Legislation

BigJohnson

Member
Messages
94
Looks like the Wyoming legislature is at their best again. Wharf aka smoke stick has a public land transfer bill (HB141) and Hicks has his 90/10 bill (SF103) with a major price gouging to nr’s. There’s probably others, but these got my attention first.
 
If it doesn't pass easily it will be for one reason and one reason only. the WY outfitters.

It doesn't matter if you use an outfitter or not they're the only voice the NR has . but it's self serving not because they love us ? sure. so what.
 
Just gonna play devils advocate here, the potential new secretary of interior is a serious liberal anti hunter, trapper. There might come a time in our future where the only opportunity you may have to recreate how you currently do on public lands is to sell them off. Horrible I know, just a plug to contact your senators and let them know to oppose any restrictions on hunting, trapping, recreating on public lands.
 
Ok let’s not get carried away here. A Montana DEER tag isn’t a worth 655.
Very true...luckily I pay only $300 for my MT deer tag, even that's pretty border line, IMO.

But, gives me a little more incentive to hunt with my family there. Plus, I usually do a bit of bird hunting and fishing, which is included in the $300.

I still have some OK whitetail hunting there.
 
Go for it on the tag increases. I just put in for Utah and they raised their prices thru the roof with little chance to draw. They also raised app fee for nonresident to $15 a wack. Go for 90/10 split also. That what most states give nonresident.

Let's also add a $100 habitat fee just to be able to apply each year.
 
Go for it on the tag increases. I just put in for Utah and they raised their prices thru the roof with little chance to draw. They also raised app fee for nonresident to $15 a wack. Go for 90/10 split also. That what most states give nonresident.

Let's also add a $100 habitat fee just to be able to apply each year.
$15 is cheap. To apply in Colorado I've got to buy a nonresident small game license of $84.96 plus the $10.40 habitat stamp just so I can apply. Then $412.61 if I draw the deer tag. $655 plus the $12.50 conservation stamp in Wyoming doesn't sound too bad especially when compared to Montana.
 
I think raising the prices for NR hunters in Wyoming is a great idea. I say do that and then cut back on NR tags and make the same amount of money (or probably more). Win, win for residents. The tag numbers need to be cut back, it's 100% best to start with Nonresidents. If you can make the same money and give out less tags to outsiders I'm all for it! Of course outfitters would hate that, but less NR hunters means less outfitters which in turn means more happy resident hunters. Like I said, It's a win win!

Californians are flooding into the state and that is what worries me the most. The population of Wyoming is quite small and it would only take a minimal amount of liberal idiots from California, Oregon or Washington to move here and completely run this state how they see fit. Not good for Wyoming and it's traditional way of living.
 
I think raising the prices for NR hunters in Wyoming is a great idea. I say do that and then cut back on NR tags and make the same amount of money (or probably more). Win, win for residents. The tag numbers need to be cut back, it's 100% best to start with Nonresidents. If you can make the same money and give out less tags to outsiders I'm all for it! Of course outfitters would hate that, but less NR hunters means less outfitters which in turn means more happy resident hunters. Like I said, It's a win win!

Californians are flooding into the state and that is what worries me the most. The population of Wyoming is quite small and it would only take a minimal amount of liberal idiots from California, Oregon or Washington to move here and completely run this state how they see fit. Not good for Wyoming and it's traditional way of living.
That's the dumbest **** I have ever heard someone say. The problem with Wyoming is that they don't control their residents. Make them pick a region for starters, then control the number of permits for that region.
 
That's the dumbest **** I have ever heard someone say. The problem with Wyoming is that they don't control their residents. Make them pick a region for starters, then control the number of permits for that region.
I'm guessing you're not a resident?? What state do you live in? Utah sure does a great job of controlling their residents...

Explain to me how it's dumb? Resident's should get the first crack at all tags and animals. And if you can help animal numbers by charging more for less tags on the Nonresidents side how is that dumb? I didn't say it would fix all of the issues, but it is absolutely not dumb to make out-of-staters pay more for less opportunity. Those tags would still be applied for and the money would still be made for the state. Smart business. The happiness of everyone outside the state does not matter to the residents. If you can cut back the NR tags but charge more for them you actually do help herds to some extent and you still make the necessary money to run everything.
 
I love how hunters always say we have to work together to protect our rights and all that crap. then as soon one turns his back the other tries to cut his throat.

Like I said, if we don't get totally hosed by guys like money we will have the outfitters to thank.
You're right. I feel that the outfitters are the only ones looking out for NR interests.......of course it comes as a byproduct of looking after their own interests.
On this tag price issue, I have heard outfitters say that they'd prefer higher tag prices because most of their clients have more disposable income and would have a better chance of drawing tags if some of others can be weeded out of the game.
When it comes to hunting opportunity, it's like a pack of wolves fighting over that last piece of meat.
 
These are the buzz-words that have a meaning all their own nowadays:

we need to unite
cant we all just get along
we're all in this together
we need to help each other
we need to work together
civil discourse
peaceful protest
....and many many more!

This really all means, screw you if you don't see it my way.
We can see it in many of the posts on this site and others.

The hunting community really isn't any better and we will eventually burn our own houses down through selfishness and division. At that point the antis have won and we'll wonder what happened to divide us.

Zeke
 
It's been proven time and again that price increases have little affect on draw odds.
My point exactly! NR hunters will still apply for the tags and pay the extra cost. The state could make the same amount of money, or possibly even more, while at the same time allowing less NR hunters the opportunity to hunt in Wyoming. It would decrease the amount of animals harvested and still provide the funds necessary to run the department.

The last thing I do is try to tell Utah, Arizona, Colorado, etc how to manage their NR hunters. That is their right and I can either deal with what they decide and continue to apply, or I can hit the road and remove myself. As a nonresident it is a privilege to get to hunt other states, not a right. So you have to take what is given to you by that particular state.

I do feel that much of Wyoming is over hunted, but I 10,000% believe the first step to limiting over hunting should be reducing NR hunters long before limiting residents. It won't fix everything but it can't hurt.
 
These are the buzz-words that have a meaning all their own nowadays:

we need to unite
cant we all just get along
we're all in this together
we need to help each other
we need to work together
civil discourse
peaceful protest
....and many many more!

This really all means, screw you if you don't see it my way.
We can see it in many of the posts on this site and others.

The hunting community really isn't any better and we will eventually burn our own houses down through selfishness and division. At that point the antis have won and we'll wonder what happened to divide us.

Zeke
How about "circle back"
 
So the justification by the residents is , if we can charge twice as much and give out half as many tags we make the same money and have more tags for ourselves. that's some complicated math but you nailed it Einstein.

you made my point once again the outfitters are the only voice the NR has. and 99% of you who don't like them are just jealous of their success both in legislation and in the field. they can drag some fat Californian who doesn't know a horse from a mule around and do better than you can and you resent it. maybe it's because they're just better hunters and they work harder so get over it.

the price increase won't change anything for me because I can afford it, but the reduction in tag numbers would. it's sad to see hunting become like a private country club but that's where we're headed.
 
So the justification by the residents is , if we can charge twice as much and give out half as many tags we make the same money and have more tags for ourselves. that's some complicated math but you nailed it Einstein.

you made my point once again the outfitters are the only voice the NR has. and 99% of you who don't like them are just jealous of their success both in legislation and in the field. they can drag some fat Californian who doesn't know a horse from a mule around and do better than you can and you resent it. maybe it's because they're just better hunters and they work harder so get over it.

the price increase won't change anything for me because I can afford it, but the reduction in tag numbers would. it's sad to see hunting become like a private country club but that's where we're headed.
I don't resent outfitters at all. I used to guide for one 10 years ago and loved it and thoroughly loved the people I was able to help find success. I personally think a lot of outfitters are great people and that they do add a lot of value for those that can afford their services. But I don't concern myself with what outfitters or other kill because it doesn't matter. I hunt for myself and myself alone. And I certainly don't resent anyone that is successful and has money.

Hunting is in fact becoming a private country club type of thing because of wealthy hunters and governors tags and things like that. It great you can afford it and we are all happy for you but the hunter pressure must go down and limiting NR before residents is 100% the best first step. It shouldn't matter for you anyway... if you're so wealthy i'm certain there are thousands of guaranteed tags for sale that you can capitalize on. You would still get to hunt and Wyoming animals would see less pressure....
 
My point exactly! NR hunters will still apply for the tags and pay the extra cost. The state could make the same amount of money, or possibly even more, while at the same time allowing less NR hunters the opportunity to hunt in Wyoming. It would decrease the amount of animals harvested and still provide the funds necessary to run the department.

The last thing I do is try to tell Utah, Arizona, Colorado, etc how to manage their NR hunters. That is their right and I can either deal with what they decide and continue to apply, or I can hit the road and remove myself. As a nonresident it is a privilege to get to hunt other states, not a right. So you have to take what is given to you by that particular state.

I do feel that much of Wyoming is over hunted, but I 10,000% believe the first step to limiting over hunting should be reducing NR hunters long before limiting residents. It won't fix everything but it can't hurt.
I don't see where it is going to decrease the amount of animals harvested. The residents will just harvest the animals meant for NR.
 
So the justification by the residents is , if we can charge twice as much and give out half as many tags we make the same money and have more tags for ourselves. that's some complicated math but you nailed it Einstein.

you made my point once again the outfitters are the only voice the NR has. and 99% of you who don't like them are just jealous of their success both in legislation and in the field. they can drag some fat Californian who doesn't know a horse from a mule around and do better than you can and you resent it. maybe it's because they're just better hunters and they work harder so get over it.

the price increase won't change anything for me because I can afford it, but the reduction in tag numbers would. it's sad to see hunting become like a private country club but that's where we're headed.
Explain how you would paraphrase what hunting is in Oregon for the nonresident.
 
I don't see where it is going to decrease the amount of animals harvested. The residents will just harvest the animals meant for NR.
if you issue less tags you will kill less animals... That is why there are tag numbers. if less tags didn't result in less animals harvested every state would issue unlimited tags. And those animals aren't earmarked/meant for NR hunters. In my opinion those animals belong to the state and those that reside in the state have first right to them. I wish I could go to alaska and kill a grizzly like a resident can, but that is not the case and it is not my right to get to do that either. it is a limited resource and if I want that right I have to be an Alaskan or get very lucky and draw one of the very few tags available to outsiders. That is fair whether I am happy with it or not.
 
That's the dumbest **** I have ever heard someone say. The problem with Wyoming is that they don't control their residents. Make them pick a region for starters, then control the number of permits for that region.
As a non resident of WY I have to disagree with you. If you don’t like it there’s no choices and neither involves controlling the residents.

1) dont apply
2) move to wyoming

WY doesn’t want guys like you because when you don’t draw a tag you’ll cry for a points system.

90/10 for Wyoming. Take care of the residents first.
 
Why don't you say what you really mean, me first.

money I never said I was a Rockefeller, I said a few hundred bucks isn't going to slow me down any. but obviously you don't care about those who aren't as lucky.

Jm , Oregon treats the NR like crap I've said it 1000 times before and I'll say it again. and the state is filled with so many narcissists like many of you that's never going to change. I can't change it but I'm more than willing to help NR hunters out when they do draw and I have for years. you also need to remember we have a little more federal land than WY but many times the population . I can draw an elk tag in the unit I live in about every 7 years. how about you ? but it's still not enough is it .
 
if you issue less tags you will kill less animals... That is why there are tag numbers. if less tags didn't result in less animals harvested every state would issue unlimited tags. And those animals aren't earmarked/meant for NR hunters. In my opinion those animals belong to the state and those that reside in the state have first right to them. I wish I could go to alaska and kill a grizzly like a resident can, but that is not the case and it is not my right to get to do that either. it is a limited resource and if I want that right I have to be an Alaskan or get very lucky and draw one of the very few tags available to outsiders. That is fair whether I am happy with it or not.
No where in the legislation did i see they were issuing less tags overall. They just plan on giving residents 90% and NR 10%. Same number of animals getting killed. No matter what they raise the cost they will still sale every NR tag they allocate.
 
The day will probably come when some of us will just have to enjoy scouting, finding bucks, take pictures and video, and live vicariously through the gunner.
I sure wish those with control would find a way to reduce success rates so that more people could hunt, rather than fewer.
Just have to keep making the most of what we’ve got.
 
The day will probably come when some of us will just have to enjoy scouting, finding bucks, take pictures and video, and live vicariously through the gunner.
I sure wish those with control would find a way to reduce success rates so that more people could hunt, rather than fewer.
Just have to keep making the most of what we’ve got.
You should move to WY. Might have to in a few years with point creep if you ever want to hunt G again.
 
No where in the legislation did i see they were issuing less tags overall. They just plan on giving residents 90% and NR 10%. Same number of animals getting killed. No matter what they raise the cost they will still sale every NR tag they allocate.
I think for elk it would result in either the same or slightly more elk. The reduction in LQ tags to NRs will result in more general tags being issued to NR’s. NRs typically have a higher success rate in general tags than res. Also some of the res hunters that would now draw a LQ tag due to the higher allocation would not have hunted general if they didn’t. You might be surprised by how many res hunters won’t hunt general. Usually the older folks.
For deer it should result in less res pressure on the general units. Those res that now draw a LQ tag won’t hunt Gen.

overall I don’t think the difference in animals killed will be ground breaking it could have a positive effect on some Gen deer areas.
 
Jm , Oregon treats the NR like crap I've said it 1000 times before and I'll say it again. and the state is filled with so many narcissists like many of you that's never going to change. I can't change it but I'm more than willing to help NR hunters out when they do draw and I have for years. you also need to remember we have a little more federal land than WY but many times the population . I can draw an elk tag in the unit I live in about every 7 years. how about you ? but it's still not enough is it .
You make it really hard to have a civil conversation with the attitude and name calling.
 
As I’ve been saying all along I doubt if this passes! Outfitters are against it. Nonres are the life-blood of $ generated. Where is Wyo going to make up the revenue loss...with doe tags and a few general tags? The Wyo economy is in the toilet. Small town communities will suffer. Covid certainly isn't helping out Wyo's economy as well!

With 90/10 limited tags will ultimately be cut roughly in 1/2. That means it could potentially take twice as long for nonres to draw high demand limited unit tags. 1/2 of limited tag $ is roughly 1/2 of the current nonres revenue. Obviously a small chunk of this will come from general tags but where is the rest of the $ coming from to make up for these losses?

How about pref pt revenue loss when new nonres decide not to apply in Wyo because it's too expensive and their draw odds are so bad....and sheep/moose/etc hunters figure out they have no chance of drawing tags in their lifetime? I bet a lot of nonres will drop out of applying once they draw high demand tags that take years to draw? Wyo better look at long term affects this will have on their economy!

Nothing has really changed from the 90-10 that has failed year after year in the past!
 
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Sorry if this was already stated. I did not read all the posts, but I feel most states can and should raise their resident tag costs. They are the ones who enjoy their states hunting and scouting year round. Most NR only get to spend a week or two.
 
As I’ve been saying all along I doubt if this passes! Outfitters are against it. Nonres are the life-blood of $ generated. Where is Wyo going to make up the revenue loss...with doe tags and a few general tags? The Wyo economy is in the toilet. Small town communities will suffer. Covid certainly isn't helping out Wyo's economy as well!

With 90/10 limited tags will ultimately be cut roughly in 1/2. That means it could potentially take twice as long for nonres to draw high demand limited unit tags. 1/2 of limited tag $ is roughly 1/2 of the current nonres revenue. Obviously a small chunk of this will come from general tags but where is the rest of the $ coming from to make up for these losses?

How about pref pt revenue loss when new nonres decide not to apply in Wyo because it's too expensive and their draw odds are so bad....and sheep/moose/etc hunters figure out they have no chance of drawing tags in their lifetime? I bet a lot of nonres will drop out of applying once they draw high demand tags that take years to draw? Wyo better look at long term affects this will have on their economy!

Nothing has really changed from the 90-10 that has failed year after year in the past!
According to the fiscal note on the bill prepared by G&F, there will be an increase in revenue to G&F of $8 million...
 
Is the $8 million increase from the rise in the price of nonres tag fees? What would the increase in revenue be if nonres tags quotas remain as they are and there is the increase in nonres tag fees?

I'm also confused because nonres special deer is already $677 and special elk is $1,283? I'm sure regular and special tag prices aren't the same? Would the special price tags be even more?
 
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As a non resident of WY I have to disagree with you. If you don’t like it there’s no choices and neither involves controlling the residents.

1) dont apply
2) move to wyoming

WY doesn’t want guys like you because when you don’t draw a tag you’ll cry for a points system.

90/10 for Wyoming. Take care of the residents first.
After reading this thread I will give serious thought to moving to Wyoming. Yes for a whole year. If the 90/10 split happens. Stay 3-6 years. Than move again. To another state I have points in.
With the increased draw rate for antelope, deer and elk plus with the number of points I can draw sheep and moose while I'm there. It really does make sense.
It seems to me that is the best decision and what you are advocating. I will spread the word to ever hunter with financial means that I know.
Of coarse I will bring my political views with me.
 
Newhunter...funny you mention that you may consider moving to Wyo if limited unit tags are cut in 1/2 and it takes twice as long to draw! If you take a look at how many limited deer, elk, and antelope tags are issued in the nonres draw there really are usually only a handful in any given unit. Some units that currently have only 1 nonres tag have a good chance to go to 0 nonres tags with the new 90/10 wording. It states that if there are fewer than 10 tags than 0 tags will go to nonres.

My guess is that there are more nonres that may move to Wyo than the few tags that are issued to nonres at the current tag quotas. Nonres don't take that many tags away from Wyo residents and Wyo resident draw odds won't all of a sudden improve dramatically. Obviously it will put a very limited few more tags in the hands of Wyo residents which is important to some?

I live in Colo where around 35% of our limited deer and elk tags go to nonres and we offer unlimited tags to nonres elk hunters. I think it's great that nonres boost our local small town community economies and have the opportunity to hunt a Western state on a regular basis. I'm sure Colo will recruit even more nonres hunters if Wyo flips their middle finger to nonres!
 
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After reading this thread I will give serious thought to moving to Wyoming. Yes for a whole year. If the 90/10 split happens. Stay 3-6 years. Than move again. To another state I have points in.
With the increased draw rate for antelope, deer and elk plus with the number of points I can draw sheep and moose while I'm there. It really does make sense.
It seems to me that is the best decision and what you are advocating. I will spread the word to ever hunter with financial means that I know.
Of coarse I will bring my political views with me.
You’re not tough enough to live in WY. I’ll call your bluff.

Can’t wait to see you use your elk deer and pronghorn points as a resident...
 
Eventually, enough NR are just gonna say F=it and when someone wants to sell off NF and other public lands, they're gonna say have at it. And someone looking to raise a few billion to fund a pet project is going to start selling them off with just a whimper in objection.
 
Eventually, enough NR are just gonna say F=it and when someone wants to sell off NF and other public lands, they're gonna say have at it. And someone looking to raise a few billion to fund a pet project is going to start selling them off with just a whimper in objection.
Riiight because this mythical whine arse non resident doesn’t have any public land in the one state he’s not a NR in. ?
 
What the Outfitter Industry would seek in exchange for supporting a 90/10 split would be transferable landowner licenses. I don’t see either option passing the political gauntlet. Though a very tightly controlled CWMU style program might offer a win-win situation for all if it was managed correctly by a state coordinator fixing the past problems of Utah and Colorado’s Unlevel playing field of public and outfitter sponsored licenses. https://wyoga.org/defeating-90-10-allocation-bill-in-wyoming-legislature/
 
Riiight because this mythical whine arse non resident doesn’t have any public land in the one state he’s not a NR in. ?
Not really. A lot of us in the east don't hunt Federal land. The closest Federal land to hunt to me is 2 hours away. I'd drive by hundreds of better places to hunt on the way. It does nothing for me. A lot of us are in the same spot. Like Millions.

I've written a lot of email to state rep and state sens backing all sorts of things as the NR bringing money to their state including states I've never set foot in, because I think I should to help the overall cause. I've also written to my reps and sens to support all sort of Federal lands out west. Eventually, if I am shut out of everywhere because I need a guide to get a license or a tag is $2000 while residents are paying $40, I'm pretty unlikely to write those emails and support the Federal lands.

It's just reality.
 
Not really. A lot of us in the east don't hunt Federal land. The closest Federal land to hunt to me is 2 hours away. I'd drive by hundreds of better places to hunt on the way. It does nothing for me. A lot of us are in the same spot. Like Millions.

I've written a lot of email to state rep and state sens backing all sorts of things as the NR bringing money to their state including states I've never set foot in, because I think I should to help the overall cause. I've also written to my reps and sens to support all sort of Federal lands out west. Eventually, if I am shut out of everywhere because I need a guide to get a license or a tag is $2000 while residents are paying $40, I'm pretty unlikely to write those emails and support the Federal lands.

It's just reality.
There’s more to public lands that what you can kill or put a hook in... but I get it not everyone sees it that way.
 
There’s more to public lands that what you can kill or put a hook in... but I get it not everyone sees it that way.
I'm well aware, and I appreciate you see that. I do too. I know a lot of guys who used to hunt out west and try to draw that just quit because of stuff like outfitter pools, no access to NF Wilderness for hunting, priced out of it, etc. I'm not saying even that I am going to be that guy.

What I am saying is that those guys exist, and there's potentially a lot of them. Issues like wolves, grizzlies, trapping, hunting mountain lions, and more will just not matter to those guys eventually. Take a look around what's happening right now in this country. In a few years who knows what is going to be pushed. You need as many people on the team as possible. They way to do that isn't to see what the absolute most that you can use and abuse them and then count on them to have your back.

I've never set foot in WY, but I've spent more in points than most residents have in tags the last 5 years while consuming ZERO of the resource. I figure if I get there great, but in the meantime, I'm helping. I'd like to feel like I'm not being overtly screwed over in the process, even if I am.
 
I'm well aware, and I appreciate you see that. I do too. I know a lot of guys who used to hunt out west and try to draw that just quit because of stuff like outfitter pools, no access to NF Wilderness for hunting, priced out of it, etc. I'm not saying even that I am going to be that guy.

What I am saying is that those guys exist, and there's potentially a lot of them. Issues like wolves, grizzlies, trapping, hunting mountain lions, and more will just not matter to those guys eventually. Take a look around what's happening right now in this country. In a few years who knows what is going to be pushed. You need as many people on the team as possible. They way to do that isn't to see what the absolute most that you can use and abuse them and then count on them to have your back.

I've never set foot in WY, but I've spent more in points than most residents have in tags the last 5 years while consuming ZERO of the resource. I figure if I get there great, but in the meantime, I'm helping. I'd like to feel like I'm not being overtly screwed over in the process, even if I am.
Sounds like your buddies are a bunch of sissy la la weak whitetail hunters. You can hunt the west every year if you want to. No points no BS. There’s even reduced priced tags. It comes down to what priorities are in life. And a little bit of research.

I can fly to the lower 48 and hunt elk in any unit in the west cheaper than I can hunt elk in my own state. But I’m not going to cry about it and I’m going to keep applying every year.

suck it up buttercups!!!
 
Sounds like your buddies are a bunch of sissy la la weak whitetail hunters. You can hunt the west every year if you want to. No points no BS. There’s even reduced priced tags. It comes down to what priorities are in life. And a little bit of research.

I can fly to the lower 48 and hunt elk in any unit in the west cheaper than I can hunt elk in my own state. But I’m not going to cry about it and I’m going to keep applying every year.

suck it up buttercups!!!
Comprehension isn't your strong suit, is it?

My post wasn't about me or you.
 
Sounds like your buddies are a bunch of sissy la la weak whitetail hunters. You can hunt the west every year if you want to. No points no BS. There’s even reduced priced tags. It comes down to what priorities are in life. And a little bit of research.

I can fly to the lower 48 and hunt elk in any unit in the west cheaper than I can hunt elk in my own state. But I’m not going to cry about it and I’m going to keep applying every year.

suck it up buttercups!!!
I invite you to the east coast to hunt whitetails anytime. Have you done it? If not, the challenge is real, so far from sissy hunters it is laughable.

3Darcher has it right, there is a limit for everyone....it is a cost benefit decision and I know many that have opted out of all states or just individual states like New Mexico and Oregon because of the changes they implemented. Maybe those with more disposable income can afford it, but is that who you want hunting your state....outfitted hunters? You want those with money who haven't waited to pay for everything? Or would you rather have those that worked hard, put in their time and money and paid most of the bills to get the rug pulled out from under them? The DIY non-resident hunters put up their hard earned money and have been waiting for a tag under the pretense that the split would stay the same and they have estimated when they would draw a tag and now you want to double that time and double that cost? Doesn't sound fair to me, but my opinion doesn't count for squat, only my money counts.
 
The reason Wyoming is and has been a great state is that it does things differently than other states. I.E Income taxes, trespass laws, fuel prices, support for ranching and mining. A few examples.
The way this looks is stick it to the non-resident all the other states do.
Keep trying to be like the other states and you might have success.
Just look to Colorado. Or what is happening in Arizona right now.
Can Wyoming remain a great state by doing the same thing as Colorado, Oregon, California ??
 
I invite you to the east coast to hunt whitetails anytime. Have you done it? If not, the challenge is real, so far from sissy hunters it is laughable.

3Darcher has it right, there is a limit for everyone....it is a cost benefit decision and I know many that have opted out of all states or just individual states like New Mexico and Oregon because of the changes they implemented. Maybe those with more disposable income can afford it, but is that who you want hunting your state....outfitted hunters? You want those with money who haven't waited to pay for everything? Or would you rather have those that worked hard, put in their time and money and paid most of the bills to get the rug pulled out from under them? The DIY non-resident hunters put up their hard earned money and have been waiting for a tag under the pretense that the split would stay the same and they have estimated when they would draw a tag and now you want to double that time and double that cost? Doesn't sound fair to me, but my opinion doesn't count for squat, only my money counts.
I get what you’re trying to say and what I’m saying is they are a bunch of quitters and ccrybabies. They drank the kool aid probably from one of their friends.

It’s no ones fault but their own that they continued to build points or put in for hard to get tags than you know....GO HUNTING. And that they had some made up pretense that the application process would never change? Or allocation? Really? I’m not believing what you’re saying because it’s not true.

And how do you know it’s the hard earned money, it could be the easy earned money. How do you know so much about their money? Lots of those back east fellows have easy soft jobs to make their money. In fact that’s probably why they are QUITTERS.

I’m sure those same guys will stop their new hobby of knitting because yarn prices have gone up. It’s pushing them out of the hobby. Big brother dept store is going to get all the scarf market this year.
 
The reason Wyoming is and has been a great state is that it does things differently than other states. I.E Income taxes, trespass laws, fuel prices, support for ranching and mining. A few examples.
The way this looks is stick it to the non-resident all the other states do.
Keep trying to be like the other states and you might have success.
Just look to Colorado. Or what is happening in Arizona right now.
Can Wyoming remain a great state by doing the same thing as Colorado, Oregon, California ??
The reason why Wyoming is a great state is because if you’re soft and want everything spoon fed to you it’s going to suck living there. So many people would love to live there but you gotta be tough to do so. A back East fellow sees milk go up .50 cents a gallon and he stops drinking milk. The DIY milk drinker has been pushed out of the market. A Wyoming guy works a little harder, buys the milk and shares it with the back east fellow’s wife on Sunday morning.
 
jims if you think an adjective is a name then you must be one.

You can't argue with me because you know I'm right. and the attitude is what it is because of your actions not mine. This is a simple matter of those who have much wanting more at the expense of others.

you points fee rip off will lose it's appeal if you keep changing the rules after the fact. you sold us points based on an split in the tag numbers. prices go up on everything and that's to be expected, but when you start moving the goal post another 100 yards on a whim that's another.

When and if you ever get it to 10% then the push will be on to cut it to 5% and double prices again. then 2 1/2 % and then zero . it obvious by some in this discussion they won't be happy until they have it all and someone else pays the tab. and that is America today in a nutshell.
 
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The reason why Wyoming is a great state is because if you’re soft and want everything spoon fed to you it’s going to suck living there. So many people would love to live there but you gotta be tough to do so. A back East fellow sees milk go up .50 cents a gallon and he stops drinking milk. The DIY milk drinker has been pushed out of the market. A Wyoming guy works a little harder, buys the milk and shares it with the back east fellow’s wife on Sunday morning.

You sound like a California cowboy sober. you watch a lot of John Wayne movies ?
 
You sound like a California cowboy sober. you watch a lot of John Wayne movies ?
I love John Wayne movies. But you gotta be tough to live in that windy ass state. There’s a reason it’s the least populated state and it has nothing to do with the views, low taxes etc.
 
Not hard

Impossible

This is where I quit throwing good time after bad.
6738292E-9ECF-41FB-81A6-FBFD316330C3.jpeg
 
This isn't a battle between residents and nonresidents as much as some would like it to be. the NR has no input so it can't be.

it's a battle between the WY outfitters/land owners and revenue vs malcontent resident hunters . while some of you say you'd pay a lot more to get more tags the truth is few of you would. and many residents don't want to subsidize you at all. and of course the outfitters are a viable commercial enterprise which feeds other supporting businesses. follow the money.

So I'll sit back and watch and if it goes as I expect once again you'll get what the little boy shot at. continuing this is useless I'm done.
 
I find it somewhat fascinating that Wyo residents want to strip 1/2 of the limited tags from nonres and charge hundreds of $ more for nonres tags.

It’s somewhat amazing that Wyo res license fees don’t appear to be increasing with this bill and res application fees are only increasing by $2.00? Obviously Wyo res want more tags but they aren’t willing to pay higher fees for them? Might as well kick nones in the nuts as they sending them out the door!
 
We've given our fair share of tags to the non residents. Time to get in line with the rest of the western states. Colorado will be the last proably because its ran by liberals
 
I find it somewhat fascinating that Wyo residents want to strip 1/2 of the limited tags from nonres and charge hundreds of $ more for nonres tags.

It’s somewhat amazing that Wyo res license fees don’t appear to be increasing with this bill and res application fees are only increasing by $2.00? Obviously Wyo res want more tags but they aren’t willing to pay higher fees for them? Might as well kick nones in the nuts as they sending them out the door!
Hunt in Colorado where you're a resident...hunting as a NR in any state is a luxury. Luxury items cost more...cars, trucks, atv's, fancy rifles, fancy restaurants...all luxuries that cost more.

I never complain about whatever I have to pay for NR licenses, what the Residents choose to allocate to me, etc. it's pure luxury to get to hunt another State.
 
Hunt in Colorado where you're a resident...hunting as a NR in any state is a luxury. Luxury items cost more...cars, trucks, atv's, fancy rifles, fancy restaurants...all luxuries that cost more.

I never complain about whatever I have to pay for NR licenses, what the Residents choose to allocate to me, etc. it's pure luxury to get to hunt another State.
And afterall no one is making you apply or hunt here. I find it hard to believe anyone spending the money to hunt out of state in the first place cant afford a 600$ tag. That would still be one of the cheapest parts of a real hunt
 
Hunt in Colorado where you're a resident...hunting as a NR in any state is a luxury. Luxury items cost more...cars, trucks, atv's, fancy rifles, fancy restaurants...all luxuries that cost more.

I never complain about whatever I have to pay for NR licenses, what the Residents choose to allocate to me, etc. it's pure luxury to get to hunt another State.
And afterall no one is making you apply or hunt here. I find it hard to believe anyone spending the money to hunt out of state in the first place cant afford a 600$ tag. That would still be one of the cheapest parts of a real hunt

well said!!!!
 
Raised in Wyoming
Educated in Wyoming
Make my living in Wyoming
Pay my taxes in Wyoming
Marry and raise a family in Wyoming
Put up with below zero, deep snow and wind, wind, wind in Wyoming
Enjoy the outdoors and hunting/fishing in Wyoming.
Spend $1000s of dollars just applying to hunt in other states with ridiculous drawing odds, multiple point schemes and high license fees.

Required by some nonresident members of MM to care that they may lose opportunity and pay more to hunt in Wyoming.
 
I'm all for paying the going rate for nonres tags....no problem! I welcome the opportunity to hunt Wyo as a nonres.

It just seems weird to me that Wyo residents aren't willing to flip the bill for more tags? Stripping limited tags from nonres and then charging them hundreds of dollars more for fewer tags seems a little over the top?

It's too bad that JM, Buzz, and others can't seem to figure out that it's nonres revenue and support that keeps the state wildlife and small town communities clicking!

I was raised in Wyo, got educated in Wyo, paid taxes in Wyo, and now live where the wind doesn't howl! I enjoy returning to the state where I grew up as often as I can!
 
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jims if you think an adjective is a name then you must be one.

You can't argue with me because you know I'm right. and the attitude is what it is because of your actions not mine. This is a simple matter of those who have much wanting more at the expense of others.

you points fee rip off will lose it's appeal if you keep changing the rules after the fact. you sold us points based on an split in the tag numbers. prices go up on everything and that's to be expected, but when you start moving the goal post another 100 yards on a whim that's another.

When and if you ever get it to 10% then the push will be on to cut it to 5% and double prices again. then 2 1/2 % and then zero . it obvious by some in this discussion they won't be happy until they have it all and someone else pays the tab. and that is America today in a nutshell.
You're going to get two lessons here:

1) I'm jm77, someone else much like you is "jims"

2) calling someone a narcissist is using that word as a noun. (name calling) Using an adjective would be saying "you are a little narcissist". "Little" being the adjective describing what kind of narcissist you think I am.

Carry on...
 
I'm all for paying the going rate for nonres tags....no problem! I welcome the opportunity to hunt Wyo as a nonres.

It just seems weird to me that Wyo residents aren't willing to flip the bill for more tags? Stripping limited tags from nonres and then charging them hundreds of dollars more for fewer tags seems a little over the top?

It's too bad that JM, Buzz, and others can't seem to figure out that it's nonres revenue and support that keeps the state wildlife and small town communities clicking!

I was raised in Wyo, got educated in Wyo, paid taxes in Wyo, and now live where the wind doesn't howl! I enjoy returning to the state where I grew up as often as I can!
Good, then pay the price and quit whining...shouldn't have moved, or you can always move back.

I've spent a ton of money hunting all over the West and have you once heard me complain about a license allocation in another State? Ever heard me complain about the NR license fees?

I feel half guilty every time I draw a limited NR license in another state, even paying the higher fees its highway robbery. I mean really, $1200 for my AZ desert sheep? Good grief, I'd pay 3-4 times that much and still call it a bargain. $600ish for the 4 rifle bull elk tags I've drawn there...DIRT cheap. Even the $1600 I spent to hunt an oryx in NM...worth WAYYYYY more than that.

Bought the most expensive tag in AK to shoot a B&C muskox there a few years back...tag price was ridiculously low.

Many of the opportunities I've had to hunt as a NR, for other State's very limited wildlife resources, leaves me thankful they even allowed me to apply and were willing to share with a NR.

Much different than the attitude of entitlement on full display when it comes to NR hunting in Wyoming.
 
Here's a very interesting read about the WG&F budget and revenue:


Here's an interesting section of an article that explains the importance of nonres to the WG&F!

The breakdown of revenue is surprising. The department brings in about $56.3 million in licenses and fees and 77% of that comes from non-residents. At first glance, the large amount of licenses and fees generated from nonresidents could lead to the misconception that the state is being flooded by out-of-state hunters and fishermen. But one statistic that stands out is the money collected for preference points.

Non-resident hunters invest more than $12 million in preference points each year, while residents put a little more than $100,000 into future hunts. While residents only need preference points for moose and bighorn sheep, non-residents also need them for elk, deer and pronghorn.

The percentage of non-residents receiving licenses differs for each species, but in most cases it’s less than 20% of the available hunting licenses, said Sara DiRienzo, public information officer for the Game and Fish.
 
Here's a very interesting read about the WG&F budget and revenue:


Here's an interesting section of an article that explains the importance of nonres to the WG&F!

The breakdown of revenue is surprising. The department brings in about $56.3 million in licenses and fees and 77% of that comes from non-residents. At first glance, the large amount of licenses and fees generated from nonresidents could lead to the misconception that the state is being flooded by out-of-state hunters and fishermen. But one statistic that stands out is the money collected for preference points.

Non-resident hunters invest more than $12 million in preference points each year, while residents put a little more than $100,000 into future hunts. While residents only need preference points for moose and bighorn sheep, non-residents also need them for elk, deer and pronghorn.

The percentage of non-residents receiving licenses differs for each species, but in most cases it’s less than 20% of the available hunting licenses, said Sara DiRienzo, public information officer for the Game and Fish.
This isn’t a discussion about funding. It’s about whiney ass punk ass cry baby non residents who think it’s their cake to eat. Be grateful there’s cake to be had.
 
The percentage of non-residents receiving licenses differs for each species, but in most cases it’s less than 20% of the available hunting licenses, said Sara DiRienzo, public information officer for the Game and Fish.
Don't believe everything you read...that statement is 100% dead wrong.

The lowest allocation of licenses that NR's receive are LQ elk, 16%. Every other species is 20-25%.

Not sure where Sara pulled that from...but it's not reality.

NR's receive more than 50% of the total pronghorn tags, more than 20% of deer tags, more than 20% of total elk tags, 25% of sheep tags, 20% of moose tags.

I think she either misspoke, doesn't know, or the reporter got it wrong.

The only place there may be a discrepancy may be in regard to general elk and deer. But, the region wide deer tags total is probably close to 20% of what general resident deer tags as well.
 
As a Non-resident, I have hunted Wyoming since the early 1990's. I have enjoyed the opportunity and still do. I hunted there last year for the 1st time in several years since I had kids in college and other obligations(taking care of elderly parents) that kept me closer to home. After my 1st trip back to Wyoming in October 2019 after several years not hunting there, on my plane ride home, my 91 year mother fell broke her hip and spine and passed away about 5 weeks later. I was fortunate to get the trip in. I still miss her dearly, but she somehow allowed me to get the trip in that year.

We should all be happy to have the opportunity to hunt there. I did not get a deer that fall, but until I got the message from my wife about my mom, I had a smile from ear to ear being back to an area I enjoyed.

Love hunting the state and always have. Love the scenery and enjoyed the people I have met. Yes it is more expensive today, and the preference point cost is getting expensive as well, especially since I will be retiring in a few months. I will still hunt there as much as I can and afford to do so since Time now is more available. I hope to get a few more hunts in Wyoming and a few other places that are on bucket list before my time is up.

As a non-resident I really don't have a say in the matter in regards to license cost. Residents live there, work there and pay taxes there so it's their resources to enjoy, just like it is in my state. I hope to enjoy the hunting resources some more. I have hunted many other states and Canada and enjoyed having the opportunity and like i said I hope to continue to have the opportunity in the future.
 
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As a Non-resident, I have hunted Wyoming since the early 1990's. I have enjoyed the opportunity and still do. I hunted there last year for the 1st time in several years since I had kids in college and other obligations(taking care of elderly parents) that kept me closer to home. After my 1st trip back to Wyoming in October 2019 after several years not hunting there, on my plane ride home, my 91 year mother fell broke her hip and spine and passed away about 5 weeks later. I was fortunate to get the trip in. I still miss her dearly, but she somehow allowed me to get the trip in that year.

We should all be happy to have the opportunity to hunt there. I did not get a deer that fall, but until I got the message from my wife about my mom, I had a smile from ear to ear being back to an area I enjoyed.

Love hunting the state and always have. Love the scenery and enjoyed the people I have met. Yes it is more expensive today, and the preference point cost is getting expensive as well, especially since I will be retiring in a few months. I will still hunt there as much as I can and afford to do so since Time now is more available. I hope to get a few more hunts in Wyoming and a few other places that are on bucket list before my time is up.

As a non-resident I really don't have a say in the matter in regards to license cost. Residents live there, work there and pay taxes there so it's their resources to enjoy, just like it is in my state. I hope to enjoy the hunting resources some more. I have hunted many other states and Canada and enjoyed having the opportunity and like i said I hope to continue to have the opportunity in the future.
Well said. Its a cruel world when you finally have the time, the resources are usually limited. Its kinda like the old man and the motorhome you see at the fuel station. By the time you can afford one you're too old to drive it and park it.

Hope you make it out to WY again, I'm sure you will!
 
Well Buzz here's another article that says the same exact thing as the first. You can twist and turn the facts in both of these articles but they both must not be wrong? Nonres provide 77% of the revenue. Irregardless of whether each is a little off, it tells the importance of nonres to the WG&F revenue! That is merely the point I'm trying to make.
Res_Vs_Non.jpg



If my memory is correct the WG&F has had to make quite a few cuts in their budget over the past 7 years. Fewer fish stocked in lakes, less habitat improvement projects, etc. Ultimately things can possibly come back and bite Wyo residents on the butt with these budget cuts.


I agree 100% with other nonres comments that we are fortunate that Wyo offers nonres the opportunity to hunt.
 
Well Buzz here's another article that says the same exact thing as the first. You can twist and turn the facts in both of these articles but they both must not be wrong? Nonres provide 77% of the revenue. Irregardless of whether each is a little off, it tells the importance of nonres to the WG&F revenue! That is merely the point I'm trying to make.
View attachment 34163


If my memory is correct the WG&F has had to make quite a few cuts in their budget over the past 7 years. Fewer fish stocked in lakes, less habitat improvement projects, etc. Ultimately things can possibly come back and bite Wyo residents on the butt with these budget cuts.


I agree 100% with other nonres comments that we are fortunate that Wyo offers nonres the opportunity to hunt.
ummmm.... no none is questioning the revenue. You're fighting with yourself....like always.....
 
Well Buzz here's another article that says the same exact thing as the first. You can twist and turn the facts in both of these articles but they both must not be wrong? Nonres provide 77% of the revenue. Irregardless of whether each is a little off, it tells the importance of nonres to the WG&F revenue! That is merely the point I'm trying to make.
View attachment 34163


If my memory is correct the WG&F has had to make quite a few cuts in their budget over the past 7 years. Fewer fish stocked in lakes, less habitat improvement projects, etc. Ultimately things can possibly come back and bite Wyo residents on the butt with these budget cuts.


I agree 100% with other nonres comments that we are fortunate that Wyo offers nonres the opportunity to hunt.
77% of license revenue...not total revenue.

The percentages of NR allocations in the article are wrong, Sara should know better.

The Wyoming GF budget is so strong right now, they already have about a year of reserves, and probably will increase that reserve account significantly after this years PR/DJ funding comes through.

Not sure why you can't read your own article...

The department has also increased its reserves by a month; the Game and Fish Commission Reserve Account now holds $38.7 million, enough to cover seven months of operating costs.

For the record, I was on a zoom meeting with the GF Director about a month ago, and he said they have closer to a year of operating costs in reserve.
 
If my memory is correct the WG&F has had to make quite a few cuts in their budget over the past 7 years. Fewer fish stocked in lakes
Fewer fish stocked in lakes?

Yeah only 43 pages of "fewer fish stocked" in 2018, and 2019. Further, WYGF is now rearing their own warm water species as well.

No money for fish stocking...laffin'.


 
Hunt in Colorado where you're a resident...hunting as a NR in any state is a luxury. Luxury items cost more...cars, trucks, atv's, fancy rifles, fancy restaurants...all luxuries that cost more.

I never complain about whatever I have to pay for NR licenses, what the Residents choose to allocate to me, etc. it's pure luxury to get to hunt another State.
Never ever complained Buzz? Never? Just want to make sure.
 
Ok where does the other 36% of revenue come from?
Its actually more than 36%.

According to the 2020 information, 61% from license revenue, 24% from PR/DJ, 7% from grants, 4% other, 3% interest received, and 1% general fund (not anymore, and it was about $800,000 for legislative reimbursement for "free" licenses).
 
Never ever complained Buzz? Never? Just want to make sure.
About license fees I pay as a NR? No. If I don't think its worth it, I just don't apply (like NM). I don't expect NM to lower the NR price to suit what I find a good ROI.

So, I just don't apply there like I used to. No big deal...and you'll not find me complaining about it.
 

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