Guides Fined

Wes

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CEDAR CITY -- Four southern Utah hunting guides have pleaded guilty to leading hunters into national forests without permits. They were sentenced to probation and ordered to pay fines and restitution.
U.S. magistrate Robert Braithwaite heard pleas Monday in his St. George court from Wade Ovard, Mitch Carter, Daniel Carter and Eric Christensen.
Ovard, who operates Cleve Creek Outfitters in Santa Clara in Washington County, pleaded guilty to guiding seven clients on a deer hunt in the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forest 35 miles east of Ely, Nev., in 2003.
Charles Vaughn, a criminal investigator and special agent for the U.S. Forest Service who led the investigations, said Tuesday that Ovard's case was transferred to the Utah court from Reno, Nev., to accommodate distances involved for Ovard.
Vaughn said Ovard took clients on a hunt even though his application for a limited number of hunting permits on the Nevada forest was denied.
Ovard was ordered pay $10,020 in fines and $4,000 in restitution to the Nevada Department of Wildlife's game-theft program. He was also ordered to reimburse his unsuspecting clients the $5,000 they paid for the hunt. In addition, Ovard was placed on two years probation. Braithwaite suspended all but $1,000 of the fine if Ovard complies with probation requirements.
Mitch Carter and Daniel Carter, of Beaver, pleaded guilty to two counts of illegally taking two hunters from Kentucky on an elk hunt in central Utah's Fishlake National Forest in the fall of 2001, and for giving false information to a federal officer.
In a plea bargain, Braithwaite ordered each man to pay a $4,040 fine and pay $2,400 each in restitution to the Utah Division of Wildlife Resources' anti-poaching program.
Both Carters were placed on two years' probation, and all but $1,000 of their fines was suspended if they comply with their probation requirements.
Hunters David Hale and and Harold Knight, both from Cadiz, Ky., who were being guided by the Carters, pleaded guilty to a single count each of operating an off-highway vehicle in a closed area.
They were each ordered to pay $500 to Utah's anti-poaching program.
Eric Christensen was living in Cedar City when he illegally took a client on a 2001 deer hunt in southern Utah's Dixie National Forest while working for Parowan-based Extreme Bulls Guide Service. He was fined $100 and placed on probation.
Vaughn said Christensen was only working for Extreme Bull's owner Paul Fife when the incident occurred and was not as involved in the crime as Fife, who pleaded guilty in January 2004 to illegally guiding hunters.
Fife was fined $5,100 and ordered to pay $7,000 in restitution.
To reduce the fines is cheap compared to the regular cost of doing bussines. Some judges just don't take wildlife crimes serious.
Wes
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-22-04 AT 08:02AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Apr-22-04 AT 08:01?AM (MST)

Wes
Thanks for the story. Nice to hear that idiots are caught occasionally. I do agree with you about judges not taking wildlife crimes seriously. What good does it do to have a system where a fine is imposed for illegal activity and then not implemented? This is just my own personal thought, I think judges are yellow-bellied when it comes to wildlife crimes. They have no backbone, guts, or whatever you want to call it. If one judge would throw the book at a criminal, that would start to send a message. It will be interesting to see how the case against former Judge Harding, in Utah, proceeds this summer. He is accused of illegally killing some elk and a trophy moose. Will probably get a slap on the wrist. Sorry for the soapbox. Had to let loose.

Mark
 
at least they caught em. shows that they guys on ground were doing their work. can't say much for the judge to reduce all the fines. sorta interesting about the "knight & hale" boys gettin' caught up in all this. wonder why they haven't said anything about it on their tv show? guess i missed that episode.
 
It's good to see bogus guides sentenced, now we need to get rid of Judge Braithwaite. Paying 10% of the fine isn't much of a deterrent especially when a person could easily make the 'fine' by guiding one group illegally.

BeanMan
 
My dad shot a 5-point bull on a cow tag this year. He got fined a 100 bucks and then got another tag. They reduced his fine because he turned hisself in and hung the elk and took care of it........that doesnt set a very good example does it.....i think that he should have got in a lot more troble than that.
Just my opinion but i think that those guides should loose their guideing licences and get thrown in jail. Anyone who poaches something like that should have to pay at least $5,000 and they should have to spend jail time they shouldnt be able to hunt for like 5 years to......but thats just my two cents.
 
Garth Carter does have a son that is working with his dad but these two names of Mitch & Daniel don't sound like it. Maybe a cousin or some form of relative, but there are a lot of CARTERS around.

Brian
 
Garth's son is named Jason and would not be involved in something so stupid. To much at risk.
Yelum
 
David Hale and and Harold Knight, wow you'd think these boys would know better or at least wanna be a better role model...?...SAD...(SAKS-A-DUNG)...
 
These guys got off way easy and wildlife violations seem to always be reduced. Why? This is totally a slap on the wrist, I'm sure they made way more than there fines from committing the violations. Its time to start making an example out of people that do these things, big fines and pull their freaking outfitter licences. As for Knight and Hale I'll never buy one of their products now. Daniel Carter is or was the holder of the Utah state record archery elk and is or was owner of Outa Site Outtfitters. There is a story on his elk in the Summer '99 issue of Trophy Hunter. I've heard rumors of questionable hunting from him in the past.
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-22-04 AT 01:34PM (MST)[p]Just to clarify, I believe Daniel Carter is the nephew of Garth. Daniel does hold the archery state record, which has been suspected as being poached, but not yet proven. (he couldn't remember where the he shot the record bull when asked to show a DWR officer the kill site). Daniel was also caught poaching a deer on the Paunsagaunt a few years back but pled or fought his way out of the charges. (His deer now hangs in the DWR poaching trailor).

Kind of relates to other cases in which penalties were reduced too low for the crimes charged.......
 
Always good to see the bad guys go down, but one of the guys mentioned in that group doesn't fit the bad guy description--Eric Christensen, he split the sheets with Fife after he started questioning some of Fife's dealings. In turn the two of them got in a pissing match and Fife turned in Eric for taking a hunter out while Eric's guide license was being processed. Yes, Eric took a hunter out without being licensed yet which was a mistake and he was fined for it, but he already had taken all the steps to becoming licensed and it was just a matter of time until he had it in his hands. Eric now runs a very successful guide business and hunting movie business, Utah's Raging Bulls that is advertised on this web-site, that was highly touted on this website just two days ago, is one of his productions. Eric is an honest, hardworking guy that made a minor mistake, to compare him to the other guys mentioned in this post is just plain wrong--unlike the others Eric is not a poacher and shouldn't be labeled as one.
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-22-04 AT 09:15PM (MST)[p]This is a common attitude. It was just a minor mistake. Apparently the judge felt that way also when he suspended all but $1000 of the fines. If this guy Christensen didn't have a license he shouldn't have been guideing hunters. Thats called guideing without a license. Even if it was being processed he was still unlicensed. I'm a licensed master guide and I belive in living by the rules. It's amazing how many top guides break the laws and are defended with the excuse, " it was just a minor mistake". These guys should all lose their licenses permanently. A $1000 fine is a lot cheaper then paying for a forest service permit and the associated costs, and thats the lesson they learned.
Wes
 
Yah know I watch everyone jump so fast to conclusions about stuff on this site, and I like the diverse opinions. In utah there are no guide licenses required. Does anyone have an idea how many people do the same thing those guys got busted for. If anyone on here has ever taken a coke, a tank full of gas, or anything traded stuff for a hunt. they are just as guilty as the guys getting busted. I'm not defending them, I know most of them personally. Ovard should have been busted harded if you ask me, the carters I really dont know that well. Fife got what he deserved, christensen was a subguide under paul and I feel like he shouldn't have even been fined but whatever. Christensen told me he applied for a permit well before the season even started, and when he went in to try and apply for them again for the next season the guy in charge said "It's a good thing you came in early I haven't even looked at the ones from last year" Its just remember if you take anything for helping somebody on a hunt your just as guilty as them. I think there should be a guide license required in utah to stop people from doing this. It's like the forest service here doesn't like guides. they should work with the guides and help each other out. And I dont know what permit you got from the FS wes but If you payed more than $80 plus 3% you got screwed. Thats my opinion any way!
 
Allright,

#1 Is it not True that you can guide in utah without being licensed. YES< you can guide on private property without a license.

#2 Is it not fact that you must be permited to guide on BLM. YES< you must have the state wide BLM permit and you must therefore be licensed and bonded.

#3 Is it not required to have an additional Forest Permit to guide in each different National Forest? YES< you must have additional permits for each of the different National Forest in order to guide a hunter in them, in Utah.

NOW, Being that we got some guiding rules down. How guilty is Eric.
Well, if he was guiding on Private Property (NOT GUILTY).
IF he was subguiding under Paul Fife (NOT GUILTY) Fife should have been permitted and licensed for the Forest in question.
If he was providing a guide service, and jumping the gun on waitng for his license and or permits, than yes he would be guilty.
My personal experience and belief. Eric could have fought the system and won. He was helping a (SHADY) guide. NOt guiding on his own. Being he got the lesser of all charges, I would say the courts new he was not the "BIG FISH". I think the court should have thrown the case out.

Like one other post claimed. "everyone is doing it" "you would be suprised at how many guides are doing it". etc, etc,

What this whole thing is all about???
COMPETITION BETWEEN GUIDES and BIG MONEY SPENT ON CONSERVATION TAGS> TAGS TAGS> TAGS!!!!!!

HAPPY HUNTING AND GUIDING GUYS! LOL< LOL
Snowman
 
Trez
I know exactly what the cost are, and like I said a $1000 fine is considerably cheaper then the costs of playing by the rules.
Wes
 
Manny- Do you honestly think that Knight & Hale would risk a PR
blunder, a citation and damage to their reputation knowingly?
I don't know these guys at all but I have a little trouble believing they knowingly got into a canoe headed up schit creek.
They probably have enough money to hire any outfitter in the West.

As far as them not putting it on their show. Thats a stupid move. What better way to get it out in the open and say how important it is to get with a licensed and permited guide/outfitter. Of course why would they do that. Nobody else in this country does. Especially in the hunting/video business.
 
Wes & all the others

Wes & all the others in this site that think there $hit don't stink, ?GET A CLUE?
Secondly we all know how full of $hit the Fed?s are!. I'm sure this case was blown way out of wack and the chargers were trumped up that my 2 cents & it is the best 2 cent you will find
 
RE: Wes & all the others

Wes,
Sorry for high-jacking your post. You're right the POACHERS listed in your post got off way to easy and that's B.S. If poaching is ever going to stop, examples need to be made out of these people that get caught. The DWR claims that if you get caught--your truck, gun, and other hunting gear will be taken from you along with some jail time and big fines--I wonder if they have ever actually went through with this?
 
Is guideing people with licenses poaching?? There were no animals killed illegally. What they did was not right, I agree with that, I just know how close I have come to accepting $150 or something to show a person around on a unit when they were having a hard time finding a bull. These guys made a mistake, but that don't mean they are not great hunters or that they are bad guys. Hopefully they learned there lesson.
 
RE: Wes & all the others

>Wes & all the others in
>this site that think there
>$hit don't stink, ?GET A
>CLUE?
>Secondly we all know how full
>of $hit the Fed?s are!.
>I'm sure this case was
>blown way out of
>wack and the chargers were
>trumped up that my 2
>cents & it is the
>best 2 cent you will
>find


If you ask me it ain't worth two cents!!!!

It's always the guys that try to live by the rules that seem to get the short end of the stick and then get talked to like this.
 
I know jason carter personally and he would never be involved in something like that.
 
RE: Wes & all the others

Gosh........there used to be a lot of trophys out there.

Is it the drought or maybe.................somethin else.

This doesn't help, you knuckleheads..........

ethics and honor gone out the window...............

Mark
 

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