Antelope Island hunt bill past

YELUM

Long Time Member
Messages
3,515
KSL News reported that the bill past. Pretty sad, considering the majority of the public was against it.
Yelum
 
Sad day. Not sure how it could be classified as a "hunt", that usually implies you are actually hunting.

AntlerQuest Hunt Consulting
 
Can someone confirm that this really didn't pass! Oh please tell me it's true! Giving out mule deer tags on a State Park? I can't imagine what the hell would be next.

I sure hope Predator is right...

NvrEnuf
 
RE: Antelope Island hunt shot down!!!

Thanks man! WHEW! That was too close!

I understand that they tried to do this same thing about 7 years ago and it was shot down then as well. It sounds like it's only a matter of time before this might come up again. I sure hope it never happens...

NvrEnuf
 
RE: Antelope Island hunt shot down!!!

Now all we need is for the 188 additional " jump through the SFW
hoop " tags go down in flames as well
 
The news last night said it passed; and this morning talk radio said it passed, but the bill is not listed as passed on the States web site www.utah.gov.
 
Here are a few things you might not know about Antelope island, but before I get started let me clarify a few things I am an Outfitter and I am affiliated with SFW. But my comments and opinion on this subject are my own.
As I read through some of the comments on this post it is evident a few of you are miss informed.
First off this hunt would not be a cake walk. If any of you have been on the Island before you would know that alot of the big bucks there are as wild as any big mule deer. If they see you coming they are on the move. Granted some are some what docile but you can find that in any wild animal. You cant go feed these guys popcorn.
Hunting in a State Park. There are several State Parks in Utah that allow hunting wether it be waterfowl upland game or big game. We are currently allowed to hunt some National Monuments ie Grand Stair Case (Paunsaugunt) Glen Canyon Nation Recreation Area and others and others.
My question is this should we discountinue hunting there because it wears a name tag put on us by the Federal Government. How about the strip just a few years ago a large portion of it was made a National Monument. Dont kid yourselves it was dicussed not to allow hunting in these places anymore.
The truth of the matter is Antelope Island has been hunted through out history. Before the State forced the private land owner to sell to them hunting was a big part of the Island.
People forget this place is over 20,000 acres its not a Zoo. And we currently hunt Bison there is this any different than hunting Deer or Sheep? I dont think so.
As a young boy I was able to hunt and trap the Island with my father. One of the mission statements of the Park Service about the Island is they want to preserve the natural history of the Island. I would argue that hunting is as important of that history and should be maintained.
The bigger picture is this when do we put an stop to the decline of public property that we can hunt and start reclaiming some we hunted in the past. I can promise you that there are those out there who are working towards keeping us off public land.
To implie that these hunts would be less than fair chase couldnt be further from the truth.
I say its time we get to hunt the Island instead of a few Park Employee's.
Watchable and Huntable Wildlife are the same thing and do coexist.
Just my thoughts. Troy Justensen
 
I will admit that I've never been to the Island but I still don't think that 20,000 measly acres is enough when it's surrounded by water. Look at the mess had down south when a fence was supposedly used on only one side of an area to help trap a buck. That buck could have ran in 3 different directions and not even noticed the fence! That didn't end up doing much for the sport now did it. The antis would have a hay day with this "island hunt" and we as hunters would end up taking the brunt of it.

NvrEnuf
 
I'm not afraid of the anti-hunters as much as I'm afraid of.

SLOB HUNTERS,POACHERS,PARTY HUNTING,TRESPASSERS,UNINFORMED SPORTSMEN,DEDICATED POACHERS (dedicated hunter program in ut,)
UNETHICAL GUIDES,OUTFITTERS,CWMU'S,LANDOWNERS, HIGH FENCED HUNTS,ELK RANCHING,ILLEGAL OFF ROAD TRAVEL,AND ON, AND ON, AND ON,

I stayed out of this one till now.I think all who spoke out have that right,but so we don't discriminate, those opposed to the deer and sheep hunt should join in with the antis. And you sportsmen(?) should BE CONSISTENT and get the bullalo hunt stopped!!!!

I FEAR US MORE THAN I FEAR THEM!!!!


For the record I favored the hunt.Baised on the same things Troy stated and more.

338boy
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-04-05 AT 08:32AM (MST)[p]I believe that the Island deer and sheep hunts were poorly conceived. The backers of this bill started out trying to dictate the hunting seasons, all November for deer I believe. These dates conicide when the rather "tame" deer are even more vulnerable. The bill was presented by someone with no perceived stake in the Park, being from Southern Utah. Then when the backers of the bill could not get the dates supported by the DWR and Parks, they changed the bill. Then the backers of the bill told us how great the money would be. How many big $$$$ bucks are there out on the Island? I would say 4 maybe 5. and those would be dead in a short time and the money would dry up.

As for the sheep, the DWR has used the Island herd for transplanting. Why not continue this rather than shooting the rams on the Island??

Let me say I am a member of SFW (I also guide non-bigmoney hunters). Personally I can't believe SFW would try to push this through. If SFW auctioned the tag they would get 10% of the tag price, so maybe $10-15,000. The recoil of this deal will cost them more than that in membership losses and support. I personally know of 4 guys who spent over $8,000 at a banquet last year who will NOT renew their membership. I don't know a whole lot of people, so I imagine that there are others who feel the same. This leads me to beleive that someone of major money or importance wanted this deal pushed through. Political or other outside motives appear to be on the front with this deal. I wonder what was promised in exchange for this bill. Hmmmmmmmm........

As for the Buffalo hunt. Well that is more of a shoot than anything. The buffalo are havested by a few hunters every year. The DWR rep tells you not to shoot the one with the blue ear tag. The remaining "Leftover" bison are then sold to the public. Comparing the overpopulated bison on the Island to the underpopulated deer is rediculous. Oh I forgot, the 3-5 slammer bucks on the Island or the Over-Populated segment of the deer population.
 
Troy
Thanks for your thoughts. You are one of a few people that have had the priveledge to wonder the island at random in search of monster bucks to film, and for that I envy you. Let me share my thoughts.

I have been going to the island to film and photograph the bucks for about 4 years. My access and abilities are limited, but I have seldom been to the island without being able to locate and watch a trophy sized animal. By trophy sized, I mean a legitament 200 inch buck. No where else in this state can "I" do that. A deer hunt would jeapordize that opportunity.

Depending on the timeframe, some bucks will run, but for the most part I have been able to watch without spooking these animals.

As for a hunt not being a cake walk, maybe, depending on what the hunter is holding out for. But any hunter would be guarenteed a shot at a Boone and Crockett buck. More typicals than non-typicals. Would they run, sure, but there is no timber pockets to disappear in. Just another ravene or canyon. Yes, the hunter would have to wear out the boot leather, but we would get a trophy buck.

It has been said that a few buck taken each year wouldn't impact the deer numbers. If the herd isn't growing now, and its not, then taking a few off by hunting them would certainly impact that number.

I am certain I'll never get the chance to kill a 200 inch buck. But I'm content to be able to at least see one any time I want. And I enjoy taken a few youngsters out to see what may be their only chance to view a 200 incher. Thanks again for replying to this post. Call me some time.
Larry
 
You know, I would have to say that if bison hunting is allowed on the island, then deer hunting should be as well. I think that the State has relished big time payouts for hunts that only the rich can take advantage of. Cancel the Antelope Island hunt when the governor's tag is cancelled.
 
Daassmasta, Read Packouts last paragraph concerning the Buffalo shoot. The buffalo have an overpopulation problem the deer don't.

Sorry about your name, I couldn't resist, I hope you take it as a complement.
 
Wherever your local zoo sits used to be open to hunting at some time in the past. Gee I guess some feel they should be able to hunt there as well.
So far the small amount I see in favor of allowing hunting there are guides that would benefit by money in there pockets..notice money seems to be the factor without regard to caring about the majority of sportsman or respect for the game they "hunt".

You never hear these same financially powerful people offer to pay all that money to allow a handicapped hunter to hunt trophy animals. Instead they disguise it by letting them shoot the culls and genetic poor deer in a deer pool then pat themselves on the back afterwards. See a pattern emerging?

They actually do not care if you or I can ever hunt a peice of land. They buy it up in immense chunks to satisfy there own greed, while telling you how the money they spend helps the average hunter.....I mean heck a trophy on the wall is impressive and besides a story can be made up to liven up the hunt stories to there pals.

I respect the guys here that put in the time and hard work it takes to get a trophy every year on public grounds more than I will ever respect someone who gets one every year by plunking down $50,000.
Sure I may never have "well known powerful rich friends" but the ones I have I would not trade in for any dollar amount.

My opinion.
Best,
Jerry
 
This hunt was about one thing $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
no biological reason. The conservation groups need to check themselves people have had enough of the greed of these groups.
OK now lay on me the " well what have you done for wildlife lately" or the ever popular " wildlife needs funding " and this would have really provided needed funds for habitat.
Start putting 90% of the money raised into wildlife then
get back to me.
 
no offense taken, of course it would have been a real offense to be insulted by a hunter named shotgunjim. So how's alabama treatin'ya? Well, as my comment stated, I don't think there is a real shortage of deer there, same as buffalo. Anyways, hope the sunburn on the back of the neck is healing well. by the way, Mullets cuts are half price at Fantastic Sams until tomorrow, I know, I saw your wife there yesterday!!
 
The one major thing that got my attention was the biologist on the island wasn't allowed to speak at the hearing. I wonder why.

Vini, Antelope island is in the middle of the Great Salt lake.

Dbm, Alabama? Never been there. The last place I got my mullet cut was at Bikini Cuts, it was kind of spendy but the view was good. Havn't decided if I'am going back. Let me assure you there is at least 10 times as many Bison as there is deer. Have you ever even been there?
 
Hey Larry good to hear from Ya. I dont believe taking two bucks off the Island would effect the over all numbers. Populations is generally controled on the female side. If my memory serves me well even back in the 70's the Island population of deer was only in the 300 to 400 range. At that time they were hunting 6 to 8 bucks with out hurting the qulity.
I honestly dont think hunting these deer will effect the ability to view them at all. For the simple reason it is on such a small scale.
20,000 acres is alot of earth and the past several years the deer can leave the Island anytime they want because it is not surrounded by water. One of the things that makes these deer tough to hunt is the open country they can see you coming in any direction. You better be in dang good shape to walk one of them down.
The way the Park Service controls the acsess and the hours of viewing the average guy will never get the chance to see what is really there.
I hate to dissapoint all you Peay and SFW haters but this was not his or thier Idea.
The Idea actually came from me.So pile on boys. Why did I puss for it? There is alot of reasons.None of which was greed or money.
Very few even knew what was out there until 5 or 6 years ago. I dont think hunting should have ever been stopped on the island.Once again its just my opinion there is nothing biologicly wrong with it nor is it a safty factor.
And as far as ethical let me ask you this was it ethical to hunt there when it was private property? If so why does it change when it is called a Park. Hell we hunt waterfowl in a Refuge should we quit that too.
I dont believe there is no real good reason why we shouldnt hunt the Island
Thats just my opinon but of course my opinon is tainted because I am a money hungry guide who is a member of SFW oh lets not forget Greedy.
Larry I do hope there comes a day when you get to let the air out of a 200 inch Muley. I will give you a shout.
Troy Justensen
 
X, Your're probally right, taking two bucks off the island probally won't effect the over all population, however the whole thing reeked of greed and money from the begining. The fact that, that clown from St George who sponsered the legislation said the hunt was a tool to control the population. You said yourself the population is generally contorled on the female side. What did that guy lie? And the fact that the biologist wasn't allowed to speak at the meeting was a major issue. Maybe the reason for the hunt wasn't for greed and money but those envolved made it seem like it was.
 
Jimbo, greed is what gets people huge deer and keeps the DWR in business. Maybe the two of us can go out there one day together and take some pictures of the small herd of deer.
 
Oh yeah jimbo, I like your style, you might be a smart A@# but you are a funny one. BikiniCuts is a cool place, I've been there like five times.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-05-05 AT 01:36PM (MST)[p]"The Idea actually came from me.So pile on boys. Why did I puss for it? There is alot of reasons.None of which was greed or money." Answer=BS

"And as far as ethical let me ask you this was it ethical to hunt there when it was private property? If so why does it change when it is called a Park."

Answer=Once an area becomes a Park the game animals see many times more people and become less wary of them. People with cameras and potato chips in there hand do tend to make an animal timid.

Your smoke and mirrors are not big enough to hide the facts. Maybe if you say you want to do an autopsy of a deer after consuming human food to see how it effects antler growth then you may convince a few more to join your back door lies.
My opinion.
Jerry
 
The Knack: Do you even know Troy Justensen? I can assure you that Troy in NOT a GREEDmonger unlike some of the envious and jealous morons on this site. I've had the priviledge to hunt with Troy a couple of times and I can assure you that he is not full of BS and smoke and mirrors lies. Troy is as God-like as any person I've ever met. He is a wonderful family man and a hell of a guide. I'am not putting Troy on a pedestal for I'am telling like it is.

I believe Troy came up with the novel idea several years ago to auction off a dart hunt on the Island. The hunter would be able to dart the animal, take some pixs, put an electronic gizmo on the antlers and once the antlers were cast the hunter could retrieve the sheds. Sounds pretty non consumptive to me and a great way to generate some needed revenue. NOT, never materialized. Why? Because of comments from the not so affluent side. " It's not fair..... Only the rich will be able to participate....the SFW is getting a kick back from some special interest group or corporation...Karl Malone gets to go free if they approve it." Damn, people we are going to destroy hunting as we know it if we keep dividing our troops. Seek and destroy, is that our mission???
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-05-05 AT 05:40PM (MST)[p]I have tried to distance myself from this issue until I knew if the bill passed or not. We have given horseback rides on the island since 1994. When we first got the contract, people did not even like the island. Over the past ten years, the island?s reputation has improved vastly. Very few people knew that there was even deer out there. Tim Smith the park manager at the time wanted to sell the island to the public. We began to photograph these deer and continued to do so until 1998 when Garth Taylor took over. Two years ago Ron Taylor took control of the park, and we were again given permission to guide the public into the back country. I have spent plenty of time on the island to obtain the following conclusions.

I will attempt to share my opinions of what I think are some misconceptions posted on this web site. #1 the Island is 28,000 acre?s. it is huge! This means that these deer are not pened up and the hunt would have been fair.
#2 the deer are wild! There are a few by the road and ranch that have become used to people, but in general these deer are smart like a big buck should be.
#3 the island is not overpopulated with deer, sheep, or bison. In fact I believe that the number of deer have declined a bit in the past 3 years.
#4 hunting two deer would not inhibit viewing, but it would cut down the number of monster bucks.

What Troy said is right, but what Yellum said is right too. We all have reasons for or against the hunt. I don't think any of us want to hurt the deer herd or see access for hunting limited. All I hope is that I will still be able to show my customers these animals in the future.
 
Jerry have you ever been on the Island? I get the feeling from your comments you havent.
I would invite you to take a trip out there with me. I think you would feel a little different you may not agree with the hunt, but you would soon realize this is not a petting zoo.
It would also allow you to get to know me a little better before forming a false opinion on my character. Let me know when and I will be glad to haul you out there.
It was mentioned in an previous post that there are 10 times the number of Bison compared to deer. I believe there is roughly 600 or so head of bison and the deer are 150 to 200.
There are two reasons the deer numbers are where they are.
First the Island is marginal deer habitat at best. It is mostly grass and very little browse better suited for Bison, Sheep and Antelope.
Second Predators there are more coyotes than you can shake a stick at. And they dont eat grass. You start killing Coyotes and I will bet dimes to dollars your deer herd will increase. I believe when this went before the public several years ago the biologist said thier fawn servival rate was less than 15%.
One thing I dont understand fully is why we as hunters are so worried about sucsess. So what if both permit holders take a B&C animal. I think that is why we are lossing young hunters it is no to fun to hunt if you never get anything. I think the hunt wouldnt be any different than are great limited entry elk hunts most people get excited a shoot the first six point they see and are happy.I think there are alot of factors that would keep that from occuring ie Buck Fever.
As for the guide thing sure I would love the opportunity to either guide or hunt on the Island.But if it is as esay as evey one thinks there would be no need for a guide. Just buy a bag of popcorn and a lawn chair and sit back a sort through the monster bucks.
To be against the Island hunt is fine. And I can understand Larrys point of view. But to paint it as un ethical and hunting in a zoo. Is wrong.
If I honestly thought this hunt would be the Island deer and sheep heard in jepordy. I would be one of the first to oppose it.
My Opinion
Troy Justensen
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-06-05 AT 01:03PM (MST)[p]Troy,
The topic stirs big time feelings in me so please excuse my harsh critisism.
You may well be a great guy and all but our ideals conflict majorly on an important hunting issue.
Appreciate the invite but we have plenty of big deer here in Colorado and have the same type of terrain in many areas...minus the isolated salt flats.

The huge factor is deer becoming used to people no matter the size of an area. Our own Rocky Mountain National Park makes the area you speak of look like a speck on the backside of an elephant...Yet if they opened hunting there it would be wholesale slaughter and the cover is much more than The Island you speak of.
Please elaborate on why it is so important to you to shoot or be a part of shooting big deer that many enjoy seeing? Obviously the majority do not agree with you but "you not I" impose and even start legislation to get your way ignoring fellow sportsmans thoughts on the subject...Thus my assuming you have high dollar guys waiting in your wing to get the chance.

The issue of sportsman against sportman being wrong is insane. If everyone could do as they will without thought or approval then no game laws would exist...Some think of the here and now while others think about the future and what legacy we will leave our kids and other hunters.

I may speak my mind and come across rather harsh but I have no hidden agendas. I do not need to sugar coat my ideals to appease and try to be friends with the big names in the industry.
I will not conform to others while rejecting my principals.
Take care.
Jerry
 
Jerry thanks for the reply. To answer your question if there was ever an auction tag for the Island I do have clients that would be interested in it.Do they have what it would take to be the high bidder? I dont know. This would be the most sought after tag in the Western United States. I am not dead set on auctioning the permit.On the same hand I see no reason not to have an aution permit if we can do some good with the funds raised. It would raise alot of money for conservation if spent properly.I know they Na's out number the ya's on this thread but there is alot more people infavor of this hunt than you might think. I really believe if the whole issue was explained factually and not miss represented the Ya's would out number the Na's amongst hunters.
I just feel there is no reason not to hunt the Island.
My biggest push for the permits is to force the Park to allow us the general public to use the Island. With out all the bull crap of having to stay on maintained trails and viewing hours. Like I said before the general public has know clue what is out there and never will unless more acsess is permited.
The has been alot of BS go on with the park service on this Island including employee's shooting deer and other wildlife (Two guys were charged with this I dont know what the outcome was), harassing visators and what about all the shed horns who has them.
The Island is sand rock and grass and it burns off by lightning strikes about every 5 to 6 years. What is it hurting to allow people to hike where they want instead of a limited trail network.
My biggest fear is this like I stated in an earlier post. What about the Grand Stair Case, Perishont. Glen Canyon. San Rafael Swell what is going to keep the State or Federal government from getting rid of hunting in these areas. I know for a fact it has already ben discussed. You would not believe the regulation I have to live by to guide in some of these areas's. It is ileagal for me to kill a coyote or for my client to fire his gun at anything other than the animal he has a permit for. He can not even check his rifle to make sure it is on and be legal.
So you asked for it and you got. Theres my two cents
If hunting dramaticly reduced the numbers of deer sheep and bison on the Island for both watchable and huntable wildlife I would be the first to change it. I have no hidden agendas or un spoken promises. I simple want to see hunting back on the the Island

Troy Justensen
 
Hello Everyone,
I rarely join in these types of posts, but I tend to agree with both sides in this case. I have been to the island several times, in fact I was just out there yesterday. It is not an island where the deer are confined by any means. I think what this all comes down to is the amount of access and the number of people who would be allowed to access the island during the hunt or for scouting purposes. For one guide and one hunter the chances of finding and killing the biggest deer on the island in 4 days (I believe this was the proposed length of the hunt) go down dramatically. This island is a huge mountain that nobody could cover in 4 days. That being said I do think that it would not be terribly difficult to harvest a giant animal, sheep or deer, but not necessarily the biggest on the island. To say that the deer are comfortable around people is not true at all, at least the ones that would be hunted. The ones by the ranch house would not be hunted, they are nice deer but certainly not the best on the island. There is absolutely NO access for anyone other than trail patrol and rangers to almost 90% of the island, so I would bet than most of these deer rarely ever see a human or even a trace of a human. But I do think that 2 tags a year is way too many. Maybe one tag every other year is better or even less.

I strongly agree with Troy on the access issue. Only a handful of people really know what kind of deer are on the island because of the strongly limited access. I was talking to a trail patrolman this weekend on the island and asked him about accessing the other parts of the island and he said absolutely not, he said they hand out fines left and right for leaving the very limited trail system and that several people are watching and waiting for you to do so. A lot of people use the excuse that they enjoy seeing these big deer and don't want that taken away because of the hunt. I love to watch them also, but the deer that we can see are not the ones that are going to be hunted, at least not initially. That is why I think that 2 tags a year is too many, but if it were limited to one every other year or every 3rd year it might be better, and everyone could still enjoy watching the deer that are visible from the road and trail.

I also agree that no of this would be discussed if it weren't for the money involved. I am very disappointed that this was process was basically taken through the backdoor, no RAC meetings or Wildlife Board. This was trying to get passed as legislation and made a law. Troy you mentioned that more people would be behind it if they knew the details, well then make the details known to everyone don't try and sneek this type of legislation through. Let the public discuss and analyze the proposal.

I guess in the end I think that MUCH more access for the public should be given so that at least we can see these animals, as of now practically nobody gets to see them. Only after that should we discuss a hunt, and the hunt should be strongly limited. This is just my 2 cents and I am not trying to step on any toes.
Thanks

Jared

www.teterhorn.com
 
Well I have spent alot of time out on that island with a spotting scope, and have seen deer that take your breath away. I will tell you one thing, that nobody will probably believe. But these deer are way, way more skittish than you think. I am not talking about the deer you pet down at the ranch. These big bucks are truly wild. They are always on the lookout for danger. There are more coyotes on this island than you can imagine. But if this hunt were to ever happen, you are GUARANTEED a 220+ buck. I have taken several photos of bucks that are well over 200 inches. I think it would be more of a true hunt if it was a bowhunt. That would be tough.
later
 
Now that I have read this entire post, I would like to express some feelings that I have about this issue.

I don't think the average hunter would like the Island opened up for hunting UNLESS the hunt was opened up into the current "Limited Entry Draw" system. I know that the average person probably doesn't know about the deer on the Island, but people have the right to get educated (RAC meetings and such) and it only makes matters worse to find out about an opportunity after the opportunity was secretly taken away from you to give to the rich...... Anyway, my point is that I would want a chance at a permit (even if it is a very very remote chance), and because I have waited and built several deer bonus points, it's even more of an issue to me.

I for one do not want another trophy hunt to open up just for the rich and famous. I think it would be safe to assume that if this bill passed or is approved in the future, that it will be an auction hunt. Just great! Another hunting opportunity in my own state that I will never be able to afford..... Troy, maybe you could give me some insight as to what method you were proposing for the issuing of the permits. Again, I don't have anything against the proposal as long as the average pocket book or resident would get some kind of chance at obtaining one.

Assuming Troy is right on the deer numbers and those numbers being able to sustain a couple of tags each year, I would not appose having the tags allocated to the Utah "Limited Entry Draw" system. And obviously, there would be more support in getting the bill passed. However, opening up deer hunting on the island in any other fashion, only proves that it is all about the $$$$$.

I am starting to believe that the "High dollar" tags are just smoke and mirrors to try to get us hunters to think that the money is making a big difference in Deer management. The successful management of our deer heard is NOT hinging on these high dollar permits/auctions. The success hinges on changing the management practices of the DWR (rReducing the total number of deer tags statewide and making smaller units would be a great start). Just ask anyone who hunts Colorado.

Just some thoughts....
 
TOp Water

The proposal that went to the Hill was to allow 2 deer tags 2 sheep tags and 2 Bison. One of which would be an auction permit and the others would be a draw.
We will have to agree to disagree on the good that auction permits bring.My personel feeling is that they have generated a bunch of money to enhance habitat and increase wildlife for me and you(Average Jooe'S) that wouldnt have been possible with out the program.
I dont know where the notion that we secretly tried to do this comes from. There was no back door attempt a bill was drafted and presented on the hill.
This Idea has been discussed by SFW's main board. There were no secrets.
About seven years ago this was discussed and ran through the rac and public meetings held by the park service. The racs did not approve it but the wildlife board did according to my memeory I may be wrong.

Troy Justensen
 
Thanks for the reply X-

As you may have guessed, I am not an expert on the island hunting proposal, but I have seen and I am very aware of the quality of bucks that live there. I only alluded to the issue being a secret because of things that I heard people muttering in a certain rac. Without solid investigation on my part, I was wrong in bringing it up. I am glad that the proposal included a permit for the draw, but I personally would like to see all of the permits allocated to the draw, as would most of the average Joe's.
This is the problem: I (the average Joe) see a proposal of two permits, one going to the draw and one going to auction, as just a simple way to generate some big money for whatever reason or whatever group.... My (average joe) chances of getting that one permit is pretty much ZER0. But the people who push for the proposal act like they are doing the average joe a huge favor by telling them they have a chance to someday draw a super premium tag and the money that the other tag generates will be used for habitat improvement and such. Habitat improvement and such is very important, but what good is habitat if the deer herd is over hunted? I know habitat and such relates to other game, but the focus here is on mule deer. Maybe some of the monies that a big dollar tag brings in could go toward supplementing revenue that the DWR would lose from cutting back general deer tags..... Which is my real issue and is for another discussion.

Boy, isn't it funny how a certain subject can make a guy can go off on a tangent.... :)

Anyway, thanks for the info!
 
Troy
I too would like to see hunting opened back up on the island,It's rough when a place that has so many menories getting shutdown on the people who use to hunt it But I would like to see the tags in the draw only, So if you want a tag you would have to be putting in for the draw for a great number of years to get a tag, I know the funds that auction tags brings in really helps the wildlife picture, But i'm looking at it from the point of a Average Joe who love to hunt there and can't afford a brought tag, But I still have time to draw before I'm to old to hunt. If you can please post a few of the great bucks you have photographed out on the island, I'm sure alot of us would love to see them because I know I might never get up there to see them in person.
 
As Troy stated in an earlier post, The island rangers have kept this place their own little preserve, allowing the public to see just the bare minimum of what the island has to offer. They can hike where and when they want, while the public has to adheir to the times and places designated. Lousy viewing times are set to make it more difficult to see these animals.

They could do a lot to inhance the opportunities for us. Better hours and more areas open to the public. They say they don't want the people or horses off the trails but the fact is the buffalo tear the ground up far worse than we would.

We are all different. Some like elk while others like deer or sheep. We are never all going to agree. Any trophy hunter would bee foolish to pass up the opportunity to put one of these monsters on the wall. Maybe I'm a fool, but I don't see anything wrong with having a place thats got huge bucks that can't be hunted. Yes I am aware that we are losing places to hunt. I've seen places I've hunted in the past be gobbled up by homes and offices. Troy said he hunted and trapped the island as a kid. That may be so, but I was under the impression that the island was private and therefore not open to the public so the public never lost a place to hunt in the past. Just an additional place to view great animals. I'm sure Troy would know more about this than I, so correct me if I'm wrong. And again, this is just my opinion.
Yelum
 
What happens to the sheds that are picked by the "Rangers" are they sold to make more money for the park or is it just a perk for working there and you get to keep the big ones you find.
 
Thats a good question Gator, but nobody has answers. The law states that they cannot be picked up by anybody, but supposedly if some are found by trails they are moved. The ranch house and a few dozen in a pile for people to look at and a few are pretty nice. But there are a lot that have been picked up. Its a wasted resource that could be utilized. No,m at the current time they are not auctioned off. (legally)
Yelum
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-11-05 AT 10:37PM (MST)[p]I'm betting that if those "rangers" like horns they have a few really nice sheds gracing there homes. Maybe some-one higher up then the "rangers will be browsing this website and start think Where do all those $$$$ Sheds end up. I think one of the biggest questions has to be why can't you travel the trails all over the park if the trail is a legal one WHY can't the public travel those same trails as the park rangers do, Something just don't add up the way the park is being ran,hell if a run my business that way I would be broke. Why aren't those $$ sheds being picked and auctioned off, I mean how many big bucks are there out there.

Better yet why not sell tickets for $5 a pop for a chance to go shed hunt one weekend. That should be a money raiser.
 

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