GAS PAINS!

HunterHarry

HunterHarry

Long Time Member
Messages
5,002
I just went to the gas station and was "ROBBED"!
Out here on the west coast we're paying up to $2.20 a gallon for the liquid gold!
I'ts going to be an expensive summer and fall! I hear rumors that it might hit $3.00 per gallon!
I drive my ass off with all summer with my salmon fishing trips ,then come the fall,the hunting trips start rackin up the miles! then in winter,it's 5 hours to my favorite steelhead river!
Is there an electric pickup out there?
 
here's one for yah, I live on the Cali. & Oregon boarder I drive 20 min. to get gas in oregon at $1,85 gal and they pump it for you.

Question'...how does Oregon make a profit after only charging $1.85 a gal and pay some one to pump it for you, well they must be...so what justifies Cali. charging over $2,20 a gal and wanting more....
 
Here in Cali they require a special formula to meet emissions standards that is one reason it cost more. Plus I think supply and demand has a lot to do with it. More people willing to pay more money for gas. I here you though HH is pretty hard on the wallet. Gas always goes up anyway in the summer so it seems like it is going to be pretty brutal this year. Oil man in office probably has something to do with it too.
 
Manny I dont know if ORE has the excise tax on top of the sales tax like California does. What a crock of chit. Kalifornicated is a confiscatory state. When I retire I'm gone from the left coast! Maybe I'll migrate to Mexico....nah, make it Idaho or Nevada or Arizona or Utah or anywhere but CA.
 
damn and to think i screamed this morning when i got gas at a 1.63 a gal
 
Electric vehicles is pushed to be the answer. But think about it. Where does electicity come from. Hydro, but a couple years ago when CA had the energy crisis and electricty prices went thru the roof with accompaning black outs the supply was tight cuz of the drought in the NW where much of CA gets its hydro power. Other sources of electrictity are Nat Gas, coal and desiel powered plants. All fossil fuels that have enviro restrictions on current and new power plants. There have been no new refiners built in Ca for over 15 years. Bottom line, supply and demand. Lets face it CA is not going to have cheap gaso soon.

from the "Heartland of Wyoming"
 
As far as Oregon goes, I know their diesel fuel has no fuel tax on it at the pump. I would imagine their gasoline is the same way. And California has a sales tax that most other states don't have if I remember correctly. Most states average from 20 to 30 cents per gallon for fuel tax so if you added that to Oregon prices, you are still paying way too much for fuel. Diesel trucks must pay a mileage tax for the use of the highways in Oregon, but I don't know how the gasoline tax works. May be a tax included with the registration fees that makes up for the fuel tax.
No matter how you look at it, it is going to be a rough year for purchasing fuel to go chasin critters! Makes the ATV a little more practical to use to get to the hunting area, and then hoof it from there. Where is all this oil that Iraq is now pumping going? Why don't they send it all over here? We are the ones paying to get their mess fixed up???
a*r
 
I've often wondered why we don't see alcohol fueled vehicles!
Certain race engines have run on it for years,we can produce it ourselves and it burns clean!
The oil companies must have bought up the patents!
 
Hell, I am paying $2.00 a gallon for diesel here in Washington! What is up with that? When I first bought my rig diesel was cheaper than regular. Now it is as high, or higher than premium. I am thinking about converting my truck into a fat burner and feed it with the heads of our politicians!
Eric
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-03-04 AT 08:53AM (MST)[p]This sucks, no question. What galls me is the people complaining but don't make any effort to change anything, and blame it on "price gouging". To me that's as major a cop-out. Be it true or not, those folks just point the finger and do nothing about it and nothing will change. Same as folks complaining about not seeing any deer (when the facts are that Fish and Game stats show 80% of hunters don't hike any farther than 1/2 mile from their vehicles). Bottom line is real simple; if you want to even have a chance to make a difference, change your behavior. Bellyachin and doing nothing nets you nothing but personal frustration.

The only way I've seen prices go down over the past is when people reduce their driving and need for gas. The supply goes back up/stations when aren't selling it, and the prices fall. Funny thing, that supply and demand thing. Fundamental economic principles always seem to kick in when they're utilized. Free market economys work when the government stays out of them (man, don't get me goin......).

Anyway, this reminds me of that old saying "when life hands you a lemon, go make lemonade"......

HOW YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE; Go ride your bike on short trips around town instead of firin up the truck; walk the dog more; get out the reloading stuff and reload for the season; start your exercise program if you haven't yet, and get serious about it this time; take a hike in the local foothills; drive the wife's car more often, cause I know those little Hondas get better mileage than our 4WDs :); Get some work done around the house. In other words, use less gas and they will drop the prices cause they ain't sellin it. If NOBODY does that, then we have no power over this at all. Let the truck sit more than it does and enjoy life outside the cab. Even if that doesn't work for awhile, you'll be clearing up all those dang honeydos early, freeing up more time to fish and hunt AND you won't be spending those hard earned bucks on stupid gas while you're doing em....
 
It's nothing more then corporate greed!!!. Didn't we just liberate one of the largest oil producing countries in the world????. We should be buying gas for 50 cents a gallon!!!. Bush is padding his pockets along with all his corprate cronies that put him in office...I call it "pay back" for votes. It's not just Bush, they all do it and at OUR EXPENSE..

Freed, I would like to think that doing what you suggest would make a difference but it won't....This is planned years in advanced..We will be lucky if we ever see gas prices below 2.00 bucks again when this is all said and done..
 
>LAST EDITED ON Apr-03-04
>AT 08:53?AM (MST)
>
>This sucks, no question. What galls
>me is the people complaining
>but don't make any effort
>to change anything, and blame
>it on "price gouging". To
>me that's as major a
>cop-out. Be it true or
>not, those folks just point
>the finger and do nothing
>about it and nothing will
>change. Same as folks complaining
>about not seeing any deer
>(when the facts are that
>Fish and Game stats show
>80% of hunters don't hike
>any farther than 1/2 mile
>from their vehicles). Bottom line
>is real simple; if you
>want to even have a
>chance to make a difference,
>change your behavior. Bellyachin and
>doing nothing nets you nothing
>but personal frustration.
>
>The only way I've seen prices
>go down over the past
>is when people reduce their
>driving and need for gas.
>The supply goes back up/stations
>when aren't selling it, and
>the prices fall. Funny thing,
>that supply and demand thing.
>Fundamental economic principles always seem
>to kick in when they're
>utilized. Free market economys work
>when the government stays out
>of them (man, don't get
>me goin......).
>
>Anyway, this reminds me of that
>old saying "when life hands
>you a lemon, go make
>lemonade"......
>
>HOW YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE;
>Go ride your bike on
>short trips around town instead
>of firin up the truck;
>walk the dog more; get
>out the reloading stuff and
>reload for the season; start
>your exercise program if you
>haven't yet, and get serious
>about it this time; take
>a hike in the local
>foothills; drive the wife's car
>more often, cause I know
>those little Hondas get better
>mileage than our 4WDs :);
>Get some work done around
>the house. In other words,
>use less gas and they
>will drop the prices cause
>they ain't sellin it. If
>NOBODY does that, then we
>have no power over this
>at all. Let the truck
>sit more than it does
>and enjoy life outside the
>cab. Even if that doesn't
>work for awhile, you'll be
>clearing up all those dang
>honeydos early, freeing up more
>time to fish and hunt
>AND you won't be spending
>those hard earned bucks on
>stupid gas while you're doing
>em....



I live outside Yreka Ca. and there was a grass roots group who went to Gov, Davis over a year ago and demanded they reduce gas price's and nothing ever came of it, there are people trying to make a change, but but it take a bigger audience to make a dent...same goes with the fish & Game dept....
 
feel sorry for ya:here in the San Luis Valley we pay $1.45 gal.






It is not what you use, but where you hit em.
 
LMAO! it was that here a week ago in NV, gassed up yesterday for $2.23 and that's only midgrade 88octane...supreme is $2.27...46 bucks for a tank full, sure glad i got that big tax relief from the Bush Administration...think i will trade in the ol V-10 super duty 4x4 for a Hundai that way when i go huntin this fall i can put it on a pack frame and carry it where i go!
 
Last october I traded my Bronco, which got 6-8 mpg for a Hyundai at 38 mpg. It was costing me $16 a day in fuel to go to and from school each day. That was when gas was less than $1.40 a gal. It dont take no rockit sientist to figger out that you can save mo muney fo huntin' wit a mo fuel effishint rig. I hate to think about what I would be doleing out for gas every week if I was still driving a rig that only got 6-8 mpg at $2.00 a gallon.
I would probably be riding my horse into town every day.
Eric
 
I'm with freedvr on this one. Gas is in limited supply, that is why the price is high. There is no government conspiracy or anything like that. Most states tax gas because how else are they going to pay for building and maintaining roads? Somebody has to pay for roads and it only makes sense that the people who drive the most pay the most. We pay about half of what they pay in Europe so we should be thankful for that. Like freedvr said, the best thing to do is drive less and/or drive vehicles that are more fuel efficient. In a way, higher gas prices are a good thing, just because it encourages people to drive less. After all, gas is a non-renewable resource. When it's gone, it's gone, and what are we going to do then?
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-04-04 AT 09:28AM (MST)[p]Bob, Don't you live in Washington???. Remember the lottery???. It was sold to us on the basis it would pay for ROADS and EDUCATION???. Remember?. Not a conspiracy?, You are a politicians dream...Now the state of Washington is trying to ram Sound transit down our throats because traffic is so bad..We are going to pay 190 MILLION to sound transit this year and they haven't built a damn thing...It's already billions in debt..

Higher gas prices are a good thing???. It is nothing less then a legal way to steal...Remember the 70's gas shortage?. Funny how we suddenly had excess after gas went above 50 cents a gallon....
 
Kingfish, yes I live in Washington. And no I'm not into conspiracy theories. Gas is a valuable resource and people are willing to pay for it. Why should they sell it for any less than the maximum people will pay? Why do you feel that charging more for gas is stealing? If you don't want to buy it you don't have to. Nobody is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy anything. I don't know about the Sound transit deal you're talking about so I can't comment on that. And there's nothing funny about having excess after the price goes above a certain point, it's just supply and demand, Econ. 101 basics. Like I said before, higher gas prices is really the only way to encourage people to cut down on the amount of gas they use. Don't you ever wonder what is going to happen when we run out of gas? IT's not going to be good, that's for sure. There will be a lot of people starving, in addition to all kinds of other problems. This country is so dependent on gas that there is no way we could survive without it.
 
Just face it we will pay what ever it cost for gas,disel,lpg!
Its runs in cycles however motivated(pres elect year!),it will be an hot issue across America for the next 6 mos,since the record sales on gas guzzlers(I drive V-10 2500 only every day!).
We do it to our selves every time then wonders why we never see it coming,yes it not fair to all! even more so to us in California but its worth cleaner air at any cost if you ever seen you little one with an ashmia attack!
I am saving now just for gas so I hunt this year I figure that
1-trip utah 400.00(scout i will rent high mpg car)5-7 days
1 two week trip Ca X-B ZONE 400./500.
Then the weekend waterfowl trip at 100. a trip.
Rackmaster
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-04-04 AT 08:53PM (MST)[p]Like I said Bob...Your a politicians dream!!!!!. Supply and demand??? LMAO.....You live in Washington and don't know your being ripped off by sound transit???. No wonder your not upset about the price of gas....I suppose your ok with your proprety taxes going up too...It's just supply and demand!!!. You supply the revenue and they demand it...Econ 101?, more like organized crime.
 
Kingfish, gas is high in all states, not just here. So you can't blame it all on the state. I don't like high gas prices any more than anybody, after all my truck only gets 16 mpg, but I see no reason to get all worked up over it when there is not one thing you can do about it. (other than just not buying gas)

Property taxes will continue to go up as long as people keep having kids and the schools get more and more crowded. Teachers are already over paid and they are demanding more. No other state employees get a raise, but teachers think they should be the exception. Again, I see no reason to complain about it as it will do no good. I suppose if you don't like this state, the only logical thing to do is to get the heck out of here. Go to another state where the property taxes aren't so high, and where you don't have to drive so far to get into some decent hunting. Maybe Idaho, since you drive there every year to hunt anyway, you may as well move there. I'll probably be right there with you, when I retire in 20 years.
 
Bob, You are right Idaho would be a great place to live...I'm just amazed you don't see the hypocracy of our state and federal politicians....Again, we were sold the lottery many years ago to pay for education and roads...If you can tell me that's being done then I'll quit complaining.. Any particular place in Idaho you want to live???. lol.
 
Guys,

Will we ever learn. Gas supply is finite, most of it is 'owned' by people that hate our guts. But we don't do anything to get around it. Agriculture in the United States could produce around 30% of our fuel needs in the form of alcohol and biodiesel. It is estimated that it would cost about $2.50 a gallon so that is one reason why we don't do it yet. Some day we may be able to change over to a 'hydrogen' economy, basically making hydrogen fuel from water. There are some hurdles to overcome to be sure but if our country dedicated itself to researching and producing this fuel we could do it. in 15-20 years. I know this don't help the short term but wouldn't it be great to tell OPEC to get screwed.

The implications for economic health and strategic security for America are immense. Big oil does not want it to happen.

BeanMan
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-05-04 AT 10:57AM (MST)[p]Kingfish, well if the lottery money was intended to fund roads 100% I wasn't aware of it. But I wouldn't doubt if that was something they promised, as all politicians lie it seems, or at least they are very good at stretching the truth. I never believe anything a politician says. Look at the new stadium they built in Seattle. The people voted against it, yet they went and did it anyway, with our money.

I'm thinking southwest Idaho...see ya there in 2023!
 
The first thing we need to do is nuke those 30 million idiots in California idling 4 miles to work alone in their SUVs.

Remember, alot of the electric crisis was caused by energy broker corporations (enron), and it didnt have to happen.

I read an article that Canada is building the worlds first hydrogen supply pipeline to get ready for fuel cell cars. Amazing that a country with such a small population would be more forward thinking than americans.

I completely blame these high prices on BUSH and his CRONIES, they voted down the fuel efficiency increase last summer..
 
Another part of the formula is refinery capacity. You could double the amount of oil imports and it would not lower the price much. We are refining at over 90% capacity. no new refineries have been build in the last 10 years, but some have closed. Couple that with areas of the US require special formulated gas (Exa. CA) and it is not possible to trade gas when there are spot shortages, thus states especially CA is very fulnerable to price spikes.

from the "Heartland of Wyoming"
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-06-04 AT 01:14PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Apr-06-04 AT 01:08?PM (MST)

Hey Bobby,
I'd be willing to bet that you are one of those backwoods, inbred, fellas that thinks that homeschooling his children is the way to go. Where the hell do you get off saying that teachers are overpaid on a forum that is talking about high-priced gas? I for one think that teachers are one of the most important tools in society for the future of this great country (a country that I share with people like you unfortunatly). Personally, I don't even have children, but I see the udder joy of teaching on a daily basis when my fiance comes home and she has a smile on her face from ear to ear just from teaching and being around those kids. In the future, think ahead of you decide to vent your opinions onto this site. Myself and the other readers don't want to hear your gripes and complaints about something that has nothing to do with high priced gas or trophy hunting. Oh yeah, if you do have kids and they are in public schools, do those UNDERPAID teachers all a favor and pull them out, and you stay home with them all day and teach them your own narrow-minded points of view.

To all the other readers, sorry for the post. It was just something that I had to get off my chest after seeing his post.

Oh Bob, almost forgot, I was taught by regular UNDERPAID teachers and I came out alright. I went on to collage, and now at 26, have a 70k a year paying job that is only going to pay better and better the longer I stay.

Scottyboy
 
Thank God i live in good ole Oregon!



oregonCd.gif
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-07-04 AT 10:55AM (MST)[p]Scotty, KMA!!! "udder joy"? What, do you milk cows or something? Those underpaid teachers didn't teach you how to spell very well, did they? You went to "collage?" Well, seems you would know how to spell it then. Tell you what...I will gripe about anything I want on here, and if you don't like it, then don't read it! I WILL NOT "think ahead" before I decide to vent my views. Why don't YOU think ahead before you put your crap on here? I sure don't want to hear anything out of you. So Scottboy, I suggest you keep your mouth shut! if I want your opinion, I will ask for it. Got it?
 
Will we ever learn. Gas supply is finite, most of it is 'owned' by people that hate our guts. But we don't do anything to get around it. Agriculture in the United States could produce around 30% of our fuel needs in the form of alcohol and biodiesel. It is estimated that it would cost about $2.50 a gallon so that is one reason why we don't do it yet. Some day we may be able to change over to a 'hydrogen' economy, basically making hydrogen fuel from water. There are some hurdles to overcome to be sure but if our country dedicated itself to researching and producing this fuel we could do it. in 15-20 years. I know this don't help the short term but wouldn't it be great to tell OPEC to get screwed.

The implications for economic health and strategic security for America are immense. Big oil does not want it to happen.

BeanMan


I AGREE WITH YAH WHOLE HEARTEDLY BEAN' I SAW DEISSLE FOR $2,18 IN YREKA YESTERDAY...OREGON IS EVEN EDGING UP A BIT...
 
Oh, Bobby Boy what have you done??? You vented too much my ignorant friend. Only an ignorant mind would say that teachers are overpaid and why or how you could apply that to gas prices is beyond most of us. There are 10 million other reasons for the rise in gas prices and you went ahead and insulted teachers. I teach History and Economics at the High School level and do a little extra work with the college if the college needs me for a term or so. Stay off this site about hunting if your going to express narrow minded political views. Get off you soapbox and say somethiing that worth while next time.
 
Is that all you can come back on? One spell check error! You are going to have to try alot harder than that. I may have made one spelling error, but you're the one that sounds like the uneducated idiot on here. Seems to me that your running mouth did'nt only offend just me. After reading your crap that you posted, I'd be willing to bet that you are one of those guys that has "little man syndrom". Big words, but nothing to back it up with. Keep my mouth shut? Jump into your 1979 ford pinto and drive your uneducated a$$ down to Tucson. I'll gladly be waiting for you. And as far as MY opinions go, I'll let you hear them each time I see it appropriate. Like I said before ,people come onto this site not to argue over UNDER PAID teachers. They come onto this site to read and chat with fellow trophy hunters like myself. I for one don't want to keep arguing about something that has nothing to do with the basis of this website.
Oh yeah, my fiance says hi. She is off to work as one of those "damned overpaid teachers" WHATEVER BOB, BRING IT!!

SCOTTYBOY
 
Dear bob, My wife is a teacher and she works her tail off for 25 little 2nd graders. She brings work home and spends her money to supply the class room. I could go on and on but it wont matter Teachers will still be UNDER paid.
Im driveing to lake powell this week I cant weight to fill up 4 time's!
 
Am I the only person who thinks our government is resposible for higher gas prices?. Am I the only one who thinks this is all a bunch of dirty politicians making themselves and their rich business buddies richer??. Oil might be a finite resource but not in our lifetimes....Why do you think government won't let other forms of energy be developed??. Because the oil companies own government...The oil conglomerates put Bush into office, they put Clinton into office, and they will be resposible for the next person (Bush) to be in office for the next four years. There isn't now and has never been an OIL SHORTAGE!!!. There is billions of untapped crued in Mexico, In Alaska, In many parts of the Pacific ocean...So why don't we drill in those places??. It's just a ploy to crank gas prices up to $2.00 a gallon just like they did in the 70's...Once they got .50 cents a gallon we all of the sudden had plenty of gas...Remember....Don't cheat on your taxes....The government doesn't like competition!!!!
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-07-04 AT 01:48PM (MST)[p]Scotty, I think you're taking what I said the wrong way. The reason I brought up teachers was in reply to Kingfish bringing up property taxes here in Washington. It's got nothing to do with you down there in Arizona. I don't know how it works in Arizona, but here our property taxes support our schools. Kingfish brought up how property taxes are increasing, and therefore I commented that they will continue to increase as long as the cost of schools continue to increase. And what do you think is the biggest expense for schools? My guess would be the teacher's salaries. I didn't want to get into a debate about teacher's pay here....all I was saying is that here in Washington teachers think they should get a raise, yet it isn't thought necessary for ALL state employees to get even a small cost-of-living raise. I'm not saying teachers are not important, but I'm not sure why they feel they are superior to everybody else, just because they work with kids. Also, they are paid very well, at least in this state, plus they only work 9 months out of the year. If everybody else is expected to go without any increase in pay because of the way the economy is, I think the teachers should be willing to do the same. After all, they should be in the teaching profession because they enjoy working with kids and sharing their knowledge, not just for the money. If they wanted to make a lot of money then they should have gone into a different profession. That's all I have to say on the subject. But please don't tell me what subjects I can talk about on here. This is a message board and it is for sharing opinions, whatever those may be. If you disagree, then say so. But I really don't appreciate your insults. You are right that this is a hunting board, but we do talk about other things besides hunting. If you don't like that, go somewhere else. However I would say that this thread was probably posted in the wrong forum, the campfire would have been more appropriate, but oh well. Like I said before, if you don't want to read my opinions, then DON'T READ MY POSTS!!!
 
Now that was'nt too hard, was it Bob? All you had to do was explain yourself in a more civilized manner and none of this would have ever come about in the first place. I for one am NO advocate for teacher's rights by any means, but the way that you said your comments earlier were insulting not just to me, but to alot of other people that share this board with us. I for one am willing to call a truce concerning this particular subject and lets' all get back to the reason we all come to this site for= talking trophy bucks and hunting in general.

SCOTTYBOY
 
"I completely blame these high prices on BUSH and his CRONIES, they voted down the fuel efficiency increase last summer.."


Idiot! That would have taken at least 10 years to even dent the demand. Meanwhile, the price of your new car goes up 10%. Everything that is wrong with the world is not the Presidents fault, no matter how much you liberal whiners would like it to be.

----------------------------------------------------------

There is not a crude oil shortage. There are not enough refineries to keep up with demand. Refineries are running 24/7 and still cannot keep up. We can't build anymore refineries because the EPA and the tree huggers have made it nearly impossible.
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-07-04 AT 02:13PM (MST)[p]Well Scotty...no it wasn't hard, but I would have to say that if you want me to reply in a more civilized manner next time, you do the same to begin with. In your first post, which was directed at me, you insulted me with the very first sentence (backwoods inbred fella.) Doesn't seem like a very good way to start off, in my opinion. I still fail to see how my original comments regarding teachers would be insulting to ANYBODY. Everybody wants to make more money, and wouldn't it be great if every single person in this country could make more money, but then what good would that do? It's all relative. Basically, everybody makes what they are worth. If a person is not making what they feel they should, generally they have the option of getting a different job that pays more. It's all supply and demand. Whatever teachers are making, it must be fair, otherwise they wouldn't be doing that job, right? Ok, now let's talk hunting. Start a thread and we'll talk.
 
> Am I the only
>person who thinks our government
>is resposible for higher gas
>prices?. Am I the only
>one who thinks this is
>all a bunch of dirty
>politicians making themselves and their
>rich business buddies richer??. Oil
>might be a finite resource
>but not in our lifetimes....Why
>do you think government won't
>let other forms of energy
>be developed??. Because the oil
>companies own government...The oil conglomerates
>put Bush into office, they
>put Clinton into office, and
>they will be resposible for
>the next person (Bush) to
>be in office for the
>next four years. There
>isn't now and has never
>been an OIL SHORTAGE!!!. There
>is billions of untapped crued
>in Mexico, In Alaska, In
>many parts of the Pacific
>ocean...So why don't we drill
>in those places??. It's just
>a ploy to crank gas
>prices up to $2.00 a
>gallon just like they did
>in the 70's...Once they got
>.50 cents a gallon we
>all of the sudden had
>plenty of gas...Remember....Don't cheat on
>your taxes....The government doesn't like
>competition!!!!

Nah, KF, you're not the only one. We've also got a guy at work who's real big into those conspiracy theories (lol) :)
 
Kingfish, Gas is actually CHEAPER now than it was in the 70's, and just about any time in history. I know you don't want to hear that, it blows your government conspiracy theory right out of the water. If you don't believe me, read this:


There is little question that the rise in fuel costs is hurting trucking companies, airlines and other big energy users.

But other observers see no reason for alarm in the rise of gas prices for the overall economy.

"If you adjust energy prices for the general increase in prices or put them relative to income, they're a bargain," said Paul Kasriel, chief economist at Northern Trust in Chicago.

Adjusting for inflation, gasoline prices in 1981 were the equivalent of nearly $3 a gallon now. Earlier generations didn't have it any better -- fueling a Model-T in 1919 cost $2.75 a gallon in today's dollars.

"No question about it, in the long term gas prices are very much at the bottom by historical standards," said Cyrus Bina, an economist at the University of Minnesota/Morris and a student of energy markets.

Compared with the prices of most consumer goods, gasoline prices have been falling in relative terms for generations.

To buy 1,000 gallons of gasoline at today's prices requires less than 6 percent of per capita personal income, adjusted for inflation. In 1981, the year gas prices peaked, the same quantity would have extracted 14 percent of personal income.

Here's a link: http://www.startribune.com/stories/535/4688421.html
 
kingfish has nailed the solution, let's begin drilling for oil in ANWAR and off the coasts of CA & FL tomorrow.
 
dang, i thought them bigfooters were passionate. gov. conspiracy? don't figger that one. dang, there's another one o' them black helicopters. wonder what's up with that? anytime opec slows production, there's a shortage. and unlike other commodities, the price change is instant. even tho the tanks and lines are full of cheap fuel because the expensive stuff aint been shipped yet, the suppliers change their prices instantly. sometimes just on speculation. as far as "Bush and his cronies" what a dumb statement. this is an election year and i guarantee you that the price of gas is gonna be a hot topic during the debates. Bush doesn't want high fuel prices. and, we have democratic elections all the time to choose who represents us in our republic. vote for kerry or hell even nader. guarantee ya that ya won't like them. as soon as the saudi's get enough money piled up, the price will go down again. and as long as the liberals in DC won't let us develop our own petroleum we'll be at the mercy of the arabs. we don't even need to pump the oil, just develop the system so we can, then the arabs will back off. that's the way it works. and i don't think teachers are neccesarily over paid, but i think the education system from top to bottom is so stinkin' liberal that nobody learns much. i ain't no home schooler either. but most teachers i know would be better off workin' at mcdonalds.
 
ya but who causes that the liberals are so outspoken that even conservatives are that their mercy...Some times you need to have a voice on things, if your not one to do that then you can't complain if you speak up and practice what you preach then great. But don't blaim the teachers for the system! Most are as fed up with the system as anybody else. Have you tried to discipline kids when all you get back is the big F you. I love teaching if it was just shut the door teach, and pay me on how the kids preform for my subject area. There needs to be more accountablility and I believe merit pay is the only way, we need better and more stringent evaluations and that would solve the problem!
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-08-04 AT 01:44PM (MST)[p]Desertbull, shove it. Before you call me a liberal maybe you should do enough reading do more than just regurgitate rhetoric and blame "treehuggers". Your the type of person that plays easily into the corporate spinners hands. Also state some references for your supposed refinery capacities, its the same crap we heard about power plants during the Enron-induced power shortage 2 years ago. If you followed the department of justice hearings AT ALL you will find out that it turned out companies had been keeping plants out of operation as part of a price-fixing scheme.

Increasing fuel efficiency of vehicles will help this problem, and the GOP controlled congress voted it down. Wonder why?

Canada is already bidding contractors to build the first hydrogen-supplied highway in anticipation of fuel-car cars becoming a major transportation source within 8 to 10 years. Why is a country of only 30 million people so far ahead of america on fuel efficiency?

If you are ignorant to the facts, just call me a liberal, that will make you feel better.
 
The reason educators seem too be overpaid is not due to wages but rather to the cost of insurance. I'm a teacher who is also the head negotiater for our school district. the cost of health insurance has risen to almost equal to our salary.
Now you got a new topic to ##### about health ins.
Driftersifter
 
why does everyone say, "they do it this way in canada"? who cares? this ain't canada. there were plans to put in a natural gas pipeline to valdez alaska and a gas liquification plant at the end of the pipeline so that LNG could be shipped to the lower 48 for auto use. libs stopped it too. LNG is great stuff. cheap, clean, here. if ya like the way they do it in canada, there is a highway that goes there. and all this crap about enron. enron was a phony company from the start. didn't have any assets but a building in houston. no transmission lines, were partners in just a few MW's worth of power. relied almost totally on buying on the spot market. they had thousands of MW's contracted to deliver but when demand increased the people who owned the generation used their surplus to provide their own customers. california bought into enron's bs and got burned. i'm in the power biz. i know of what i speak. this BS about conspiracies cracks me up. you conspiracy guys need to get some sleep. the insomnia is crackin' ya up.
 
Man oh man, gas prices are really rising where I'm at. Its horrible. Someone is getting away with murder in the first degree. If gas gets over 2.00 a gallon you might see Morty_Pass out there bustin guns at the gas companies.

later, MP
 
All I want to say is F OPEC and the camel they rode in on. If we'd build a few more refineries and drill on our own shores, we'd all be a whole bunch better off. And just ignore the eco whackos, they're just worthless socialists. There, now I said it and my life is complete (less 1 30" wide typical muley). :)
 
once why i was huntin gi had the shits really bad. i started farten a whole lot when there was a monster buck coming my way. as i pulled up to shoot i couldnt help to let it go. i hoped the deer might of thought it was a grunt call, but i thought wrong. he sniffed the air and took off. i pulled up and shot but missed by a fart. never have had a chance to get a buck like that again
 
Here are two good options. First, get a job with a company car and gas card as I did. I put in premium every time! I make my company enough money that they would pay $5.00 per gallon to keep me working.

A second option is to not use gas. Duh! If you can't afford it use public transport, don't drive to recreate, buy a bike, buy a metro that gets 45 miles per gallon, get a job that doesn't require a long commute, move closer to work, etc. Nobody is putting a gun to your head to buy it.
 
Dillinger, you right. No one is putting a gun to our head to buy gas, but might as well be. Its kind of like no one is putting a gun to your head to buy the medicine that you need to live. I dont think i need to explain. I dont think me packing an elk out on my huffy 10 speed will work. lol And i dont think the geo metro will make it into the bridger-teton forrest. I cant move closer to work b/c the cost of living near work is way to high. Probablly even higher than you could imagine to afford. Not all of us can have as good of benifits from our job like some of you. In other words there are some people hurtin b/c of how high gas prices are. And we are forced to buy gas, or become homeless living on a street corner.

MP
 

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