EU: no "Buy American" clause in Stimulus

[NeMont]

HD,

Do you propose the Obama repudiate all the trade agreement the U.S. has?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7866900.stm

Wait until every other country offers retaliatory measure and see how fast the downturn gains speed and destroys what ever trade we have left.

We are dependent on imports and still think we can dictate to the world that they are required to open their markets but we can close ours. That is arrogant and it is also destructive to our companies that are making money overseas.

I know, I know I am a sell out, nazi, unAmerican but the reality of the situation is that if the rest of the world starts retaliatory trade policies against us because of this legislation we will be in a depression. Go look at the Great Depression and what happened when protectionist policies blocked trade. It deepened, lengthened and broadened the economic destruction that was taking place.

To think we can dictate to the world's trade policies is as much of a fantasy as thinking we can force democracy upon people who have no history of democracy.

Nemont

 

[piper]

thats true, it should be an individual decision whether to buy American made or not, I think the growing income gap in America was part of the reason so many said to heck with it, I could care less about our country, maybe that is going to change a little

 

[huntindude]

So lets borrow the money from them to buy their crap? I say to hell with them. yes I understand we need their money but lets wean ourselves of their money and their crap and become more self sufficient like we used to be.

We've become lazy and dependant on others to do our work for us, there has never been a better time to see the error of our ways and change them. or we can ask the asians and EU for more money and beg them for more of their crap since we can't risk upsetting them, that should work out just dandy in the long term.

" Buy American " I love it, just think how much better off we would be if we would have figured out this so very complex and difficult to understand economic principle years ago.

American products = American jobs = paychecks= taxes paid.

Chinese products = Hop sing job = no American job = American in debt to buy hop sing product = broke American = no taxes paid = where we are today= people saying we should borrow more money from Hop Sing to buy his crap and keep him happy = me saying WTF?

 

[NeMont]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-03-09 AT 10:20AM (MST)[p]Where do you propose we borrow the money from to finance not only our Trillion dollar budget deficit but also our multi billion dollar monthly trade deficit? If we tell the rest of the world to stick it then what was just a deep recession is guaranteed depression.

Also what do you tell the American companies that are making money overseas? "Look we are happy that you are making money in foreign markets but we think steel workers in America are more important then the Americans who have risked their capital to help you expand"?

The buy american clause is nothing but a political payoff and in the end would cost us far more then not having it in there. I have no problem buying American but to insist for years that other countries open their markets and then close ours when it suits us is arrogant. It will make far more Anti American feelings then the War on Terror has. When you are talking trade you are talking something near and dear to people's hearts, their money. Money trumps all and if Obama insists on this buy American clause watch and see what kind of destruction that brings. Even the threat of China dumping their dollars will destroy more wealth in one day then all of the stimulus spending hopes to accomplish in four years.

We are surviving on a sub prime mortgage financed with 31 day T-bills and the interest rate is set to more then double, especially when we are going to tell our lenders to stuff it. The borrower has way less leverage right now then the lender.

Nemont

 

[huntindude]

Here's the thing, if we stay on the path of submission you suggest we're screwed, we may get by a few more years on borrowed money but our industry keeps leaving and our debt grows until nobody will loan us money because we aren't good for it not because we hurt their feelings.

So, we all know when our credit dries up we're going to just print the money anyway, maybe we should try to borrow the money to build our industry and domestic economy up from those foreign inverstors that see we may become a super power again due to our new found common sense and they want that good investment, or just print it like we're going to do if we stay on your path anyway. what do we have to lose? we take a shot at becoming something other than a bum or end up the same place we're headed if we fail, can't never did anything.

 

[NeMont]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-03-09 AT 10:32AM (MST)[p]Why would the rest of the world loan us the money to compete with them? The rest of the world isn't stupid.


If you told your banker, "Look, I demand you loan me this money but I am going going to do all my other business at a different bank and I expect not only the best rates from you but also expect you to work with me only on my terms". How much money are you going to get.

I agree with your buy American idea but out here in the real world that idea doesn't sit well with those we have demanded open trade with in the past.

You can't have it both ways. You can't tell the world we are going to only buy American made stuff and then demand they loan us the money to do it. That ship has sailed years ago.

That is why I have been preaching that we need to change course for a long time, Why I disagreed with GWB's and Cheney's idiotic "deficits don't matter" rhetoric and Greenspan's/Bernanke's easy money policy. The time to act was years ago now it is to late to codify into our laws arrogant language to keep steel workers happy. I bet most of those steel workers have cheap crap from China in their homes. It is the height of hypocracy and arrogance.

Nemont

 

[huntindude]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-03-09 AT 10:45AM (MST)[p]I agree it's probably too late but it's not too late to try.

Why would they loan us the money? greed is the one thing you can count on and if those foreigners thought we we're in a situation to be a great investment they'd sell their own mother out just like we did with this country. besides not all investors have a horse in the race, they just want a good investment.

If we think we can get by forever asking for money with our hat in our hands we're doomed, if we get off our butts and the world thinks we're going to show them we still have what it takes with or without them they'll want a piece of the action and the money will come.

Would it work? I think so, do we still have what it takes? no, but I like to think we do.

 

[NeMont]

FYI, "We" the U.S. is not a good investment. We are a horrible investment and everyday the printing presses run we become a worse investment.

Foreign investors would be better off to just buy the real property of the U.S. and refuse to loan our government any money. That day is coming

We have been living beyond our means for so long that we don't have any wealth left. We cannot finance our twin deficits internally, we don't have enough money.

If we could afford to be arrogant and demand "buy American" that would be great but that language violates almost all of our trade pacts throughout the world. We cannot afford the results of China retaliating against us. They own us, like it or not.

So explain who is going to loan us this money if the EuroZone, the Middle East and Asia are put off by our arrogance?

You are living in a dream world if you think our trading partners are going to stand still and let this go.
Nemont