "wildlife research" the money is supporting.
It is this: the Island has a supply (huge bucks) we all know there is a demand for the product. Therefore the powers to be chose to use this basic economic principal to pad the coffers. This hunt has nothing to do with wildlife management or IMO hunting or for that matter what the public wanted. It has to do with selling a product to the highest bidder/raising money. Nothing requires the bidder to even set foot on the island let alone shoot the deer.
However, for someone to assert that the removal of two male deer from this herd of deer by hunting is a management tool for population control is absolutley absurd.
Call this "hunt" what it is and that is simply selling one deer to the highest bidder and balancing it with a draw tag to make money and appease those who lobbied for the hunt.
Yes the money may help the Island whether it out weighs the negative is debatable. I would like to see some actual documentation of the so called "wildlife research" the money is supporting.
It is this: the Island has a supply (huge bucks) we all know there is a demand for the product. Therefore the powers to be chose to use this basic economic principal to pad the coffers. This hunt has nothing to do with wildlife management or IMO hunting or for that matter what the public wanted. It has to do with selling a product to the highest bidder/raising money. Nothing requires the bidder to even set foot on the island let alone shoot the deer.
T
typicalfreak
Guest
MulePacker... Buck only units have proven to show great success as far as controlling numbers in history and maintaining a healthy herd.
If its absurd, what would you do?
If its absurd, what would you do?
T
typicalfreak
Guest
Yelum... If you increase the habitat the numbers will increase... Still there will have to be some kind of control. If there isnt some kind of control, the numbers will exceed carrying capacity for any given area and then eventually there will be habitat loss and evenually animal number loss
littlebighorn
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,313
I don't know anyone who knows the Island any better than Yelum, and I genuinely admire how he can disagree with the hunt and still not bash everything about it.
It is nice to see objective thought on this forum.
Unfortunately it seems to be a rare commodity
It is nice to see objective thought on this forum.
Unfortunately it seems to be a rare commodity
T
typicalfreak
Guest
Maybe thats the reason why they could be promoting the hunt right there, because the numbers jumped up... But idk
MulePacker
Active Member
- Messages
- 514
TF,
I would be interested in reading the synopsis where a deer herd population was controlled through buck harvest when carrying capacity was an issue. If possible provide a link or a source I would be glad to look it up. If the herd is over carrying capacity it is always reduced/increased through antlerless harvest. It is why Utah and all other western states have very limited doe harvest currently, yet had abundant doe harvest in the late 80's.
Buck harvest is used to maintain herds within carrying capacity as a means of generating revenue and providing opportunity. Buck Harvest is not used to control herd numbers per se. This certainly makes sense since the removal of male animals doesn't have a drastic effect on the overall population or dynamics of the herd.
As Example,
AI herd lives within carrying capacity over many years without buck harvest, the removal of two bucks does not change the status quo. Habitat has been the only factor to effect AI deer numbers. It is known deer migration off of AI occurs in years of inadequate habitat.
Cache unit, severley under carrying capacity. If your arguemnt holds true we should be reducing buck permits in order to grow the herd. Why has this not happened because buck to doe ratios indicate reduced or increased buck harvest would not change the population over an extended period of time. Yes it decreases the herd population for a period of six months from hunting season until fawning. However, it does not cause a rise or fall in term populations.
By the way a healthy herd can be maintained well under or over carrying capacity. Don't get the two mixed up when talking of population we are referring to carrying capacity not herd health.
I would be interested in reading the synopsis where a deer herd population was controlled through buck harvest when carrying capacity was an issue. If possible provide a link or a source I would be glad to look it up. If the herd is over carrying capacity it is always reduced/increased through antlerless harvest. It is why Utah and all other western states have very limited doe harvest currently, yet had abundant doe harvest in the late 80's.
Buck harvest is used to maintain herds within carrying capacity as a means of generating revenue and providing opportunity. Buck Harvest is not used to control herd numbers per se. This certainly makes sense since the removal of male animals doesn't have a drastic effect on the overall population or dynamics of the herd.
As Example,
AI herd lives within carrying capacity over many years without buck harvest, the removal of two bucks does not change the status quo. Habitat has been the only factor to effect AI deer numbers. It is known deer migration off of AI occurs in years of inadequate habitat.
Cache unit, severley under carrying capacity. If your arguemnt holds true we should be reducing buck permits in order to grow the herd. Why has this not happened because buck to doe ratios indicate reduced or increased buck harvest would not change the population over an extended period of time. Yes it decreases the herd population for a period of six months from hunting season until fawning. However, it does not cause a rise or fall in term populations.
By the way a healthy herd can be maintained well under or over carrying capacity. Don't get the two mixed up when talking of population we are referring to carrying capacity not herd health.
backpackin
Member
- Messages
- 84
I think they should implement a management hunt on the island. There are some really great genetics out there but I've also seen a bunch of mature management bucks out there too. I bet people would pay good money to even get a management deer from the island. Plus, if hunters are taking out the two most genetically superior bucks each year it might be a good idea to keep the management bucks in check too.
trophymuley
Active Member
- Messages
- 441
thats the one thing i fear with the island hunt. with such a small based herd on the island how many years can the island be hunted before it ends up with giant two points and crabby forked uglys. there are some freaken ugly genetics out there. how cool would it be to do straight management hunts out there for a solid 15 to 20 years! the island would be a paradise of 200 plus deer. oh the dreams.
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
backpackin
Member
- Messages
- 84
>thats the one thing i fear
>with the island hunt. with
>such a small based herd
>on the island how many
>years can the island be
>hunted before it ends up
>with giant two points and
>crabby forked uglys. there are
>some freaken ugly genetics out
>there. how cool would it
>be to do straight management
>hunts out there for a
>solid 15 to 20 years!
>the island would be a
>paradise of 200 plus deer.
>oh the dreams.
>"I've hunted almost every day of
>my life, The rest have
>been wasted"
+1
>with the island hunt. with
>such a small based herd
>on the island how many
>years can the island be
>hunted before it ends up
>with giant two points and
>crabby forked uglys. there are
>some freaken ugly genetics out
>there. how cool would it
>be to do straight management
>hunts out there for a
>solid 15 to 20 years!
>the island would be a
>paradise of 200 plus deer.
>oh the dreams.
>"I've hunted almost every day of
>my life, The rest have
>been wasted"
+1
T
typicalfreak
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-12 AT 06:51PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-12 AT 06:49?PM (MST)
MulePacker... I think were on the same page for the most part. Im talking about preventing it not fixing it... big difference. I have no idea if Antelope Island is over carrying capacity right now. I never have said that it is... Im looking at the future not the present. Your right about doe tags. If deer get to the point of over exceeding limits a certain amount of either sex should need to be culled... Common sense. In a situation like Antelope Island they wont have strictly doe tags due to the buck to doe ratio thats on the island.
The harvesting of an animal regardless of sex is controlling the population. Thats 2 less deer, do the math.
Buck tags help to maintain numbers not get rid of them. This is more of what I was trying to explain. Its the whole health of the herd colectively and in the long run thing. You dont need 50% bucks to have a healthy herd, it can actually get way way lower than that and still be a great herd and allows the herd to be maintained to a degree where it doesnt reach the point of exceeding the limits. This is why buck tags are so effective.
MulePacker... I think were on the same page for the most part. Im talking about preventing it not fixing it... big difference. I have no idea if Antelope Island is over carrying capacity right now. I never have said that it is... Im looking at the future not the present. Your right about doe tags. If deer get to the point of over exceeding limits a certain amount of either sex should need to be culled... Common sense. In a situation like Antelope Island they wont have strictly doe tags due to the buck to doe ratio thats on the island.
The harvesting of an animal regardless of sex is controlling the population. Thats 2 less deer, do the math.
Buck tags help to maintain numbers not get rid of them. This is more of what I was trying to explain. Its the whole health of the herd colectively and in the long run thing. You dont need 50% bucks to have a healthy herd, it can actually get way way lower than that and still be a great herd and allows the herd to be maintained to a degree where it doesnt reach the point of exceeding the limits. This is why buck tags are so effective.
T
typicalfreak
Guest
>thats the one thing i fear
>with the island hunt. with
>such a small based herd
>on the island how many
>years can the island be
>hunted before it ends up
>with giant two points and
>crabby forked uglys. there are
>some freaken ugly genetics out
>there. how cool would it
>be to do straight management
>hunts out there for a
>solid 15 to 20 years!
>the island would be a
>paradise of 200 plus deer.
>oh the dreams.
>"I've hunted almost every day of
>my life, The rest have
>been wasted"
+1 that would be cool!
>with the island hunt. with
>such a small based herd
>on the island how many
>years can the island be
>hunted before it ends up
>with giant two points and
>crabby forked uglys. there are
>some freaken ugly genetics out
>there. how cool would it
>be to do straight management
>hunts out there for a
>solid 15 to 20 years!
>the island would be a
>paradise of 200 plus deer.
>oh the dreams.
>"I've hunted almost every day of
>my life, The rest have
>been wasted"
+1 that would be cool!
Latest press release of the posse involved in the amazing feat of whacking Walter and Waldo on Antelope Island.
When questioned about the hunt the group stated after spotting the two after a few minutes and shooting them, there downfall was hanging aroung staring at them as they have done for years.
Thanks for the group photo fellas.
Best,
Jerry
When questioned about the hunt the group stated after spotting the two after a few minutes and shooting them, there downfall was hanging aroung staring at them as they have done for years.
Thanks for the group photo fellas.
Best,
Jerry
1911
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 6,197
LAST EDITED ON Nov-17-12 AT 05:30AM (MST)[p]>Latest press release of the posse
>involved in the amazing feat
>of whacking Walter and Waldo
>on Antelope Island.
>When questioned about the hunt the
>group stated after spotting the
>two after a few minutes
>and shooting them, there downfall
>was hanging aroung staring at
>them as they have done
>for years.
>Thanks for the group photo fellas.
>
>
>Best,
>Jerry
lmao. I just wonder how long until the island auctions its naming rights like a stadium. Last I heard the two finalists were Austad Private Hunting Preserve, or Mossback Fantasy Island.
I've had mixed feelings on the whole thing over the years but I think if they are going to allow hunting, make it a draw or youth only draw. It is a damn shame to see it arrive at a place where a grown man can get his rocks off whacking a bought and paid trophy with his crew. (yes I understand this particular one was a draw and good) There are plenty of private ranches for that sort of thing, and every year another slice of the public is added to the same.
Give a 14 year old boy a shot at that or put a 15 year old girl on one of these massive bucks. I'm sure the auction tag clients will find a way to survive.
>involved in the amazing feat
>of whacking Walter and Waldo
>on Antelope Island.
>When questioned about the hunt the
>group stated after spotting the
>two after a few minutes
>and shooting them, there downfall
>was hanging aroung staring at
>them as they have done
>for years.
>Thanks for the group photo fellas.
>
>
>Best,
>Jerry
lmao. I just wonder how long until the island auctions its naming rights like a stadium. Last I heard the two finalists were Austad Private Hunting Preserve, or Mossback Fantasy Island.
I've had mixed feelings on the whole thing over the years but I think if they are going to allow hunting, make it a draw or youth only draw. It is a damn shame to see it arrive at a place where a grown man can get his rocks off whacking a bought and paid trophy with his crew. (yes I understand this particular one was a draw and good) There are plenty of private ranches for that sort of thing, and every year another slice of the public is added to the same.
Give a 14 year old boy a shot at that or put a 15 year old girl on one of these massive bucks. I'm sure the auction tag clients will find a way to survive.
S
SMELLYBUCK
Guest
Jerry,
No mullets in the photo. You're photoshop busted.
No mullets in the photo. You're photoshop busted.
hossblur
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,500
Yelum,
I am not sure how many shots were fired last year but I GUARANTEE there were more than 2 fired on the Newfoundlands last year. 7600ft in elevation? WOW, my elk camp on the North slope was 9200ft. Most of that 7600 mark is the ledges to the south. Its not personal, Yelum, in fact I drive a maroon s-10 blazer usually when we are out there, if you see it pull me over and lets shoot the bull. I hear a lot of BS surrounding this hunt and that is what it is. It is not a conservation tool, otherwise where is the antelope tag out there? It DID NOT save the island, the island turned a profit without it last year. It was not done to give the average guy a tag. It was done because years back Karl Malone(personal chum of THE DON) made it known he would pay 6 figures to kill one of those deer. THE DON knew he couldn't get it for conservation, or managment. He knew that there wasn't support for the hunt with both hunters and non hunters. Davis county did not want it. SOOO, he went and sold it to the legislature as a way to finance the island, and even threw out dollar ammounts it could fetch. THIS HUNT WAS DONE TO REWARD DEEP POCKETS ASSOCIATED WITH SFW, the public tag was thrown in to help shut us up. If the hunt was necessary for biology it would have been done decades ago. It was done as a gift to guys like Denny who throw around money(which they write of on their taxes), plain and simple. Its wrong, its shooting fish in a barrel, and it makes hunters look like killers. Never said its not a big deer, never said denny did anything illegal, never said Doyle did either. Look at the pic, the public hunter is thrilled, Colorado Buck is trying to piggyback the hunt for his show, and Doyle looks bored or embarrssed or both, and he should be.
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
I am not sure how many shots were fired last year but I GUARANTEE there were more than 2 fired on the Newfoundlands last year. 7600ft in elevation? WOW, my elk camp on the North slope was 9200ft. Most of that 7600 mark is the ledges to the south. Its not personal, Yelum, in fact I drive a maroon s-10 blazer usually when we are out there, if you see it pull me over and lets shoot the bull. I hear a lot of BS surrounding this hunt and that is what it is. It is not a conservation tool, otherwise where is the antelope tag out there? It DID NOT save the island, the island turned a profit without it last year. It was not done to give the average guy a tag. It was done because years back Karl Malone(personal chum of THE DON) made it known he would pay 6 figures to kill one of those deer. THE DON knew he couldn't get it for conservation, or managment. He knew that there wasn't support for the hunt with both hunters and non hunters. Davis county did not want it. SOOO, he went and sold it to the legislature as a way to finance the island, and even threw out dollar ammounts it could fetch. THIS HUNT WAS DONE TO REWARD DEEP POCKETS ASSOCIATED WITH SFW, the public tag was thrown in to help shut us up. If the hunt was necessary for biology it would have been done decades ago. It was done as a gift to guys like Denny who throw around money(which they write of on their taxes), plain and simple. Its wrong, its shooting fish in a barrel, and it makes hunters look like killers. Never said its not a big deer, never said denny did anything illegal, never said Doyle did either. Look at the pic, the public hunter is thrilled, Colorado Buck is trying to piggyback the hunt for his show, and Doyle looks bored or embarrssed or both, and he should be.
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
Hossblur, Now I can agree with every reason you stated for having this hunt. Totally. I will say Doyle worked a heck of a lot harder for the second buck, as that buck was difficult to keep track of. But in the end, its a sure thing for a monster buck, unlike anby other unit. Not because of the dsize of the island, cause there are many cwmu's smaller. But cause there are so many bucks and so few hunters.
Just so you know, there were 6 shots fired over a 15 day period. I never heard any except my wifes. There were 4 shots fired over a 4 day period on the island.
Yelum
Just so you know, there were 6 shots fired over a 15 day period. I never heard any except my wifes. There were 4 shots fired over a 4 day period on the island.
Yelum
Yelum-
All of us appreciate your photo's and sharing them with us.
I feel you were used by the parties involved in this mess to try and sway the look of this shoot.
Some great bucks you used to film are now gone to the greedy and are no longer there for your or anyones enjoyment.
If anyone was to be allowed to take one of these bucks that all of us could come to an agreement with it would be you.
It is not an attack or questioning of your skills in the field...I think you know what I am saying without trying to degrade you in any way. It is not my intent.
If they did offer you a tag I think it is chickensht that you were not allowed first crack of your choice, and speaks louder than words about what they are about.
Best,
Jerry
All of us appreciate your photo's and sharing them with us.
I feel you were used by the parties involved in this mess to try and sway the look of this shoot.
Some great bucks you used to film are now gone to the greedy and are no longer there for your or anyones enjoyment.
If anyone was to be allowed to take one of these bucks that all of us could come to an agreement with it would be you.
It is not an attack or questioning of your skills in the field...I think you know what I am saying without trying to degrade you in any way. It is not my intent.
If they did offer you a tag I think it is chickensht that you were not allowed first crack of your choice, and speaks louder than words about what they are about.
Best,
Jerry
nontypical
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 4,192
One point I would like to bring up is this:Why does the money guy get first crack for 5 days(or whatever it is)before the regular Joe gets to hunt?
Is it because he has the money?
Answer:Yes.Yes,it is.
Is it fair?
Answer:No.Life's not fair.
Money got O.J. acquitted of 1st degree murder(we all know he was guilty-would a public defender have gotten him off??),and money fills Denny's walls with the best "trophys" money can buy.
Yes,I like money too.And no,I'm not going to give it to you guys.
That's not the point.The point is,this entire A.I.hunt reeks and gives hunting a bad image,IMO.Jerry pretty well nailed it.It's all about the antlers and ego.
Is that good for the future of hunting??
Is it because he has the money?
Answer:Yes.Yes,it is.
Is it fair?
Answer:No.Life's not fair.
Money got O.J. acquitted of 1st degree murder(we all know he was guilty-would a public defender have gotten him off??),and money fills Denny's walls with the best "trophys" money can buy.
Yes,I like money too.And no,I'm not going to give it to you guys.
That's not the point.The point is,this entire A.I.hunt reeks and gives hunting a bad image,IMO.Jerry pretty well nailed it.It's all about the antlers and ego.
Is that good for the future of hunting??
7
7thgenmt
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Nov-18-12 AT 01:12PM (MST)[p]Doyle is out there to make money off the wildlife in your state,the wildlife that supposedly belong to the public,not the guy with the most cash.Your not fooling anyone with your BS stories about what a great guy he is and how he loves to help people kill big bucks.Either your a complete Utard or your in his pocket,either way your a tool if you look up to him and those like him.They are helping the sport of hunting slip away year after year until they day will come when you,and your children wont have the opportunity's(limited as they are)that you have now.He flourish's in the state of Utah because your hunting has already been sold out from under you,every year it gets a bit worse.If the hunters of Utah dont act fast your going to see a day where if you cant afford a high dollar tag and a tool guide you wont be doing any hunting.If the hunters of your sate dont quit idolizing thug guides and the tools that hire them and buy your premium tags your going to end up being spectators.Open your friggen eyes!
cabinfever
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 2,382
Here is a different angle: The money raised from the sell of the tag goes mostly to the island for habitat projects and research. This benefits the island only, and ensures that big bucks will be on the island in the future for the very same hunter to purchase the tag and kill another giant buck. How does this benefit the general deer population in Utah. I have nothing against the hunt, but lets put the money in projects off the island that benefit the average hunter.
hossblur
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,500
That is a good point. The antelope on the island are constantly being studied because of their genetic individualism. The bison have their own money. In Utah we have a deer problem, and nothing done out there is helping our herds.
Yelum, it seems that you and I pretty much agree, your just much nicer than I am, your mom and dad should be commended!! I obviously wasn't raised right!
I believe that Doyle worked hard for the draw hunter. The deer he shot I only saw once this year, he was a little less predictable. BUT, and perhaps it was just shear coincidence, Doyle was helping as a national hunting show was taping, pretty good PR! Give the guy credit, he gets his name out.
The spider bull became a freaking circus, but at least it went away, the sad thing is this happens every year!
As a side note. All the Denny supporters. What does he do with all the meat he kills? What kind of M.D. is he? Have any of you ever had him work on you?
Look at the pics. Denny looks...awake? Colorado Buck looks like he is missing a chromosome. Doyle looks embarrased. The public hunter looks thrilled, and he should be.
YUP, I am hating the game, not the players!!
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
Yelum, it seems that you and I pretty much agree, your just much nicer than I am, your mom and dad should be commended!! I obviously wasn't raised right!
I believe that Doyle worked hard for the draw hunter. The deer he shot I only saw once this year, he was a little less predictable. BUT, and perhaps it was just shear coincidence, Doyle was helping as a national hunting show was taping, pretty good PR! Give the guy credit, he gets his name out.
The spider bull became a freaking circus, but at least it went away, the sad thing is this happens every year!
As a side note. All the Denny supporters. What does he do with all the meat he kills? What kind of M.D. is he? Have any of you ever had him work on you?
Look at the pics. Denny looks...awake? Colorado Buck looks like he is missing a chromosome. Doyle looks embarrased. The public hunter looks thrilled, and he should be.
YUP, I am hating the game, not the players!!
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
nontypical
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 4,192
A biologist buddy of mine that once worked for Idaho F&G claims to know Denny and says he was an engineer(not a doctor).
I would also like to know where that meat went.Personally,I love mule deer meat!
Hunting is dying a slow death...Killing is taking over...
I would also like to know where that meat went.Personally,I love mule deer meat!
Hunting is dying a slow death...Killing is taking over...
hossblur
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,500
>A biologist buddy of mine that
>once worked for Idaho F&G
>claims to know Denny and
>says he was an engineer(not
>a doctor).
>
>I would also like to know
>where that meat went.Personally,I love
>mule deer meat!
>
>Hunting is dying a slow death...Killing
>is taking over...
"Hunting is dying a slow death....Killing is taking over", that sentence says what I have written way to many posts trying to convey, good job. Sorry, I was under the impression he was an MD, doctor not PhD, my bad
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
>once worked for Idaho F&G
>claims to know Denny and
>says he was an engineer(not
>a doctor).
>
>I would also like to know
>where that meat went.Personally,I love
>mule deer meat!
>
>Hunting is dying a slow death...Killing
>is taking over...
"Hunting is dying a slow death....Killing is taking over", that sentence says what I have written way to many posts trying to convey, good job. Sorry, I was under the impression he was an MD, doctor not PhD, my bad
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
S
SMELLYBUCK
Guest
Dropper .01,
When are you going to step up and share what you have to share? Pretty sweet if you ask me.
When are you going to step up and share what you have to share? Pretty sweet if you ask me.
J
Jtec2006
Guest
I wish all you guys against Doyle, Colorado, money, and success would stop putting in for this tag so I could draw. Take your liberal Ideas and go to Obama country. The world has a right to turn, stop hating the rich, successful, or lucky. "It is not fair they did it" or "I can't so why should they" is what all I hear. Get off your envious or jealous horse and deal with it. They found a way to take full advantage of the state park and it is a wonderful for the whole program. Doyle and Colorado found a way to make a living doing what they love and anyone can't blame them for that. Nice buck to all and congrats to everyone involved.
P.S. nobody wants you to fail at your job or success except "liberals"
P.S. nobody wants you to fail at your job or success except "liberals"
J
Jtec2006
Guest
I wish all you guys against Doyle, Colorado, money, and success would stop putting in for this tag so I could draw. Take your liberal Ideas and go to Obama country. The world has a right to turn, stop hating the rich, successful, or lucky. "It is not fair they did it" or "I can't so why should they" is what all I hear. Get off your envious or jealous horse and deal with it. They found a way to take full advantage of the state park and it is a wonderful for the whole program. Doyle and Colorado found a way to make a living doing what they love and anyone can't blame them for that. Nice buck to all and congrats to everyone involved.
P.S. nobody wants you to fail at your job or success except "liberals"
P.S. nobody wants you to fail at your job or success except "liberals"
These practical objections have a lot of force - but so does the objection on principle. Teddy Roosevelt, after all, thought the canned hunt unsportsmanlike, and left as a legacy of that opinion the teddy bear. Hunting is supposed to be real; hunting trophies are only as meaningful as the hunt they symbolize.
A cartoon from The Washington Post shows TR refusing to shoot a captive bear while on a bear hunt in 1902.
http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/brainiac/2010/12/real_hunters_do.html?s_campaign=8315
A cartoon from The Washington Post shows TR refusing to shoot a captive bear while on a bear hunt in 1902.
http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/brainiac/2010/12/real_hunters_do.html?s_campaign=8315
smitty
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,434
I wonder how many of us have put in for the tag? I don't think that I have, but I would be excited to draw it, but then reality would start to sink in. Sure, I'd be able to go down and kill a great buck, but I don't hunt just to kill stuff.
But killing a great buck doesn't make me a better hunter/person than someone that hasn't.
I think it's hard for most of us to verbalize our feelings about this paticular hunt.
I'm torn, it would be fun to go hunt the island, but at the same time, I know I'd feel like an idiot doing it. And I sure as hell wouldn't need a guide!
If this hunt is all about money and research........ahhh bullshiz, we know it's not about research!
But killing a great buck doesn't make me a better hunter/person than someone that hasn't.
I think it's hard for most of us to verbalize our feelings about this paticular hunt.
I'm torn, it would be fun to go hunt the island, but at the same time, I know I'd feel like an idiot doing it. And I sure as hell wouldn't need a guide!
If this hunt is all about money and research........ahhh bullshiz, we know it's not about research!
BrowningRage
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 4,436
"Colorado Buck looks like he is missing a chromosome"
Made me spit out my Dew..!!! LOL
"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
Made me spit out my Dew..!!! LOL
"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
ID_Elkmagnet
Active Member
- Messages
- 369
>LAST EDITED ON Nov-18-12
>AT 01:12?PM (MST)
>
>Doyle is out there to make
>money off the wildlife in
>your state,the wildlife that supposedly
>belong to the public,not the
>guy with the most cash.Your
>not fooling anyone with your
>BS stories about what a
>great guy he is and
>how he loves to help
>people kill big bucks.Either your
>a complete Utard or your
>in his pocket,either way your
>a tool if you look
>up to him and those
>like him.They are helping the
>sport of hunting slip away
>year after year until they
>day will come when you,and
>your children wont have the
>opportunity's(limited as they are)that you
>have now.He flourish's in the
>state of Utah because your
>hunting has already been sold
>out from under you,every year
>it gets a bit worse.If
>the hunters of Utah dont
>act fast your going to
>see a day where if
>you cant afford a high
>dollar tag and a tool
>guide you wont be doing
>any hunting.If the hunters of
>your sate dont quit idolizing
>thug guides and the tools
>that hire them and buy
>your premium tags your going
>to end up being spectators.Open
>your friggen eyes!
There's a lot of truth in that statement.
Justin
>AT 01:12?PM (MST)
>
>Doyle is out there to make
>money off the wildlife in
>your state,the wildlife that supposedly
>belong to the public,not the
>guy with the most cash.Your
>not fooling anyone with your
>BS stories about what a
>great guy he is and
>how he loves to help
>people kill big bucks.Either your
>a complete Utard or your
>in his pocket,either way your
>a tool if you look
>up to him and those
>like him.They are helping the
>sport of hunting slip away
>year after year until they
>day will come when you,and
>your children wont have the
>opportunity's(limited as they are)that you
>have now.He flourish's in the
>state of Utah because your
>hunting has already been sold
>out from under you,every year
>it gets a bit worse.If
>the hunters of Utah dont
>act fast your going to
>see a day where if
>you cant afford a high
>dollar tag and a tool
>guide you wont be doing
>any hunting.If the hunters of
>your sate dont quit idolizing
>thug guides and the tools
>that hire them and buy
>your premium tags your going
>to end up being spectators.Open
>your friggen eyes!
There's a lot of truth in that statement.
Justin
ID_Elkmagnet
Active Member
- Messages
- 369
I want to know how the mossback crew got the new sitka camo a year early?
Justin
Justin
P
Preacherman
Guest
>I wish all you guys against
>Doyle, Colorado, money, and success
>would stop putting in for
>this tag so I could
>draw. Take your liberal Ideas
>and go to Obama country.
>The world has a right
>to turn, stop hating the
>rich, successful, or lucky. "It
>is not fair they did
>it" or "I can't so
>why should they" is what
>all I hear. Get off
>your envious or jealous horse
>and deal with it. They
>found a way to take
>full advantage of the state
>park and it is a
>wonderful for the whole program.
>Doyle and Colorado found a
>way to make a living
>doing what they love and
>anyone can't blame them for
>that. Nice buck to all
>and congrats to everyone involved.
>
>
>P.S. nobody wants you to fail
>at your job or success
>except "liberals"
Agreed.. These guys didnt make a dime off of the hunt from what I can tell just a movie and a Photo. Not sure what all the fuss is about..
I had the pleaseure of meating the both of them and they were fun to hang out with. A great experience all aroound. From what I can tell by reading these posts is that there are Jelous people (And I mean really Jelous) and those that truly opose to it.
The ones that capitolize on it are doing nothing wrong.
I read in another post. " Dont hate the player hate the game" I beleive that this is a true statement and that if you or anyone else wants this hunt to change then you must do it yourself!!!!
Just my thoughts
>Doyle, Colorado, money, and success
>would stop putting in for
>this tag so I could
>draw. Take your liberal Ideas
>and go to Obama country.
>The world has a right
>to turn, stop hating the
>rich, successful, or lucky. "It
>is not fair they did
>it" or "I can't so
>why should they" is what
>all I hear. Get off
>your envious or jealous horse
>and deal with it. They
>found a way to take
>full advantage of the state
>park and it is a
>wonderful for the whole program.
>Doyle and Colorado found a
>way to make a living
>doing what they love and
>anyone can't blame them for
>that. Nice buck to all
>and congrats to everyone involved.
>
>
>P.S. nobody wants you to fail
>at your job or success
>except "liberals"
Agreed.. These guys didnt make a dime off of the hunt from what I can tell just a movie and a Photo. Not sure what all the fuss is about..
I had the pleaseure of meating the both of them and they were fun to hang out with. A great experience all aroound. From what I can tell by reading these posts is that there are Jelous people (And I mean really Jelous) and those that truly opose to it.
The ones that capitolize on it are doing nothing wrong.
I read in another post. " Dont hate the player hate the game" I beleive that this is a true statement and that if you or anyone else wants this hunt to change then you must do it yourself!!!!
Just my thoughts
Smitty,
I couldn't agree with you more. I drew a tag in the New Mexico drawing for an antelope in a unit where they assign you a ranch as there was little to no public land. I was there the night before, found the goat I wanted to kill in the first 10 minutes. I came back the next morning and shot him in the first 10 minutes of being back on the ranch. I felt kind of like an idiot. I was happy of course, I didn't pay for it, as I was the public hunter with the public tag on his ranch, but it wasn't really hunting. It was like I just shot one of his cattle. He ended up netting 85" and will be the biggest antelope I will ever kill, but I rarely ever tell the story of that hunt to other hunters, cause it really wasn't a hunt. Don't get me wrong, I had a great time, and knowing I hadn't paid for it made it enjoyable to me (had about 5% odds to draw), but it just didn't feel the same as my hunt 2 weekends ago. I would LOVE to hunt AI, please do not get me wrong, or the Henry's or Colorado Unit 201 for Elk some day, and they would be great hunts as I got to look over many animals to determine which one I would want to kill, but it wouldn't be the same as actually earning one, as I can speak from experience. That is where my previous post of leaving a hole in you comes from. Not because I am making an assumption, but because of the way I felt after my Antelope hunt, and that was fair chase, after drawing the tag. i could only imagine if I got to hunt a state park, before the season opened, with a guide for a couple hundred grand. I really do feel sorry for Denny, the days of going out and enjoying a hunt are over for him. He will never be satisfied going to the field and shooting a meat buck because that is all he saw the trip and didn't want to go home empty handed......not the way most of us would be satisfied after filling a tag, knowing how truly hard it is to be successful hunting........ I would think that when he tells his buddies he has another hunt coming up, he needs to stop using the word hunt and start telling people "He's going killing this weekend".
I couldn't agree with you more. I drew a tag in the New Mexico drawing for an antelope in a unit where they assign you a ranch as there was little to no public land. I was there the night before, found the goat I wanted to kill in the first 10 minutes. I came back the next morning and shot him in the first 10 minutes of being back on the ranch. I felt kind of like an idiot. I was happy of course, I didn't pay for it, as I was the public hunter with the public tag on his ranch, but it wasn't really hunting. It was like I just shot one of his cattle. He ended up netting 85" and will be the biggest antelope I will ever kill, but I rarely ever tell the story of that hunt to other hunters, cause it really wasn't a hunt. Don't get me wrong, I had a great time, and knowing I hadn't paid for it made it enjoyable to me (had about 5% odds to draw), but it just didn't feel the same as my hunt 2 weekends ago. I would LOVE to hunt AI, please do not get me wrong, or the Henry's or Colorado Unit 201 for Elk some day, and they would be great hunts as I got to look over many animals to determine which one I would want to kill, but it wouldn't be the same as actually earning one, as I can speak from experience. That is where my previous post of leaving a hole in you comes from. Not because I am making an assumption, but because of the way I felt after my Antelope hunt, and that was fair chase, after drawing the tag. i could only imagine if I got to hunt a state park, before the season opened, with a guide for a couple hundred grand. I really do feel sorry for Denny, the days of going out and enjoying a hunt are over for him. He will never be satisfied going to the field and shooting a meat buck because that is all he saw the trip and didn't want to go home empty handed......not the way most of us would be satisfied after filling a tag, knowing how truly hard it is to be successful hunting........ I would think that when he tells his buddies he has another hunt coming up, he needs to stop using the word hunt and start telling people "He's going killing this weekend".
hossblur
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,500
Do a search, I was against this hunt BEFORE it took place last year. BEFORE doyle got involved, BEFORE Denny did either. It has nothing to do with Doyle or Denny(although it is amazing how these two names are involved in any controvesial hunting post). The previous post hit it, Denny doesn't enjoy hunting like even the public draw hunter does, look at the pics. It is about aquistions for Denny, and money to Doyle, there isn't any soul in it, but thats for them, as for me and my State, I sure wish this thing would stop, BUT THE DON has lots of "friends", so I am sure there will be plenty of 6 figure tags in the future. NO I DIDN't and WON'T put in for this tag. I don't shoot fish in a barrel.
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
txhunter58
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 8,529
First let me say that if I were in charge, I am not sure how I would handle the antelope Island situation. Certainly not a hunt in the true sense of the word, but some herd reduction is neccessary.
However, if we follow the path set by people on this thread, we would eliminate almost all sheep and moutain goat hunting in the lower 48. Those animals are hunted so little, they are usually not afraid of people. Yes, the terrain they inhabit makes it sometimes difficult to get to them, but they are not truly wild. I have walked within 100 yards of both species in Colorado at less than 100 yards, and hardly had them look up at me. My wife and I were once having a picnic on the Arkansas river (on the highway) and had a bighorn herd graze by at 100 yards with 3 legal rams
And we might have to eliminate the Henry's deer hunt too. Sure lots of photos of big bucks there just looking at the camera. Maybe we need to eliminate all limited hunts?
And, lets say you were in an accident tomorrow and were paralysed from the waist down. If the standard set here is the only way to hunt, do you then give up hunting altogether?
My point is that this issue is more than black and white, and I am careful not to look down at what another person does in most cases. Do we outlaw canned hunts? Sure. But do we make it illegal to shoot an animal wihin a mile of your vehicle? Hmm? There is a lot of grey on this whole issue
txhunter58
venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
However, if we follow the path set by people on this thread, we would eliminate almost all sheep and moutain goat hunting in the lower 48. Those animals are hunted so little, they are usually not afraid of people. Yes, the terrain they inhabit makes it sometimes difficult to get to them, but they are not truly wild. I have walked within 100 yards of both species in Colorado at less than 100 yards, and hardly had them look up at me. My wife and I were once having a picnic on the Arkansas river (on the highway) and had a bighorn herd graze by at 100 yards with 3 legal rams
And we might have to eliminate the Henry's deer hunt too. Sure lots of photos of big bucks there just looking at the camera. Maybe we need to eliminate all limited hunts?
And, lets say you were in an accident tomorrow and were paralysed from the waist down. If the standard set here is the only way to hunt, do you then give up hunting altogether?
My point is that this issue is more than black and white, and I am careful not to look down at what another person does in most cases. Do we outlaw canned hunts? Sure. But do we make it illegal to shoot an animal wihin a mile of your vehicle? Hmm? There is a lot of grey on this whole issue
txhunter58
venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
H
hunt4130
Guest
what a buck!
hossblur
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 10,500
Yelum, I don't know the total acrerage of AI. So if we have a 17 mile long stretch in ALL of utah that is a game preserve, we now have to outlaw what? And REALLY, comparing AI(where the deer are) to a sheep unit? Good lord! This hunt isn't some traditional area, hunted for generations that was suddenly closed, it has been hunted 2 times, there are a whole 4 people that have ever hunted it, get real. It is a canned hunt bought by guys that are too lazy to hunt real trophy units, plain and simple. Denny spends 100's of thousands on hunts, he can buy any tag in the west, he got this one because it was easy, and it was high profile. It is not about conservation, managment, giving oppurtunity to wounded vets, or handicapped hunters, it didn't save the island, IT WAS ABOUT OPENING ACCESS to guys like Denny that are dumb enough to write a check. Then he can sell it as "helping a good cause", I wrote several checks to Primary Childrens this year, I hope to god I never expect anything from them!
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
"Your just jealous because _____, so you can't know anything!!"
