DWR Survey for Deer/Elk.

cantkillathing

Very Active Member
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1,453
How many of you got a call about a survey basically asking if it is determined that elk impact the deer herds if you are in favor of hunting more elk?

I have several issues with this. 1st the DWR in one sentence will tell you how the Deer herds in utah are the best they have ever been, and then in same sentence ask what needs to happen to help a struggling deer herd. which is it the best or struggling.

2nd, why are we willing to reduce elk to help deer, when we have have not first tried a big and more aggressive approach on predators first.
 
Utah has made an aggressive approach on predators. We have a coyote bounty. You can hunt harvest objective on cat and bear. And I believe utah has upped bear tag numbers. My best advise to anyone not doing this, go hunt predators where you deer and elk hunt.

"We don't have a gun problem we have prescription drug problem."
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-16-19 AT 09:42AM (MST)[p]my definition of aggressive is a little different. Unlimited lion tags, unlimited bear tags, bigger and more enticing incentives on coyotes, coyotes are the hardest to control, they multiply faster than we can kill them, poison would be the best way.

on harvest objective units allow trapping of lions, to me it is dumb to have to release a lion from your trap if you are on a harvest objective unit, if you have a lion permit you should be able to harvest lion.
 
>LAST EDITED ON Jul-16-19
>AT 09:42?AM (MST)

>
>my definition of aggressive is a
>little different. Unlimited lion
>tags, unlimited bear tags, bigger
>and more enticing incentives on
>coyotes, coyotes are the
>hardest to control, they multiply
>faster than we can kill
>them, poison would be the
>best way.
>
>on harvest objective units allow trapping
>of lions, to me it
>is dumb to have to
>release a lion from your
>trap if you are on
>a harvest objective unit, if
>you have a lion permit
>you should be able to
>harvest lion.

Hey cant!

That Poison Will Kill a few of the Millions of Protected Magpies!

Oh We Can't do that!

Or How Bout a few F'N Crows as well!









I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-17-19 AT 01:01PM (MST)[p]Why are we willing to reduce cats and bears to help deer, when we have not first tried a big and more aggressive approach on elk first?


You see the problem with your arguement? It caters to your wants and desires with no regard for others. There are plenty of us that want a healthy cat and bear population also. I enjoy hunting ungulates and predators, like many people. Why would we wipe out one person's preferences for anothers? Why don't we control our take of animals, before we resort to mismanaging one species to try to benefit another. You know what hurts our deer herd, the ridiculous amount of general tags.
 
I agree with cantkillathing. Lions are particularly over populated in many areas, coyotes are bad too. Hell golden eagles for that matter are snipers on deer fawns.
 
>I agree with cantkillathing. Lions are
>particularly over populated in many
>areas, coyotes are bad too.
>Hell golden eagles for that
>matter are snipers on deer
>fawns.

So?

You're gonna get Laws Changed to Shoot/Kill Eagles?

Yes Lion & Bear like to eat too!

Coyotes are killing More Deer than any other 4 Legged Predators!

The Biggest Number of Predators in this State stand on 2 Legs!

GOOD GAWD A MIGHTY!

How Much harder can You Hunt a Deer & Elk Herd?













I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
Bess which would you rather do first: kill more elk to see if it helps the deer herd, or be more aggressive on predators to see if it helps the deer herd?

That's all your options. But we already know if the DWR are running a survey they are already intending to kill more elk.
 
Killing more elk won't do a thing to help the deer herd. Elk are grazers, deer are browsers, they primarily eat two different foods.

What would help is to remove all the encroaching water sucking pinyon and reseed with sage and other browse plants. and while we're at it, start logging again, which is what caused the deer heard to explode out west in the first place.
 
>Bess which would you rather do
>first: kill more elk to
>see if it helps the
>deer herd, or be more
>aggressive on predators to see
>if it helps the deer
>herd?
>
>That's all your options. But
>we already know if the
>DWR are running a survey
>they are already intending to
>kill more elk.

Well cant!

You're just like a Woman/The DWR!

You're not Giving Me many Options!:D

Any Decent Sportsman in the State knows that Killing more Elk in this State Ain't gonna Bring the Deer Back!

Just one More Excuse to Kill More Elk by Selling more Elk Permits = more money Generated!

47 Years & Counting of PISS POOR Deer Management in this State!

Any of You really think anything's gonna get any better with the Utah Deer Herd?

There's already been some major damage done on LE Elk Units by Killing More Elk in recent years!

So We need to Kill More Elk,Huh?

I'm all for Killing more Coyotes Statewide cant!

But that's already been Happening and I Sure as Hell haven't seen Deer Herds Rebound because of it!

Most TARDS in this State wouldn't be happy until every Bear & Lion in this State was dead!

I Like seeing Quality/Mature Animals of just about all Breeds of Wildlife in this State,You can Exclude the Coyote,RockChucks,Coons,Skunks.Magpies & Prairie Dogs,These Critters need a Major Thinning!

The Quality Hounders in this State like to see some Maturity in the Animals they Hunt as Well,I Don't Blame them one Damn bit!

So Tell Me cant,or anybodyelse?

They've Been Thinning Lions & Coyotes out of the Book Cliffs for many Years!

It Has NOT Helped the Quality of the Book Cliffs Deer Herd!

What I seen in the Book Cliffs Last Fall during November was the Poorest Excuse for an LE Deer Unit I've ever seen out there since they Shot it out Many years ago!

I Don't Think alot of You are seeing the Big Picture!

Continuous & Over-Lapped Hunting From Mid-August through January & February!

The Shed Hunting Pressure is a F'N Joke as Well!

If there is a Big Buck or Bull in this State He's got a Name & a Price Tag on His Head & a Posse Surrounding Him Months before the Shooter is Brought in to Kill Him!

There's 50+ More Reasons,I'm not listing all of them!

Let's Hunt These SONS-A-BITTCCHHES to Death Shall We?





















I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
I never got a survey.
It seems like I rarely do.



see my latest wildlife pictures on I.G.
Follow me @ antler_chaser_
 
There has been significant thinning of predators in many areas of the state with little to no benefit to the deer herd. What helps deer herds is when we as humans quit killing them. How did the Henry mountains become the unit it is? When the Book Cliffs was changed from general to limited entry, it was closed. The quality of the deer herd that closure provided was amazing, then it was opened up to limited entry and each year they continue to over harvest and the herd declines. Take the La Sal mountains, a terrible deer herd: when was the last time the lion quota was filled on that mountain? It's been years, the cats just aren't there, yet the deer herd continues to struggle. If we're going to manage predators to help our deer, we've gotta manage deer to help our deer. You wanna increase predator tags by 90%, let's decrease deer tags by 90%.

Deer and elk guys better start waking up and supporting houndsmen, or we're gonna be in the same boat as California. If you think predators are bad now, wait til they take hound hunting away. You can't complain that houndsmen need to be on the mountain killing more predators, then complain when houndsmen are on the mountain and it disturbs your deer hunt.
 
The hounds men cut there own throat. I was on the RAC and every time an increase of lion and bear permits were being asked for they opposed them. I explained that if they kept opposing tag increases that the division would eventually find different ways to harvest them. Then 2 years later, spot and stalk, them bait tags, I knew it would happen, and warned the hound men association that they were not being smart.
 
You gotta Think about it cant!

You Could Eliminate every Wild Predator in this State!

And the Deer & Elk Herd would Still Suffer & Not be what some of us would like it to be!

Our Game Herds have been turned in to nothing but Money!

Rather it be Big numbers of Small Money or Small Numbers of Big Money,it's all about $$$!

Just when You Think & Wonder where Or How they could add more Hunting Pressure/Permits in this State They Damn sure find Ways and do it!

47 Years & Counting of POOR Deer Management!

You Really Think anything Drastic or Serious enough Changes will ever be Made to Bring Back Quality Deer Hunting in This State?














I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
I can also tell you this!

Last Year during the LE Deer Hunt in the Book Cliffs They were Parading 16"-20" 4 Points around like they were Trophies!

That's what it's came too!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
The Book Cliffs deer herd not including Reservation take in over 500000 acres and herd size is approximately 10000 head of deer.
Elkassassin and whiskey you are saying that around 450 permits that probably take less than 400 bucks is destroying the deer herd.
 
Bess we have come to face the music, I know the deer herd is as good as its ever going to get, its never getting better. This is it, I have learned to live with it and make the best of what is there.
We have sold our hunting opportunities to the highest bidders and that wont change either, it might get worse.
 

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