Henry’s management tag???

Hoss1911

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Hey guys I have a Henry’s management archery tag this year and was wondering if anyone has seen any respectable management bucks? I have been down there a bunch and have seen a few good management bucks but I thought I would throw it out to anyone that wants to share any info your be much appreciated! Thanks
 
What a buck! Would that dropper knock him out of the management criteria? If it isn't above the first fork you may be good???

I pulled this from the orientation course workbook on the divisions website:

"What is the legal definition of a management buck? A management buck is a buck deer with 3 points or fewer on at least one antler. Points are counted above the first fork and don’t include the eye guard, which isn’t considered a point. A point is a projection that’s longer than one inch, measured from its base to its tip, including damaged or broken antlers. A broken point will count if it is one inch or longer."
 
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According to the officer on the Henry’s it can have as many browtines and base points as he can grow. They only start counting points after the first branch off the main beam(where the G2 leaves the beam)
 
Guy's I gotta be straight with you. That's not a management buck. You can tell he had the full back fork he has just broken it off. You aren't doing your heard any genetic good by removing him.
 
"Would it be considered poaching tristate?"

I don't know the answer to that. But it would be irresponsible and unnecessary.


"You saw him break it off? "

Nope. But I have seen plenty of broken tines to know it when I see it. I didn't see the sun get switched on but I know that sucker is on fire.


Listen fellas the purpose of a "management tag" is to make management decisions. That means we can make good decisions and bad decisions. Nobody has ever made a bad management decision by letting a deer go. If you truly care about management of that deer herd then you let that one walk.
 
Guy's I gotta be straight with you. That's not a management buck. You can tell he had the full back fork he has just broken it off. You aren't doing your heard any genetic good by removing him.
Doesn’t matter. That buck now meets the definition of a management buck determined by the state. Ethics are ethics and change between hunters. Law is law and stay the same between hunters. Don’t drag ethics and emotions into the legality of something
 
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N-Corey,

I don't think you are that much different than most hunters. What do you think the state does when suddenly half the management bucks that come in without a fork have had one of their forks broken off? What happens when you get accused of breaking the fork off yourself?

What ends up happening is the state stops putting the management of deer in the hands of public hunters. Our greed now will effectively end opportunity for others like our children in the future.



Example. I hunt a large well managed private ranch for mule deer. We started seeing a bunch of three points and what we call super forkies. Here in Texas we only have 1 mule deer tag on our license. The lease members aren't going to burn their tag and chance at a trophy on a management buck. So we got together and decided we would start bringing in hunters for a small fee to shoot management deer. Here's the problem. The management hunters didn't want to kill management deer. They wanted to kill trophies. They wanted to kill a management deer that was as close to a trophy as possible. The first year was about a 50/50 split on mistakes versus righteous kills in the management deer department. The next year we decided a new rule was needed. Management hunters had to go with trophy hunter's and the trophy hunters had to give the OK on which management deer got shot. Guess what. I think we only had 4 management deer killed. All the management hunters were shown management deer but declined shooting them since they weren't giant deer. Now most of the management deer we kill are gifted or for kids. It's amazing how kids aren't greedy and they are much more interested in management and conservation than grown men are. I actually guided one of the future management hunters on an antelope hunt before mule deer season opened. He started telling me how head gotten a management spot on this lease in Texas and he was going to kill a buck that somehow barely fell in the lines of management but was going to be a giant. He told me he didn't care who he pissed off because he was going to do it and never come back so he didn't have to face the lease members anyway. No skin in the game and no skin off his teeth.
 
Hornkiller,

If you personally owned that deer. If you actually had that deer in a pen and somebody wanted to buy that deer from you would you sell it to them at a discount because you think its an inferior deer???

Be honest.


" Law is law and stay the same between hunters. Don’t drag ethics and emotions into the legally of something"

I didn't mention ethics or emotions. I am talking about science. The purpose for the managment tags is to influence genetics. That deer's genetics are trophy genetics. Killing it is bad science and YOU KNOW IT. How many true management deer would you pass in search of something that broke a tine off?
 
I zoomed in on that antler and it looks like it was deformed as a youth, maybe there was some kind of incident, idk but better safe to get him out of the gene pool
 
"Deformed as a youth"???????

Your kidding right???? You do realize he didn't have those antlers as a youth?


Just trying to make sure you are joking around.
 
He is legal, i have shot a spike elk with broken tines, he should have been a 2by and I went through a checking station you could tell I didn’t break them. Go kill it and have a blast that’s a deer that is awesome and most regular tag holders are going to pass rather than feed a lion or winter kill hang him on your wall with the respect he deserves
 
Some Regular Tag Holders Might Pass Him up!

Towards Mid Season That Buck will have Lots of Lead throwed his way if not Sooner!


He is legal, i have shot a spike elk with broken tines, he should have been a 2by and I went through a checking station you could tell I didn’t break them. Go kill it and have a blast that’s a deer that is awesome and most regular tag holders are going to pass rather than feed a lion or winter kill hang him on your wall with the respect he deserves
 
Hornkiller,

If you personally owned that deer. If you actually had that deer in a pen and somebody wanted to buy that deer from you would you sell it to them at a discount because you think its an inferior deer???

Be honest.


" Law is law and stay the same between hunters. Don’t drag ethics and emotions into the legally of something"

I didn't mention ethics or emotions. I am talking about science. The purpose for the managment tags is to influence genetics. That deer's genetics are trophy genetics. Killing it is bad science and YOU KNOW IT. How many true management deer would you pass in search of something that broke a tine off?


I dont live in Texas and I dont hang out with wade lemon!
So no i wouldn't have a deer for sale in the 1st place.
Even if its broken off he is legal and your always throwing around legal terms!
We are talking about a limited entry public land buck not a private ranch in Texas tristate try to keep up.
 
I dont live in Texas and I dont hang out with wade lemon!
So no i wouldn't have a deer for sale in the 1st place.
Even if its broken off he is legal and your always throwing around legal terms!
We are talking about a limited entry public land buck not a private ranch in Texas tristate try to keep up.


You're dodging. Too scared to be honest and show this isn't about management and all about greed.
 
This deer is legal and could be harvested on a management tag. Funny that some times people are about sound management and other times they are not. Seems hypocritical to me...

As far as sound management goes...let me give you a hypothetical situation. Let’s say there is a bighorn sheep unit and it is open on a rotation based on wildlife management and BLAM...someone illegally kills the sheep on the off year rotation. Is that sound management?

For me, it would be irresponsible and unnecessary.
 
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"Isn’t the buck doe ratio somewhere like 35/100 and this 3x4 is going to screw up 20 years of management? "

No

"As far as sound management goes...let me give you a hypothetical situation. Let’s say there is a bighorn sheep unit and it is open on a rotation based on wildlife management and BLAM...someone illegally kills the sheep on the off year rotation. Is that sound management?"


Sounds like mismanagement if that actually happened.

You might want to learn what hypocrisy is before you start throwing nickel words around. While you are at it, look up "intellectual dishonesty".

"You lost me at "heard""

Thank you for the spelling fix Bocephus. I make those all the time.
 
Guy's I gotta be straight with you. That's not a management buck. You can tell he had the full back fork he has just broken it off. You aren't doing your heard any genetic good by removing him.
I don't think anyone really asked your opinion lol, you're talking like you are the God of deer hunting. That buck is 100% legal and it does look like a broken g2 but the velvet looks perfect around that little nub so I'm thinking it grew that way because it would have to break it while in velvet. Either way perfectly legal managment buck.
 
"you're talking like you are the God of deer hunting."


With a capital "G"! Now that's respect. :ROFLMAO:


Nope Pauns08. Apparently I'm just the one sucker who cares about the resource and the future of hunting big mule deer.

Like I asked the other guy, if you personally owned that deer would you sell it to someone as inferior?
 
N-Corey,

I don't think you are that much different than most hunters. What do you think the state does when suddenly half the management bucks that come in without a fork have had one of their forks broken off? What happens when you get accused of breaking the fork off yourself?

What ends up happening is the state stops putting the management of deer in the hands of public hunters. Our greed now will effectively end opportunity for others like our children in the future.



Example. I hunt a large well managed private ranch for mule deer. We started seeing a bunch of three points and what we call super forkies. Here in Texas we only have 1 mule deer tag on our license. The lease members aren't going to burn their tag and chance at a trophy on a management buck. So we got together and decided we would start bringing in hunters for a small fee to shoot management deer. Here's the problem. The management hunters didn't want to kill management deer. They wanted to kill trophies. They wanted to kill a management deer that was as close to a trophy as possible. The first year was about a 50/50 split on mistakes versus righteous kills in the management deer department. The next year we decided a new rule was needed. Management hunters had to go with trophy hunter's and the trophy hunters had to give the OK on which management deer got shot. Guess what. I think we only had 4 management deer killed. All the management hunters were shown management deer but declined shooting them since they weren't giant deer. Now most of the management deer we kill are gifted or for kids. It's amazing how kids aren't greedy and they are much more interested in management and conservation than grown men are. I actually guided one of the future management hunters on an antelope hunt before mule deer season opened. He started telling me how head gotten a management spot on this lease in Texas and he was going to kill a buck that somehow barely fell in the lines of management but was going to be a giant. He told me he didn't care who he pissed off because he was going to do it and never come back so he didn't have to face the lease members anyway. No skin in the game and no skin off his teeth.

Tri, you do realize your "management" hunts on your large trophy ranch wont really help, right? There has been a ton of studies done on this, management hunts to control genetics DO NOT WORK.

Rut
 
"Tri, you do realize your "management" hunts on your large trophy ranch wont really help, right? There has been a ton of studies done on this, management hunts to control genetics DO NOT WORK."


I know the studies you are talking about and honestly they are garbage. When handled properly removing genetics from deer herds actually does help the trophy quality. I have seen it done for three decades. I have seen the effects when it is practiced incorrectly and I have seen the effects when practiced correctly. Every commercial deer hunting operation I know of is practicing culling of undesirable deer. Every single one of those companies is benefiting from it.

You have to be careful the years you do or don't do it. You have to be careful what your harvest parameters are. You tend to get faster results when you are culling doe also.
 
"You're dodging. Too scared to be honest and show this isn't about management and all about greed"

I'm not dodging anything tri! I could careless what ut does because its all about money and guides which you benefit from! We are not talking about money on this particular buck we are talking if its legal or not!
If someone brought that buck into your shop and told you they killed it on the henries on a management tag would you do the right thing and tell them your not going to mount an "INFERIOR" buck because they should have shot a 22" 3×4? Hell no you wouldn't you would be there best friend and take the money!
 
"I'm not dodging anything tri! I could careless what ut does because its all about money and guides which you benefit from!"

I honestly can't tell what you are trying to say.

"We are not talking about money on this particular buck we are talking if its legal or not! "

I'm not talking money or legality on this particular buck. I am talking about science and sound management. Go back and read.

"If someone brought that buck into your shop and told you they killed it on the henries on a management tag would you do the right thing and tell them your not going to mount an "INFERIOR" buck because they should have shot a 22" 3×4? Hell no you wouldn't you would be there best friend and take the money!"

Obviously you haven't been reading. I don't think that buck is inferior. Thats my whole point.


You are still dodging the question I asked you.
 
Personaly I have no problem with someone taking this buck with a management tag.
But with that being said it is amazing the irony with so many on this post. A few of you guys are quick to point out the lack of ethics when some hunter harvests a buck that lives inside city limits but on this thread the comments our " if it is legal then it is the hunters right to harvest the buck" or "it meets the DWR definition of a legal managment buck".
Again I have no problem with a management hunter harvesting this buck, just like I have no problem with a spike hunter harvesting a broke antler X 6 point bull on a spike only hunt. The DWR has figured in allowances for not typical managment animals that will be harvested.
It is not up to me to judge other hunters ethics it is up to me to live to my personal ethics and to the law of the local jurisdiction.
Just my opinion
 
The primary objective of the management hunts on the Henry’s and the Paunsaugunt is provide increased opportunity on large mature bucks while protecting the deer with at least 4x points per side. The UDWR specifically requests that hunter refrain from shooting young legal bucks and hunt for mature management bucks. Also, many hunters with a premium tag on the Henry’s would not shoot this deer because of his 3x side. Perfect example of an awesome management deer! Hope some gets him.

From the UDWR website

Why a management buck deer hunt?
The goal of the management buck deer hunt is to remove excess bucks from the Paunsaugunt and Henry Mountains limited-entry units, which currently have high buck-to-doe ratios. At the same time, there’s an effort to protect the larger antlered bucks on these units. The harvest of mature bucks with three or fewer points will accomplish both goals. It will help the Division of Wildlife Resources (DWR) reduce buck-to-doe ratios while preserving trophy-class animals. Having lower buck-to-doe ratios is important because it results in the birth of more fawns and contributes to the long-term health and strength of the herds. This hunt will also provide more opportunities for sportsmen on two of Utah’s best hunting units.
 
Hornkiller,

If you personally owned that deer. If you actually had that deer in a pen and somebody wanted to buy that deer from you would you sell it to them at a discount because you think its an inferior deer???

Be honest.


" Law is law and stay the same between hunters. Don’t drag ethics and emotions into the legally of something"

I didn't mention ethics or emotions. I am talking about science. The purpose for the managment tags is to influence genetics. That deer's genetics are trophy genetics. Killing it is bad science and YOU KNOW IT. How many true management deer would you pass in search of something that broke a tine off?


no i wouldn't sale him for cheap i would get as much as I can out of him!

Would you charge more to mount him because he has trophy genetics tri?

Be honest!

Are you going to start charging less to mount lesser animals to help out genetics?

Be honest tri!

At the end of the day someone is gonna spend 10-15+ points to shoot a management buck like that!

Look at the d.w.r. definition of management buck and tell me he doesn't fit the description!
 
It seems like it's everyone against Tristate here so I thought i'd at least clarify what I think he's trying to say because I mostly agree with Tri.

Yes that is a legal management buck when going by the book. But that buck has potential of creating some monsters in his future offspring. Thus the smart thing would be to let it walk and breed.

But for most people they'll only hunt the Henry range once or twice so they obviously don't care about killing it. As long as it fits the description then have at it, it won't affect their future hunting!
 
"no i wouldn't sale him for cheap i would get as much as I can out of him!"

There you have it. He has trophy value.

"Would you charge more to mount him because he has trophy genetics tri?"

Nope. Businesses set prices on hours of labor and materials costs. Genotypes and phenotypes don't alter cost.

"Be honest!"

I always am.

"Are you going to start charging less to mount lesser animals to help out genetics?"

My prices don't effect genetics. Do you know what genetics are? Did daddy ever teach you how baby deer get made?

Be honest hornkiller!

"At the end of the day someone is gonna spend 10-15+ points to shoot a management buck like that!

Look at the d.w.r. definition of management buck and tell me he doesn't fit the description!c"

I was never commenting on the legality. I'm talking about science and trying to help the herd for years to come. But I never did understand greed.
 
So he hasn't been breeding alot does the last several years.
Hell he could be sterile never touched a doe.
See how that works out. He is a legal buck to take since NO ONE knows if he a breeder or not. I know with my 20 some point I would pull the trigger.
 
"My prices don't effect genetics."
"I was never commenting on the legality. I'm talking about science and trying to help the herd for years to come. But I never did understand greed."


There you have it you really don't care about the science huh tri!

If you honestly truly cared about the genetics and the science to help the herd you would offer a smaller fee to mount management deer but no you are greedy and will continue the blabbering!


My daddy never had to teach me how deer get made.
 
Hornkiller,

Lay off the booze. You don't know how business works, you can't read, and you don't know how baby deer get made. You are loosing it.


Gator,

Maybe he is a deer psycho and murders doe instead of breeding them. You are probably saving other deer by killing him.?

There's no logic like greed logic.
 
"Tri, you do realize your "management" hunts on your large trophy ranch wont really help, right? There has been a ton of studies done on this, management hunts to control genetics DO NOT WORK."


I know the studies you are talking about and honestly they are garbage. When handled properly removing genetics from deer herds actually does help the trophy quality. I have seen it done for three decades. I have seen the effects when it is practiced incorrectly and I have seen the effects when practiced correctly. Every commercial deer hunting operation I know of is practicing culling of undesirable deer. Every single one of those companies is benefiting from it.

You have to be careful the years you do or don't do it. You have to be careful what your harvest parameters are. You tend to get faster results when you are culling doe also.

Post any scientific research that agrees with what you just said. Let me save you the trouble, you can't! It isn't just the bucks that are spreading the genes. Take a biology class and get back to me taxidermist.

Rut
 
Lmfao ok tri you win.

You really should write a biography
"Tristate is god like"

Since we are not talking about what this thread was intended for let me ask You.


When buying supplies for a plain old shoulder mount Do you charge the same price to mount a deer with a 16" form as you do a deer with a 20" form?

Do you buy the cheapest forms you can for the small bucks or do you buy quality for both?

Be honest tri!

The smaller buck is better for business aint it tri?

You cant charge more just because its a trophy class animal right?

Just wondering since we are talking about greed!

Ps can you pm me how baby deer get made?
 
"Post any scientific research that agrees with what you just said. Let me save you the trouble, you can't! It isn't just the bucks that are spreading the genes. Take a biology class and get back to me taxidermist. "

Hey rutcrazed go back and read my post. It specifically mentions including doe in a culling plan. Quite honestly you still have a genetic effect on your herd if you don't include doe. It just happens at a slower rate of change. Just as we can influence antler development in culling we can influence the breading seasons for deer just by removing doe. It's funny how science shows how removing doe to change the peak of rut works when bucks contribute genetics, but to change antler development in bucks is impossible?????? Like I said its junk science. Biologists were using culling long before anyone new what genetics were. It worked then and it works now.

By the way I took a whole lot of biology classes and genetics when I received my degree in Wildlife and Fisheries Sciences.
 
"When buying supplies for a plain old shoulder mount Do you charge the same price to mount a deer with a 16" form as you do a deer with a 20" form?"

Yep.

"Do you buy the cheapest forms you can for the small bucks or do you buy quality for both?"

Quality for both.

"Be honest tri!"

Nothing has changed. I always am. You must get lied to a lot buy people close to you.

"The smaller buck is better for business aint it tri?"

Nope. They are actually worse for business.

"You cant charge more just because its a trophy class animal right?"

I can charge whatever the hell I please.

"Just wondering since we are talking about greed!"

It sure sticks in your craw when someone points out the reality of the your issue.
 
Is anyone actually shocked that tri didn't actually know the reason why Utah has "management" hunts on the Henry Mountains?

This dude has an opinion on everything in a state he doesn't live and doesn't even understand. Yeah, I know you've hired guides to hold your hand as you walk around our state and pull the trigger. Good for you. Educate yourself before you try and come and preach to others.
 
Vanilla,

Go back and read. I'm not even discussing why they have "management" hunts.

Calm down. No need to go 16 year old girl today.

If you want to make this a conversation about semantics and what the word "management" can or does mean then go for it. Some people care about the science behind growing giant deer and protecting the genes needed to insure our children get to hunt giant deer. If you want to get your panties in a twist because your greed is more important than the future of deer hunting, have at it.


Hell lets all start killing giant bucks and make sure and knock a point off so now he's a "management" deer. What do you care?
 
You guys haven’t seen tri mad until he calls you boy? Plus I guarantee if he had a guide tell him I found your buck come look, he would shoot it as fast as his guide could get his shooting sticks out
 
Cooper, nobody here has seen me mad.

If you think you are going to make me feel bad for hiring guides and killing giant trophies think again.
 
"You must get lied to a lot buy people close to you."

Dont turn into dr. Phil now tristate!

Or do you have a degree in that as well?


"It sure sticks in your craw when someone points out the reality of the your issue."

You haven't pointed out any reality!
You live in your own little f%@&ed up world maybe to many chemicals from tanning?

The only issue I have is I can't stop arguing with idiots like you!
 
There was a statement about ownership of the deer,yes I am a taxpayer in this state I own the deer it is not inferior it meets the criteria and I have been waiting 15-20 years to hunt it ,I am an average guy who cannot hire a guide. I will shoot thatdeerthat I own and not out of greed but because it meets the opportunity that was given to me following all rules and regulations
 
"There was a statement about ownership of the deer,yes I am a taxpayer in this state I own the deer it is not inferior it meets the criteria and I have been waiting 15-20 years to hunt it ,I am an average guy who cannot hire a guide. I will shoot thatdeerthat I own and not out of greed but because it meets the opportunity that was given to me following all rules and regulations "

Yeah dang big, you own it. Try and go sell it since you own so much. ;)

That's the thing about greedy people. They have a dozen different ways they will argue they "deserve" something.

Why would you settle for this buck. Go kill a 250 incher and smack his g-3 off with a hammer. Sure it will score 10 inches less but what do you care as long as you get a big deer and get to call it "legal".


I think I know why yall are scared of the words I am typing. Yall are all hoping the DWR isn't reading this and going to actually do something about it.
 
I guess I don’t understand how greed is part of this? I am new to this forum but Tristate you seem to want to push that your beliefs are the only way. Sorry but you are wrong and you are taking the fun out of this.hunting is about experience being with friends and if you are able to harvest something legally so much the better if you believe most of us are just about inches and killing you are mistaken.
 
Smac
"There was a statement about ownership of the deer,yes I am a taxpayer in this state I own the deer it is not inferior it meets the criteria and I have been waiting 15-20 years to hunt it ,I am an average guy who cannot hire a guide. I will shoot thatdeerthat I own and not out of greed but because it meets the opportunity that was given to me following all rules and regulations "

Yeah dang big, you own it. Try and go sell it since you own so much. ;)

That's the thing about greedy people. They have a dozen different ways they will argue they "deserve" something.

Why would you settle for this buck. Go kill a 250 incher and smack his g-3 off with a hammer. Sure it will score 10 inches less but what do you care as long as you get a big deer and get to call it "legal".


I think I know why yall are scared of the words I am typing. Yall are all hoping the DWR isn't reading this and going to actually do something about it.
”Smacking the G3 off” isn’t legal. The buck in the video is legal by definition of the law. You have zero idea whether that buck always has that antler configuration based on genetics or if something unfortunate happened to him this year.
 
Listen fellas the purpose of a "management tag" is to make management decisions. That means we can make good decisions and bad decisions. Nobody has ever made a bad management decision by letting a deer go. If you truly care about management of that deer herd then you let that one walk.

This was your statement. This is not the purposes of the management hunt on the Henry's or the Pauns. The state is very open about this. Again, go educate yourself before you start your lecture. The next time you did that would be the first time you did it. You might be surprised how nice it is to not be ignorant for once? Maybe...
 
I guess I don’t understand how greed is part of this? I am new to this forum but Tristate you seem to want to push that your beliefs are the only way. Sorry but you are wrong and you are taking the fun out of this.hunting is about experience being with friends and if you are able to harvest something legally so much the better if you believe most of us are just about inches and killing you are mistaken.

Excellent mind set. Go shoot the 140 inch management deer and be happy with your friends and family then.
 
Smac

”Smacking the G3 off” isn’t legal. The buck in the video is legal by definition of the law. You have zero idea whether that buck always has that antler configuration based on genetics or if something unfortunate happened to him this year.


How would they know you smacked it off???? All that matters is killing the biggest buck you can kill.

Any 8 year old can tell that buck in that video had a fork and broke it off. Quit the BS with this nobody can tell so its legal crap. Just admit you are greedy and you don't want little things like the future of deer hunting for all of our kids get in the way of you getting what you want.
 
This was your statement. This is not the purposes of the management hunt on the Henry's or the Pauns. The state is very open about this. Again, go educate yourself before you start your lecture. The next time you did that would be the first time you did it. You might be surprised how nice it is to not be ignorant for once? Maybe...


Your still talking about semantics and what this person means or the DWR means. YOU DON'T GET IT. I AM TALKING ABOUT THE SCIENCE AND BEING RESPONSIBLE. You might be surprised how nice it is to not be greedy and think about the future of hunting for once.

The only thing you want to "manage" is how to manage that buck into the back of the truck by any greedy means necessary.

I never once ever told anyone it was legal or illegal to kill this deer. I never talked about the ethics of killing this deer. I talked about science and greed.
 
You admitted yourself that killing this deer would not screw up the unit management. You twist yourself into so many circles chasing your own tail you can't even keep your own arguments straight.

Good luck on this one!
 
"Post any scientific research that agrees with what you just said. Let me save you the trouble, you can't! It isn't just the bucks that are spreading the genes. Take a biology class and get back to me taxidermist. "

Hey rutcrazed go back and read my post. It specifically mentions including doe in a culling plan. Quite honestly you still have a genetic effect on your herd if you don't include doe. It just happens at a slower rate of change. Just as we can influence antler development in culling we can influence the breading seasons for deer just by removing doe. It's funny how science shows how removing doe to change the peak of rut works when bucks contribute genetics, but to change antler development in bucks is impossible?????? Like I said its junk science. Biologists were using culling long before anyone new what genetics were. It worked then and it works now.

By the way I took a whole lot of biology classes and genetics when I received my degree in Wildlife and Fisheries Sciences.

Wow! You can spot a recessive antler gene in a doe? Very impressive!! I am not sure which is funnier, the stupid things you post or the fact that you believe the stupid things you post???

Rut
 
You admitted yourself that killing this deer would not screw up the unit management. You twist yourself into so many circles chasing your own tail you can't even keep your own arguments straight.

Good luck on this one!


Dude, you really need to learn how to read. I thought lawyers were supposed to be good at that.:rolleyes:
 
"Wow! You can spot a recessive antler gene in a doe? Very impressive!! I am not sure which is funnier, the stupid things you post or the fact that you believe the stupid things you post??? "


Trust me you aren't laughing near as hard as I am when I read genius statements like "recessive antler gene". You obviously don't know how genetics work.
 
SO has anybody come up with a picture of this buck from last year????? Come on he's a giant deer on the Henry's.
 
"Wow! You can spot a recessive antler gene in a doe? Very impressive!! I am not sure which is funnier, the stupid things you post or the fact that you believe the stupid things you post??? "


Trust me you aren't laughing near as hard as I am when I read genius statements like "recessive antler gene". You obviously don't know how genetics work.

Please educate me! I have a friend with the same degree as you and he had to take Intro to Biology and one Genetics class, you must have got some extra classes because you looked so smart!
LOL!!!!!!

Maybe just draw me a quick Punnett Square.

Rut
 
How about this fellas. Anybody got a picture they want to share of this buck from last year?

6A9B31CE-C853-4D97-8BA0-E73910B84E49.jpeg
 
"There was a statement about ownership of the deer,yes I am a taxpayer in this state I own the deer it is not inferior it meets the criteria and I have been waiting 15-20 years to hunt it ,I am an average guy who cannot hire a guide. I will shoot thatdeerthat I own and not out of greed but because it meets the opportunity that was given to me following all rules and regulations "

Yeah dang big, you own it. Try and go sell it since you own so much. ;)

You made the statement about ownership to hornkiller, your so full of bs ?
 
First of all you might not be dealing with "recessive" anything. Second you are talking about managing live wild animals so quit thinking you are going to nail down individual genotypes to individual animals. Start thinking more like a farmer and combine that with known behavior of your studied species. Start thinking of desirable and undesirable phenotypes. Start thinking of management tactics which spead up your genetic turnover and sharing. Then start forcing your herd through a genetic bottleneck. Thats about as simple as i can put it.
 
First of all you might not be dealing with "recessive" anything. Second you are talking about managing live wild animals so quit thinking you are going to nail down individual genotypes to individual animals. Start thinking more like a farmer and combine that with known behavior of your studied species. Start thinking of desirable and undesirable phenotypes. Start thinking of management tactics which spead up your genetic turnover and sharing. Then start forcing your herd through a genetic bottleneck. Thats about as simple as i can put it.

What is your herd size? Is this a truly 100% high fence area, nothing in, nothing out??

Rut
 
There are trolls in every state, including mine. There are also people who will never admit the sky is blue even when you show them a picture. That’s why websites like MM created the “ignore” button.

So if you enjoy arguing with a wall, please carry on. But I use the ignore feature and have moved on

Would i shoot that buck? Absolutely. The genetics of the Henrys would do just fine without him.
 
"There are trolls in every state, including mine. There are also people who will never admit the sky is blue even when you show them a picture. That’s why websites like MM created the “ignore” button.

So if you enjoy arguing with a wall, please carry on. But I use the ignore feature and have moved on "


You haven't moved on boy. You got your hand slapped a couple of years ago and all you do is fallow me around on threads and tell people to ignore me. YOU DON'T IGNORE ME AT ALL. I own you.

See Utah400. Earlier you were unsure on what hypocrisy is. Now here is an actual example of it. TXHUNTER58 calls people trolls while he is trolling them and lies to everybody about how he ignores a person and they should do the same. In reality he is telling you to do what he doesn't have the balls to do.


The only ignoring going on here is no one will post a pic of this buck from last year because they know it will show him with a full back right fork.
 
First; I don't think it is broken. Hard to be sure in the video but I sure can not see any damage to the velvet.

Second; Some deer genetically grow antlers that are pron to breaking. A few years back I watched a big whitetail. He lived to well past his prime and every year he broke his antlers up badly. Found quite a few of his sheds and they were noticeably less dense than other sheds. By keeping a deer like this around another year are you helping the herds genetics.
 
"First; I don't think it is broken. Hard to be sure in the video but I sure can not see any damage to the velvet."

It broke

"Second; Some deer genetically grow antlers that are pron to breaking. A few years back I watched a big whitetail. He lived to well past his prime and every year he broke his antlers up badly. Found quite a few of his sheds and they were noticeably less dense than other sheds. By keeping a deer like this around another year are you helping the herds genetics."


You could be correct. AT LEAST YOU ARE THINKING LIKE A SCIENTIST. I haven't seen any proof that certain deer are "Genetically prone to breaking". That could be a study or multiple studies which come up in the future. Whether this condition does or does not exist is irrelevant in this case because you couldn't possibly decide that off of one year and one broken point. Down here probably one in four deer that come in my shop have some type of damage to their antlers which you can tell occurred during the growth cycle of the antler. The fact is these are wild animals living in wild environments and all kinds of physical interactions damage these antlers NORMALLY all the time.

"He finally called someone boy"


Cooper you might be surprised and find out he is actually a kid. Me and that youngin' go way back. :ROFLMAO:
 
"First; I don't think it is broken. Hard to be sure in the video but I sure can not see any damage to the velvet."

It broke

"Second; Some deer genetically grow antlers that are pron to breaking. A few years back I watched a big whitetail. He lived to well past his prime and every year he broke his antlers up badly. Found quite a few of his sheds and they were noticeably less dense than other sheds. By keeping a deer like this around another year are you helping the herds genetics."


You could be correct. AT LEAST YOU ARE THINKING LIKE A SCIENTIST. I haven't seen any proof that certain deer are "Genetically prone to breaking". That could be a study or multiple studies which come up in the future. Whether this condition does or does not exist is irrelevant in this case because you couldn't possibly decide that off of one year and one broken point. Down here probably one in four deer that come in my shop have some type of damage to their antlers which you can tell occurred during the growth cycle of the antler. The fact is these are wild animals living in wild environments and all kinds of physical interactions damage these antlers NORMALLY all the time.

"He finally called someone boy"


Cooper you might be surprised and find out he is actually a kid. Me and that youngin' go way back. :ROFLMAO:
Still on here acting like a know it all i see lol
 

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