DRAFT MOOSE REGS/QUOTAS

Draft moose regulations dated 3/15/23 with proposed tag numbers reflecting the new 90/10 R/NR split;


It looks like 1 possible NR random antlered tag in unit 25 & in unit 26.

Before Buzz beats me to it, If you don’t like the NR random odds, go apply in MT, ID, or UT ?…

Horniac
Or just don't apply at all...don't care.

The random draw is awesome in Wyoming...I snagged a random 26 bull tag last year with 1 point.

Now with 90-10 more residents will get to do the same.
 
Or just don't apply at all...

Exactly, NRs shouldn't apply for WY Moose/Sheep at all. That is exactly what the tag app services have recommended, starting in 2022. But too many NRs just apply for everything and don't study the policy & data.

With the farcical 3% CC fee and $150 points, for 1 NR random sheep tag and 2 NR random moose tags - what fool looks at the current deal for WY moose/sheep and jumps in to that mess?

I feel bad for the really high WY moose/sheep point holders (on the cusp) as they not only need to keep applying, they need to keep buying those $150 points "just in case".

No other state has ever sold a point for anywhere near $150 and then pulled the rug out from under.
 
Exactly, NRs shouldn't apply for WY Moose/Sheep at all. That is exactly what the tag app services have recommended, starting in 2022. But too many NRs just apply for everything and don't study the policy & data.

With the farcical 3% CC fee and $150 points, for 1 NR random sheep tag and 2 NR random moose tags - what fool looks at the current deal for WY moose/sheep and jumps in to that mess?

I feel bad for the really high WY moose/sheep point holders (on the cusp) as they not only need to keep applying, they need to keep buying those $150 points "just in case".

No other state has ever sold a point for anywhere near $150 and then pulled the rug out from under.
I feel bad for the residents that gave up 20-25% of their sheep, moose, goat, and bison tags to NRs. Way too generous for way too long.
 
I’m sure I don’t understand the discussion here regarding the nonresident Moose tags that are being drawn for, for the 2023 hunting season.

As I review the attached data set, Chapter 8. Moose Hunting Season (Draft) it seems to be showing the number of tags available for Residents in some Hunt Areas and for tags for both Residents and Non-Residents for other Hunt Areas.

So…. looking at Hunt Area 1, Type 1, they are proposing 6 Resident Tags and 1 Non-Resident Tag

Regarding Non-Residents then, are they proposing 1 Non-Resident be available for a Non-Resident, In Hunt Area, Type 4?

When they refer to a Random draw, does that mean, regarding this Hunt Area 1, Type 4……. that a total of 7 draws will be made, if one of those 7 is a Non-Resident, that Tag will be awarded to the Non-Resident. However if all 7 drawn are Resident tags, no Non-Resident tags will be awarded?

Meaning, up to 10% Non-Residents “may” draw a tag Moose but only if they draw one of the 7…… out of all Residents and Non-Residents that have applied for that Hunt Area. Thereby making it possible for up to 10% of the moose tags will be awarded to Non-Residents but it is also possible for less than 10% Non-Residents will be awarded, even zero Non-residents May draw?

I’m I correct or still confused and wrong.

ABF2DEF7-18B9-428B-AF15-CEC94EC10B19.jpeg
 
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I’m sure I don’t understand the discussion here regarding the nonresident Moose tags that are being drawn for, for the 2023 hunting season.

As I review the attached data set, Chapter 8. Moose Hunting Season (Draft) it seems to be showing the number of tags available for Residents in some Hunt Areas and for tags for both Residents and Non-Residents for other Hunt Areas.

So…. looking at Hunt Area 1, Type 1, they are proposing 6 Resident Tags and 1 Non-Resident Tag

Regarding Non-Residents then, are they proposing 1 Non-Resident be available for a Non-Resident, In Hunt Area, Type 4?

When they refer to a Random draw, does that mean, regarding this Hunt Area 1, Type 4……. that a total of 7 draws will be made, if one of those 7 is a Non-Resident, that Tag will be awarded to the Non-Resident. However if all 7 drawn are Resident tags, no Non-Resident tags will be awarded?

Meaning, up to 10% Non-Residents “may” draw a tag Moose but only if they draw one of the 7…… out of all Residents and Non-Residents that have applied for that Hunt Area. Thereby making it possible for up to 10% of the moose tags will be awarded to Non-Residents but it is also possible for less than 10% Non-Residents will be awarded, even zero Non-residents May draw?

I’m I correct or still confused and wrong.

View attachment 107088
There won't be a random tag for non residents in area 1 with only 1 tag. It goes 75% of the quota goes towards preference point holders and 25% goes to the random draw. With 1 tag there is no random tags. 6 go into the resident draw 1 goes into the non resident draw
 
I’m sure I don’t understand the discussion here regarding the nonresident Moose tags that are being drawn for, for the 2023 hunting season.

As I review the attached data set, Chapter 8. Moose Hunting Season (Draft) it seems to be showing the number of tags available for Residents in some Hunt Areas and for tags for both Residents and Non-Residents for other Hunt Areas.

So…. looking at Hunt Area 1, Type 1, they are proposing 6 Resident Tags and 1 Non-Resident Tag

Regarding Non-Residents then, are they proposing 1 Non-Resident be available for a Non-Resident, In Hunt Area, Type 4?

When they refer to a Random draw, does that mean, regarding this Hunt Area 1, Type 4……. that a total of 7 draws will be made, if one of those 7 is a Non-Resident, that Tag will be awarded to the Non-Resident. However if all 7 drawn are Resident tags, no Non-Resident tags will be awarded?

Meaning, up to 10% Non-Residents “may” draw a tag Moose but only if they draw one of the 7…… out of all Residents and Non-Residents that have applied for that Hunt Area. Thereby making it possible for up to 10% of the moose tags will be awarded to Non-Residents but it is also possible for less than 10% Non-Residents will be awarded, even zero Non-residents May draw?

I’m I correct or still confused and wrong.

View attachment 107088
There has to be a minimum of 4 non-resident tags for one to go to the random draw.
 
There has to be a minimum of 4 non-resident tags for one to go to the random draw.
There won't be a random tag for non residents in area 1 with only 1 tag. It goes 75% of the quota goes towards preference point holders and 25% goes to the random draw. With 1 tag there is no random tags. 6 go into the resident draw 1 goes into the non resident draw
Thank you, makes more sense now.
 
Okay, all of my questions have been answered, I think. You said, “ Resident and non-resident quotas are allocated separately, which keeps it simple and leaves no ambiguity at all in the number of licenses residents and non-residents can draw for each hunt code.”

Sorry but I’m dumber than your average non-resident,
so one final question. If they offer….. 1 non-resident tag, as long as at least one non-resident applies for it, it’s going to a non-resident….. no chance it will be awarded to a resident?

Thanks.
 
Okay, all of my questions have been answered, I think. You said, “ Resident and non-resident quotas are allocated separately, which keeps it simple and leaves no ambiguity at all in the number of licenses residents and non-residents can draw for each hunt code.”

Sorry but I’m dumber than your average non-resident,
so one final question. If they offer….. 1 non-resident tag, as long as at least one non-resident applies for it, it’s going to a non-resident….. no chance it will be awarded to a resident?

Thanks.
If no non residents apply the tag would go into the resident draw.
 
There has to be a minimum of 4 non-resident tags for one to go to the random draw.
Don't think so.

The GF chooses to do that, but pretty sure it's just like the R/NR split, where they issue 10% of the total quota to NR. Lots of areas they issue NR tags in areas with less than 10 tags.

I don't think there's anything stopping the GF from issuing 25% of the total NR quota to Random applicants.
 
I don't think there's anything stopping the GF from issuing 25% of the total NR quota to Random applicants.
It's in regulation that the 75/25 PP/random split is by area, not total quota.
I'm sure that will change for next year.
 
You think Wyoming is expensive? Try Idaho. You buy the hunting license for $185 + a $45.75 app fee + the 3% credit card fee. So if a guy just puts in for a sheep/goat/moose tag he is out $230 bucks + CC fees and he doesn’t even get a point! Pretty bad if a guy isn’t hunting deer or elk on a general tag to diffuse the price.
 
You think Wyoming is expensive? Try Idaho. You buy the hunting license for $185 + a $45.75 app fee + the 3% credit card fee. So if a guy just puts in for a sheep/goat/moose tag he is out $230 bucks + CC fees and he doesn’t even get a point! Pretty bad if a guy isn’t hunting deer or elk on a general tag to diffuse the price.
What you are missing is Idaho like New Mexico can not be compared to Wyoming. Apples to oranges. Wyoming like Idaho use to be cheaper to apply. But you could skip a year or two in Idaho or NM and not get behind the curve. Your odds the next year remain constant. Wyoming started off cheap, but missing one year of purchasing points can put you back multiple years.
 
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You think Wyoming is expensive? Try Idaho. You buy the hunting license for $185 + a $45.75 app fee + the 3% credit card fee. So if a guy just puts in for a sheep/goat/moose tag he is out $230 bucks + CC fees and he doesn’t even get a point! Pretty bad if a guy isn’t hunting deer or elk on a general tag to diffuse the price.
That's the saddest story i have heard all day!!
 
You think Wyoming is expensive? Try Idaho. You buy the hunting license for $185 + a $45.75 app fee + the 3% credit card fee. So if a guy just puts in for a sheep/goat/moose tag he is out $230 bucks + CC fees and he doesn’t even get a point! Pretty bad if a guy isn’t hunting deer or elk on a general tag to diffuse the price.
Skip the draw buy state raffle tickets. One of my best friends won the Idaho raffle tag with $100 worth of tickets and shot a B&C ram.
 
Don't think so.

The GF chooses to do that, but pretty sure it's just like the R/NR split, where they issue 10% of the total quota to NR. Lots of areas they issue NR tags in areas with less than 10 tags.

I don't think there's anything stopping the GF from issuing 25% of the total NR quota to Random applicants.
It's in regulation that the 75/25 PP/random split is by area, not total quota.
I'm sure that will change for next year.
I must correct myself in that pp/random is split by area is in statute and therefore will require a much harder push to change.
 
You think Wyoming is expensive? Try Idaho. You buy the hunting license for $185 + a $45.75 app fee + the 3% credit card fee. So if a guy just puts in for a sheep/goat/moose tag he is out $230 bucks + CC fees and he doesn’t even get a point! Pretty bad if a guy isn’t hunting deer or elk on a general tag to diffuse the price.
And thank God you don't get a point...let's leave these ponzi schemes to all the other states.
 
I must correct myself in that pp/random is split by area is in statute and therefore will require a much harder push to change.
If they don't change that statute there will be years with no random sheep tags for NRs.

Meh, not my problem to deal with let the department worry and change it if they want.
 
I’m certain the WG&F realizes they are in the process of losing nonres pref pt revenue for sheep and moose as nonres drop out of the draw like dead flies if there are 0 nonres random tags and insane draw odds for the few tags available. Maybe the res sheep and moose tag prices will double to make up for the loss?
 
You think Wyoming is expensive? Try Idaho. You buy the hunting license for $185 + a $45.75 app fee + the 3% credit card fee. So if a guy just puts in for a sheep/goat/moose tag he is out $230 bucks + CC fees and he doesn’t even get a point! Pretty bad if a guy isn’t hunting deer or elk on a general tag to diffuse the price.

Idaho is cheaper only if you don't buy WY moose/sheep points. But there are fewer applicants in Idaho and WAY more random tags in Idaho.

Wouldn't you rather go after 6 random Idaho ram tags than 1 random Wyoming ram tag? When the app money is similar, fewer applicants and 6x the tags?

If you're more than a couple points under max for WY moose/sheep, you're a fool to be sending WY any moose/sheep money in 2023...

Funny how WY waited until well in to the app period to disclose that they would only be giving 1 NR random sheep tag and 2 NR random moose tags. Many folks had already applied.
 
Does anyone know if Wyoming publishes a report that shows how many people have 24, 23, 22, etc. preference points.

I have 22 non- res. points now, so I think I set on the “edge” of whether to drop out or keep applying…….
 
I’m certain the WG&F realizes they are in the process of losing nonres pref pt revenue for sheep and moose as nonres drop out of the draw like dead flies if there are 0 nonres random tags and insane draw odds for the few tags available. Maybe the res sheep and moose tag prices will double to make up for the loss?
No, just raise NR regular deer, elk, and pronghorn $50-$100.

IIRC, elk, deer and pronghorn points can be raised to $75 each without legislative approval.

Could also double the price of nr doe/fawn tags and raise cow/calf tags to $500.
 
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Idaho is cheaper only if you don't buy WY moose/sheep points. But there are fewer applicants in Idaho and WAY more random tags in Idaho.

Wouldn't you rather go after 6 random Idaho ram tags than 1 random Wyoming ram tag? When the app money is similar, fewer applicants and 6x the tags?

If you're more than a couple points under max for WY moose/sheep, you're a fool to be sending WY any moose/sheep money in 2023...

Funny how WY waited until well in to the app period to disclose that they would only be giving 1 NR random sheep tag and 2 NR random moose tags. Many folks had already applied.
Idaho is an up to 10% of the tags, so there is a chance they may not issue a single nr sheep, goat, or moose tag.
 
Does anyone know if Wyoming publishes a report that shows how many people have 24, 23, 22, etc. preference points.

I have 22 non- res. points now, so I think I set on the “edge” of whether to drop out or keep applying…….
Think at your points I would weather it out a few years. During that time look at areas that have taken the fewest points to draw and do your research. If willing to go guided I think you have a lot of options.
 
Idaho is an up to 10% of the tags, so there is a chance they may not issue a single nr sheep, goat, or moose tag.

Idaho issued 6 NR random ram tags in 2022 & 2021. And 7 NR random ram tags in 2020. It will almost surely be 6 again in 2023.
Whereas the absolute maximum WY NR ram tags will be 1 in 2023.

A random ram tag shopper would be crazy to send their money to WY this year instead of Idaho.

And just go buy Powerball tickets with that money before sending a dime to WY (and buy a tag up north with the winnings).
 
Idaho issued 6 NR random ram tags in 2022 & 2021. And 7 NR random ram tags in 2020. It will almost surely be 6 again in 2023.
Whereas the absolute maximum WY NR ram tags will be 1 in 2023.

A random ram tag shopper would be crazy to send their money to WY this year instead of Idaho.

And just go buy Powerball tickets with that money before sending a dime to WY (and buy a tag up north with the winnings).
And like I said there's a chance they won't issue any in 2023.

Wrong, Wyoming will issue 18 tags to NRs...3 times as many as Idaho and they're guaranteed tags, not up to.
 
Does anyone know if Wyoming publishes a report that shows how many people have 24, 23, 22, etc. preference points.

I have 22 non- res. points now, so I think I set on the “edge” of whether to drop out or keep applying…….
How old are you?

At 22 M/S points, WY has you by the balls. You almost have to keep giving them $150x2 (+$180 CC fees, $30 app fees) and hope for the best. But you are likely throwing all that money away.

At 22 sheep points, there are almost 320 NR folks ahead of you. And 255 other people at your same point level.

Data here: https://wgfd.wyo.gov/WGFD/media/content/PDF/Hunting/TOTAL_PREF_POINTS_MS.pdf
 
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Wyo residents claimed that Wyo nonres tag allotments were way more generous than other Western states and they wanted to level the playing field. It's obvious with 90/10 that the opposite has happened.

There are a lot more nonres friendly states than Wyo for sheep and moose. With 90/10, Wyo may actually be considered the worse nonres state in the West....especially for what they did to nonres that supported their pref pt program revenue for so many years. That's pretty evident looking at the 2023 nonres tag allotments. Why on earth should nonres pay $150/year each for sheep and moose points when there are 0 to a couple nonres tags with lottery type draw odds? The WG&F just shot themselves in the foot!

Nonres in other states also don't have to worry about being required to hunt with a guide in wilderness! Plain and simple, with 90/10 the WG&F revenue is going to go into a tailspin with a loss in applicants and pref pt revenue.

The WG&F better start saving their budget because it could be slim pickins for funding in the coming years....especially with fewer nonres tags with the 2023 d/a/e winterkill.
 
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How old are you?

At 22 M/S points, WY has you by the balls. You almost have to keep giving them $150x2 and hope for the best. But you are likely throwing all that money away.

At 22 sheep points, there are almost 320 NR folks ahead of you. And 255 other people at your same point level.

Data here: https://wgfd.wyo.gov/WGFD/media/content/PDF/Hunting/TOTAL_PREF_POINTS_MS.pdf
Not even close to all top point holders even apply every year. If I believed that, I never would have drawn sheep in 2019 with my points. There were several hundred residents with more points than me, yet I had enough points to draw in the preference pool.
 
Wrong, Wyoming will issue 18 tags to NRs...3 times as many as Idaho and they're guaranteed tags, not up to.
"Random" ram tags.
Wyoming: 1
Idaho: 6-7

There are very few PP ram tag guys out there - and they know who they are.
 
Think at your points I would weather it out a few years. During that time look at areas that have taken the fewest points to draw and do your research. If willing to go guided I think you have a lot of options.
Thanks LIK2
It’s more than simply drawing a moose tag someday. Others may not relate or agree and I understand that may criteria is very personal and thereby can certainly be considered narrow and self centered. Be that as it may, here’s where I’m coming from in attempting to decide if I’m still in or hanging it up.

If I were 50 years old, I’d stay with it but at 76…… it’s a race for time…… if it doesn’t happen soon I’ll stumble 20 yards short of the finish line. If there are still dozens of folks with 24 and 23 points, it’s time to surrender, and put the effort into something with more immediately gratifying….. like a half dozen ribeye steaks and have the grandkids over for dinner.

I know I could most likely still draw a moose tag in one of the less sought after units but there are other factors that are driving my decision. I’m not interested, in any way shape or form in hiring an outfitter, not that I’m opposed to outfitters, or to sportsmen who hire them, it’s simply a perceived value vs cost for me. I would however consider paying an access fee to a proven property, on an easier to draw Hunt Area. Second, this is not a meat hunt or a much anticipated week to enjoying the wonders of nature. I have those experiences every time I leave my yard. Also….This tag costs right close to $2,000.00. I can buy a lot of high priced beef for $2.000.00. Regarding the great pleasure and satisfaction from the hunt……. I certainly will do that but I don’t need to spend this kind of money to have an equally good hunting/outdoors experience. After paying for preference points for over 20 years, $2,000 for the tag, add fuel, food and lodging, I’ll be hunting for a mature moose. I won’t be disappointed if I come home without a moose, what I will be disappointed in is if I’ve invested 3 to 4 thousand dollars or more, to hunt a Hunt Area where there is little to no possibility to pursue a mature bull with little likely that any exist there.

Right or wrong, that’s the reality I’m weighing my decision on.
 
Thanks LIK2
It’s more than simply drawing a moose tag someday. Others may not relate or agree and I understand that may criteria is very personal and thereby can certainly be considered narrow and self centered. Be that as it may, here’s where I’m coming from in attempting to decide if I’m still in or hanging it up.

If I were 50 years old, I’d stay with it but at 76…… it’s a race for time…… if it doesn’t happen soon I’ll stumble 20 yards short of the finish line. If there are still dozens of folks with 24 and 23 points, it’s time to surrender, and put the effort into something with more immediately gratifying….. like a half dozen ribeye steaks and have the grandkids over for dinner.

I know I could most likely still draw a moose tag in one of the less sought after units but there are other factors that are driving my decision. I’m not interested, in any way shape or form in hiring an outfitter, not that I’m opposed to outfitters, or to sportsmen who hire them, it’s simply a perceived value vs cost for me. I would however consider paying an access fee to a proven property, on an easier to draw Hunt Area. Second, this is not a meat hunt or a much anticipated week to enjoying the wonders of nature. I have those experiences every time I leave my yard. Also….This tag costs right close to $2,000.00. I can buy a lot of high priced beef for $2.000.00. Regarding the great pleasure and satisfaction from the hunt……. I certainly will do that but I don’t need to spend this kind of money to have an equally good hunting/outdoors experience. After paying for preference points for over 20 years, $2,000 for the tag, add fuel, food and lodging, I’ll be hunting for a mature moose. I won’t be disappointed if I come home without a moose, what I will be disappointed in is if I’ve invested 3 to 4 thousand dollars or more, to hunt a Hunt Area where there is little to no possibility to pursue a mature bull with little likely that any exist there.

Right or wrong, that’s the reality I’m weighing my decision on.
Quit then...sounds like you're talking yourself out of it.
 
"Random" ram tags.
Wyoming: 1
Idaho: 6-7

There are very few PP ram tag guys out there - and they know who they are.
I see that there are 189 people with more points and then another 254 with 22 points.

My odds of hunting the age of moose I’m wanting to are simply too high. Can’t see any rational reason to continue applying.
 
If I were 50 years old, I’d stay with it but at 76……
76 years old - congrats! Yes, you need to retire from WY m/s with your head held high.

At 22 NR m/s points, you have invested just over $5,000 in your WY moose/sheep saga! It is now time for WY res to take over your role of paying for their state agency. I thank you for what you have done for the state of Wyoming.

There MIGHT be a VERY, VERY small chance that a few 22 point guys could get the LOWEST tier m/s tags in 2023, but highly unlikely IMO. Most of the hundreds of guys at 22+ points are finally paying attention in 2023 and the smart ones will come off the sidelines 2023 to get these last few PP tags before the next change happens (BP-exponent, PP/random split or whatever the next change ends up being).

In 2022, there were both moose & sheep tags (lower tier) drawn at 22 points, but that is going to jump significantly in 2023.
 
76 years old - congrats! Yes, you need to retire from WY m/s with your head held high.

At 22 NR m/s points, you have invested just over $5,000 in your WY moose/sheep saga! It is now time for WY res to take over your role of paying for their state agency. I thank you for what you have done for the state of Wyoming.

There MIGHT be a VERY, VERY small chance that a few 22 point guys could get the LOWEST tier m/s tags in 2023, but highly unlikely IMO. Most of the hundreds of guys at 22+ points are finally paying attention in 2023 and the smart ones will come off the sidelines 2023 to get these last few PP tags before the next change happens (BP-exponent, PP/random split or whatever the next change ends up being).

In 2022, there were both moose & sheep tags (lower tier) drawn at 22 points, but that is going to jump significantly in 2023.
Not even close to $5000 you're a liar and a fraud.

There were moose tags he could have drawn a decade ago with his points.
 
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Just so you know 2lumpy that same NR moose tag will increase from $1,982 to $2,750 next year plus your $15 application fee so you need to factor that in as well. Sheep tags will go from $2,320 to $3,000.

Agree with LIK2HNT, at 22 points I would probably hold on to them and let the dust settle and see what develops. WY might convert to bonus points at some point which would give you slightly better odds to draw over lower point applicants.

Horniac
 
I see that there are 189 people with more points and then another 254 with 22 points.

My odds of hunting the age of moose I’m wanting to are simply too high. Can’t see any rational reason to continue applying.
You waited too long by choice.

My NR Dad drew unit 24 in 2012 with 11 points in the preference draw.

Killed this bull:

DSCN9427.jpg


DSCN9407.jpg


He shot it opening day, and I think we could have done better but I couldn't get him to lay off the one he killed.

That year, your odds of drawing were 100% with your 12 points.

You also could have drawn 23, 25, 26, 27, 35, 36, 17, 18, 21, 22,10, 11, 9, 4, 5, 6, 2 and 3 all with 12 points.

I'm finding it pretty tough to feel sorry with point gatherer's who make a decision to wait for????? What????

Further, if you went all those years just gathering points with no plan, and if you believed that things would get better moose population wise, well, you weren't paying attention in 2012.

Waiting has consequences...and I don't do that. When I have points to draw a decent tag, they're gone.

I can assure you my Dad's bull ate better, and looks better on the wall than your 22 points ever will.
 
Just so you know 2lumpy that same NR moose tag will increase from $1,982 to $2,750 next year plus your $15 application fee so you need to factor that in as well. Sheep tags will go from $2,320 to $3,000.

Agree with LIK2HNT, at 22 points I would probably hold on to them and let the dust settle and see what develops. WY might convert to bonus points at some point which would give you slightly better odds to draw over lower point applicants.

Horniac
The squared points is dead and I don't see that dumb idea coming back. There isn't going to be another task force from what I understand, likely for a very long time.
 
Just so you know 2lumpy that same NR moose tag will increase from $1,982 to $2,750 next year plus your $15 application fee so you need to factor that in as well. Sheep tags will go from $2,320 to $3,000.

Agree with LIK2HNT, at 22 points I would probably hold on to them and let the dust settle and see what develops. WY might convert to bonus points at some point which would give you slightly better odds to draw over lower point applicants.

Horniac
Horniac, thanks for the encouragement but I’m afraid the sand is too far gone from the hour glass. At 76…… the joints and tissues won’t allow hunting at all in a couple more years, so if I can’t make it work this year or next, I can’t trust my physical condition much longer. 80 years old seem pretty ominous to me, so if it’s not going to be practical, this fall or next, there is little justification to build points.

Yep Buzz, you’re absolutely right. I could have drawn a moose tag, but didn’t think I could find a mature bull in the Area’s I could have drawn. I haven’t been just wanting “a” moose hunt. I’ve killed immature moose already and I don’t hunt for the meat, as a top priority. I don’t hire outfitters. It’s not worth the cost…. to me. So it is what it is.

I have no hard feelings toward Wyoming
F &G and the resident/non-resident ratios, before or now. I’m not frustrated at the current price or the pending price of the Moose tag. I’m just wanting to deal with the realities, as they are today……. Of course, I suspect you do much the same, as you approach each application season.

I don’t see a problem attempting to gather as much info before taking a fork in the road as I can. All the best. Thanks for your input as well…..
 
Horniac, thanks for the encouragement but I’m afraid the sand is too far gone from the hour glass. At 76…… the joints and tissues won’t allow hunting at all in a couple more years, so if I can’t make it work this year or next, I can’t trust my physical condition much longer. 80 years old seem pretty ominous to me, so if it’s not going to be practical, this fall or next, there is little justification to build points.

Yep Buzz, you’re absolutely right. I could have drawn a moose tag, but didn’t think I could find a mature bull in the Area’s I could have drawn. I haven’t been just wanting “a” moose hunt. I’ve killed immature moose already and I don’t hunt for the meat, as a top priority. I don’t hire outfitters. It’s not worth the cost…. to me. So it is what it is.

I have no hard feelings toward Wyoming
F &G and the resident/non-resident ratios, before or now. I’m not frustrated at the current price or the pending price of the Moose tag. I’m just wanting to deal with the realities, as they are today……. Of course, I suspect you do much the same, as you approach each application season.

I don’t see a problem attempting to gather as much info before taking a fork in the road as I can. All the best. Thanks for your input as well…..
You also could have drawn 23, 25, 26, 27, 35, 36, 17, 18, 21, 22,10, 11, 9, 4, 5, 6, 2 and 3 all with 12 points.

No mature bulls in any of those units I guess? There is ZERO wilderness in 23, 24, 25, 26...all units I've hunted and there are mature bulls in 24 and 26... I can tell you that:

My 24 bull:

DSC00872.jpg


Last year 26 bull:

IMG_4507.jpg


Also, Jim Fraundeitz killed one of the top B&C bulls taken in a 3 year recording period in unit 25, which you also could have drawn the year he killed it, 2012.
 
You waited too long by choice.

My NR Dad drew unit 24 in 2012 with 11 points in the preference draw.

Killed this bull:

View attachment 107199

View attachment 107200

He shot it opening day, and I think we could have done better but I couldn't get him to lay off the one he killed.

That year, your odds of drawing were 100% with your 12 points.

You also could have drawn 23, 25, 26, 27, 35, 36, 17, 18, 21, 22,10, 11, 9, 4, 5, 6, 2 and 3 all with 12 points.

I'm finding it pretty tough to feel sorry with point gatherer's who make a decision to wait for????? What????

Further, if you went all those years just gathering points with no plan, and if you believed that things would get better moose population wise, well, you weren't paying attention in 2012.

Waiting has consequences...and I don't do that. When I have points to draw a decent tag, they're gone.

I can assure you my Dad's bull ate better, and looks better on the wall than your 22 points ever will.
You also could have drawn 23, 25, 26, 27, 35, 36, 17, 18, 21, 22,10, 11, 9, 4, 5, 6, 2 and 3 all with 12 points.

No mature bulls in any of those units I guess? There is ZERO wilderness in 23, 24, 25, 26...all units I've hunted and there are mature bulls in 24 and 26... I can tell you that:

My 24 bull:

View attachment 107219

Last year 26 bull:

View attachment 107220

Also, Jim Fraundeitz killed one of the top B&C bulls taken in a 3 year recording period in unit 25, which you also could have drawn the year he killed it, 2012.
Buzz…. Take a breath…….. it must be therapeutic for you.

I just read a set of data that was shares in here, looked it over, had a question about the non-resident draw process, got clarification from you guys.

Great, thanks.

I went looking for the annual preference point totals on the Wyoming website, couldn’t find it right away and asked if anyone knew if Wyoming publish one. Did not want to keep looking it if there wasn’t one out there, somewhere. Got some info back from people……. at the same time they offered their opinions regarding staying or dropping out. I simply told them at my age and physical condition, if I couldn’t draw what I wanted to hunt…… in the next year or two, without a guide, or draw one of the harder to draw Areas I was not going to continue to apply.

I did say, I’d use the money for something I’d get more out of.

What is it that causes you to find everyone’s generizations and opinions so GDamn provoking.

Have a beer and send me the bill, for hell sake.
 
It's the same thing with most species in every state. People think points = trophy quality. You have way better odds of killing a trophy if you actually hunt
 
If people that had points in the 21-27 range last year, and didn't apply for a tag they had a chance of drawing that's on them. It's not like there wasn't sufficient warning that 90/10 was becoming a reality. In 2021 there was plenty of chatter on this forum to burn points while the getting was good.
 
Buzz…. Take a breath…….. it must be therapeutic for you.

I just read a set of data that was shares in here, looked it over, had a question about the non-resident draw process, got clarification from you guys.

Great, thanks.

I went looking for the annual preference point totals on the Wyoming website, couldn’t find it right away and asked if anyone knew if Wyoming publish one. Did not want to keep looking it if there wasn’t one out there, somewhere. Got some info back from people……. at the same time they offered their opinions regarding staying or dropping out. I simply told them at my age and physical condition, if I couldn’t draw what I wanted to hunt…… in the next year or two, without a guide, or draw one of the harder to draw Areas I was not going to continue to apply.

I did say, I’d use the money for something I’d get more out of.

What is it that causes you to find everyone’s generizations and opinions so GDamn provoking.

Have a beer and send me the bill, for hell sake.
What causes people to gain points with no plan or idea how or when to use them?

I have plans for every point I've ever acquired...and rarely apply for points only. I have active applications. Points are for burning, not collecting.
 
well, they are nice pictures…….
Kill 'em with class.

You had 21 points in 2022 and had ZERO chance at any WY moose tag in 2022. Many of the applicants one point class above you didn't draw in 2022.

Sure, you likely had pockets of opportunity these last 10 years, but you deserve to use your points as you choose.

Many WY residents have gotten through this by blaming the victims. Your 22 points and >$5,000 in spend have kept WY resident tag price artificially low. I thank you on behalf of WY residents for your contribution.
 
Kill 'em with class.

You had 21 points in 2022 and had ZERO chance at any WY moose tag in 2022. Many of the applicants one point class above you didn't draw in 2022.

Sure, you likely had pockets of opportunity these last 10 years, but you deserve to use your points as you choose.

Many WY residents have gotten through this by blaming the victims. Your 22 points and >$5,000 in spend have kept WY resident tag price artificially low. I thank you on behalf of WY residents for your contribution.
He never applied for sheep Pinocchio...and never spent half that on moose points either.

Blew it by not drawing when the getting was good.
 
Buzz…. Take a breath…….. it must be therapeutic for you.

I just read a set of data that was shares in here, looked it over, had a question about the non-resident draw process, got clarification from you guys.

Great, thanks.

I went looking for the annual preference point totals on the Wyoming website, couldn’t find it right away and asked if anyone knew if Wyoming publish one. Did not want to keep looking it if there wasn’t one out there, somewhere. Got some info back from people……. at the same time they offered their opinions regarding staying or dropping out. I simply told them at my age and physical condition, if I couldn’t draw what I wanted to hunt…… in the next year or two, without a guide, or draw one of the harder to draw Areas I was not going to continue to apply.

I did say, I’d use the money for something I’d get more out of.

What is it that causes you to find everyone’s generizations and opinions so GDamn provoking.

Have a beer and send me the bill, for hell sake.
He doesn't have a life. And He is always smarter than the other Hunter or Poster!After reading how much he posteed on this topic, I kinda feel sorry for him.....................BULL!
 
What causes people to gain points with no plan or idea how or when to use them?

I have plans for every point I've ever acquired...and rarely apply for points only. I have active applications. Points are for burning, not collecting.
I have lots of points that I don’t know exactly what I’m gonna do with yet. How could I, I may be decades away from using them and things change constantly. Points are a savings account. I likely will never be able to afford to buy the tags I want with cash so I am using my points, just like airline miles!! I used up a few points and a lot of luck last year and drew about $400k worth of hunts in one year. That’s a damn good savings account if you ask me.
 
It’s no biggie…… we all got our “ways”.

Nobodies loosing any sleep……

There’s a lot more important things to get boiled up over. You guys gave me the information I needed, I appreciate it.

Where ever you are hope your snow melts soon and your critters pull through better than expected.
 
Kill 'em with class.

You had 21 points in 2022 and had ZERO chance at any WY moose tag in 2022. Many of the applicants one point class above you didn't draw in 2022.

Sure, you likely had pockets of opportunity these last 10 years, but you deserve to use your points as you choose.

Many WY residents have gotten through this by blaming the victims. Your 22 points and >$5,000 in spend have kept WY resident tag price artificially low. I thank you on behalf of WY residents for your contribution.
He could have drawn last year. Not what he wanted but he could have shot a moose.
 
I have lots of points that I don’t know exactly what I’m gonna do with yet. How could I, I may be decades away from using them and things change constantly. Points are a savings account. I likely will never be able to afford to buy the tags I want with cash so I am using my points, just like airline miles!! I used up a few points and a lot of luck last year and drew about $400k worth of hunts in one year. That’s a damn good savings account if you ask me.
Until things change and you'll be the next 2lumpy...
 
It’s no biggie…… we all got our “ways”.

Nobodies loosing any sleep……

There’s a lot more important things to get boiled up over. You guys gave me the information I needed, I appreciate it.

Where ever you are hope your snow melts soon and your critters pull through better than expected.
I like your style 2lumpy your a class act!

I wish you well on whatever you decide to do now and in the future…

Horniac
 
He doesn't have a life. And He is always smarter than the other Hunter or Poster!After reading how much he posteed on this topic, I kinda feel sorry for him.....................BULL!
You're right, I am pretty smart...why I've shot as many or more elk and desert sheep in Arizona than you have.
 
Thanks Horniac. I appreciate that. In all honesty.

Nobody owes me anything in this world. If I die tomorrow I won’t feel cheated out of a single thing. Anybody that’s lived as well as I have has nothing to complain about.

Some folks call it, “eating the heart out of the water mellow.”
 
You're right, I am pretty smart...why I've shot as many or more elk and desert sheep in Arizona than you have.
You might be a hero to many here but not me. Shame sites get taken over by guys like you. Stay in the Woods the World will be a better place! Do You even have a job or a family ? I doubt it. Done!
 
Not even close to $5000 you're a liar and a fraud.

There were moose tags he could have drawn a decade ago with his points.
Correct i would of had 22 moose points...got out at 14, drew a great tag, shot a boone and crockett moose DIY, passed the info on to Zeke and the next year he did the same as me...no excuses on moose with that many points.
 
Yep had 21 points last year and kept up on the up coming changes and put in for a unit I had a real chance of drawing. Glad I did and had a great hunt and made some great memories on what I believe will be my only moose hunt where I'm the tag holder. Still only had a 50% chance when draws came out. 2 applicants jumped in with 22 points and I drew the 3rd tag where there was me and one other applicant in the 21 point pool.
 
Yep had 21 points last year and kept up on the up coming changes and put in for a unit I had a real chance of drawing. Glad I did and had a great hunt and made some great memories on what I believe will be my only moose hunt where I'm the tag holder. Still only had a 50% chance when draws came out. 2 applicants jumped in with 22 points and I drew the 3rd tag where there was me and one other applicant in the 21 point pool.
Awesome! Better to burn points than to collect points.
 

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