New to muzzle loaders

Jaybird967

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I’m looking to get into muzzle loaders and would like some suggestions on what to buy. Not new to hunting or shooting, just want more options for tags.I plan on huntin Colorado and Nevada so it’s gotta be iron sights. Budget is around $600. Thanks!
 
Bottom end of where I would start would be a CVA Optima V2. Basic gun with a good barrel. Lots of people shoot them very accurately. A step up would be the CVA Accura LR-X for about $200 more (Midway has them for $550-600). Remember you will be spending several hundred dollars more on accessories.
 
IMO i'd stay away from the X cva guns. Just got in an MR-X and its a turd. Going back to the company for replacement. Super heavy trigger, the scope rail came all burred up, forearm sits cocked sideways. I've heard folks are having horrible accuracy issues with them as well. Never got past opening the box and looking it over.

The regular cheapie, CVA Optima V2 has always been a solid gun.
 
I bought a CVA Accura PR this summer. It's a great gun and shoots really well. I liked it so well, I bought a second one so my daughter could use it.
 
Go Made in America (Tennessee). See link:
Knight Rifles

I would stay away from Traditions. Had forend break (they replaced), scope rail holes drilled off center on receiver (modified rail), camo finish degraded and got sticky (they could do nothing, except use different paint on later models), flash hole not within spec (they said, "Did it pop the primer? Then it works.") The last almost cost me a bull in UT last year.
 
I have 2 knights. Good guns but unless he gets their economy model (bighorn), he will bust his budget.

I actually don’t own a CVA but if I were just getting into muzzleloader, I would most likely buy a CVA.
 
I don’t own any CVAs and wouldn’t buy one (or a Traditions for that matter). Personally, in that price range, I’d look for a TC Omega (the X7 of you can find one). Although you may have trouble getting the TC rifles to shoot a conical really well without cutting off the QLA (for use in CO).
 
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"Although you may have trouble getting the TC rifles to shoot a conical really well without cutting off the QLA (for use in CO)."

Exactly why I always tell anyone who plans to hunt where conicals are required (Colorado) to NOT buy a T/C rifle. Since he specifically mentions Colorado.

T/C will not back up a rifle that won't shoot conicals, only sabots. Call them and ask them and they will tell you the same thing. My Omega shot some conicals sideways and they said "shoot sabots"
 
I picked up the CVA Optima V2 scoped package with a case from muzzle-loaders.com shipped to my house for $385. Shoots great. Only hunted elk so far. The only draw back is finding 209 primers.
 
"Although you may have trouble getting the TC rifles to shoot a conical really well without cutting off the QLA (for use in CO)."

Exactly why I always tell anyone who plans to hunt where conicals are required (Colorado) to NOT buy a T/C rifle. Since he specifically mentions Colorado.

T/C will not back up a rifle that won't shoot conicals, only sabots. Call them and ask them and they will tell you the same thing. My Omega shot some conicals sideways and they said "shoot sabots"
I’d still buy a TC or Knight over a CVA. Some of my TCs shoot a conical fine. If one doesn’t - cut the QLA off. Very simple.

Or, buy a cheapo CVA for use in CO and a nice rifle to shoot in other states.
 
T/C has been aware there was a problem for over 20 years. They could fix it if they wanted too but they have decided they don’t want to. CVA actually has a short QLA on their guns as well but they don’t have the issue that T/C has.

When I bought my Omega, their ad said “shoots sabots and conicals equally well”. My gun shot conicals at a 5” group at 25 yards with some bullets going thru the target sideways. I sent my gun in to them, and by that time they were not making that claim. I did remove my QLA and it shoots much better, but I just have a bad taste in my mouth from that experience and their lack of acknowledgement of a problem, and not fixing the problem.

They should make a new add:

Our guns are guaranteed to MAYBE shoot conicals. If not, no problem, just take to a gunsmith and get him to remove one inch of the barrel! But we won’t pay for that!”

For full disclosure, I should mention that I don’t shoot sabots. I only hunt Colorado and when I hunt Texas I still use conicals.

I buy American when I can (VERY hard to do these days) but when the American made is twice the cost and doesn’t work as well, I have no problem buying foreign. Competition is the only way to make things get better overall. When I was a kid, you drove an American car 100,000 miles and it was done! Because foreign cars starting kicking their butt, the American companies starting making better cars. Drove my latest Ford truck 245,000 miles and was still running well when I sold it.
 
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Also, define “nice rifle”. A muzzleloader is a tool/ gun. It’s not a fashion statement or a status symbol. I want it to be easy to use (including clean up), shoot accurately and not break down. Looks and who made it are way down the list.

Again, for full disclosure. Here are the guns I own:

T/C renegade 54 (sidelock). Built this myself in 1986 and has killed multiple elk. It was pre-QLA and shoots conicals very well

T/C Omega 50. Had to remove the QLA

Knight long range hunter 50: got this new but half price when knight when under for a bit.

White whitetail .508. Love this gun but they don’t make them any more. Parts are almost impossible to get.

When I was buying Muzzys, CVA was just starting out and had some problems, so stayed away from them. But they have come a long way and hear good things about their guns now.

So again, to answer the posters question about buying a gun specifically for Colorado, I wouldn’t buy a T/C and hope it works out.
 
As an aside for someone who already has a T/C gun that they want to get it to shoot conicals. Here are a few things to try:

Get a conical with an expandable bell in the rear. When that enters the QLA, if it expands and doesn’t allow gas pass by (which is what throws off the bullet), it might shoot ok. Examples of this would be:

Thors
Hornady bore driver
Federal BOR
Powerbelts.
 
Tex, you’re absolutely right - for someone who doesn’t know anything about muzzleloading and is looking to start with a budget conical rifle, a CVA is fine.
 
OK, he is asking for suggestions for specific models that shoot conical’s well and don’t cost more than $600. You have yet to give a suggestion. Please do (excluding QLA models)
 
The Colorado/NV and open sights make it harder. I am goi g to sell my Knight Ultra lite wit Nitride finish for 700. Great rifle but won’t meet his needs. Warning, muzzle loading is addictive. I am building a custom muzzleloader and have two other Knight rifles.
 
I have a White Super 91 and half a dozen TCs and have been muzzleloading exclusively for about 30 years. There aren’t any current production conical rifles I’d recommend for under $600. I’d scrape a few more pennies together and find a Savage 10ml-II. The finest production muzzleloader ever made, IMO. I have three and they are amazing rifles.
 
I have been muzzleloading for about 35 years. And have hunted with them in Colorado for at least 25 years. Killed 11-12 elk with them. But just trying to answer the guys question.

As stated, he will Prob get addicted and this will just be the first of several muzzleloaders he will get through the years. But it’s not for everyone. It’s a lot more work than centerfire! So he will be fine to get a model that doesn’t break the bank (but shoots accurately) for his first one.
 
Forgot about my latest gun! The longer I hunt the more retro I get. Not a production rifle. A friend made this one for me. 54 cal round ball shooter! Can’t wait to try it out in Colorado
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