200 inch net bucks for utah, please read

E

elkhunter57

Guest
Please go look at our Utah deer herd, If you have good for you and if you seen a 200 inch net buck while you were out even better. But if we changed the way we hunt all the Utah units minus henreys my idea by the way along time ago, little private no other state migration, limited private, no reservation, perfect pilot unit!!!!
Ok question for you all: are your hunting groups still talking about the big wide deep forked 200 inch buck your seen and are you hoping to draw next year, and are you hoping your dad, our son or daughter, gets to draw in hopes of seeing, or waking up opening morning after a sleepless night? PLEASE I HAVE A PLAN FOR UTAH MULE DEER PLEASE HELP ME, I WILL POST IT AND HAVE ALREADY BUT WILL KEEP TRYING. ITS A POST FOR UTAH 200 INCH HAVEN BUT GO CUT SHORT
 
That comment was like someone on crack. It made no sense. Explain!
"I've hunted almost every day of my life, The rest have been wasted"
 
Dude's been on the oil rig a little too long I think... that was the most incoherent thing Ive ever read I think...

"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
The plan!!!! Make some deer units primitive weapon only, make some units rifle only, The units with more open type turf we hunt with bows, and muzzle, the units with tight cover we hunt with rifle..
And the last 4 days of all the hunts we make the hunt a three point or better, maybe youth hunters can take the small buck, but point being our BUCKS HAVE TO GO UP!!!!!!! THEY JUST DONT SHOW UP ANYMORE
 
Then you could create an app for my phone so while in the field, I'd be able to know what, when, where and how I should be hunting. I'm already confused.

The solution to getting more bucks is to....drum roll....kill less bucks! Less tags = less deer getting killed. But that would take a real effort on the part of the DWR to actually figure out which units need help.

Or just sale left over tags to rifle hunters on units that are already struggling....that should help. (sarcasm)
 
"less tags = less bucks getting killed" Wrong in my opinion. Just look at the limited entry hunts that go on already. The last couple of days of the hunt(or the last day the hunter is going to hunt) you have a ton of smaller deer being shot and guys saying stuff like, well I waited x ammount of years to draw this tag and was hoping for a bigger one but never found it and I am certainly not going to let the tag go to waist after waiting x ammount of years! You will have the same thing going on with less tags. More people putting in and haveing to wait a few years to draw they will feel the same way the guys with limited entry tags feel. You then will have guys shooting more bucks. If I know that I will be able to draw a unit every year and I am after bigger ones in my opinion poeple will be willing to eat more tag soup in hopes that the passing on the smaller ones will lead to bigger ones in the future. I have seen this on some ground that I have hunted for the last 20 years. When the bigger ones became fewer and farther between, everyone started shooting anything that they could. The last few years the foccus has been more on killing something with a little size to it rather than a small one and now we are starting to see some bigger ones come back because people stopped shooting the smaller ones just to fill a tag. Just my opinion though, take it for what it is worth.
 
Sage, come on, tell us if you think our deer herd needs some help, lets help the dnr fix it for our future hunting, and closing a deer unit., well the antis would love that idea, read my post on 200 inch haven, the last one was bait,the first one had the plan, Maybe throw in the last four days of any hunt would be 3 point or better, minus the youth hunter they can shoot little bucks all hunt.
 
Elk, I agree the deer herds need help. I was talking to a DNR person and he said it was mostly the loss of habitat, roads and road kill, and old growth that produces little forage. Hopefully we can work together and increase deer numbers.
 
There is no one solid answer to fix our herds but we have to start somewhere. For example, I own a few acres in Eastern Utah that is all private. For 20 years I have seen very few hunters and the pressure is almost non-existent... and yet we still have very few deer up there, despite the proper habitat. I believe the problem up my way is that the coyotes are wiping them out. For every trip I go up I will hear and see coyotes, sometimes more than I see deer. Guess I need to become a coyote hunter and wipe some of them out!
 
I could be with on the elk issue, the only thing that scares me is the dnr will shoot all the elk, and continue to wipe out deer, then we will have nothing. Going some pilot unit primitive may help our deer herds, and nothing against rifle hunters, I am one of them. I was the first person to say the spike only for elk on the fishlake would not work, man was i ever wrong, they shot a 400+ gross bull there this year, and so why not try something to help mule deer, I have the full plan on pm if you would be interested in reading? Kinda keeps my message more complete to convey without hitting the trash zone on this site.
 
Stockhunter, ya got the right idea, by the way they are worth 50 bucks, ya just gotta jump thru a few hoops first to get your money.
And please shoot them dogs, make it a family outing like deer hunting used to be!!!!
 
Shootinfool,

Good point. I see exactly what you are saying. I do that myself. My standards go down as the hunt progresses. I'm not much of a trophy hunter though. Antler size was a priority for a few years. But I realized I was missing what is truly important to me about hunting and I was enjoying the hunt less and less. I look back at some of my footage of bucks I've passed...and I shake my head. What was I thinking!!! I've finally reached a point where the taking of an animal is less important than the hunt itself. Would I pass a big buck (to me 160" or better)...no. But I won't pass on a small 3 or four point either; especially if my kids are with me.

Honestly, I've had all I can take of the trophy hunting lifestyle, commercialization, elite hunting guide, trophy of a lifetime crap!
 
Lineguy!!! lmao im still smileing at that one, bam right on the chin, OK bud,what do you think we should try to do with our deer herd? Right or wrong i"m just trying to fix the deer, and help Utah make allot of money cause, without money, this state will never have deer again, sad to say. Primitive weapon units sell lots of tags, and saves deer, hell who knows maybe someday we can have two season openers, one in Sept. and one in Nov. And still have big deer to hunt. Trashers come on I have seen it work on elk in New Mexico it was a kick ass elk hunt. May work for deer!!!!!!!!!
 
Shootinfool, Perfect, perfect, perfect, very well said I feel the same way, Its the kids we need to help! We need to pass this hunting thing on, the right way. We need to figure a way to get deer back, this plan i posted maybe away to do that?
 
>There is no one solid answer
>to fix our herds but
>we have to start somewhere.
>For example, I own a
>few acres in Eastern Utah
>that is all private. For
>20 years I have seen
>very few hunters and the
>pressure is almost non-existent... and
>yet we still have very
>few deer up there, despite
>the proper habitat. I believe
>the problem up my way
>is that the coyotes are
>wiping them out. For every
>trip I go up I
>will hear and see coyotes,
>sometimes more than I see
>deer. Guess I need to
>become a coyote hunter and
>wipe some of them out!
>

No something bigger is wrong in Utah. Other states all have predators, heck look at Colorado, we have so many bears it is unreal and no way to kill em.

The real issue has been mismanagement of deer herds and poor habitat management.

This combined with over harvest is the reall issue. Not to mention ELK out Compete deer. they actually out compete every other game/herd species. So while you have all enjoyed elk hunting, the elk hunting comes at the cost of deer.

To really get it fixed. limited tags, tags based on unit objectives not statewide objectives, and the pain of not drawing a decent tag except for every couple years.

Also got to work preds, but they are not any more of an issue in Utah than other states.

I am always amazed when I travel to visit family in Utah, it is almost like a switch at the boarder... Deer in CO but almost none in Utah. It is tag numbers and habitat...
 
I might have been out of line. Folks have told me to keep down my exuberance until they have had their morning coffee.

That said, I am from Kansas and a 200 inch muley isn't common but at the same time it isn't unheard of. It sure takes a lot of variables to get an animal that big. Pressure is a big problem here as I'm sure it is there. Not sure there is just one right answer. But on a positive note, one person CAN make a difference.

If all else fails, youtube has a plethora of Schoolhouse Rock videos.
 
>Come tx packmule lol, help me
>fix the deer, oboy here
>we go again lol


It's a simple fix: game fence the rds, kill off all other animals (especially the wolves that have migrated into Northern Utah }> ) and reduce tags to achieve 10:1 buck to doe ratio. That many bucks running around and an increase in CC from wiping everything else out and you're bound to have a cpl 200"ers running around the hills.
 
See below for the best way to increase the number of bucks in an area that is already at max population (Max population based off of available winter forage, etc...)


1. Buck to doe ratios need to be brought into balance.
2. Increase habitat that allows the increase of Max Population.
3. Kill more predators
4. stop hitting deer on roads


We don't need "primitive hunts" we don't need any more fing regulation nor do we need any extra rules.


There is not a single unit in this state that is a "more open" unit or "more dense" unit. Every unit has a wide variety of places and locations to hunt.


To "fix" the deer herds one must know what "fixing" means. Do we need more deer? more bucks? more of both?


How then do we achieve the desireed goal? Its easy to say the "what" of the matter but the "how" is where we fall short every time.


SWbuckmaster will disagree with me 100% on this as well as many many other experienced and weathered hunters that have many more years of experience and many more miles under their boots...

We need to kill more does. Now I am in no way implying that we need a 1996 Monte Cristo double doe tag fiasco repeat... I believe that if an area can support...lets say 100 deer... and one buck can successfully breed 9 does with an almost guaranteed 100% fertilization rate then this area could support lets say only 10 bucks and 90 does.


Next year, using this example, these 90 does would produce around 130 fawns. Only 40% of these fawns will make it through the first year leaving you with about 50 fawns in total and a total of 150 deer. If every other fawn was a buck then instead of having only 10 bucks in this area you now have 35.


But with such a great increase in buck numbers and overall deer numbers you must remember that this area can only suport a max population of 100 deer. What now needs to happen? We need to hunt and harvest some of the deer. In an example like this you should be killing atleast 23 bucks a year and 23 does a year. Killing this number of deer of both does and bucks would leave you with 35 breeding bucks a year and 65 breeding does.


Tag adjustments would be based on a +/- 10% population standing.


I know "bucks don't give birth to fawns" but fawns and does eat the same food and compete for the same food as the bucks do.


So my question in this "fix the deer" thread (which I apologize for hijacking) is: If an area can only suppport X amount of deer...how many of the total population would you like to be bucks avilable to hunters?



I apologize again if this example makes as much sense as the OP's original post.
 
I have seen primitive weapon units work, the opening post i sent was to be read with my first post. Hope it makes sence when or if your read it. Its about the dream about seeing and hunting big deer like we did in the sixties. Yes i screwed things up but, please keep writing you have some very good points. Also the fishlake,manti, and pahvant, need some serious help. There is a question I have to ask you, is it easier to kill a buck at a 1000yd on the Pahvant or the South Manti? Reference to close cover units verses open type cover. P.S. I have spent a lifetime hunting them both, and I hope you are familiar with these Utah unit, just asking and i"m trying to be a smartass.
 
There are open areas and heavy cover areas in EVERY unit. You can't decide a primitive weapon based on that. You ever hunt Monte Cristo? Is it flat open country or think dense cover? Its all of the above. You are asking to place more rules and regulations on an already over regulated sport.
 
...you would be taken way more seriously if your objective wasn't so preposterous....like maybe...

"170 inch net bucks for utah, please read"
 
The point to my story was not that if everyone became a trophy hunter the deer heards would recover and we would be knee deep in trophy bucks. the point of my story was that we started to care more about the deer heard instead of killing something. We realised that if we killed everything that we saw there would be nothing left for the next year or the year after or the year after that and so on and so forth. Being more picky about what we would kill and realizing that when we let the little two points go and smaller deer go that next year they will be there to breed the does and thus increase the deer heard. In turn, we also realised that when the little ones grow up, it increases the odds of seeing bigger deer in the future. I am by no means a trophy hunter but I am very concerned about what there will be, in terms of opportunity, when my son gets the chance to hunt. If people have to sit out two or three years to hunt even a general area because tags were reduced then the tradition of "the hunt" will die off. If that happens, it doesnt matter how many young people we get interested, they will become disinterested just as fast when they realize that they will only be able to hunt every other or every three years. If you ask me for an answer to the deer heard problem I would not be able to come up with one, other than the sportsmen have to start to care more about the deer heard than they do killing giant monsters or killing everything they see just because they have a tag. Again, just my opinion, take it for what it is worth to you.
 
Zigger ok i got ya, i have some good deer shot back in the day, and one being 200 plus net, 4x4 but 200 grew here once they can grow again!
 

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