Bad used car deal - transmission OUT -any advice?

Roy · Feb 1, 2020

So my son just bought a 2008 Ford Escape, only had 132,409 miles. In great physical condition - clean record, no accidents. Bought it for $3995 - $4412 TTL out the door. Sounded like a great deal, had recently passed a state inspection and it checked out mechanically. Or so we thought.

The very next day after we bought it a check engine light came on showing a P0741 code. Bad transmission. We called the dealer, he said he would work with us, his mechanic scanned it, they checked the transmission fluid, said it was clean (I checked it too - looked clean to my untrained eye) and they determined it was just the solenoid that needed replaced and assured us it was fine to drive. The transmission wasn't slipping at all - running fine, until this Tuesday. Son takes it to Aamco for an transmission inspection - a second opinion, they check it and as soon as he drives it off the lot, the transmission goes completely out. No gears at all. So, it looks like a complete transmission overhaul is needed. Another $2 - $3 grand. I am beyond pissed.

So the dealer is trying to work with us, but we want him to just give us our money back. The car doesn't fall under the Texas lemon law as it is before 2013 and the contract says it is "AS IS", but our consumer rights say we can take it to an arbitrator.

I am just really wanting to know if it is worth it to fight it and take it to arbitration or just bite the bullet and pay to get it fixed. The guy is saying he will work with us, although he is still insisting it is just the solenoid that needs replaced. I mean - we had the car less than 36 hours and it started having problems. I think we might have a pretty good case, but is it worth the cost of fighting it?

DW · Feb 1, 2020

Aamco.

coloradoman · Feb 1, 2020

DW said:
Aamco.

Yep from what I have heard this type of thing is not uncommon.

Jagerdad · Feb 1, 2020

You have options such as doing multiple steps all at once (if allowed in Texas).
1) Open a Case with the Arbitrator (Hearing Date to be Determined)
2) Open a Small Claims Case (Hearing Date to be Determined)
3) Get a written report from any mechanical shop (Be ready to Subpoena the Mechanic and Pay for his time in court)
4) Write up your own History
5) In Good Faith, Work with the Dealer. After all, it's a Used "AS IS" Vehicle.
6) Don't be an Azz

Jagerdad Chicanery Legal Services

Roy · Feb 1, 2020

DW said:
Aamco.

So, are you saying Aamco is not reputable? I have heard some shady things too about some locations but this one is supposed to be pretty trustworthy - a couple people I trust trust them. Need to mention that the transmission started slipping on the way there and the p0741 code had been on for a week and the other transmission place in the area was telling me the same thing prior to taking it in, so I don't think they ultimately did anything to impact it negatively. Though it is a little curious he only made it about 200 yards before it wen out completely.

Homer · Feb 1, 2020

dump it in the Brazos....report it stolen.

elkassassin · Feb 1, 2020

Kinda Where I Have a Problem Buying Used Vehicles!

JUDAS Roy!

It's The Kids 1st Vehicle!

You Shoulda got him a 2020 F-350 KING RANCH!

For GAWDS SAKES He's gettin to the Age where He Wants to Give the Ladies a NICE RIDE!

eelgrass · Feb 1, 2020

"Son takes it to Aamco for an transmission inspection - a second opinion, they check it and as soon as he drives it off the lot, the transmission goes completely out. No gears at all."

What did Aamco say before he drove it off?

elkassassin · Feb 1, 2020

eelgrass said:
"Son takes it to Aamco for an transmission inspection - a second opinion, they check it and as soon as he drives it off the lot, the transmission goes completely out. No gears at all."

What did Aamco say before he drove it off?

Was it:We're about 99.9% Sure the Tranny is gonna go out Soon?

elkassassin · Feb 1, 2020

Just RAZZIN Ya Roy!

That's a Bad Day for sure!

If the Car Sales Place where You/Your Son Bought the Rig Doesn't Take care of it?

Ask Them if they've Ever Heard of a Gal Named JENN (With a Y!) that Lives in Utah!

Zim · Feb 2, 2020

This happened to me in Illinois two years ago when I bought a 4Runner with leaky head gasket. But Illinois has a lemon law and I knew my rights. The dealer didn’t flinch until I filed a small claims lawsuit then everything changed. Ended up negotiating a 1/3 me, 2/3 them gasket replacement immediately case closed. I suggest nothing will happen until you file the arbitration then they will deal to avoid the hearing. Good luck.

Roy · Feb 2, 2020

To be clear again - the problem was clearly happening before we took it to Aamco. They only performed a basic inspection and couldn't even complete it because the transmission was already failing. I don't think they had anything to do with it. The problem existed before we bought the car. So, right now - we are trying to do as Jagerdad has suggested in #'s 5 and 6 of his suggestions, but I think we may have to be prepared to take it to arbitration if he doesn't do his part. I will keep you updated.

UtyoteKiller · Feb 3, 2020

"Need to mention that the transmission started slipping on the way there and the p0741 code had been on for a week and the other transmission place in the area was telling me the same thing prior to taking it in, so I don't think they ultimately did anything to impact it negatively."

Sorry but this says it all. You drove an automatic transmission for a week with a problem, the car should have been left at the dealer from day one when problem occurred.

Roy · Feb 3, 2020

Homer said:
dump it in the Brazos....report it stolen.

Oh if I were dishonest...there are quite a few things of this ilk I could do!

UtyoteKiller said:
"Need to mention that the transmission started slipping on the way there and the p0741 code had been on for a week and the other transmission place in the area was telling me the same thing prior to taking it in, so I don't think they ultimately did anything to impact it negatively."

Sorry but this says it all. You drove an automatic transmission for a week with a problem, the car should have been left at the dealer from day one when problem occurred.

Probably so. But it was his call to let us continue driving it. We have documented proof of that.

heartshot · Feb 3, 2020

Is there a way to see if the P0741 code was cleared before you bought it. It may have been erased by the dealer or prior owner. I wonder if the computer can still see the history.

Homer · Feb 3, 2020

heartshot said:
Is there a way to see if the P0741 code was cleared before you bought it. It may have been erased by the dealer or prior owner. I wonder if the computer can still see the history.

Why do you think the fluid looked so good.....

Jagerdad · Feb 3, 2020

YOU are a Good Father ROY. Allowing your SON to decide every step is what Good Father's do.

Jagerdad

desperatehills · Feb 4, 2020

You need to give the dealership every opportunity to make it right. Everyone wants to say the dealership is dirty. They take trades or buy vehicles at auctions and often do not know if there is a issue. Did you have a independent inspection done? We do vehicle inspections for purchase every week and I can assure you that a tech may not catch your problem. The clean fluid and codes cleared could have been done by the guy that traded the car in. If they offer to split the cost with you I would take them up on it.

As for Aamco, the horror stories I have heard is people will take their car in to get their tranny "checked" and before they know it the trans is in small pieces on the bench with a big estimate for repairs. It doesn't sound like they got very deep into yours

Desperatehills a.k.a. Tom's Auto Service est. 1981

Roy · Feb 5, 2020

desperatehills said:
You need to give the dealership every opportunity to make it right. Everyone wants to say the dealership is dirty. They take trades or buy vehicles at auctions and often do not know if there is a issue. Did you have a independent inspection done? We do vehicle inspections for purchase every week and I can assure you that a tech may not catch your problem. The clean fluid and codes cleared could have been done by the guy that traded the car in. If they offer to split the cost with you I would take them up on it.

As for Aamco, the horror stories I have heard is people will take their car in to get their tranny "checked" and before they know it the trans is in small pieces on the bench with a big estimate for repairs. It doesn't sound like they got very deep into yours

Desperatehills a.k.a. Tom's Auto Service est. 1981

Thanks for the reply - I think this is exactly what happened. It doesn't look like the dealer knew about it and neither our inspection nor his inspection caught it. So the dealer is working with us. He is buying a new (used) transmission and we are paying for the labor. Going through his guy to do the labor he quoted us $450. So that is a big relief. I just hope it gets fixed correctly.

feddoc · Feb 6, 2020

Sounds like both parties worked on the issue.

desperatehills · Feb 6, 2020

Excellent, glad it worked out

Jagerdad · Feb 6, 2020

Dear Roy

Are you willing to share will all of us, your guess in a % amount how many decisions were yours and what % was your Son's..? I am "SO GUILTY" of being a Helicopter Parent in Over Protecting my Children yet, I explained to them at near age 6 and forward these words: "I WILL LET YOU HURT YOURSELF" and I truly and deeply meant it. There were quite a few times they said: Dad, I Have This...I relaxed and something I knew but didn't mention because they SAID they'd work it out and it failed for the things I held back from saying. I may be available but allowing a Child to learn what a sharp knife is and in endless days, we Fathers must be; Fatherly.

My statement above might sound weird and two sided but I made, even forced each child to THINK deeply upon most every subject. Each knew if they wanted to lay back, I would fight the Battle but not one of them wanted to feel they were a fat lazy american.

So Roy, if willing, here among friends, just for fun, how much of the decisions were your and % His...? No one cares actually. I write the above to many of us older Fathers may share past events and in such a process, YOUNGER Fathers, now Members, may read and learn.

Next question: " a new (used) transmission " could mean endless products to me. Is it a used Transmission rebuilt by Aamco or is it a Scavenged (Pulled) Tranny from a Wrecking yard...? You need to have at least a Teaspoon of WRITTEN-DOCUMENTED data.

Here is where you might take what I wrote and ask your Son to read, Ponder and tell you His Answers.

No Offense
Jagerdad

"I CARE so I wrote".

Roy · Feb 6, 2020

I’ll admit I was pretty heavy handed in this one. It’s his money but I co-signed. Don’t tell him I said this but I don’t think he is quite ready to take the reins completely on something with this much money on the line just yet, but he was involved in every step. Let’s just say it was a “hands on” learning experience. We both learned a few things from this deal.

The new transmission has 40K miles on it with a limited warranty. Like I said, we just have hope it gets installed correctly! Otherwise, we may still have some lessons taught to us!

It has been my experience that parenting only gets harder as your kids get older and their decisions have bigger consequences.

desperatehills · Feb 7, 2020

A used transmission is what I would have recommended for the circumstances. When you get the vehicle back don't panic if it has a few odd shifts. The escape transmissions are known for this. My wife drove one for 80k mile as a company vehicle. From time to time the shift from 1st to 2nd would hit extremely hard. The dealership did several reprograms but never really solved it. It seemed worse when we had more people in the rig. It never left us stranded, it was just a annoying quirk.

One important thing to do. When you get the vehicle back and all seems well, take it to a independent shop and have them run a scan test. Make sure they know to check the trans module for codes. This is not the same as taking it to autozone. The wrecking yard that provided the transmission will warranty it for a short time. If there are any issues you want to point them out right away. The wrecking yard wants to provide a good trans and the dealership wants to install a good trans. Neither has much control over the history of the transmission.

Jagerdad · Feb 7, 2020

Dear Roy
I, as many, have enjoyed your Post. In no manner do I wish to sound rude. This reply post is about how mean and UNFAIR of a Father I have been. I have heard the terms "NOT FAIR" a Gazillion times as I told each Child to write me a 500 word essay about the below (Caveat Emptor) PLUS, what measures they could have done AND SHALL do in their future acts or purchase's. In such times we did not have Internet... Kinda makes it doubly hard requiring trips to the Library.

"What Is Caveat Emptor ?"
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/caveatemptor.asp

The second item I would like to offer is the following Website:
https://www.carcomplaints.com/Ford/Escape/2008/ Click on Transmission after each page.

After reading the above Website, maybe consider Abandoning the Car and work with the Dealer to apply the Loan into a different Make/Model Vehicle.

Jagerdad

Roy · Feb 8, 2020

Duly noted Jagerdad - and I never consider your posts rude - thanks for the advice!

joesikora · Feb 15, 2020

heartshot said:
Is there a way to see if the P0741 code was cleared before you bought it. It may have been erased by the dealer or prior owner. I wonder if the computer can still see the history.

A dealership would be able to see that Info

fireball77 · Feb 20, 2020

Roy said:
So my son just bought a 2008 Ford Escape, only had 132,409 miles. In great physical condition - clean record, no accidents. Bought it for $3995 - $4412 TTL out the door. Sounded like a great deal, had recently passed a state inspection and it checked out mechanically. Or so we thought.

The very next day after we bought it a check engine light came on showing a P0741 code. Bad transmission. We called the dealer, he said he would work with us, his mechanic scanned it, they checked the transmission fluid, said it was clean (I checked it too - looked clean to my untrained eye) and they determined it was just the solenoid that needed replaced and assured us it was fine to drive. The transmission wasn't slipping at all - running fine, until this Tuesday. Son takes it to Aamco for an transmission inspection - a second opinion, they check it and as soon as he drives it off the lot, the transmission goes completely out. No gears at all. So, it looks like a complete transmission overhaul is needed. Another $2 - $3 grand. I am beyond pissed.

So the dealer is trying to work with us, but we want him to just give us our money back. The car doesn't fall under the Texas lemon law as it is before 2013 and the contract says it is "AS IS", but our consumer rights say we can take it to an arbitrator.

I am just really wanting to know if it is worth it to fight it and take it to arbitration or just bite the bullet and pay to get it fixed. The guy is saying he will work with us, although he is still insisting it is just the solenoid that needs replaced. I mean - we had the car less than 36 hours and it started having problems. I think we might have a pretty good case, but is it worth the cost of fighting it?

Sorry to hear of this , same thing happened to us , we bought a 2005 jeep, and dropped not only 3k on tranny, but have since rewired plus , new window motor, actuator, head lights just stop working , been stranded several times etc etc slowly finding more and more things wrong or things they hid....I WILL NEVER BUY USED AGAIN