First Muzzle Loading hunt help

MtnHillbilly

MtnHillbilly

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Drew a CO muzzy tag (8 points) after 20 years bowhunting elk. Ive blown both shoulders and cannot pull back my bow any longer.
question is what can you help me with regarding hunting with a Muzzle loader?
I purchased the Tradatiions Pursuit ultra light about 10 years ago in anticipation of shoulder issues. My load is 90grains of Blackhorn with a 330 grain Powerbelt ELR as its a round that devastated a decent bull Moose last year from a friend who borrowed my Traditions. Im installing the Williams western precision sight this week. I want to maximize my hunt success and am looking for tips tricks etc as I've never hunted elk with anything but a compound or longbow!
 
I second trashing the Pbelts. Surprised they worked well on moose. Must have been the sweet spot = perfect diistance/velocity. Don't wait til they fail on an animal to switch. Learn from others like me: lost bull elk shot at 60 yards. Federal BOR loc in 350 gr lead work for me out of cva accura v2.
I use Williams rear peep sight with aperture removed, creating ghost ring type setup. Lyman front globe sight with fine crosshiar. Dot of yellow fingernail polish at center. Good luck
 
Never tried Powerbelts. Some people like 'em. Some tell horror stories about them. Enough so I stayed away from them.

Take your gun to the range and figure out the bullet drop and maximum range. You'll see posts on here about 300 yard range with a ML. There is absolutely no way mine will do that. About 125 is as far as I'm comfortable. Bullet drops off fast after that. But I have the same aim point for 50 and 100 yards.

Second, shoot several times to see if bullet impact changes. as it gets dirty. I remove the breech plug and clean mine after every range session, say 5-6 shots.

Anyway, figure out what yours will do. Good luck and post kill pics!
 
For CO with an open-sighted rifle where you’re shooting 200 yards max (probably 175 max unless you’ve got really good eyes), you don’t need a super high BC bullet. Terminal performance is the most important thing on elk. IMO, the best bullets are Swift A-Frames, Nosler Partitions, Barnes 290 gr, BOR Loc 270 copper or 350 lead bullets. Find one of those that shoots well in your rifle and you’ll be good to go.
 
diablo said:
For CO with an open-sighted rifle where you’re shooting 200 yards max (probably 175 max unless you’ve got really good eyes), you don’t need a super high BC bullet. Terminal performance is the most important thing on elk. IMO, the best bullets are Swift A-Frames, Nosler Partitions, Barnes 290 gr, BOR Loc 270 copper or 350 lead bullets. Find one of those that shoots well in your rifle and you’ll be good to go.
Click to expand...
Of the bullets you mention, only the BOR locks are legal in CO. ? I will be using the 350 gr lead BOR lock. Will be using 90 gr of BH 209
 
I cant find any descriptions or reviews of the ELR that discuss how it is constructed. The original powerbelts are made entirely of SOFT lead. Don’t hold up for really big animals unless you have the ideal shot broadside thru the ribs. If the ELR is also soft lead I don’t want any part of it for an elk. Because all shots are not ideal in my experience. If anyone has more info on how “they are constructed better” please post that link.
 
Use a full bore sized chunk of solid lead like a TC Maxi Hunter, REAL Bullet, or Hornady Great Plains.
 
I have been told that Maxi-hunter is generally recommended for deer. It’s made of soft lead

Maxi-Ball is recommended for elk. Lead alloy so it’s tougher
 
HIcountryman said:
At closer range they don't perform. Too much velocity causes them to fragment, I think.
Click to expand...
Interesting. At 250 yards this bullet was a clean pass-through. Exit hole wasn’t much bigger than the entrance. I thought it performed very well considering distance. Was very accurate too
 
txhunter58 said:
I cant find any descriptions or reviews of the ELR that discuss how it is constructed. The original powerbelts are made entirely of SOFT lead. Don’t hold up for really big animals unless you have the ideal shot broadside thru the ribs. If the ELR is also soft lead I don’t want any part of it for an elk. Because all shots are not ideal in my experience. If anyone has more info on how “they are constructed better” please post that link.
Click to expand...
IMG_9998.jpg

with 90 grains Blackhorn this is the 330 grn. ELR taken from against the hide of a bull moose from a 75 yard shot last year . moose walked 30 yards and fell over.
they are full bore hardened lead with a copper jacket and designed for magnum charges
 
diablo said:
For CO with an open-sighted rifle where you’re shooting 200 yards max (probably 175 max unless you’ve got really good eyes), you don’t need a super high BC bullet. Terminal performance is the most important thing on elk. IMO, the best bullets are Swift A-Frames, Nosler Partitions, Barnes 290 gr, BOR Loc 270 copper or 350 lead bullets. Find one of those that shoots well in your rifle and you’ll be good to go.
Click to expand...
I will look into BOR Loc and see if I can find them to see how the shoot out my rifle. and I have a healthy supply of 330 grn. Powerbelt ELR that worked incredibly good out of my gun on a bull moose last year..
 
Joe2Kool said:
Never tried Powerbelts. Some people like 'em. Some tell horror stories about them. Enough so I stayed away from them.

Take your gun to the range and figure out the bullet drop and maximum range. You'll see posts on here about 300 yard range with a ML. There is absolutely no way mine will do that. About 125 is as far as I'm comfortable. Bullet drops off fast after that. But I have the same aim point for 50 and 100 yards.

Second, shoot several times to see if bullet impact changes. as it gets dirty. I remove the breech plug and clean mine after every range session, say 5-6 shots.

Anyway, figure out what yours will do. Good luck and post kill pics!
Click to expand...
thanks I plan on shooting quite a bit once I get this sight installed... screws are all wrong size for front sight and dove tail for elevation is stuck at the moment. and Im gonna try out to 200 but like archery I'm more realistic with 100 and in. but curious to see what happens at 150 and 200 for grins.
 
Stay away from the very soft maxi-hunters. I have shot several deer with my Lyman Deerstalker in .54 cal. These loads fragment much too often and leave a poor blood trail. Never got an exit wound at any range! The power belts did better, but also failed to exit. Some kind of a hard cast option would be a better choice.

LaGriz
 
MtnHillbilly said:
View attachment 81439
with 90 grains Blackhorn this is the 330 grn. ELR taken from against the hide of a bull moose from a 75 yard shot last year . moose walked 30 yards and fell over.
they are full bore hardened lead with a copper jacket and designed for magnum charges
Click to expand...
From this pic, looks like a lot of mass loss with minimal expansion. Any measurements on either?
 
Joe2Kool said:
From this pic, looks like a lot of mass loss with minimal expansion. Any measurements on either?
Click to expand...
That’s what I was thinking. Not what I’d call textbook terminal performance. I’d be curious to hear what the recovered bullet weighed.
 
“they are full bore hardened lead with a copper jacket and designed for magnum charges”

The copper jacket is just to protect your barrel. It doesn’t add any toughness to the bullet. Too thin. But where do you see anything that says they are “hardened lead”. The rest of powerbelts are just soft lead, so if they are a lead alloy, they is an improvement.

Can’t argue with the result on the moose. But was it a broadside, though the ribs double lung? Or did it encounter any bone.

Not trying to talk you out of it, just want more info.
 
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Broadside double lung. the only shot I'm likely to take as well.

the hardened lead info is in the the literature that comes with the bullets.

Ill be using these unless I can get my hands on something else that shoots more accurately. I haven't been able to locate BOR Loc . seems to be out of stock every where I've looked.

quit looking at no excuses because they were not in stock most of last year.
 
They are factory seconds because some of the tips are supposed to be loose. But I have shot 2 packs and no loose tips so far. Check out my “why should I weigh BH 209” thread for how accurate they have been for me.

But after shooting 2 packs of them I ordered another 10
 
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“the hardened lead info is in the the literature that comes with the bullets.”

Can you take a pic of that and post it. I can’t find anything online that confirms that.
 
This is my first time muzzleloader for elk too. I'm going to try the Hornady Bore driver. I have some Federal Bor locks but I don't have enough to practice and go hunting (and they didn't shoot very good). I hope the Hornady Bore Drivers do OK but I will try and get that broadside rib cage shot.
 
JakeH said:
This is a PB ELR I recovered in the dirt after target practice awhile back.

View attachment 83623
Click to expand...
I see that the bullet held up well (unlike original powerbelts) but the mushroom leaves a little to be desired. Maybe the fact that it went into dirt might have sheared that part off? The expansion I have seen with the federal BOR locks lead seem to have a nice mushroom. So while it looks like a much tougher bullet than original powerbelts the jury is still out for me.

Anyone have a pic of one recovered from an animal or at the range in water jugs/etc?
 
txhunter58 said:
I see that the bullet held up well (unlike original powerbelts) but the mushroom leaves a little to be desired. Maybe the fact that it went into dirt might have sheared that part off? The expansion I have seen with the federal BOR locks lead seem to have a nice mushroom. So while it looks like a much tougher bullet than original powerbelts the jury is still out for me.

Anyone have a pic of one recovered from an animal or at the range in water jugs/etc?
Click to expand...
Just the one I posted from my buddies moose! Also I just got a hold of some of those BOR locs and they shot pretty good! A little more noticeable kick. I had one jam while loading. Is this common or do they need a pretty clean barrel? I’d had about10 shots with powerbelts and 2 borlocs prior. Thinking I do a thorough clean and try just BORlocs? They do get a ring dimple from loading rod which I hope doesn’t effect expansion? Shooting 66 grains by weight blackhorn out of traditions pursuit
 
I am shooting the BOR locks with 95gr (volume) BH209 Been shooting 10-12 per session and have never had a problem loading them. Do not swab at all between shots. I shoot a Knight long range hunter.
 
I have had great luck with the Fury bullets, Thor bullets and Arrowhead XLD (if you are shooting a .45 caliber). The Fury 285 universal fit is what I am going to use this year in my .50 cal CVA Accura V2 and 460 No-Excuse in my knight .50 caliber Dusk Extreme. Both shoot awesome in their respective rifles.
 
Thanks for all the advice! unfortunately I didn't get a chance to test out the bullet. worst use of 8 points and I've had better hunting in OTC units? beautiful country though. I'm guessing a combination of Full moon and overly aggressive hunters?
 

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