Amateur hour....

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
Decisions, decisions.

Be silent and figured for a fool.... or speak and remove all doubt....

Ahh what the heck…. you only live once!

I am set to visit SE ID in Oct during the general deer/elk season with both tags in my pocket, good for 3 capped units for elk and 2 general units for deer. I have never been out there before, unfortunately, but am excited just to see some new country. I plan to shoot pretty much any legal elk if I get an opportunity, but am not too motivated to take a deer unless its worth the distraction from elk... If anybody cares to strike up a chat on PM, I'd appreciate the chance to ask a few questions, but I am not soliciting any public responses on the forum for obvious reasons and also because I might want to ask dumb questions like "what's the usual weather", LOL... guess I just did!
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
Good gracious fellas. 324 views and nothing but tight lips for a guy who's been on the forum for two-three years and posted 200 times. I'm not mad, I get it, general unit lockjaw. Good luck to all this season, I hope to post a followup in a couple months. Maybe I'll even help a few of you out someday if I'm able to find success.
 

broomd

Active Member
Messages
773
Good gracious fellas. 324 views and nothing but tight lips for a guy who's been on the forum for two-three years and posted 200 times. I'm not mad, I get it, general unit lockjaw. Good luck to all this season, I hope to post a followup in a couple months. Maybe I'll even help a few of you out someday if I'm able to find success.
It isn't personal. many of us are tired as f*ck dealing with non-resident hunters in our state, they are legion and every forum is filled with sh*t about guys wanting info on Idaho. Things are out of control and have been for several years now. It's only getting worse.

Good luck.
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
Thanks for your honest answer, and you are not wrong about people all over inquiring about ID. But there are lots of nonresidents going to and seeking info on Wyoming, Colorado, Montana, etc. as well. Maybe you have even gone out of state occasionally. I hope that all the nonresident interest could at least tell you that you have reason to be proud and thankful of the opportunities your state(s) provide. I wasn’t trying to restart any debate on this here, but unlike some I wasn’t seeking the info to make a decision whether to go at all or to what unit. I already have my tags. I am showing up. . I intentionally didnt mention unit names or basin locations in my post. For elk, they are in a capped unit. For deer, overall numbers are capped. I hardly see how nonresident numbers could be the biggest problem when all tags are ultimately limited. In every case I can imagine -except maybe those NR with an outfitter - residents should easily have the hunting advantage of scouting familiarity, easier to obtain tags, information, convenience, local friends, stock, or maybe even private access. I am new to it in ID and reliant so far on only my maps, apps, and scarcity of online info, and a hopeful attitude. The only person in my entire sphere who ever hunted ID is a long gone great uncle who’s mounted bull with a 1950’s or 60’s metal tag hung on the wall at our last family dairy farm in PA. I have been looking forward to repeating his success in some fashion for 40+ years. I am just planning a short but exciting trip, then I will be on my way. I did ask to strike up some chat about it, and thought maybe I shouldn’t, then thought “why not”. I’ll do my best to steer clear of any folks who seem tired as f*ck of people like me.
 

KickrBuk

Member
Messages
44
Everyone is a NR in another state , I notice residents are always upset when a NR drags bigger bucks back to the barn because their time is limited and they hit it harder, I know a lot of residents take it serious, but a lot !!! I mean a lot expect to be able to kill one off the road and they can’t because of NR’s lol 😂,
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
It isn't personal. many of us are tired as f*ck dealing with non-resident hunters in our state, they are legion and every forum is filled with sh*t about guys wanting info on Idaho. Things are out of control and have been for several years now. It's only getting worse.

Good luck.
Hey Broomd, I know I posted a long reply specific to your post. I really wasn’t trying to come across as arguing with you in any way and I get it that what you said has truth, and the frustrations it causes. My response is sort of the “other side of the coin” that the internet affords us to always keep these debates going on endlessly. There are frustrations on both sides, believe me. I‘ll try to stay more positive and maybe you or people you know will too, and eventually a better vibe will result. There will always be antagonistic elements no matter what side the fence one comes from. I look forward to NOT being a problem for you Idaho hunters and I hope to receive the same courtesy, but theres only so much that internet forums could do to make that happen, and usually the forums work in the opposite way. So, done here on this one, hopefully this thread sinks to the bottom from here out.
 

twsnow18

Active Member
Messages
683
The forums aren't like they used to be. I joined hunt talk in 2013 and here in 2011, I think. Even just 9 years ago, threads would maybe get 50 views. There were maybe 15 regulars on the boards, so it was more tight knit. A boring thread on HT will get a thousand views these days. Guys just aren't gonna open up about much besides gear, strategies, etc.
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
The forums aren't like they used to be. I joined hunt talk in 2013 and here in 2011, I think. Even just 9 years ago, threads would maybe get 50 views. There were maybe 15 regulars on the boards, so it was more tight knit. A boring thread on HT will get a thousand views these days. Guys just aren't gonna open up about much besides gear, strategies, etc.

Agreed - tough to maintain any sense of community when its a free-for-all populated by thousands of strangers, of which I am one to most of you - and you to me. There's really no right answer but I think people should still try to generally help and encourage the truly naïve newcomers (ignore them when deserved, but don't attack), call out the schemers and liars, ease back on the resident/nonresident hate rhetoric, and should reserve juicy detail via PM to those who have built up some level of trust over years. I realize I am not there with most of you and may never be, but still fun to be here.
 

BrianID

Very Active Member
Messages
1,615
This thread went south really fast. After reading the first post I was getting ready to share some information. The truth is Idaho residents are frustrated by how poor the mule deer hunting is in the SE portion of the state compared to how it use to be. 20 years ago when many of us though SE Idaho mule deer couldn't get much worse found out we were wrong.

Katoom, I'll send you a message, I've hunted all three units in your elk zone.
 

Mallards_Only

Active Member
Messages
739
While some of you may feel "charitable," I guarantee you there are hunters who have been hunting your unit(s) for years who have spent countless days learning the unit, patterns of deer/elk, and "honey-holes" in the unit who will be very unhappy with you sharing your information with newbie NR's. Let them wear out some boot leather and learn the area themselves.
 

BrianID

Very Active Member
Messages
1,615
Mallards_Only,

Nothing wrong with sharing some general information about an area with a PM. Maybe I should start charging a fee like Founder does for some of his honey holes.

Only a fool would give up a honey hole that they have learned through hard work or passed down to them from their dad or grandfather. I'll tell anyone that asks what the weather or roads are like though. I'd much rather see DIY nonresidents coming to Idaho to give it their best effort than residents or nonresidents that have a guide take them hunting.

Maybe the best solution is that residents should only be allowed to hunt in the county they live in for general season. That would really improve the general season hunting in many units across Idaho.

All the new transplants from California and other states also need information on your honey holes so they can just show up and hunt without putting any scouting effort like you have. ;)
 

JPickett

Active Member
Messages
337
try not to get your feelings hurt by lack of response. i posted a similar thread just inquiring about pressure in a unit i haven't hunted yet. really the zero response i got and the harvest data form F&G answered my question for me. sometimes you gotta read between the lines
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
try not to get your feelings hurt by lack of response. i posted a similar thread just inquiring about pressure in a unit i haven't hunted yet. really the zero response i got and the harvest data form F&G answered my question for me. sometimes you gotta read between the lines
I may have slipped a slight guilt trip in there 😜 but my feelings are intact. I agree with reading between the lines but it is refreshing to sometimes just talk to somebody. Keeping sensitive stuff off open forums is just common sense these days, but maintaining some personal humanity is good for the soul. Anybody that ever helps me is entitled to equal or greater help from me if I could ever reciprocate. I would never ruin their ability to actually experience a hunt by telling them to go to XX spot or some coordinate where I killed or saw an animal. A unit, sure. A large drainage system within a unit, probably, but only to the right person. A specific wallow, trail, glassing point, or funnel - that isnt doing anybody any favors.
 

Mallards_Only

Active Member
Messages
739
I think what people don't realize is that, while not giving up a specific "honey hole," sometimes by giving up what they consider "non-specific" information they are essentially doing just that. Bucks and bulls rarely sit in the same isolated "hole." But giving up a general area that they have found or drainages, etc results in hunters eventually stumbling onto "holes," whether it be through additional hard work or pure luck. Many hunters are willing to "hunt" more in an area they've been directed to. Eventually, they're gonna figure it out. Weather--OK. But even roads info can sometimes be used to read between the lines. When you tell me what the roads are like in a specific area of a unit, that tells me you've spent a fair amount of time there. i.e. You've hunted it a lot which means you feel like it's worthy of concentrating your efforts there. People think they're giving up non-specific info. I see this all the time, especially on social media these days. But, I can oftentimes do enough detective work to find out more than they have overtly revealed, if necessary.
Ducks are a perfect example of this. While not the same as deer in the sense that they are migratory and move around more, the concept is generally the same. I see guys post chest-thumping pics online all the time who think they're being coy by not giving up their location. But, with a little detective work, I can usually figure out the general vicinity of where the hunt took place and through my experience in the area, will often recognize the background or other features in the photo.
 

Zeke

Long Time Member
Messages
9,308
Hunting, by it's very nature, is a selfish and self-serving sport.

No doubt I can see both sides of the discussion here.
It really doesn't matter whether someone is a resident or Non-res, sharing info with anyone is a matter of choice and I respect those who don't share and those who do.

I'm a NR in Idaho and personally I would only ask for help in Idaho from someone I already know...but that's just me.

I can also see where the residents are coming from with the decline of resources and increased pressure from the "entitled" out of State crowd.

We're all in this together through these interesting times!

Zeke
 

Idahoron

Very Active Member
Messages
1,988
The fact is I have helped a ton of guys on here. Most never even say thank you. Most never reply with how they did. Then some guys I gave info to are on here giving out my info to the public like they worked hard to get it.
Facebook is full of people that beg every day for info. Guys are getting their hot girl friends/wife's or faking accounts with girls pictures to glean/steal info on hunts. The level of laziness, selfishness, and lack of respect is staggering.
People that get info the easy way don't care about how hard the person had to work to get that info. All they see is they look like the big shot on campus because they tuned a guy into a good spot. 's OP I hope you understand that it probably isn't you that has caused tight lips.
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
Idahoron, I know that I didn’t personally cause the tight lips and that bad experiences with sharing has more to do with it than anything. thanks for your comments.
 

BrianID

Very Active Member
Messages
1,615
The fact is I have helped a ton of guys on here. Most never even say thank you. Most never reply with how they did. Then some guys I gave info to are on here giving out my info to the public like they worked hard to get it.

I've been on Monstermuleys for almost 20 years now and have had similar experiences as you Ron. I don't blame you for giving up on helping others. All of us are free to do as we choose. For the most part, I quit giving specific information over 10 years ago. I did make an exception for a moose hunter this year.

Guys might try to read between the lines and try to get a honey hole from me but it won't do them much good. The only time I have a honey hole in Idaho is when I have a big buck scouted before the season. I've killed deer and elk in at least a dozen units in Eastern Idaho. I don't have a single honey hole in Idaho that I hunt every year. I enjoy learning a new area or visiting an old place I haven't hunted in 10 or 20 years.

Even though most don't let me know how their hunt went, some do. I've also been able to get help in many other Western States on monster muleys. I was able to get some useful information for a NM deer hunt and Colorado deer hunt last year. I really appreciated the guys that were willing to share with me and I sent all of them a thank you message after the hunt.
 

broomd

Active Member
Messages
773
N
Hey Broomd, I know I posted a long reply specific to your post. I really wasn’t trying to come across as arguing with you in any way and I get it that what you said has truth, and the frustrations it causes. My response is sort of the “other side of the coin” that the internet affords us to always keep these debates going on endlessly. There are frustrations on both sides, believe me. I‘ll try to stay more positive and maybe you or people you know will too, and eventually a better vibe will result. There will always be antagonistic elements no matter what side the fence one comes from. I look forward to NOT being a problem for you Idaho hunters and I hope to receive the same courtesy, but theres only so much that internet forums could do to make that happen, and usually the forums work in the opposite way. So, done here on this one, hopefully this thread sinks to the bottom from here out.
No worries, like I said, it isn't personal.
We'll just post our ranch and do our best to kill our deer and elk right here. We've worked hard on this land, and we've paid the taxes. It's our slice of heaven and we'll fiercely protect it.
 

Idaho75

Active Member
Messages
120
Decisions, decisions.

Be silent and figured for a fool.... or speak and remove all doubt....

Ahh what the heck…. you only live once!

I am set to visit SE ID in Oct during the general deer/elk season with both tags in my pocket, good for 3 capped units for elk and 2 general units for deer. I have never been out there before, unfortunately, but am excited just to see some new country. I plan to shoot pretty much any legal elk if I get an opportunity, but am not too motivated to take a deer unless its worth the distraction from elk... If anybody cares to strike up a chat on PM, I'd appreciate the chance to ask a few questions, but I am not soliciting any public responses on the forum for obvious reasons and also because I might want to ask dumb questions like "what's the usual weather", LOL... guess I just did!
What units are you hunting?
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
For anyone following I just wanted to update and say thanks to those who joined me in talking about this hunt, as well as some really cool Idaho guys I met on the scene. The hunt went off great except that I never did make it to the better elk areas, despite some very appreciated suggestions. I found a spot with good deer numbers and stayed there all week, finally getting an “average” buck, a decent looking 3x3 maybe a 3 year old, after passing on several smaller bucks. I didn’t see anybody else with anything all week, and hunters I talked to in the area said I did well to score and that the hunting has been tough. No elk at all were encountered, old sign was present but sparse. I now know of better areas, and did find a better spot on the last day, but I ran out of time. No complaints, Idaho was beautiful! On the way back east, I chased and finally scored on a Wyoming doe antelope. Anybody that says its easy, hasn't tried it late in the season!!!! Spooky is an understatement.

I want to reiterate that every person met in ID (and WY) was a class act, helpful and encouraging. I witnessed no illegal ATV riding, and everyone was respectful of my camp. Sometimes the online rhetoric makes it sound like there will be problems from the word “go”.. but that just was not the case. Thanks Idaho for a great, welcoming trip. Maybe I can visit again someday.

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BrianID

Very Active Member
Messages
1,615
Thanks for coming back and reporting. If more guys would come back and report on their hunt, new members would probably find more help when asking questions before their hunt.
 

Katoom

Active Member
Messages
265
Katoom , is that a Remington Mtn rifle?
Yes, in 7mm08. I have another in 280 and another in 30/06 that I originally bought for my dad and since inherited back. It makes for a tough choice when pulling one from the cabinet to take along...

the rifle used on the antelope was a Ruger American in 6.5CM that I purchased for use as a loaner to friends but thought might serve the purpose better off the bipod.
 

h20fwl

Member
Messages
17
Thanks for the follow up story. I'm glad you had a safe and successful hunt. It is nice to see people successful who are appreciative and respectful of others. Great job!
 

Rackers

New Member
Messages
1
Res or non res.. bottom line is that too many tags are being issued in most open units and they are completely over ran with "hunters". Even the deep 10 mile trips.. oh look another hunter.
 
Messages
58
Everyone blames non residents for what is going on with to many tags being handed out to them. Well blame the fish and game and all the statics that are wrong when reported. Why is it all the non residents fault for everything that goes on in Idaho. Last count it public land is not owned by residents in state of Idaho it is owned by all the people whether you are resident or non resident. People have all kinds of excuses for putting in the work to harvest and animal and people wanting information on honey holes. Well I can say call the biologist in the areas you are hunting if you want information do your homework using any map application out there use google maps with the lay out of the land and plan to come a few days early to scout out the area. If you don't have time to do any of that than don't buy a tag and expect someone just to tell where the elk are.
 

BradA

Very Active Member
Messages
1,765
Nice pics thanks for sharing with us.


 

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