Diamond creek elk

Blindnonresident · Dec 10, 2019

No.
Making deals with the government has never been in our best interest. We have found that the minute you accept any agreement with them they continue to want.

Outdoordan · Dec 10, 2019

LAST EDITED ON Dec-10-19 AT 11:50PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Dec-10-19 AT 10:00?PM (MST)

As I am sitting here contemplating whether to write this I decided I would make my last comment. I don't argue online anymore. You believe what you will, I'll believe what I will.

The 4 months you are referring to is cow elk hunts on/or within 1 mile of private. This represents less than 25% of the unit, and not the lion share of the elk. The reason for these hunts is THE RANCHERS are complaining about depredation. The F & G have had their hands tied as they are paying out RECORD disbursements to Farmers and Ranchers whom do not allow access to the public for hunting, yet complain about elk depredation. They are doing these hunts in other units as well. I personally don't see this as "killing the herd" because these are dispersed elk that have come to savor the taste of alfalfa, not the elk that live on the majority of the unit. The lion share of elk aren't hunted when these large herds of elk migrate down in December.

Do I think hunters actions are appalling? Absolutely. I have seen more poaching cases this year than ever before. I also read of guys taking 1000+ yard shots with rifles, 600+ yard shots with muzzleloaders, and 100+ yard shots with bows because "they thought they could make it", or "it ain't dying unless the lead is flying". But those are all different issues for another day.

If you feel you are right, than start writing the commissioners, fish and game employees, and politicians. I know I make my concerns known.

Zelda18 · Dec 10, 2019

LAST EDITED ON Dec-11-19 AT 05:20AM (MST)[p]>LAST EDITED ON Dec-10-19
>AT 11:50?PM (MST)
>
>LAST EDITED ON Dec-10-19
>AT 10:00?PM (MST)
>
>As I am sitting here contemplating
>whether to write this I
>decided I would make my
>last comment. I don't
>argue online anymore. You
>believe what you will, I'll
>believe what I will.
>
>The 4 months you are referring
>to is cow elk hunts
>on/or within 1 mile of
>private. This represents less
>than 25% of the unit,
>and not the lion share
>of the elk. The reason
>for these hunts is THE
>RANCHERS are complaining about depredation.
> The F & G
>have had their hands tied
>as they are paying out
>RECORD disbursements to Farmers and
>Ranchers whom do not allow
>access to the public for
>hunting, yet complain about elk
>depredation. They are doing
>these hunts in other units
>as well. I personally
>don't see this as "killing
>the herd" because these are
>dispersed elk that have come
>to savor the taste of
>alfalfa, not the elk that
>live on the majority of
>the unit. The lion share
>of elk aren't hunted when
>these large herds of elk
>migrate down in December.
>
>Do I think hunters actions are
>appalling? Absolutely. I
>have seen more poaching cases
>this year than ever before.
> I also read of
>guys taking 1000+ yard shots
>with rifles, 600+ yard shots
>with muzzleloaders, and 100+ yard
>shots with bows because "they
>thought they could make it",
>or "it ain't dying unless
>the lead is flying".
>But those are all different
>issues for another day.
>
>If you feel you are right,
>than start writing the commissioners,
>fish and game employees, and
>politicians. I know I
>make my concerns known.

You?ve got a lot of audacity to assume you know or even remotely understand what's happening.
For 4 straight months farmers and ranchers contend with trespassing, poaching, harassment, cattle shot, gates torn down, elk being constantly chased and harassed, dead elk from road hunters flock shooting herds of 300 plus elk.
There is no help to stop the law breaking.
You think it's a drop in the bucket?! You don't have a clue. You think the ranchers are getting hand outs? You?re wrong. You think with all the fence destruction from people and elk, farmers and ranchers are making hand over fist?
That's an old wives tale.
You also think I haven't among others gone so far as to get legal help to stop all I mentioned above and light a fire under fish and games butts?
You can't get the commissioners to do a dam thing. I've talked, given presentations till I was blue in the face and it's done nothing to stop it.
You sit and nit pick all you want. Fact is, there are herds of 3-500 elk being chased in trucks for 4 months straight, add in all the slug trashy people issues and it's a recipe for a disaster.
I dam near was shot by a road hunter shooting at elk crossing a public roadway while I was driving down the road. The elk crossed in front of me and from the opposite direction, a jack wagon shot into the middle of the herd right at me. But please tell me again how safe and how much it's a drop in the bucket.. please speak for me. Better yet, if you don't live it every single day, keep your mouth shut and don't speak to me about it.
I guess you haven't heard about the cattle shot by these idiots either, didn't make the local news.
When you have a bunch of people driving around private property with rifles who hunt illegally and unethically, shooting towards homes for 4 months, tell me it's a drop in the bucket. Tell everyone who lives it everyday how wonderful it is.
We?re all sick and tired of it. Tired of the elk, tired of the people and tired of ducking bullets for 4 months.

Mallards_Only · Dec 10, 2019

Is it any wonder the public has a negative view of hunters? I sometimes wish I wasn't a part of the hunting community as well when I read about some of these scumbags and the things these so-called "hunters" do. It's embarrassing and disgusting. I don't blame you Zelda or BlindNR. I'd be pissed too.

Outdoordan · Dec 11, 2019

>LAST EDITED ON Dec-11-19
>AT 05:20?AM (MST)
>
>>LAST EDITED ON Dec-10-19
>>AT 11:50?PM (MST)
>>
>>LAST EDITED ON Dec-10-19
>>AT 10:00?PM (MST)
>>
>>As I am sitting here contemplating
>>whether to write this I
>>decided I would make my
>>last comment. I don't
>>argue online anymore. You
>>believe what you will, I'll
>>believe what I will.
>>
>>The 4 months you are referring
>>to is cow elk hunts
>>on/or within 1 mile of
>>private. This represents less
>>than 25% of the unit,
>>and not the lion share
>>of the elk. The reason
>>for these hunts is THE
>>RANCHERS are complaining about depredation.
>> The F & G
>>have had their hands tied
>>as they are paying out
>>RECORD disbursements to Farmers and
>>Ranchers whom do not allow
>>access to the public for
>>hunting, yet complain about elk
>>depredation. They are doing
>>these hunts in other units
>>as well. I personally
>>don't see this as "killing
>>the herd" because these are
>>dispersed elk that have come
>>to savor the taste of
>>alfalfa, not the elk that
>>live on the majority of
>>the unit. The lion share
>>of elk aren't hunted when
>>these large herds of elk
>>migrate down in December.
>>
>>Do I think hunters actions are
>>appalling? Absolutely. I
>>have seen more poaching cases
>>this year than ever before.
>> I also read of
>>guys taking 1000+ yard shots
>>with rifles, 600+ yard shots
>>with muzzleloaders, and 100+ yard
>>shots with bows because "they
>>thought they could make it",
>>or "it ain't dying unless
>>the lead is flying".
>>But those are all different
>>issues for another day.
>>
>>If you feel you are right,
>>than start writing the commissioners,
>>fish and game employees, and
>>politicians. I know I
>>make my concerns known.
>
>You?ve got a lot of audacity
>to assume you know or
>even remotely understand what's happening.
>
>For 4 straight months farmers and
>ranchers contend with trespassing, poaching,
>harassment, cattle shot, gates torn
>down, elk being constantly chased
>and harassed, dead elk from
>road hunters flock shooting herds
>of 300 plus elk.
>There is no help to stop
>the law breaking.
>You think it's a drop in
>the bucket?! You don't have
>a clue. You think the
>ranchers are getting hand outs?
>You?re wrong. You think with
>all the fence destruction from
>people and elk, farmers and
>ranchers are making hand over
>fist?
>That's an old wives tale.
>You also think I haven't among
>others gone so far as
>to get legal help to
>stop all I mentioned above
>and light a fire under
>fish and games butts?
>You can't get the commissioners to
>do a dam thing. I've
>talked, given presentations till I
>was blue in the face
>and it's done nothing to
>stop it.
>You sit and nit pick all
>you want. Fact is, there
>are herds of 3-500 elk
>being chased in trucks for
>4 months straight, add in
>all the slug trashy people
>issues and it's a recipe
>for a disaster.
>I dam near was shot by
>a road hunter shooting at
>elk crossing a public roadway
>while I was driving down
>the road. The elk crossed
>in front of me and
>from the opposite direction, a
>jack wagon shot into the
>middle of the herd right
>at me. But please tell
>me again how safe and
>how much it's a drop
>in the bucket.. please speak
>for me. Better yet, if
>you don't live it every
>single day, keep your mouth
>shut and don't speak to
>me about it.
>I guess you haven't heard about
>the cattle shot by these
>idiots either, didn't make the
>local news.
>When you have a bunch of
>people driving around private property
>with rifles who hunt illegally
>and unethically, shooting towards homes
>for 4 months, tell me
>it's a drop in the
>bucket. Tell everyone who lives
>it everyday how wonderful it
>is.
>We?re all sick and tired of
>it. Tired of the elk,
>tired of the people and
>tired of ducking bullets for
>4 months.

Umm, your reading skills leave a lot to be desired. I have no problem ending those cow hunts. Those were FOR the Ranchers and Farmers FOR the elk on Private Property. What those hunts have done is push the elk onto private that used to live partially on public. If you have a solution, let us all know.

As for bad behavior, I think I agreed that there are many unethical hunters out there as well?

idahohuntr · Dec 11, 2019

>We?re all sick and tired of
>it. Tired of the elk,
>tired of the people and
>tired of ducking bullets for
>4 months.

While I would never condone unethical or illegal behavior, I think its important for those of us fortunate enough to live in rural areas to recognize the public's wildlife does exist on the landscape and their are potential impacts associated with that wildlife and the public pursuing their wildlife. To be fair, there are plenty of bad actors on the private landowner side as well...folks harassing legal hunters, illegally posting public lands, etc.

Perhaps if you are tired of elk and elk hunters you should move to the City?

Blindnonresident · Dec 11, 2019

Outdoordan I can tell you have given this subject much thought by the fact you edited your response 3 times over the course of 2 days. My response below is not a personal attack on you but I have some thoughts too.

"The 4 months you are referring to is cow elk hunts on/or within 1 mile of private. This represents less than 25% of the unit, and not the lion share of the elk."

Such BS. It's one of many hunts during that 4 months and 1 mile as the crow fly's from cultivated private land. Lay down a mile scale on a flat boundary map. Most will be amazed at how much country that really is but will still chose the path of least resistance which is walking the fence line.

""The reason for these hunts is THE RANCHERS are complaining about depredation.""

Interesting. If the reason for these hunts is "ranchers" and Game/Fish correctly managing an elk herd then the state has failed their duty........again. I think it's about tag sales, revenue, and over hunting. One thing is for sure the state won't fail at depositing in their pension trust despite the cost to the animals and sportsmen.
The vast majority of those complaining have the least financial skin in the game but a way of life to lose. I wonder who will prevail?

""I personally don't see this as "killing the herd" because these are dispersed elk that have come to savor the taste of alfalfa, not the elk that live on the majority of the unit. The lion share of elk aren't hunted when these large herds of elk migrate down in December.""

Laugh out loud. You make it sound like they are showing up for a 5 star dining experience. They show up on the ranch August 31st because it's about survival and escaping man. It's the start of the 4 month slaughter and they are there to survive. They have been chased there. They aren't there to stimulate their taste buds and once they are there the lions show up to share too.

"write your commissioners"

Really? Good one. The shortest of short timers at the Game and Fish(commissioners) are worried about their own retirement, pension, and not rocking the boat for themselves. The only way anything will change is by kicking the entire agency in the coin purse.

This story has one common theme. Human greed.
People are more worried about themselves today than the good of the future.

Manage the resource where it's headed instead of where it's been!!!

Outdoordan · Dec 11, 2019

>Outdoordan I can tell you have
>given this subject much thought
>by the fact you edited
>your response 3 times over
>the course of 2 days.
>My response below is not
>a personal attack on you
>but I have some thoughts
>too.
>
>
>
>"The 4 months you are referring
>to is cow elk hunts
>on/or within 1 mile of
>private. This represents less than
>25% of the unit, and
>not the lion share of
>the elk."
>
>Such BS. It's one of many
>hunts during that 4 months
>and 1 mile as the
>crow fly's from cultivated private
>land. Lay down a mile
>scale on a flat boundary
>map. Most will be amazed
>at how much country that
>really is but will still
>chose the path of least
>resistance which is walking the
>fence line.
>
>
>""The reason for these hunts is
>THE RANCHERS are complaining about
>depredation.""
>
>Interesting. If the reason for these
>hunts is "ranchers" and Game/Fish
>correctly managing an elk herd
>then the state has failed
>their duty........again. I think it's
>about tag sales, revenue, and
>over hunting. One thing is
>for sure the state won't
>fail at depositing in their
>pension trust despite the cost
>to the animals and sportsmen.
>
>The vast majority of those complaining
>have the least financial skin
>in the game but a
>way of life to lose.
>I wonder who will prevail?
>
>
>
>""I personally don't see this as
>"killing the herd" because these
>are dispersed elk that have
>come to savor the taste
>of alfalfa, not the elk
>that live on the majority
>of the unit. The lion
>share of elk aren't hunted
>when these large herds of
>elk migrate down in December.""
>
>
>Laugh out loud. You make it
>sound like they are showing
>up for a 5 star
>dining experience. They show up
>on the ranch August 31st
>because it's about survival and
>escaping man. It's the start
>of the 4 month slaughter
>and they are there to
>survive. They have been chased
>there. They aren't there to
>stimulate their taste buds and
>once they are there the
>lions show up to share
>too.
>
>
>"write your commissioners"
>
>Really? Good one. The shortest of
>short timers at the Game
>and Fish(commissioners) are worried about
>their own retirement, pension, and
>not rocking the boat for
>themselves. The only way anything
>will change is by kicking
>the entire agency in the
>coin purse.
>
>This story has one common theme.
>Human greed.
>People are more worried about themselves
>today than the good of
>the future.
>
>Manage the resource where it's headed
>instead of where it's been!!!
>
>

I bet we'd agree on more than we disagree on. This thread was started because of NR wanting elk (bull) tags and it turned into a debate on cow elk hunts used to alleviate depredation.

I stand by my comments, but appreciate yours. Thanks.

Blindnonresident · Dec 11, 2019

I wouldn't recommend moving to the city to my worst enemy.

OR would I?

Zelda18 · Dec 11, 2019

>>We?re all sick and tired of
>>it. Tired of the elk,
>>tired of the people and
>>tired of ducking bullets for
>>4 months.
>
>While I would never condone unethical
>or illegal behavior, I think
>its important for those of
>us fortunate enough to live
>in rural areas to recognize
>the public's wildlife does exist
>on the landscape and their
>are potential impacts associated with
>that wildlife and the public
>pursuing their wildlife. To
>be fair, there are plenty
>of bad actors on the
>private landowner side as well...folks
>harassing legal hunters, illegally posting
>public lands, etc.
>
>Perhaps if you are tired of
>elk and elk hunters you
>should move to the City?
>

That's pretty ignorant. Since we're on the subject of you thinking it's all my fault and my problem, I'll tell you what. Every rancher and farmer are going to come to your back yard and trespass, harass, shoot towards your home, shoot your animals, harass the wildlife, harass your family and consider what is yours as mine.
You come ?crap? in our backyards then leave us with the mess.
It's about time you have the pleasure of experiencing all we have to endure.

BlindNR,
You hit the nail on the head. I've said verbatim everything you stated and share in your experiences.
What a sad state of affairs we're in.

twsnow18 · Dec 11, 2019

Yada yada yada...

Simply put, Idaho offers what others don't.

ID: True OTC tags.
180 bucks and 320 bulls with those tags.
Cheapest tags

MT: Gotta draw the "general" tag? WTF, that's not OTC.
Very poor buck age class.
Spendy

WY: Gotta draw the "general" tag? WTF, that's not OTC.
Small bucks outside of G/H
Spendy now
Can't hunt the wilderness

CO: True OTC, but raghorn capital of the world
Draw for deer
Orange army, nuts to butts

WA, OR, NV, AZ, UT, NM.... good luck....

Deepcolor · Dec 11, 2019

This thread is just another example of the demise of this site. Get online and complain about things you can't change to people that can't change them.....seems productive. ?

Zelda18 · Dec 11, 2019

>This thread is just another example
>of the demise of this
>site. Get online and complain
>about things you can't change
>to people that can't change
>them.....seems productive. ?

So pointing out and correcting ignorance isn't allowed..?
Educating isn't allowed?
Seems to me there needs to be more education on what's happening ?on the ground? and perhaps it could curtail the support for bad tags and help light a fire to insure other contact F&G as well as local prosecutors.

Blindnonresident · Dec 12, 2019

"This thread is just another example of the demise of this site. Get online and complain about things you can't change to people that can't change them.....seems productive. ?"

Does anyone else see the irony here???
Or should I say the complaining?

***** Stars