RE: JUDAS PRIEST,IT'S ww!!!
OK I was going to resist but now I've been hooked and am on the line I ain't gettin reeeeeeeeled in without a fight so here we go.
I wonder where Bessy is because my caps are going to be turned on and yes it is yelling. GO BACK AND READ THE DEBATES AND SPECIFICALlY MY POSTS FROM LATE 04 AND THROUGH 06 WHERE I WAS LABELED AN OPPORTUNIST. I AM WATCHING OUT FOR THE FUTURE, NOT TODAY! BACK THEN I TRIED MY BEST TO CONVEY WE WERE HEADED FOR A CRASH, WE ARE STILL HEADED ONLY FASTER TOWARDS THAT CRASH. REREAD PRO'S POST, THIS IS WHAT I WAS PREACHING 2 PLUS YEARS AGO THE SCALE IS TIPPING AWAY FROM A VIABLE BULL TO COW RATIO. WHEN THIS HAPPENS ELK HERDS WILL CRASH AND EVERYONES CHANCE FOR THEIR 15 MINUTES OF ELK FAME WILL BE GONE AND IT WILL TAKE YEARS TO REBUILD. IF WE THINK OPPORTUNITY IS LIMITED NOW ---WAIT UNTIL WE DON'T HAVE COWS. THERE WILL BE A WHOLESALE SLAUGHTER OF TROPHY BULLS AND THEN A LOT OF LEAN YEARS. THIS IS THE IRONIC PART FOR BESSY, HE IS FAR ENOUGH BEHIND IN THE POINTS GAME HE MAY BE DRAWING HIS TAG AFTER THE WHOLESALE SLAUGHTER, THEREFORE HUNTING PISSCUTTERS BECAUSE HE TRIED TO PROTECT THE TROPHY BULLS.
"It is amazing that so many people want to change the "elk management". The best thing Utah has going for it (LE Elk), and
all these people want to change it."
Did it ever occur to anyone that elk management is a lot more complicated than killing 400" bulls? In fact I am willing to bet us opportunist whiners would be less vocal if Utah would adhere to it's elk management plans.
"Here is a suggestion: Leave the elk alone and worry about the deer."
IMO worrying about the deer will require managing elk, you can't run 200 head of horses and 200 head of cattle on the same acreage. It is the same with deer and elk, their is a compromise somewhere, about 25 percent or 50 to 200. You want deer recovery, elk need to be looked at in the equation. Growing big nonproductive elk does not help in the equation.
Now I do agree the management bulls are a joke. Killing bulls is killing bulls, it is sad we have allowed our DWR to buy into the inches mentatlity when deciding harvest strategies.
Go review numbers it is easy to see that spike units do not allot near the number of LE permits that nonspike units do. Spike Units do not produce near the number of trophy bulls that nonspike units do. What they do is keep a closer bull to cow ratio and age objective to the elk plan than nonspike units. Therefore it is an easy fix for the DWR. However, don't blame the DWR, blame all the vocal minority that has fought so hard for "EXTREME LIMITED HARVEST" in order to become the "best elk state". Basically we have been filling our minivan with jet fuel to win the race, the sad thing is we have just lost control and now hope our chute works (oh yeah minivans don't have chutes) to save our --- (donkey).
I will say it again killing bulls is killing bulls, whether it be spikes, management bulls, 400"ers. Wouldn't it just be easier to establish harvest objectives, allot the number of tags to insure objective is met for a particular unit and then let effort and hunters determine the size of the bulls harvested.
In this scenario a few hunters would take spikes, a few more would not fill their tag, more would harvest "management bulls" and a few would harvest trophies. However, bull to cow ratios, viability, and other "elk managment" strategies would be in line. Oh that is what the other states are doing, we can't follow this management strategy because we wouldn't be the "best" I get it. I wonder what our excuse will be when we are laughed at for letting the "best" herd crash. I challenge you to step out of the box for a minute project the future of the western border herds if CWD infiltrates the herd. You see it is not partail to protecting bulls like management hunting. It will kill cows and bulls. Sad thing is a herd can rebuild with 5 bulls and 100 cows it can't however rebuild with 5 cows and 100 bulls. A scenarion where a herd can be lost overnight due to out of whack bull to cow ratios.
I am only glad like ktc, that I can draw me the hunt of a lifetime this year. Then I too can sit back and not worry about the crash and rebuild as I will be out of the car.
Of course I still have one daughter a couple of friends and hopefully a lot of grandkids to keep fighting for. I doubt I will ever just be able to sit on the sideline, how long can an old out of shape reserve last. Keep it up PRO, WW, C3, PACKOUT, we need our best opportunist whiners in the game.
Travis
